Both a conservative think tank and a progressive college institute discredit major tenets of TRP. So why is TRP still a thing?

MelodiousTones · 2022-05-31T18:47:25+00:00

Hate can be luxurious and comforting.

juliuspepperwoodchi · 2022-05-31T20:43:11+00:00

Because manchildren who are used to being coddled their entire life are all Tyler Durden pissed off about the fact that money and pussy isn't just handed to them.

XihuanNi-6784 · 2022-05-31T22:24:30+00:00

Because like most things fomented in conservative echo chambers, it's not fact-based but faith based, with a massive dose of personal anecdotes and cherry picked 'stats' masquerading as 'evidence'. Also, most people have a lot of sunk costs in this ideology. They also want to face the possibility that it's really their fault, or that their loneliness is mostly bad luck and coincidence. People want the world to be meaningful and purposeful, even if that purpose is fucked up. They'd prefer the sexual dystopia they've dreamed up, to the real world where both men and women are getting screwed by patriarchy and capitalism etc. It's easier when the villains are women, as opposed to larger disembodied systems that are harder to challenge.

tenmileswide · 2022-05-31T23:17:23+00:00

TRP promises simple solutions to complex problems, a practice that never works but also allows for a lot of salesmanship to wallpaper over that fact.

Practical_Trainer249 · 2022-05-31T19:11:46+00:00

Because it’s just a giant pity party. They want everybody to pity them and feel bad for them because they think they are the biggest victims who have to endure the most suffering in life.

FutureSignificant412 · 2022-05-31T23:37:44+00:00

You can't reason people out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.

sernamedeleted · 2022-06-01T00:48:40+00:00

Because it's a cult. Cult members don't care about their cult being discredited.

JoeRMD77 · 2022-05-31T19:44:16+00:00

Incels are mostly introverts. That's the one common denominator amongst these men.

And the rest of the men who aren't looking for a serious relationship can best be described as having high "openness to experience". They're called voluntary celibate.

What makes an incel

xvszero · 2022-06-01T03:18:39+00:00

Why is antivax a thing? Why do people think more guns will solve gun violence? Why do people think there are death panels in Canada? Why do people think Bill Gates is microchipping your kids? Why do people think contrails are the government poisoning us? Why do people believe in miracles? Why do people believe in horoscopes?

Facts don't matter to probably half the population, if not more.

vcreativ · 2022-06-01T06:27:26+00:00

TRP is weird, no worries. Whatever the situation is in real life RP will not help. That being said, there are entry-level components that just make sense to any normal person.

If you want a good relationship (even just with yourself) you might want to consider finding a job you like and be good at it, take care of yourself emotionally and physically. And you know, buy a few clothes.

RP doesn't have a monopoly on self-improvement. This is where many people seem to get confused. The issue from my point of view is how it then degrades into sophistry and at the end you simply cannot trust anyone, not even yourself.

I've read the article. My conclusion, science should never be reported by an opinionated person. Selection bias will necessarily go through the roof.

Here's an example:

"Many incels quote a rule of thumb that 20% of men have 80% of the sex. Is this true?"

"It turns out, the answer is no. And of course, it isn’t! Imagine how much sex those 20% of men would have to be having! [...] the top 20% most promiscuous men account for about 60% of male sexual partnerings, and the trend is, again, quite stable over time."

First of all, I really hate opinionated language as part of what's claiming to be a report of science. The two don't fit together. If you're emotional while analysing data, you shouldn't be analysing data.

Secondly, saying that the 80%/20% rule of thumb is ridiculous but then stating it's ~60%/20% and so the problem isn't what was previously stated and has therefore gone away is just weird. For a rule of thumb, that's not that far off.

What would've been far more interesting is stats on some sort of measure of attractiveness (difficult to normalise I imagine) and/or mental health of those 20%.

My take, they might be doing well in the former (who knows I've definitely been surprised by exactly who is being promiscuous) but unlikely in the latter.

Stronger social circles and women's refusal to remarry give women the upper hand once more in advanced age when dating.

I think this could be a thing, it pays to have a social circle. I don't know if women refuse to remarry, I'm sure some might, and I don't understand how phrases like "upper hand in dating" are supposed to help anyone.

Unless of course it ought to be viewed as a competition and I just got it wrong.

Kappador66 · 2022-06-01T11:55:57+00:00

The focus on marriage seems so weird to me.

The role of marriage has changed since the 50s. Today it is very normal to be in a relationship and even live together but not marry or only are after a long time together. Back then that didn't happen, people just married their partners in their early/mid 20s.

So looking at the rates of relationships/cohabitation is much more interesting then the legal status of marriage.

To marry, you need a romantic/sexual relationship first. Incels by definition can't get even relationships, how are they supposed to marry somebody. Unless you want arranged marriages or something like that.

Also, 60/20 is still a Pareto distribution, just with different parameters in the distribution function. Hence this doesn't disprove anything.

prjj2001 · 2022-06-02T02:16:09+00:00

I'll give you a metaphor and hopefully it will make it clear if you are a spiderman fan you will recall the black suit arc (or at the very least one of them) when he had the suit it made him stronger but made him more aggressive and made him push his friends away and he almost lost himself to it until he realized what it was and got rid of it

That's what the redpill is to them its power but unlike spiderman they don't realize what it's doing to them even when they are shown

I hope this helped

loveopenly · 2022-06-01T06:07:34+00:00

Not to be picky but the study only shows data until 2015 which is before online dating really hit the mainstream. So their argument about the 80/20 rule possibly is being applied to mostly data about in person interactions (I don't see how they collected the data). In 2015 swiping wasn't really the dominant style in online dating, and sites like ok cupid and POF allowed messaging without having to swipe. The online dating system was different. Okc popularized the 80/20 narrative with a blog post but that was pre swipe.

Things have changed massively in the last 7 years and the argument here in my opinion just doesn't hold up. There needs to be more recent data to really understand what's going on.

I'm not defending red pill or incel ideologies here but if you are going to point to science you need to do it correctly or you are no different from those ideologies.

Legal_Plant_7291 · 2022-06-01T13:39:59+00:00

Of course the wall exists. It's not that women can't get married or have sex - that's the easy part. It's that they can't do it with the men that they want.

No woman really wants to settle down with an average/broke loser , even if tons of guys like that are available to date and marry. The problem is that the order women get, and the more financially successful they become, the more demanding they are of a man's income level and career success.

Women are now, on average, out-earning men and going to college and graduate school at higher rates. Soon, the already non-existent wage gap will be even more ludicrous. Women are just bound to become unbelievably picky in the coming decades. If you think it's bad now, you haven't seen anything yet.

The problem isn't available supply, but rather the demand for that available supply. All the good-looking/successful men are already taken, leaving only lower-value men to marry/date. Why would an older, successful man with options settle with an older woman when he can get a harem of 20-something babes? Yeah, exactly.

So yes, the wall absolutely exists when you factor in the quality of men that women have access to in their advanced age. Attractive, successful, confident men don't exactly grow on trees - particularly as you go up in age.

Title	Both a conservative think tank and a progressive college institute discredit major tenets of TRP. So why is TRP still a thing?
Author	carritotaquito
Upvotes	20
Comments	43
Date	May 31, 2022 6:31 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/v1wuh9/both_a_conservative_think_tank_and_a_progressive/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/both-a-conservative-think-tank-and-a-progressive.1117848 https://theredarchive.com/post/1117848

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