LWMA Lounge

Jaded-Ad-2695 · 2022-12-31T01:59:58+00:00

The more I read the less hope I have for my gender. If the alt right is the closest thing to an ally we can get than what is the point?

Moist-Quiet-647 · 2022-12-30T21:10:45+00:00

Has anybody here read Kate Manne's books? Are they as bad as they sound? I'd like to see for myself but, frankly, I don't think I have the mental fortitude to do so?

For those who don't know her, she's the one who coined the term himpathy, the notion that any empathy for men in need is bad.

Moist-Quiet-647 · 2022-12-29T12:32:02+00:00

I stumbled upon this post on AskFeminists from a guy (presumably) who works for a suicide hotline. He asked how to make suicidal men with "problematic" views change their mind. Because apparently, his goal isn't to save those men but to turn them into feminists.

[...] there’s a pattern at this one in particular where (problematic as it may be) there are a number of men saying they felt emasculated when their wives, girlfriends, sisters, etc. started making more money than them. If this were a personal friend or coworker I’d be more quick to call them out, but given that the target audience is people who are suicidal there are rules for how we respond to things.

Basically he complains that he can't just shut them down because obviously the men are suicidal and it would be counterproductive.

I expected the answers to be a massive shit show, to my surprise the overwhelming majority of answers is "don't". Most posters are aware that saving these men takes priority over turning them into feminists.

I will highlight this answer in particular:

Me: former clinical psychologist, & feminist.

You are not asking the right questions here. You should be asking “what is the most empirically-proven way to reduce suicide risk in this population?”.

It is severely clinically inappropriate to be assuming that a feminist angle is appropriate.

All that matters for suicide is “what works”.

Suicide risk management has nothing to do with any particular social/political theory, & everything to do with “what will help this person live”. If you have to lie, then lie. If you have to say something you don’t believe, then say it.

Do what works. Nothing else matters.

There was also one poster who insisted suicidal sexist men shouldn't be helped because they are dangerous. That poster was downvoted and apparently banned.

Seeing that not all feminists will put feminism before men's lives gave me some hope.

jacksleepshere · 2022-12-29T11:57:26+00:00

Just want to say this sub is hot trash. It shouldn’t take several paragraphs in a post to create a discussion on a topic. That doesn’t make it a lazy post. The fact that mensrights which appeals to a portion right wingers, and menslib, which hates men, are the only other options to discuss men’s issues is infuriating.

Some_Gun_Nut · 2022-12-28T21:04:24+00:00

I was reading a comment saying the reason that men do not know how to initiate and cultivate friendships is because of Toxic Masculinity does not properly socialize them.

The one problem I have with this perspective is that while I do think it does exist, it doesn't really accurately describe a good chunk of isolated and lonely men, but rather the "successful" ones.

Case and point: Andrew Tate, yes, he is definitely acting Toxically Masculine (or rather the character is, at this point social media kind of promotes that you don't break kayfabe to sell products, kind of like the Liver King scandal. Andrew Tate has every incentive to not break character and continue promoting his grift), there is no doubt about that, but what about people like me who were not properly socialized due to their own upbringing?

Because like, the traits that people attribute to Toxic Masculinity (Homophobia, sexism, aggression, etc.) aren't really part of me. Yet I am lonely and don't really experience the world the way that others do, so I feel a disconnect between what is said and what I perceive.

Dougwasneverfunny · 2022-12-24T22:13:58+00:00

I was listening to a podcast that I normally really like. But the subject of a #himtoo rally came up and the hosts kind of sighed as though they where sick of hearing it. But that was because the movement had been cooped by the alt right and I realize any time there is an effort to actually advocate for men it gets derailed and taken over and we are back to where we once where only even worse because now we just accept that even as victims we are villians. It feels like society is just accepting that it would be better off with out men because its impossible to address our issues without given people like the altright strength.

Society has made this shit our identity and there is nothing we can do about it.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-23T03:49:58+00:00

Respect is earned. The only thing Russia has earned is distrust & how barbaric it is. Russia will never be trusted or respected again. Any country that celebrates the mass kidnapping of children, the torture & rape of children as well as women & men deserves NO RESPECT.

