Red Pill Rules: Paying for her on dates?

Dreamlancer · 2015-08-12T09:25:37+00:00

The red pill is about living a life that you can agree with. If u don't want to pay for your dates, then don't. If you are looking for specifics right now.

You already brought up the pay issue. Next time meet directly at the bar, not hanging out first. Order your drink either beforehand or when she arrives. Now I'm not looking to give you line for line dialogue, but this is generally how I feel the exchange should be handled if it comes around a second time. Some amused mastery, some dread, and some idgaf all fired in a single exchange.

You have a drink, she arrives and orders drink.

"I forgot my wallet."

A smirk and a sip of your drink with "I guess you're not drinking" will start the wheel.

Hold frame some here. She may swat your arm. She may plead to get you to pay for her. You really don't need to say much at all unless you can get some quick witted teasing in on some things she is saying. Other than that you can just smirk and drink your drink all the while ignoring her pleas.

Eventually she will see you won't budge and will then go for guilt trip. "You're really going to make me pay for my own drink?"

You can hit her with more amused mastery along the lines of "I thought that's what we came here for but if you are that eager to go back to my place." Which keeps things playful. Could lead straight back with proper frame. Although I feel that this while solving an issue for the night doesn't address the fact that this is a repeating issue. Additionally she may just as easily say no, and call you an asshole.

She knows she is there for sex but she doesn't want to just say she is there for sex and feel like a slut. But she doesn't want to feel like she is paying for it either. She needs it to feel right and flow for her. It needs to "Just Happen" she needs to be at this stage: "I was so caught up in the moment of it all."

So that's why she gets defensive.

So when she fires back that she won't just go to your house and have sex with here. It's her wheel spinning. Tell her blunt and short. "Then go." and continue your drink.

Holding frame provides atomic bomb levels of dread in that very moment as she is stunned speechless. She will look at you in silence. Ignore her. She will either pull out a stool and magically find the wallet she left behind. Don't bother commenting on it. If she is sleeping with you already, hiding drink money wasn't set to make you an orbiter paying for her or whatever. It's as I explained above for her own feels.

The alternative is that she storms out of there angry at that time. Although she will call/text you if everything was right. She wants it and she knows it. Shit tests are unlikely here in my experience. However comfort tests are abundant. Just tell them if she wanted drinks, bring over a bottle of wine at X time.

That changes the dynamic and location moving forward from a bar to your house. From then you can just say any of the following if your frame is tight.

"Bring over a bottle of wine at X for a movie"

"Bring over food to cook dinner"

Or even simpler "come over wearing nothing under your jacket." Now that the venue has changed from public to private you can treat it as such. She gets the feels of feeling like she is getting more commitment by doing things such as that with/for you, and being close to you.

Plus side you don't really need to pay for much anymore.

Now final words here. If she storms out of there and doesn't call back. It could be a number of things, but all of them essentially amount to her not being as into you. Just roll with it and find another.

Edit: Typed this up on my cellphone last night in bed. Went back through it today to fix the language fails induced by auto correct.

bea5tly · 2015-08-12T08:10:24+00:00

If a girl forgets her wallet or trys to play that cute shit... Do what I do. Tell the waitress/bartender that you didn't want one check and to split them. Watch how fast her hamster spins then.

Even better leave her ass there with the ticket. I can guarantee you she'll never forget her wallet again. Entitled bitches.

RPMahoutsukai · 2015-08-12T11:59:42+00:00

What am I supposed to be doing?

You're supposed to hold frame. Which means, you're supposed to insist on doing what you want to do, what you expect to do, what you plan to do.

You make a choice for yourself. You want to pay for dates - you pay, you do not want to do it - you don't. Paying for women on dates is not bad, neither is not paying. Everything else is just opinion and lifestyle choice.

Of course society (women-dominated), your mother and other women will convince you that you should pay for dates. Men who enjoy getting sex for nothing just for the sake of it will convince you that you should not. You should not listen to how you should behave, but rather make an informed choice. Get facts and make a decision. You should do this with everything, never default to something someone pushes onto you, think for yourself, consider the facts and alternatives and decide... and stick to it.

With paying for girls you seem to have already made a choice. You don't want to pay for dates. Then don't. If you would still have to choose, you could go along the lines of:

Paying for dates is more socially acceptable, meaning you'll get less unnesecary tension and problems on dates. This however attracts unwanted attention, in girls that try to exploit guys for things on dates, and means you will waste dates on girls that have no intention of sleeping with you but just want to drink on your account
Not paying for dates is less socially acceptable, meaning you'll get unnesecary tension, some girls will be repulsed by you who would otherwise end up in your bed. At the same time, you keep your money, and you don't attact girls who want to exploit you for money.

Think facts, reasons, consequences and decide. Simple! And no morals or emotional judgement involved.

