Discussion about nagging

gabilromariz · 2014-12-14T08:53:02+00:00

A man who "needs" to be nagged makes for a poor capitain. The man in the post is irresponsible, not aware of safety concerns, does not care for the dog at all or for his things (washing pants with stuff in the pockets). He also seems to fail pretty big in taking responsability for things.

As you've said, nagging is a sign you don't trust his ability to be a fully functional adult. So it's also a sign that girl needs to "next him".

That said, #3 is a very important distinction. I think it comes down to the tone and frequency of what you're saying, plus the important part. Screeching at him daily to pick up his socks is nagging but telling him nicely, once, to remember to shut the garage door isn't.

FleetingWish · 2014-12-14T18:17:23+00:00

I read the linked post. What stands out to me is that she thinks she has to nag him, but yet her nagging doesn't fix anything. That is pretty typical. Nagging doesn't fix anything, and in fact, it makes it worse. What nagging does is belittle the man, and makes him think less of himself. Men are less likely to be able to do things right if they don't think they are capable of doing things right. It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Nagging shifts the responsibility from the man to the woman. In her garage example she takes responsibility for the garage situation. When the reality is, he should have taken responsibility for it. But, he doesn't have to because she is in charge of everything. If you want people to take responsibility, you have to give them responsibility. And, yes, that means allowing them to make mistakes. People learn from mistakes when they have to take responsibility for them.

sugarcrush · 2014-12-14T03:57:40+00:00

Don't be in a relationship with someone you have to nag. Be with a guy who knows how to take care of his shit.
When I start to feel the need to rant (something like OMG I told you this like five times already, this isn't that difficult, nag nag nag).
Nagging is screechy and constant. A reminder about something important is polite and INFREQUENT.
Personal safety is huge to me so I wouldn't stay with someone who kept leaving the door open. Someone could come in and harm us, steal things, and like she said the dog has gone missing multiple times already so yeah I wouldn't stick around. Stop nagging and leave already!!

squirrelcuisine · 2014-12-14T13:42:38+00:00

I forget to lock my car at night sometimes (There is nothing in our cars what so ever besides some coins).. I do it maybe 1 time a month. I really dont know why.. My wife hits the remotes on both cars before she goes to bed. Problem solved. When I wake up in the morning I get a "Hey your car was unlocked last night!" funny comment.. and it is delivered in a way like she found buried treasure. I think about it.. and in my head I aspire to be better.. some times I will go for months with no problems. The thing is.. it isnt that big of a deal. Nothing happens.

to me .. the OP getting that mad about something that didnt cause any harm and was an inconvenience not an actual problem bothers me deeply. she posted in hampsterdam (2xnonsense) knowing she would get told. "You go girl"

<quote>

Today when I came home the door was open again. I was fuming. Fortunately the dog was asleep inside, but when I raised it with him (admittedly I was pretty angry) he said 'yeah, yeah, the garage door. You sound like a broken record sometimes' as though I was the problem for repeatedly mentioning it.

<quote>

yeah.. want to start a really nasty pissed off fight.. get this mad about nothing at me. Nothing happened and yet she is "fuming". It is so funny.. my RPW has learned or has always precisely been tactful and knows precisely how to nudge me when needed and also makes me feel like she ALWAYS has my back.

Guess that is why she and I have been married 21 years and probably will be another 30-40.