Saw this on Twitter. Finally, someone acknowledging men along with women and children.

Suzylahnes122 · 2022-12-22T14:37:01+00:00

Just saw the post about how a woman murdered her step dad because he had “nudes” of her and she had 0 evidence to back it up

And the amount of redditors giving her the benefit of the doubt is appalling.

Some_Gun_Nut · 2022-12-19T14:46:46+00:00

I was listening to a podcast in the gym a few days ago. I can't remember the exact episode (I'll link if I can find it) where one of the guests essentially said.

"Men are tired of being viewed as success objects, women are tired of being viewed as sex objects."

Which actually kind of summarizes the zeitgeist fairly imo. I imagine many would argue that this is because of the patriarchy and this is why it needs to be dismantled, but I feel like dismantling whatever patriarchal systems they believe to exist is almost always used in the context to help women than it is to help both genders.

Assuming if the patriarchy does exist, what reasons besides altruism, would a man want to give up less power they supposedly have? It feels like everyone is playing a zero-sum game and not trying to help each other.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-19T04:03:46+00:00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_h1coEJmKc

Would be nice if there'd also be a video on the men of the Jurassic films. The series has it's share of strong male characters, why not also highlight that as well? No doubt such a video would be decried as being sexist :/

CompetitiveOwl2 · 2022-12-18T23:45:53+00:00

I want to share something personal here because I don't think it fits as a post. It's so good to find a place that seems to be about ending the gender divide and targeting gendered problems without turning it into us Vs them.

I'm white, I'm straight and I'm a cis-man. The truth is all those things get a lot of hate. Oh I understand that people who have shared my immutable characteristics have done awful things to many people. Small but incredibly visible minority though they may be I do understand that people have been terribly impacted and the reaction to being hurt is often anger and hatred. I understand that.

None of this changes the fact that I am a person. A human being. All I want is to be seen as one, to feel seen as an individual human, to be seen as ME before any of those other things.

I understand that it's hard to do that. I suffered at the hands of women as a small child. Teachers, my mother and my sister all wounded me deeply on an emotional and psychological level. As a young teenager I was a misogynist in the true sense of the word: I had a hatred and disdain for women. I'm not proud of it, I thank God that the worst I did was probably cutting off relationships coldly out of fear of being vulnerable. In my early to mid teens I also rediscovered my faith and that prompted me to examine my anger, hatred and unwillingness to forgive. It was a struggle, it was challenging but eventually I forgave the people who hurt me and I learned to see people as themselves.

I'm not here to preach or convert, I wouldn't feel right leaving my faith out of my story but I'm not pushing it on anyone. All I want to say, really is I know how hard it is to let go of those feelings. For young men here who might be like I was I encourage you to find a way to let go and view people as people, as human beings deserving of dignity and respect. Don't assume the worst but love yourself enough to walk away if it comes. In many ways it's what we're asking of the world so we need to practice it ourselves.

I'm sorry if this post is a total mess but I've had a lot of this welling up as I've read the posts on here.

Edit: changed a word and fixed a typo.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-16T23:47:06+00:00

No shocker that numerous feminist and misandrist organizations are supporting Amber Heard. Amazing how even with the tons of evidence against her proving she abused and mistreated Johnny Depp and even her admitting to it that she still gets blind support. Heard supporters are the same as Trump supporters, blind loyalty to such a terrible person all the way to the end. No amount of evidence can convince their supporters they're terrible people who don't deserve any respect or support. No surprise many of the organizations backing Heard have a long history of misandry as is.

Moist-Quiet-647 · 2022-12-16T19:17:53+00:00

https://twitter.com/JoshGellers/status/1603364564665602049

This is a take from a nominally "left-wing" academic.

Why do some GenY men prefer video games to real life? Because they're not being constantly shat on in video games for a start, but also because video games are "fair". One's achievements in video games mostly depend on the time they invested in it.

