Looking for advice for 'nice guy' kids

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August 7, 2019

So in my becoming aware of more and more things I feel I am becoming aware that my son may eventually fall under the curtain of NMMNG. He has a few things going on but I'm just wondering if other parents have dealt with anything like this?

Post Information
Title Looking for advice for 'nice guy' kids
Author wtf_ever_man
Upvotes 14
Comments 19
Date 07 August 2019 02:20 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/249039
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/cn6eje/looking_for_advice_for_nice_guy_kids/
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[–]ReddJiveRed Beret19 points20 points  (6 children) | Copy


Not a lot there. I keep thinking about posting more.

One thing to understand there is no cure. you won’t stop whatever they decide. The best you can do is prepare them so that they will recall and course correct on their own.

No man can be convinced of what we talk about. Those days have left. The best you can hope for is that when they hit a wall they will go. Yep. My dad taught me this. Should have listened.

My advice is don’t go for the tropes of manhood, or the Miller Lite Masculinity as it’s being called. Example. My boys don’t play sports. I think those days of sports being the essence of what a boy learns are long long gone.

My oldest is in Civil Air Patrol. Search and Rescue qualified. He has performed 2 actual SAR missions this summer. He has a civilian pilots license (can only fly with CAP missions just to be clear). he is also going to fighter jet training soon (the USAF is making huge investments in getting young kids interested in being pilots apparently their projections show a shortage in a decade).

My youngest is in Navy Sea Cadets. At 14 a SCUBA diver, wreck and rescue certified. He has dived to 80 feet and has mapped out ship wrecks for tourism use. He has just returned from training that taught him how flight operations on a air craft carrier are performed. He is also rated by the USN within the sea cadets as Aircrew certified. we are just now exploring what that opens up for him.

My point is this. Lead them to things. Don’t just put them into the mill press of what ever one else does. Most people want thier kids to be sports stars. Those days are done. Yeah every kid learns to play ball but not every kid flies to military bases and learns some pretty cool shit that can benefit them later in life. Not every kid learns to be on their own at these young ages. It’s those lessons that stay with them.

I don’t have to be the guy that knows everything and does everything. I just have to be the guy that knows how, where to find things and then how to make it happen. Make them try a lot of things. Make them learn a lot of things. Even if they don’t like it they will have some pretty cool stories when they are done.

[–]InChargeManRed Beret8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]stoicstephen4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Your kids sound cool as fuck.

[–]JacquesOffDerrida1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Please do post more there, and on the parenthood one as well. In our few exchanges you helped me a lot with my young boys. I turned many things around with them and changed my mindset (and theirs) due to your advice.

[–]wtf_ever_man[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

I can see your points and appreciate your feedback. I am hard on myself(as I feel I should be) because I feel I'm not doing enough for them both(daughter and son). I do know leading is a weakness of mine and I need to step up more into that. I need to get them both out of their comfort zone and to try more things.

I have been trying to find them each "their thing" that will carry into adulthood. I will continue this endeavor and keep looking.

Thank you for your reply.

[–]ReddJiveRed Beret5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Finding their thing isn’t your job. Your job is to expose them. My oldest wants to lift now. His reason? He hates his skinny arms and legs and wants to look like me. Now...there is an element of setting the example. I have a black belt they do as well, I was in the military they want to as well.

BUT I just expose them to options. I am an Eagle Scout...they tried it. Didn’t like it. I was a High School baseball player, they didn’t like it.

Oddly /u/RStonePT touched on this in his cast on ego investment talk.

The more you focus on missing out, the more you miss out on just fucking living. Instead of creating memories, you create doubt and uncertainty. You will then question (or regret) most of your decisions, which, over time, makes you a boring unfulfilled person.

[–]RStonePT1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I should give credit to David Dutton for the inspiration

[–]WesternhagenWinner11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

Straight out of the book:

Nice Guys are created due to a fear of abandonment. Their parents neglect them, shame them, put unrealistic expectations on them, or use them to gratify their own needs. If you're doing any of that to him, stop it. If your wife is doing any of the above, you have to intervene decisively to stop it.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy

This is very low on details.

How old is your son? Is he showing behaviors your recognize? Or is this your own concerns because you feel like there's problems in you or your wife's (also you) parenting?

[–]wtf_ever_man[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Hes currently 12 so honestly in some regards I feel like he only has a couple years left before hes matured more or less into his young adult life which sets the tone for his 20s and 30s.

I am seeing patterns and I'm not trying to project but I do see similiarities between him and I. I'm trying to reel back my own shit because I know he will be who he is and I'm not trying to live life through him or make his choices but I do see things there.

