Mo' Money Mo' Problems! | PurplePillDebate

Scurvemuch · 2017-08-30T13:35:41+00:00

This article talks a bit about the relationship of perceived income to a desire for a more attractive partner....

[–]ArthurMacArthur 10 points11 points12 points 8 years ago (122 children) | Copy Link

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The result of the second study, the one that you quote in your OP, actually becomes more interesting when juxtaposed with the results of the first study. Men who are feeling flush with cash are both sterner judges of their own LTR's attractiveness, and are more likely to hit up a random woman they think is hot. This isn't much of a surprise, honestly.

Women who are feeling flush aren't going to start finding fault with their LTR's appearance or think that they somehow "deserve" a hot dude, but they are apparently as likely as men to approach a random dude that they find attractive.

The behavioral measure used in Study 2 could have contributed to the nonsignificant gender difference in the tendency to approach the attractive alternative under the influence of money... we observed their actual behaviors (instead of self-reports) to prevent social desirability or self-knowledge from biasing their responses. This may suggest that women's insistence on loyalty is largely influenced by external norms related to gender roles.

I do appreciate that the study authors caution the reader not to extrapolate too much from this; that the study participants were college students in dating relationships and that these results should not be generalized to people in married relationships.

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No shit...Would an Eastern European woman submit to someone more like Robert E. Lee, Nathan Bedford Forrest (educated sexy war criminal?) or Frederick the Great?

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It sounds like you've met a couple such women... they do make an impression

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But I would think "wealthier" women would be less likely to put up with less attractive men

Women don't think in terms of their own pure monetary wealth. Women - especially UMC and above women - think of themselves as a package deal. Their attractiveness and style, their job, their background (family, education, SES) all go into it.

Similarly, they view men as a package deal - their monetary situation, their career/career trajectory, attractiveness, and their background.

And women who are "wealthy" in terms of the sum of those parts (not just money) feel they are entitled to as "attractive" (in term of the sum of his parts) as they can get.

Whereas, with wealthy men, it's a much more explicit "I have money, you maintain the hot." These guys make no bones about looking for arm candy, even if they're simultaneously looking for a LTR.

I live in TrophyWifeVille, and the men my age (late 30s) and above are generally letting themselves go. I see gin blossoms, thinning hair, abs sculpted by scotch and luxurious dinners. (Of course exceptions exist - my own husband is an insane CrossFit health nut)

The women, on the other hand? Either they come from the same pedigree, and can afford to do the WASPy matron wearing pearls and a sweater set ... Or they're knocking themselves out in the gym, have tighter bodies than their late teens/early 20s daughters, and survive on only rabbit food, clear liquors, and wine.

Exceptions to the women exist as well, but I'll be honest - as a woman not from this background, I definitely align with the second stereotype (with more of an emphasis on wine than the usual gal, though)

u/ArthurMacArthur hit it on the head.

[–]Scurvemuch 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (66 children) | Copy Link

[–]SmurfESmurferson3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (44 children) | Copy Link

I straddle both umc world financially but not socially / background wise.

I'm in WASPy New England. The exact area that The Stepford Wives was written to satirize (hence, "TrophyWifeVille"). So take what I say with a grain of salt - it might not apply to LA, Silicon Valley, etc.

The gym boys by and large are dating or married to women who are not nearly as attractive as the men are.

Even with the gym boys, the pressure is on the wives to be "hotter." Not just gym bodies, but perfect hair, makeup, nails always done, on-trend clothes. The guys can get away with khakis and polo shirts.

The real high rollers, millionaires and up, are either with 15-20 year younger women , or with the same girl they were with since HS

Where I am, 7 figures isn't really "high rolling." But even with the billionaires (and yes, we know a few, including ones in my husband's office), every one is in a very old school, white color job (think finance, law, pharma, insurance). The type of job where you just can't bring a 15 - 20 year younger woman to a work event without serious career repercussions.