Offline, the world is paradoxically getting more horizontally egalitarian and less vertically egalitarian at the same time. Women are being more selective and are placing more and more value on immutable genetic characteristics than on status. If hard work ceased to pay off, then why bother? A simple and very rational decision here.

IRL as a MMO sucks. You don't choose your stats. Some are born with all stats maxed, while others can never progress no matter how many hours they spend on the game. And you can't reroll. My character sucks, so I'm moving to different video games. Simple as that.

(Do note that this tweet was made in response from a very long thread that also blames men for their own unemployment, but at least has the merit of being sourced and academic).

Note to the tweet's author: If you want to understand the phenomenon of "single video game bros", one way would be to ask thos bros to begin with. Also, re-read John Rawls.

Anyway, I'm going back to WoW. I've been playing for 8 hours today and that Death Knight ain't gonna level up itself.

Interesting_Doubt_17 · 2022-12-16T12:07:23+00:00

There is something I don't understand about male feminists.

They will always claim (just like any other feminist) that men are so powerful and can produce positive change for other people including men.

But here's my question: if men are so powerful in society, why don't male feminists use their power/privilege to help other men when they struggle with something (rape, DV, depression, etc.) and create a shelter/safe space for these men? I mean male feminists are also men, right?

Unless they know deep down that the average man is not as privileged as the HIGH-STATUS men of society. It's almost like they're just trying to pander to other people by virtue-signaling how woke they are.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-16T07:43:32+00:00

Found this great post on Twitter written by a female user and it should be applauded:

Anyway, misandry is real and getting worse and we need to call each other out on it.

Sexism exists in more than one way. Women can be misandric and it's just as awful as men being misogynistic.

Check yourself.

Amen to all of this. Misandry and misogyny are as bad as each other and it's time for the former to be recognized and condemned as much as the latter. It's always great to see men and women looking out for one another like this. Standing up for each other against injustices.

Sinistaire · 2022-12-12T14:16:01+00:00

I don't know where else to post this, so I'll just do it here. I often lurk on the purplepilldebate sub. It's often pretty toxic, but every once in a while, there are some really interesting posts.

This thread caught my eye, because it's relevant to LWMA issues, and this comment is one of the most insightful I've ever seen.

The highlight:

Leftism is tied to feminism and feminism is, in many ways, a political vector for women's staunchly capitalist/Darwinist attitudes around men and sex. Therefore, when it comes to men, most of the left's inclusive and egalitarian compassion for the suffering is replaced with a hostile, dismissive, bootstaps-esque hyperagential treatment of men, that chafes at ever implying men deserve any help at all that isn't a backhanded side benefit of things aimed at the "real" victims in society.

And so then the conservatives, (that are just going to lead men into the same Darwinist world that feminists will, except worse because they don't even support the progress to marginalized groups that men could benefit from on the side) smile, open their arms to these dejected young men and say "Hey we hear you" while the left screams at them to come back and take their beatings like real men.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-11T10:34:42+00:00

Came to this post on Twitter and thought I'd share it, I feel many here would wholeheartedly agree with it:

"Lets start by banning "The future is female" slogan. Such a hateful, arrogant, ignorant and divisive narcisstic slogan-it is loathesome."

I'd add to this not only is this slogan all of these things, but it also promotes anti-male genocide. The person who coined it literally advocated for reducing the world's male population to 10%. This slogan should be banned and even outright outlawed considering it advocates for genocide.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-09T22:43:56+00:00

I used to enjoy reading Fangoria Magazine back then but lately they've become way too political and feminist to the point I don't read them, anymore. I swear you can't read a newer issue they put out now without them going off on a feminist soapbox. I feel like I'm reading something you'd see on subs like FDS or GenderCritical. I'll read older issues whenever I can find them as back then they were without a doubt the top Horror magazine but they sadly had a bad fall from grace when they decided to get overtly political.

HorrorHound and Rue Morgue are much better Horror magazines these days anyway, though the latter sometimes can get annoyingly political but not nearly to the extent Fangoria now does. I always feel it's best to keep politics and entertainment completely seperate, no matter how much I may agree with one's views or stances on certain thing.