hockey_puck · 2014-12-14T11:54:27+00:00

My husband has a forgetful streak. He gets so focused on the task at hand that other time-sensitive tasks (i.e. remembering to eat, calling his mom, etc.) often fall by the wayside until the primary task is completed. We're both naturally absent-minded, so I have to employ all sorts of different methods to keep myself from being forgetful as it is! I was so afraid of mothering or nagging him that I never said anything for the first few years of our relationship. If I noticed he'd forgotten something, I'd handle it to the best of my ability and then let it go. He became a little frustrated with himself for his forgetfulness, and asked me to remind him of certain things. We use a calendar that shares events between our phones--I'll program the stuff in, and set it to alert both of us. So we each get a notification, which is useful and neutral--a computer program's reminder can't exactly convey frustration, and it's never confrontational or directed at just him. I'm not perfect and I need my reminders, too! Sometimes I'll ask him, "Would you like me to remind you about that later?" if I know he's going to be having a busy day. It's less nagging/mothering and more taking on the mutually-agreed-upon role of a personal secretary. A lot of the difference between nagging and reminding is how you ask (tone, phrasing, etc.) and how often you ask (there's a big difference between "Why haven't you paid the electric bill yet?! I've asked you five times!" and "Oh! I think today's the day the electric bill is due, isn't it? Here, let me check...") Often, if he'a forgotten something more than once, I'll just do it myself (as long as it's something I can actually do), and not bother him about it at all. He's always grateful when that happens--he gets that moment of panic when he remembers what he forgot, followed by relief (and a big hug and kiss for me) when he realizes that it's taken care of. Or I'll send him a text like, "Did you like the surprise I packed in your lunch today?" to gently remind him to take a break from working and actually eat his lunch. But unless your SO asks for help in remembering certain things, he's a grown man and can handle himself. True nagging is generally born from a lack of patience, and patience is a very important quality for all rpw (and all people, really) to have. Anyone who feels the need to spout off unsolicited nagging should probably take a deep breath and work on cultivating some more patience--if someone is worth your love, they're worth your patience, too. If it's unmanageably bad and he forgets really serious stuff, as others have said, he's not a good captain.

[deleted] · 2014-12-15T21:12:42+00:00

[permanently deleted]

PhantomDream09 · 2014-12-14T21:53:11+00:00

Here is a link to another thread that talks about nagging in case you (or anyone else) is interested in taking a look. :0)

What is the RPW alternative to nagging?

"Nagging" for me is when someone is repeats information that the other person already knows about in an irritating manner (either because of their tone or how frequently they repeat the information). The information is shared not because it is new or vital - but rather because the speaker feels irritated, anxious, worried. It does show that the speaker (the person nagging) doesn't believe or trust that the other person can remember to take care of the task(s) in question, and I do consider it to be disrespectful.

I'll quote my response from the thread I linked because I think it answers questions 1-3.

Most of the time, I only remind my SO of something after he has asked me to (usually the following day) simply because he knows what he needs to prioritize.

There are some situations (upcoming events etc) where it's appropriate to remind him about things on the horizon. I'll mention it once, he acknowledges. He may have to double check on something else while he's at work first to make sure there won't be a conflict, and as a back-up he'll ask me to check in again in a week or so.

Generally though, I try to ask myself "would I be annoyed if my mom reminded me about x?" If the answer is "Yes" then it's safe to assume that my SO would most likely also find it annoying if I were to remind him about x. Mentioning an item of importance once when my SO has a moment is all that's really needed. Nagging is usually an expression of anxiety and/or dissatisfaction - if you identify the underlying cause you'll be able to pick up on whether or not you are mentioning the item for a legitimately constructive reason, or if you're simply leaking some pent up negativity.

The one exception is the alarm clock, and it's more of a joke between us. I know his alarm is always set, and he knows it's set, yet I'll still ask him almost every night before I conk out if the alarm is on. Cue teasing and cuddles

I, on the other hand, can be very forgetful. As a result, I have to keep a running list of appointments and things that need to be taken care of. My SO is very kind though, and he always seems to know when something has slipped my mind and he will gently prompt me. :0)

Link

As for what advice I would give to the OP...it sounds like they both have different priorities. The gentleman doesn't seem concerned about the well-being of the dog (since it is a safety issue) and that being really neat/tidy isn't something that's a priority for him. The OP/girlfriend should invest in an electric fence that surrounds the property so that if the dog does get out he/she won't be able to wander far. I don't really like electric fences, but if it's used as a last line of defense to keep the dog from getting in the street or lost, then I think it's all right. Also, the OP/girlfriend could look into training the dog.

If the OP/gf doesn't like when paper and odd ends and bits get caught in the washer or dryer - then it takes all of two minutes to check the pockets of everything before turning on the laundry. If she's irritated and tired of trying to nag - then she should conserve her energy and just take care of whatever caught her eye (dishes not in the dishwasher for example). It takes far less energy to simply do the task than it does to try and force the boyfriend to do it.

If these things are ruining her ability to be happy, then she should leave, because it's not going to change or get better. She can't force him to care about things, or do chores. If he isn't motivated to do things, then she needs to understand that that's simply his personality. She's acting like a mother, not a girlfriend.