I have no idea if they're cheating with girls 15 - 20 years younger (and while I don't think every single one is, I don't doubt that it happens more than I'd expect), their wives are age and career/SES appropriate.

or with the same girl they were with since HS

That generally doesn't happen here. There are exceptions, but they're few and far between (and generally shit shows - like our friends. Together since HS, similar backgrounds, and she's the town bicycle. He's paid for 3 abortions that weren't his. He has to have the cuckold fetish, it's the only thing that makes sense)

[–]Scurvemuch 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

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my Uniform!

You're of my people!

Wealthy people don't re marry?

They do, but generally to similarly aged/background-ed women. There are whole bars here that are known as second/third/fourth marriage meat markets - where the 40+ crowd looking for a new spouse goes to drink and hopefully meet someone/hook up.

Like anything else, exceptions exist ... But they're so rare that they're instant gossip (like the guy I know who left his wife for a woman younger than his daughter. That didn't go well, on any level). It's like watching the news - it's easy to only notice those stories, but you have to remind yourself that they're being noticed for a reason. Because they're unusual.

That said, I'm going to add some nuance to the cheating thing I mentioned earlier. There is WAY more "understandings" in this crew than in my WC/MC background.

I was at lunch with a few married women I know a year or two ago, and the subject somehow changed to sex ... Which then changed to more than a couple of them expressing gratitude for their husbands mistresses (for saving the wives the annoyance of sex).

You could have knocked me over with a feather at that.

[–][deleted] 8 years ago* [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Question: could a 38 year old hedge fund manager get away with having a 25 year old attractive full professor of mathematics - at MIT - on his arm?

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i'm pretty sure we've disagreed on this exact same issue before, but what you're talking about is NOT a widespread issue.

i don't doubt that people at your husband's firm may say that this bit of "conventional wisdom" is a legitimate concern, but that's really more a case of not-20-years-younger wives club trying to defend their territory and rationalization by beta husbands who couldn't actually replace their dumpy old wife with a hotter, younger model even if they wanted to.

if Chad the hotshot who brings in all the good clients and makes fat stacks of cash shows up at work event with a significantly younger Mrs. Chad, she will get some icy stares from the other women and good old Chad will have to deal with some good natured ribbing and ball-busting from the men. but i guarantee you that it will not have any negative repurcussions for his career or social life. and while the other women might shit talk Mrs Chad behind her back, in the real world attractive women almost never end up being at the bottom of social hierarchies.

[–]SmurfESmurferson1 point 8 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Like I said in the beginning of the previous reply:

I'm in WASPy New England. The exact area that The Stepford Wives was written to satirize (hence, "TrophyWifeVille"). So take what I say with a grain of salt - it might not apply to LA, Silicon Valley, etc.

but that's really more a case of not-20-years-younger wives club trying to defend their territory

I've never once denied that the women don't play a part.

but i guarantee you that it will not have any negative repurcussions for his career or social life.

That is where you are wrong. We've watched it go down once or twice.

Unless the younger woman is also incredibly mature and extremely advanced in her career (therefore, able to conduct herself on par with those in the room), the younger girl isn't a good look.

They'll fuck them on the side, but that's NOT who you bring to white collar work events.

Even socially, it's a no-no to bring Daisy Duke to an adult's dinner party. THAT is the wife game, though - he'll find himself cut out of the social circle, because wives run the social lives.

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Ok I compete with people in factors that I can control like monetary savings, guitar skills and tax knowledge.

Attractiveness is largely within an individual's control. Everything from diet and exercise, knowing how to apply makeup and wear clothes that flatter your body, and wearing hairstyles that flatter your face.

My friend was bullied heavily in the Single Women Shelter system because she wore "cheap" clothes so this is a topic that I'm irritated by.

Cool. I do 99% of my clothes shopping at thrift stores, get bomb-ass $9 haircuts from the local beauty college, and work out religiously at my local YMCA. Healthy, fresh food is probably the cheapest of all if you make it yourself, and it'll keep you skinny and fit.

It doesn't have to cost a lot to look good, it just takes some effort and care.

I don't like shallowness or people judging each other.

And yet calling it shallow is a judgment in and of itself. Caring about your appearance isn't mutually exclusive to caring about other facets, such as professional success and self-actualization.