If you feel guilty when you make your own choice, read "When I Say No I Feel Guilty". You have absolutely ZERO reason to feel guilty for living your own lifestyle, as you are not imposing it on anyone else. You do not force her to date you on your terms, you do not con her into it, you OFFER it. Openly. If she doesn't like it she can leave, there's nothing to be guilty of. It's the same with feeling guilt for non-exclusive dating. You're guilty if you tricked them into believing you're exclusive to get into their pants, but you are not guilty if they want exclusivity but you are openly non-exclusive and they still stay with you because they can't get enough of your cock.

Back to frame holding, if your plan is to come to a date and pay for yourself, while she pays for herself, then you give her no reason to think otherwise, and just do it.

She brought no wallet - her problem. What would you do if you didn't bring wallet to a date/event/anything? You'd probably either cancel the date, go get your wallet, or ask the other party to pay for you, promising to repay later. Reasonable, right? Then that's what you should expect from her. Tell her she can repay you later, or that next time drinks are on her. If she really did forget her wallet, then she will eagerly accept. If not, she actually just forgot her wallet to use you as an ATM, and in a manipulative fashion - leave. She's not what you're looking for.

You should learn to distinguish when people try to manipulate you. Useful skill to have. When you feel she does, you can act as harsh as you find acceptable. The advice bea5tly gave is perfectly fine, hold her accountable, and have her solve her problem on her own (she's a Strong Iindependant Woman, remember?). If she genuinely forgot her wallet, I don't think that's an adequate action though. It's fine to let her repay you later or just pay for your next date.

PS: And yes, you can find plates or LTR material girls who will be fine with sharing the bill. They do exist.

GarrusShotFirst · 2015-08-12T08:20:06+00:00

Eh, I have no problem paying for dates. But I have a fuck harem of about 5 chicks right now, so I'm really not "dating" one girl.

Mouthpiece · 2015-08-12T12:48:14+00:00

Don't date girls who forget their wallets.

It's one thing to make a conscious decision to pick up the tab everyone's and then, especially if your income is where you want to to be, and your entertainment budget accommodates the expense.

But these women are exploiting you.

I'm also not a big believer in "dates"with women you aren't sleeping with yet, at least the kind of dates where splitting the check is going to be and express or implied debate. Inviting her to a concert? Tell her how much the ticket's going to cost her. Going to a fancy dinner? Pick a place that you want to go, and if it someplace she won't be able to afford, decide ahead of time that you're picking up the tab. Otherwise don't go or just pick different company.

(Dying to try out that new steak joint? Take a business contact instead. )

And a woman who pulls that "forgot my wallet" shit on you should never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever get a second look. Pay the tab and give her cab fare for her ride home alone.

PeluzaHT · 2015-08-12T12:59:26+00:00

In my case, I decided that by social norm I pay the first time, and split the second one and on (I tell them this on our first meeting, take it or leave it). Money is not a problem, but it´s the meaning of paying. From time to time, I pay and have no problem with that, but it´s not the rule. Not bringing your wallet = goodbye, it´s the attitude behind this what makes me think like that. I pay if I want to, but don´t feel entitled to be paid or that´s your right for me to pay for you.

vys1 · 2015-08-12T13:12:20+00:00

My personal advice is no. Ungratefulness and entitlement develop very very quickly if you are the one paying all the time. Trust me. It's not about your girl being evil or manipulative or anything like that. It's human nature. When you bathe do you think, "Shit, I'm lucky that I even have water to bathe"? Of course not. But once water rationing starts, you start to treasure your showers. That's the way humans work. Give it to them all the time and they take it for granted.

Retro93 · 2015-08-12T13:30:25+00:00

You are feeling shame, not guilt. Allow me to explain the difference. Guilt is internal, you feel it because you've done something that doesn't line up with your personal code. Shame, however, is external, coming from other people, or in this case, your blue pill brainwashing.

You handled the situation well, but you should've cut the girl off the second time it happened. First time? Sure, I'll cover you, but you'll be paying me back the next time I see you. Why? Because that's how I would treat a male friend. I reserve paying for things as a reward. If she's been on her best behavior, no problem with rewarding that. That's not what this was, though.

kempff · 2015-08-12T08:18:00+00:00

You're 25 and you cant use paragraphs? Come on. Next time she "forgets her wallet", pay your share with tip and walk out. Tell her you "forgot her share of the bill".

I keep paying for them. I don't want to pay for them

Then stop paying for them, faggot.

What would you do?

I would read the fucking sidebar and put my omphaloskepsis-laden recovering-bluepill advice-requests in r\asktrp before the mods ban me for being a faggot.

could of

Could have

Is the correct advice to just stop having sex? Keep having sex but only tell them come to my apartment? Look them dead in the eye and say flat out "pay for your own shit." Pay for these damsels in distress? Guide me gentlemen.

...