Gonalex · 2022-12-08T14:19:35+00:00

I just want to say that this place has woken me straight the fuck up, or at least even more than earlier. Sadly it does also make me feel even more distant from the average women because I know my problems and the way I will explain them becomes even more of a threat to them psychologically. Me having all these stats and knowledge to back up my claims is usually met with a very *SUS* attitude from women around me.

But honestly so be it, we all need to fight to make a change in here. May that be starting our own social media channels regarding this topic, getting our irl friends to join here, anything really. This place gave me hope for my future as a man and my potential son's future and I thank you for that.

NullableThought · 2022-12-07T09:52:21+00:00

I just wanna say that I just found this sub a few days ago and it's already one of my favorites. I keep thinking "wow, I'm not crazy" after reading comments and threads here

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-07T04:06:56+00:00

I forgot to say before but I also hate when misandrists like to deny misandry exists or acknowledge it but downplay it and claim it doesn't have systematic power like misogyny and that women don't take away the rights of men like men do with women. Which is blatantly misandrist in and of itself to say and incredibly ignorant. It's just trying to make enemies out of men and women. Last I checked, men and boys face plenty of disadvantages and often have their rights infringed upon; false accusations with no due process, still being required to register for the draft or face criminal actions if failing to do so, the lack of male shelters and clinics, boys doing terribly in schools due to bias, male victims of violence and rape and such still not getting recognition or support, etc. and let's not forget doozies like the blatantly discriminatory Gillette ad or "educate your son" meme.

Men and women face struggles and hardships, and there's plenty of work to be done in regards to both. But misandrists as usual just want to downplay and minimaze the inequalities and struggles faced by men and boys, and to try to trivialize them as much as possible to the point they don't want men and boys to matter. It's disgusting and divisive.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-06T05:01:51+00:00

I hate it so much from the core of my soul whenever you bring up that men are also victims of violence and experience things like rape, sexual harassment/assault, domestic abuse, etc. and that they also suffer these things from women and that violent and abusive women also exist, you get the usual misandrist retort of trying to silence women or only bring it up when women tell their stories. And a new favorite retort of these people is to say that mentioning male victims of female violence and abuse is like saying "all lives matter." Ugh. It just goes to show how these people don't care whatsoever about the rights and welfare of men and boys, and want to disadvantage them as much as possible and see to it they never get any recognition or support.

Don't even get me started when they say to start a seperate topic on the subject of male victims and not "hijack" when women share their stories of abuse. This is precisely one of the main reasons male victims have difficulty getting heard or helped in the first place when they're being told this garbage. We only "hijack" when women share their stories because all too often we forget men also suffer the same types of violence and abuse (from women and men alike) and this is one of the main reasons male victims continue to be overlooked and ignored. It's only male on female instances of violence that get any recognition or campaigning to stop them when we're just trying to make sure male victims (of women as well as other men) are also acknowledged and helped. Of course they care nothing for providing equal aid to all victims.

Moist-Quiet-647 · 2022-12-05T20:30:01+00:00

What is this sub's relation to r/Menslib? Are LWMA and ML "enemies", or is there bridges?

I'm new here. The people there seem to be of good faith but are limited in their reasoning by their adherence to fourth-wave feminism.

Deadlocked02 · 2022-12-05T10:05:46+00:00

There was a thread about the Korean hostility towards feminism on r/worldnews. I was (positively) surprised with some of the answers, including the most upvoted one. Sadly, it got deleted. Not sure if it was moderation bias or rules I’m not aware of. Link.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-05T08:21:08+00:00

I've said this before, but I really, really, really hate the negative association and stigma that activism for male issues has with the Far/Alt/Radical Right. Likewise people thinking you're automatically a woke SJW for being in any way leftist. Both stupid associations and misconceptions that need to end. I'm very liberal and hate how male issues are constantly ignored and swept aside. The rights of both men and women are equally important and too often people forget men have their struggles and inequalities as well, and it's time for this to get some much-needed attention and action taken.