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Women don't think in terms of their own pure monetary wealth. Women - especially UMC and above women - think of themselves as a package deal. Their attractiveness and style, their job, their background (family, education, SES) all go into it. Similarly, they view men as a package deal - their monetary situation, their career/career trajectory, attractiveness, and their background. And women who are "wealthy" in terms of the sum of those parts (not just money) feel they are entitled to as "attractive" (in term of the sum of his parts) as they can get.

That's exactly right. I mean, you can take me anywhere.

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Seriously??? Garth Brooks man!

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Sure why not? But only occasionally

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Weird, to me that sounds entirely normal. What is strange about it to you?

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I personally see the SES and family background as a major contributor to someone's character.. agreed on that last part being fucked up though.

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Oh I think I misinterpreted something- I never meant I wouldn't date someone based on those factors. I just meant that family values and financial status impact us all, for good or bad. Like, parents who value a strong work ethic will try to instill the same in their kids- or parents who think travel is important will give their kids a chance to do that when possible. These things all impact how the kid experiences the world.

Some people do well because of their background, some people do well despite it; same goes for people who don't do well in life.

Personally I have more respect for people who succeed despite their family than for people who never had to try.

The only time someone's family was an issue for me was when he would have had to sever his relationship with his family in order to be in a relationship with me. That was hard all around, but there's no way I was willing to be the reason he lost his family.

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America IS a racist country. Believe you me, the travesty of Puerto Rico's current political status is the least of the myriad racial issues that still exist in this country, if you happened to have been paying attention to events of the last few weeks. Only a supporter of of Israel would try to draw a parallel between the debates surrounding Puerto Rico's situation with the daily bloodletting that defines life under military occupation for a Palestinian...

A Palestinian from Ramallah or Tlkarem...can they vote in Israeli elections? Are they given their full land-use rights? Can they apply for a permit to expand their homes? Are they allowed freedom of movement? Can they protest without being gunned down? Why the enthusiasm for apartheid?

And all Israeli settlements illegally constructed since the start of the occupation in the West Bank are Jewish only. They were built on confiscated Palestinian land to fulfill the religious desires of die-hard Zionists.

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Eastern bloc girls are dangerous. It's Machiavelli with a pretty face and demure glance

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Why is it more problems? It's less problems in every respect.

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Oh. I couldn't think of why it would ever be better to be poor. I guess the money is the "options" TRP likes to call them right?

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Yeah exactly. If he has other options but chooses to be monogamous, it means I'm adding enough value to his life to be worth committing to. Same thing goes for him- he knows I have options, he makes sure he's worth committing to.

The prerequisite here is self-respect and respect for one another- I know perfectly well that if I acted in a way that made him lose respect for me he'd walk.

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Lol, not guilty your honour

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Personally I prefer discussions about power dynamics, the nature of power, and former eastern bloc values vs North American values. Observations about the degradation of western society are also enjoyable

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Why the unemployed dude? Interesting preference.

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[–]Rian_Stone0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]ClarityofDisasterPerson Going Their Own Way2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]KronosStoneIndigo MGTOW0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]ClarityofDisasterPerson Going Their Own Way0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 8 years ago* [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

I'll take your word for it! It is hard to be physically fit and much below average in most of the US; I'd put you at 1.5 SD above average attractiveness, by your description. 2 SD if your personality is also attractive.

[–]ClarityofDisasterPerson Going Their Own Way0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 8 years ago* [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

It is polarizing, which is good for your chances: a few think your personality is damned hot, others think it's unattractive AF. Much better than lots of "meh" votes. Which would you rather have: some people think you're an 8, others think you're a 2 - or everyone seeing you as a 5?

[–]ClarityofDisasterPerson Going Their Own Way0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Rian_Stone0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Title	Mo' Money Mo' Problems!
Author	Scurvemuch
Upvotes	10
Comments	215
Date	August 30, 2017 1:35 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/6wz6ah/mo_money_mo_problems/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/mo-money-mo-problems.266236 https://theredarchive.com/post/266236

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