Her other option is to simply stop doing anything and try to wait him out. I don't recommend this approach as I think it's passive aggressive, and she'll only be driving herself crazy (she seems to have higher 'neatness' standards than he does). There's also no guarantee that this would eventually spur him to clean up.

Edit: Things like this are why it's so important to find a good man, someone you trust and respect. If they've been dating for any length of time, then his habits shouldn't come as a surprise to her. Moving in together doesn't change who people are at their core.

Lizziloo87 · 2014-12-17T19:27:31+00:00

To be fair, I think that the garage door thing was sort of a big deal since it was about the dog's life. But she could have handled it better.

Anyway, neither girl nor guy likes nagging. I don't think anyone enjoys it.

The washing machine comment she made seemed interesting though, I can relate to it:

A few days ago I took our clothes out of the washing machine and there was tissue and paper over everything because he'd thrown his jeans in the machine without emptying the pockets, when I told him what had happened he said 'well why didn't you check them before you turned it on?' as though it was my responsibility and when I said be needed to be more mindful of it in future he replied 'I'm always doing something wrong in your eyes, aren't I?'.

My fiance has said the same thing to me before (the "why didn't you check them part") after a pen exploded on our clothes. I did think it was unkind that he put all the blame on me at the time, but after we sat down and discussed it further we both decided that we'd both be more mindful about leaving things in our pockets. The issue wasn't made into a problem.

To be honest, its communication that takes the gold in my own relationship. Even though my fiance is somewhat forgetful I don't tend to nag him about it as much as I used to. I can actually feel negative thoughts now saying "he forgot because he doesn't think you're important" and recognize those awful thoughts as my own insecurity. He loves me and I know that, cognitive behavior therapy has helped me cut down on my nagging.

Therefore, that being said, I think nagging comes from two things: (at least for me) 1. insecurity and my own anxious thoughts. "stinkin' thinkin'" 2. poor communication

happy to say, #2 is pretty much non-existent now and when I feel that urge to believe my "stinkin' thinkin'" I take a deep breath and remind myself that he's just forgetful. Depending on the importance (such as the dog thing in the previous post) I would bring it up in a LOVING way, not "fuming" like the original OP expressed.

After all, I don't think her boyfriend intended for the dog to get loose again. (I hope!)

tradmarriageftw · 2014-12-14T03:56:12+00:00

This was starting to happen to me. My husband is pretty on point with getting stuff done, but he hates going grocery shopping and I realized I would remind him we should get going way to frequently. He knows we need to go, geez! So what I did was ask "hey, do you think I have time to clean the bathroom before grocery shopping?" and then he tells me the plan or even better make it easier by offering to drive when he's ready to go (something I'm relearning to do). I think this girl needs to figure out a new plan for the dog. If that means leaving it in the house or building a fence in the yard. It's been said here you can't change the man you chose. She chose a forgetful one and if she feels something important isn't getting done then she needs to take care of it.

Aerobus · 2014-12-14T14:41:14+00:00

I think men and women have different definitions of nagging. I think women feel its nagging it if they "have to constantly remind the man of doing something multiple times" (you do not have to, by the way, ladies), whereas a man thinks it's nagging it if the same thing is told to them 2+ times (yeah, you say the same thing twice and it already feels like nagging).

Here's my solution: Tell him something verbally once. If he does it, great. If not, go make him a list of the things you feel he needs to do, hand him that list, and say, verbatim: "I do not want to nag you. I know how annoying that can be, but I really would like to see these things get done. I'm going to give you this list so that you remember to get it done without me nagging you." Finish off with a hug and a kiss, and then walk away. (Side note: if you ever want to motivate a man into listening to you throwing in hugs + kisses will always help).

If you're man takes care of the things, you picked a good captain. If not, then you didn't.

KlaiFrai · 2014-12-15T22:30:45+00:00

Was actually talking about this to SO when we saw a similar thread the other day. I think his view boiled down to

"If it's a big thing and he doesn't seem to understand why it's so important, then just once explain why it's important and the consequences of leaving it unchecked (the house will burn down, the dog will get run over, people will loot the garage, etc). If he doesn't know why you keep telling him to do something, he's gonna think you keep making a big deal out of nothing."