Skeleton_Warrior · 2022-12-02T21:13:09+00:00

I'm still so glad and grateful this sub exists, as I've said many times before. It's great to have a politically left sub that's anti-feminist and anti-woke. I hate how on social media almost anything anti-feminist is usually very right-wing or posted by a MAGA fanatic. Likewise you say you're leftist or liberal with your politics people are quick to assume you're an SJW or woke. I'm liberal with most of my views and stances, but am also strongly anti-feminist and anti-woke.

Sad thing is the negative stigma associated with the concept of rights for men and boys is only going to result in male issues continuing to be overlooked and ignored. How badly boys do in schools and comprise the vast majority of dropouts, male victims of things like rape, sexual harassment/assault, domestic abuse, etc. not being recognized or helped, the lack of abuse shelters and health clinics that help men, the disportionate male suicide rate, the lack of awareness for campaigns to also end sexism and violence against men, etc. this'll all continue to not get any sort of attention as long as the negative association of male issues with the Right continues.

Tedfordshire · 2022-12-02T09:43:26+00:00

I just saw an ad on instagram for a woman only nightclub. And obviously, the hatred and hypocrisy was running completely unchecked in the comments.

They say it exists to get women away from men hitting on them all night. Which I can kinda understand. However not one person stopped to consider WHY men have to hit on women like they do? Is it because men are horrible people who love to ruin women's evenings? Or is it because the average man is completely invisible to women and has to put in constant effort to even have a CHANCE at a romantic encounter with one?

If the purpose of the club is to stop women getting hit on, I wonder if they would mind if a lesbian woman went in there? Why are men excluded but lesbians aren't?

Also, it's hilarious how the logical extension of feminism is always just transphobia. There were people in the comments saying that only biologically female people should be allowed in because otherwise men could just identify as women to get in and harass women. So yeah, that's the sort of argument we're dealing with.

There's nothing wrong with gendered spaces existing. Gentlemen's clubs have existed forever. What I do have a problem with is the sheer hatred that is used to justify this club existing. It seems like this women's club was set up to be anti-men more than it was pro-women.

sparkydoggowastaken · 2022-12-01T03:30:20+00:00

maybe dont relax rule 2, thats pretty important

slong35 · 2022-11-30T21:45:13+00:00

How do you all stay hopeful or motivated? I’ve wanted to ask this but I feel like this would be a good place to do so. Everywhere I look, there’s this harsh and unfair point of view people express regarding men in general and I’ve gotten so sick of hearing it. I recently finished reading the myth of male power and while I don’t really understand his reasoning for some point of views, he still brings up a lot of issues that have clearly gotten much worse since the 90s when the book was written.

I really want to be a fair-minded person and want to believe in the best that people could be regardless of race or gender but I don’t understand why I still constantly feel like the “bad guy” when I just want to see men in a more fair and positive light and the opinion I disagree with is openly aggressive and hateful toward that particular group, which seems completely hypocritical to me but whatever.

Anyway, I just want to see why you all believe in what you do and just need some positivity in what feels like a very negative political world.

Best to you all and wish you a great day whomever is reading this.

Blauwpetje · 2022-11-30T20:47:32+00:00

When I heard this song for the first time, being about 20, I hoped, wished and more or less expected love would start and be like this. Feeling alone, meeting a nice girl who felt the same, talking all night while looking into her eyes, and, without taking any too explicit initiative, ending up lying close together (more intimate than explicitly sexual to begin with). What I regret is not just that it didn’t happen, but that I changed my aim and my strategy, that I decided I needed a strategy at all. Are women not interested in men who are interested in love like that? Was that different in the ‘70s when this song was written? Or has it to do with (something I of course didn’t see then) Jim Croce looking tremendously good?

https://m.youtube.com/results?sp=mAEA&search_query=long+time+ago+jim+croce

Title	LWMA Lounge
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	24
Comments	86
Date	November 30, 2022 8:00 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/z91hhu/lwma_lounge/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/lwma-lounge.1141234 https://theredarchive.com/post/1141234

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