2015-08-12T08:09:20+00:00

[permanently deleted]

DreDawgg · 2015-08-12T09:23:02+00:00

If she offers I have no problem paying for everything. If she feels entitled to shit for free its a fast next and never talking to that bitch again.

rizzla453 · 2015-08-12T10:55:24+00:00

My solution is to alternate paying for rounds with the girl. So she guys two drinks, then I buy two drinks.

Keeps it fair, keeps you out if provider zone and prevents awkwardness.

If she has a problem with that she isn't worth your time anyway

Hennez · 2015-08-12T13:29:53+00:00

Lately a roommate where I live tries to clash a bit with me in the subject (he's 45). I tell him how I've been making girls pay for dates and all (I tell him just for sharing an interesting story) and he says "you have to pay for her", "that's not how men should behave".

Without really altering myself I respond: well, if I happened to meet a real lady I would consider doing so, but they're all just women who want to have fun and not be held accountable, I don't owe her anything and I'm not under any obligation to pay for her presence.

Once we went out with some girls I know (the same ones I tell him the stories about) and I said "they are going to pay for half of it". He and the guy he invited insisted loudly this wasn't going to be the case and how a gentleman's responsibility is to pay for the ladies... The same lady that was fucking me some days later leaving her 7 year old at home one friday night until 3 am.

The problem is not so much that a gentleman should pay for a lady, that would be fine. The problem is that I don't see any ladies left in the wild.

Edit: grammar.

THE__USURPER · 2015-08-12T13:37:22+00:00

I live in a conservative area where the tradition of men paying still exists.. However I'll only pay for a girl if she is my actual gf..

As for fwb just buy a pitcher and she can drunk from that

thiasus · 2015-08-12T13:52:32+00:00

A few of these girls seem to forget their wallet/not bring any money

"Tough luck, maybe you can work something out with the waiter ;)"

Jessie_James · 2015-08-12T14:13:30+00:00

Generally, if you invite someone on a date, you should pay. If you invite someone to "hang out" then you don't.

Personally, I tell women something like "I paid this time, next time is on you." And I mean it. They cry every time they crack open their wallet but they keep paying. What is even more ridiculous is that most know I make 6 figures and they are making $8/hr, and I still make them pay.

No problems here, just be upfront about it.

Jessie_James · 2015-08-12T14:14:00+00:00

Generally, if you invite someone on a date, you should pay. If you invite someone to "hang out" then you don't.

Personally, I tell women something like "I paid this time, next time is on you." And I mean it. They cry every time they crack open their wallet but they keep paying. What is even more ridiculous is that most know I make 6 figures and they are making $8/hr, and I still make them pay.

If they whine, I flip the script and say "Why, are you using me?" "Are you a golddigger or something?" I tell them it's all about Give and Take, and if they just want to take, take, take I'm not going to stick around.

No problems here, just be upfront about it.

my_redpill_account · 2015-08-12T14:34:09+00:00

Do what you want to do. You don't wanna pay? Don't pay. They expect you to pay so tell them you want separate checks. Not your problem if they ordered drinks knowing they couldn't pay. Don't break frame if they try to manipulate you. Don't believe their lies/excuses.

_the_shape_ · 2015-08-12T14:45:53+00:00

This is the time that you use their own bullshit (i.e. feminism) against them.

"Since I'm a feminist myself, I'll pay for my half, you pay for your half - wouldn't want you thinking I'm some chauvinist pig who treats you like my child, now would I?"

beginner_ · 2015-08-12T15:18:50+00:00

You can let them get away with it exactly once. The next time, her fault. Pay the first time, then demand she pays the next time and if she refuses call her old fashioned, turn the feminist crap around in your favor.

If she refuses drop, her or for sure never go out with her again. Spending $50 on drinks, you could just as well get a hooker...

Probably best is to invite her over to you directly anyway just like Dreamlancer said.

"Bring over a bottle of wine at X for a movie"

if she refuses you can call her cheap.

RedSovereign · 2015-08-12T15:25:43+00:00

Post questions to /r/asktrp.

THE__USURPER · 2015-08-12T08:19:36+00:00

I think my main point or concern here is the following: Do you guys think that most women will not put out if you don't put out your wallet for them on dates, and if so, should we be nexting these types anyway? I am lost when it comes to "court or not to court."

unassumingusername7 · 2015-08-12T08:03:43+00:00

If you keep taking a girl out, she thinks you're dating. If she can't remember her wallet or otherwise respect your dating rules, demote to booty call.

Title	Red Pill Rules: Paying for her on dates?
Author	THE__USURPER
Upvotes	11
Comments	70
Date	August 12, 2015 7:41 AM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3gp5da/red_pill_rules_paying_for_her_on_dates/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/red-pill-rules-paying-for-her-on-dates.35485 https://theredarchive.com/post/35485

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