"And if he keeps doing the big things after you've explained?"

"Then he's a dumbass who doesn't care if the house get's burned down. Run away."

"And the little things?"

"Who cares? You've got as many little things I could nag you about as I do. If there's no major consequences to them, just work with them. You know I don't do them on purpose, and neither do you."

SO is a quick learner if you explain why a system exists. And sometimes he'll even come up with a better system once he hears the reasoning behind the first. Sure he does little things that annoy me, but I've found that If I try to figure out the reasoning, I can sometimes help it (in one case the answer was just adding a wastepaper basket to a room, and he was surprised he'd never considered it).

Explaining the reasoning once. If he doesn't know why it's important, it won't be a priority, and sometimes by explaining, you realize it isn't life-or-death-or-bankruptcy after all.
You can tell when you even have to wonder.
Nagging includes attitude like "I thought I told you to.... Why haven't you... You're always doing... Again? How many times do I have to tell you..." A suggestion of condescension and exasperation. I remind SO of things in two ways. The first is on Sunday afternoons, where I come by with a schedule and a "Sir, here are your appointments for the following week" in by best secretary voice. This adds a bit of fun to the scheduling, and he has mentioned that he really appreciates having a personal secretary with all the perks :P . The second thing I do is on the day before an appointment, I'll mention the appointment indirectly, for example "would you like me to meet you after work tomorrow before we go to <event> or would you like to come home first?" or "Since you'll be busy for so long at <appointment> would you like anything special in your lunch?" or "You're clothes for <appointment> are ironed and sitting on the desk". As the week wears into Thursday, he's more likely to respond with "Oh, right, that's tomorrow!"
I think SO put it best. ". . . he's a dumbass who doesn't care if the house get's burned down. Run away."

SuperSlavisWife · 2014-12-15T11:38:55+00:00

IMHO:

The alternative is to first ask regarding your point. If you're playing navigator and you ask him "What are your plans if we end up on the highway?", chances are he'll have a plan. If he doesn't, make a suggestion, make it once, listen to his answer. If he finds merit, he will follow the suggestion, if he doesn't, he won't. If he doesn't follow your advice and it goes wrong, don't say "I told you so" or "if only you'd listened to me"! Do you really think he doesn't know that your advice might have worked better? What's done is done, let him work it out, don't rub it in and he'll probably, later, once he is no longer stressed and busy, have a laugh about how right you were. There is no need to make him more stressed.
When I'm repeating myself or stating the obvious. A suggestion itself is not a problem. Making the same, obvious suggestion twice is unnecessary. In cases of "repeat offenses", I just briefly mention the issue. For example, when Jon was stressed about changing jobs I allowed him to wear his boots on the carpets in the downstairs of the house because pestering him about it when he wanted to unwind would be unfair. Now he's feeling better I'm reinstating the "no boots on carpet" rule and when he slips up and, out of habit, walks on the carpet with muddy boots, I just say "Jon, boots". He then takes them off and I clean the carpet. Zero drama required.
Nagging includes repetition, infantilization, demanding tone of voice and rubbing it in if he ignores your advice/doesn't heed the warning. A suggestion or reminder is made once, at the appropriate time, having thought it through to make sure it isn't obvious, and let be if he chooses not to follow. If you find you're repeating yourself, you're either feeling insecure about his leadership or you're making your suggestion/reminder too early, when he is likely to be doing something else and may not remember.
That guy is used to not leading. He does whatever he wants and the only consequence of his actions is a gumpy SO. The only way to not nag about that is to not pester him about it, not try and make it sound like a bigger deal than he does (he says "sure, sure, door", so you just say "yes door" and end the discussion, letting your emotions go wild will not help) and to leave him to clear up the mess. He leaves the door open, dog gets picked up by the pound, he drives down to collect it, he pays, he closes the door when he gets home. If he kicks up a fuss about dealing with the consequences of his own actions then there are more issues than the negligence and the nagging.

WhimsicalWonderland · 2014-12-16T16:09:18+00:00

First off, I agree with everyone when they say that you should be with someone who has their shit together. A Captain needs to be a good leader, and in order to do that, he needs to take responsibility for what needs to be done and actually care to do it. That's the only way for a First Mate to trust him and feel secure.