Longer story short is that he has had a neuropsych eval done for another thing going on and reading the results its all right there on paper. This was/is his test, he took it, but the paper reads like I would've taken it at his age. I have him seeing a therapist but I'm starting to wonder if that helps or hinders and I'm playing that one by ear. I don't want him growing up thinking he HAS to go to therapy to be ok.

My wife is more or less .. uninvolved. Her standards for people are pretty low. Our styles are different and it can be a battle sometimes. Our communication lacks despite trying.

The eval talks repressed emotions, not being assertive and a few other more complicated things. He knows I love him and give him acceptance but he fears rejection and to be made the fool. Stuff like that.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

As /u/Westernhagen said, make sure you're not shaming or putting unrealistic expectations on him. I know from my own experience, this is what made me fearful of rejection (still am to an extent).

Encourage him to try new things, but be ok if they don't work out.

Even on this post, I wonder how much you're pushing him to "just be ok/normal/whatever" and projecting yourself and your feelings onto him. If he has real issues - well yeah, but if it's that he seems a little odd/anti-social/whatever then just try to expose him to things... be ok if he's into different stuff than you, etc.

The overwhelming pressure to be a certain way or to fit a certain social standard may be causing some of this on him - even if you're not intending too, kid's are very cognizant of these things.

May be worth a weekend trip with just him and you to talk through some of this shit.

[–]ArborioRice3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

What are you doing to raise your son?

[–]RP_PO4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Fix yourself and you’ll likely end up preventing that. Focus on yourself, the byproducts may or may not come. My mission is all about me, but I will leave a legacy, including my kids because that is what I want. In the end they will be who they want, but not for lack of discipline and tools that I will give them.

[–]helaughsinhidden3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

So vague... but sure

my son may eventually fall under the curtain of NMMNG.

AMALT. If hypergamy is the curse all women are subject too, being the "nice guy", abdicating leadership, DEERing, passivity, and weak behavior is ours. Asserting oneself into alpha behavior is learned either by family, culture, or in most of our cases, through pain and suffering.

I have sons 21, 13, and 8.

I was SO BLUE when raising my oldest, but he and I talk regularly about the behaviors he witnessed and the fallout. I send him and the 13 year old videos, articles, and memes. I've also lent them books from the sidebar that I own, but he hasn't read them as far as I am aware. I've made the 13 year old read some material. Specifically trying to teach him to not DEER, so I've printed some of the MRP posts and given them to him on paper to read when he's at my office. My wife (their mother) has hard wired herself as their primary source of approval and because of her nature, has programmed them to seek female validation. It's a mess and I am working hard to un-F the situation. The wife backs me up NOW but that only truly began in the past 3-4 years and it began as a trickle, still only at 75% compliance. So the earlier you get on it the better because mothers and culture are definitely NOT on your side.

[–]SailorAground3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Boys need challenges and rites of passage in order to prove themselves as men. That proving themselves bit is as much for him as it is for other men. What have you done to challenge him? What have you done to train him so that he has confidence in his abilities? What have you done to give him opportunities to learn self-reliance, self-discipline, responsibility, leadership, etc.?

Reading your post, it sounds like you've allowed him to drift in the wind or just haven't done any work to help him. Come up with a plan, take action, reassess depending upon how your plan goes, and adjust fire as necessary.

[–]PillUpAss2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I struggle with the same. Agreed with other comments that you need to provide more details. BUT..

Kids learn at select moments based on the experiences they are having. If a woman / women hadn’t crushed you, you likely wouldn’t be able to truly internalize RP either. Boys haven’t been crushed yet, so many RP lessons make no sense to them. All you can do is:

1 - teach them the basics that aren’t so hard to believe (you are the prize, the need for continual improvement, the benefits of lifting, what frame is, social savvy skills like AM and AA, apply abundance mentality to friends, etc.). Get him started on those basics early.

2 - wait for that narrow window of opportunity where he will be open to seeing the code in the Matrix.

He’ll still have to fully unplug someday, but you can make it easier for him.

[–]Rifleshoot3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Sons copy their fathers. Internalize RP alpha behavior in yourself and display it to him as well. Be the head of you household and he will follow in kind.

[–]Imaginary_Historian2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You have to do more than just "be alpha" for your kid. Sons are prone to rebel against an alpha if you aren't doing your job being a parent, and when kids rebel, they will rebel against everything you are.

[–]unnaturalcontrol0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I think another source that may help is The Rational Male: Positive Masculinity. The first section of the book is about raising children to have a red pill lense.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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