Does this clip from Cassie Jaye about a realization she had about her relationship with her boyfriend make you question some of what feminism says about how bad women have it in relationships today?

Electra_Cute · 2018-02-28T01:39:59+00:00

Well I think a lot of feminism is full of misinterpretations, false narratives and it leads a lot of it to becoming absolutely dangerous. This persistence of pushing that the wage gap is primarily due to gendered discrimination is really unhinged from reality. I could imagine there being a bit of gender discrimination being part of the wage gap, bu to suggest it is the main driving force behind it, I could never get behind that.

Now in terms of what Casey Jay is saying about her boyfriend doing more uncomfortable jobs and working more, so he becomes paid more and how he is sacrificing more for his career and holds his weight in the relationship, I think it is a good thing that she realized this and it sounds like she is more thankful for having him.

I think there are some relationships where the women work the same hours and almost as hard or just has hard as men, but they are still expected to do the chores and the majority of the housework. I do not know just how common that situation is.

goatismycopilot · 2018-02-28T02:24:37+00:00

Not really it sounds like she grew up a little pampered and sheltered and had it easy and met some guy who works hard and she suddenly realized she has had an easy life.

SpaceWhiskey · 2018-02-28T02:44:29+00:00

This is so frustratingly disingenuous.

She spent a significant amount of time unemployed, by choice, so she could make a passion project. Her boyfriend paid the majority of the bills and also, presumably, didn’t do any housework, which caused her to become annoyed and led to arguments. She credits her annoyance to her being a feminist. The subject of her passion project was learning about the anti-feminist internet movement, and thus credits her changing her mind about chores and bills to renouncing feminism. As a feminist who has no problem with fairness in bills/chores, this makes me facepalm.

First, I have questions. I think it’s fair for the person who pays the majority of the bills do less chores. But that doesn’t give them the right to be a total slob of a human being. So I’m curious just how much of a mess her boyfriend was making and expecting her to clean up, since this led to multiple arguments. If he puts his dirty laundry in the hamper and his dirty dishes in the sink, fine. Or does he just leave gross shit laying all over the house? Does he let stuff rot and go stinky is she’s not home for a few days? So I’d need more details before writing off her annoyance. I think it’s perfectly fair for the person who pays less (especially if it’s way less or nothing) in bills to handle the bulk of the chores, but that shouldn’t turn them into a mothermaid who has to pick up dirty laundry and dirty dishes off the floor like you’re their parent. An adult in a relationship is still responsible for basic respectful things like that.

So let’s give the guy the benefit of the doubt, that he’s respectful about not making chores even more of a pain than they need to be and functions like an adult. My next question would be wanting to know how the arguments went down. Because even if he’s putting his dirty laundry in the hamper, I’d like to know how he expresses his opinion that she should be the one to run the washer/dryer. Is it because he pays the bills, or is it because he thinks women should be the one who washes clothes regardless? She says she came to the bill inequality conclusion on her own, so what did this guy say in his own defense during their fights?

And like... feminism isn’t newsletter. It isn’t even a consensus. Feminists argue amongst themselves, a lot. It’s how change happens, it’s how the dialogue moves forward. There are different kinds of feminism. So for this woman who thought it was unfair for her to have to do more chores despite not paying bills to blame that on feminism, I call foul. It sounds like she herself was an immature person who hadn’t really thought things out clearly, and had some growing up to do. As a feminist who feels the way she does now about chores and bills yet is still a feminist, I think she just found an easy scapegoat to blame for her past immaturity, and it’s been being reinfocred by all the anti-feminist men telling her how cool and smart she is for renouncing feminism. It sounds like she had a pampered rich girl upbringing. This is what 4th wavers call pretty white girl feminism, all the indignance, none of the struggle.

TheChemist158 · 2018-02-28T19:41:09+00:00

Haha, no. This was some pretty stupid logic. If one person pays more of the bills it's reasonable to think the other should do more housework. I pay just as much of the bills as my SO and expect he does just as much of the housework. It's not even a feminist stance. It's a common view among feminists and one I always held.

The child custody thing it's out of the blue. I think both parents should have access, but the primary custody arrangement should be based on the best interest of the child, not who "deserves" it. A man's role as a primary gaurdian should be decided based on how good of a parent he is, not just bif he financially contributes.

Just_trixia · 2018-02-28T03:37:08+00:00

Just a token from someone who have different culture, for me regardless who pay the bills more im "expected" to be more in hands in the chores over the house by my ancestor because im a women. In the current house im staying i have my grandparents, cousin(guy) and sisters (3 sisters). My cousin never helped with house chores the only thing he do was clean his own room but for us we need to clean the house, make the table, do dishes and other chores. It is how it is and no were not interested to bend anything im happy to do things like that. Tho my cousin have to help out with picking heavy things, cleaning the car and other heavy duty work.

esiemualB · 2018-02-28T04:41:50+00:00

No. I think part of the reason why men and women make different career choices is because most women still grow up with this idea that they will be SAHMs at some point, and most men grow up thinking they will be breadwinners. Feminism however is against these restrictive gender roles. Therefore, I always read "household work should be shared equally" as "under the circumstances that everything else is shared equally as well".

On the other part with fathers being involved: It's not about how big your sacrifices were when doing things that somehow benefit the child, it's about who the kid already has a bond with. If the father is never around because he's always at work, the kid will obviously have a much stronger relationship with the mother, therefore it makes sense that the mother should still be the one the kid lives with. However, I don't see why the standard case shouldn't be shared custody, with child support as a means to make sure that both parents share the cost of raising the kid equally, regardless of where the kid lives.

Mehandesetova · 2018-02-28T10:39:58+00:00

No. What she said had nothing to do with feminism and more to do with having an upper class bubble burst.

AstuteBlackMan · 2018-02-28T06:25:17+00:00

Society tends to think men don't sacrifice in relationships because men often don't complain about sacrificing. A lot of men, due to "gender norms" often just do what needs to be done and don't complain. Which is a really respectable thing.

Both genders have it bad in different ways. When we can both recognize that we can realize that we should be building each other up.

But to also play devils advocate, there are some women who are in bad relationships with men and feel men don't sacrifice and they are actually right.

Overall this clip was interesting. It's nice to see her come to that conclusion.

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