However, a lot of things are very peculiar in different people. There are times when people will lose track of time or be engrossed with other responsibilities. There are times when people just want to relax and take a break. There are also situations where people just genuinely have a hard time remembering what tasks there are to do. As long as there is care involved, the INTENT is what matters. If he is trying to be better, give him time. An example could be that the post from TrollX focuses on the times he did not close the garage door, but what about all the times he did? Good behavior is rarely praised, but bad behavior is always criticized.

What needs to happen when you find yourself nagging a lot is to have more communication between you and your SO. How are you telling your SO what to do? Are you saying it in a polite way that shows respect? Or are you outright angry and disrespectful? Framing the mind is extremely important when opening up conversation. How you introduce the topic is a lot different.

What I find is that females notice and pay attention to these details more so than guys do. It just happens to show more that women and men care about different things. If your man is great in a lot of other ways, is it really that hard to pick up the slack and turn his weakness into your positive? Your Captain will surely be grateful that he doesn't have to worry about the extra responsibility, and it gives you brownie points for being a better First Mate. It is important to pick and choose your fights. Little things are usually nagged about, and can generally be compromised.

valleycupcake · 2014-12-20T21:04:23+00:00

The alternative to nagging, as I see it, is focusing on the positive. If you've picked a good man, he already wants to take care of his own life and do right by you. It's not always easy to do, but allow him to save face when he makes a mistake. He usually gets it, feels badly about it, and wants to do better. What you can do is, if he brings it up, ask if there's any way you can help. When I do this, my guy usually says, something along the lines of "no, what I really need to do is make sure I do xyz so it doesn't happen again." I then affirm his ability to do what he sets out to do and praise how far he's already come.
Men are far more sensitive to nagging than we think. It's much more important than we understand to approach him with kindness and sweetness. One time I asked him to turn down his car radio, as it was at what I consider to be an unsafe volume. Thankfully, he later gave me insight as to what he saw as nagging. He was right; there was something else I was brooding over that had nothing to do with him, and I was subconsciously looking for something I could nag about to make myself feel more in control. Now I am more aware and make more of an effort to be kind (or, failing that, at least quiet).
I don't trust my own memory. I will become immersed in things and forget even very important tasks if I don't constantly write things down and check my lists. I learned from working with my SO that I also assume others are this way, when they're often not. SO and I have started getting in the habit of writing to-do lists together. So if there's something I want to remind him about, I write it down and bring it up when we meet. Also, on a more meta level, I help him but I don't render him dependent on me for his action items. If he forgets to do something, that's on him. Of course, I will help him to fix it if he asks, but I'm not his white knight riding in to fix every mishap that might happen. E.g. last week he was supposed to help a mutual friend with a holiday project and completely overslept. He never called her to apologize or ask what else he could do. I see that as rude and irresponsible. But he's not a rude or irresponsible person. He simply made a mistake. So we discussed it during to-do time (factually, without me making him feel badly), and it was on his list to call or email her this week. I don't know if he has or not. But when we see her this weekend, it will be up to him to handle the interaction and any consequences that might arise. (I did tell him I would rather he not ask me to apologize for him, since that could convey a lack of unity. He agreed.) So I would sum up the difference as the emotion and intent behind the reminder. Are you working together as a ship crew should or are you digging at him to try to get some sort of emotional satisfaction?
The man in the post is acting as he does for a reason (as men usually do!). Either he doesn't see it as important or he's the passive-aggressive type trying to make a point. In either instance, further nagging won't help. She can kindly explain once, at a good time for him, why it's important and then just leave it be. He might change his mind to see it as important, or he might not change his mind, and perhaps she can investigate other ways of keeping the dog inside or re-homing the dog. If it's passive-aggressive, she will remove the fuel from that fire by leaving it alone, but if she's not committed and he does that over little things, it might be time to call it quits.

Edit: formatting

Title	Discussion about nagging
Author	rpMwafrika
Upvotes	13
Comments	22
Date	December 14, 2014 3:29 AM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/2p8bfx/discussion_about_nagging/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/discussion-about-nagging.85089 https://theredarchive.com/post/85089

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