I reject a lackluster BJ -ends in fight

stonepimpletilists · 2015-11-25T14:46:10+00:00

Was getting her heated up not an option? Was there no way to guide her, or is it all on her to keep you happy... If you two were really that tired, it sounds like punishing her for trying instead of getting her to do better.

It comes across a little but hurt, but I would stop short of saying badly dealt with.

The one thing I noticed, I had to read through a lot of excuses to get to your actual story. Paragraphs of them. Then you telling us that her excuses won't cut it.

I wouldn't worry about getting her feelings, it only matters if you're a shit man who hurts them. Don't be shit

cholomite · 2015-11-25T14:52:19+00:00

The most important part of turning down lackluster sex is giving off the impression that you really don't care either way. If you come off as even slightly butthurt or pouty, you are in her frame. True outcome independence isn't just walking away without arguing, it's walking away with a smile on your face and no negative emotions towards your woman at all, that's the real mind fuck part you want to achieve.

If my gf gives me a shitty blow job and I just get up and leave and do something else, acting cold and distant towards her, but not necessarily mean or angry, she understands why. I wanted something from her, she didn't give it to me, so now I'm pouty and mad. She assumes im pouty and mad because I cant get what I want any other way. She'll ask what's wrong and want to "talk" and blah blah blah, but she doesn't really give a shit. She knows exactly what is going on in your mind and any discussion about it just backs up her belief that you're beta and she made the right call not blowing you.

The REAL mindfuck you want to achieve is turning down a shitty bj and acting like it truly doesn't matter. Get up, tell her "it's all good baby, don't worry about it" then kiss her on her forehead and walk away. You don't want to throw attention and validation at her, but you want to stay positive.

The goal is to get her hamster spinning as to why you are able to not get a BJ and still act happy and satisfied. She'll start thinking you have a side chick, got laid at work, whatever. It's a difficult balance to make, withdrawing your time and attention from her while simultaneously acting like you are completely unphased by the whole thing.

Hopefully this makes some sense.

FearDearg2015 · 2015-11-25T15:02:39+00:00

Lackluster sexual performance is an indicator of low desire. Like she is doing a chore that just needs to get out of the way so she can move on with the things she WANTS to be doing instead. Maybe you've covertly negotiated BJs onto the task list instead of them being on the IMPORTANT stuff list? You can't negotiate this stuff. If it's a lackluster performance, that means she's got something better she'd rather be doing. Outcome independence is not just about whether you get a BJ or not. Are you outcome independent about your marriage? You sound like you are settling for lackluster sex here. Just stop her if it's not going well. Don't try to adjust her head like she's some mechanical sex doll. If you are gonna adjust her head, then put some feeling into it. I have this picture of you lying back like a fat slob starfish and saying "left a bit, right a bit, ooooh, that's the spot".

If you want her to hungrily gobble your cock like it's the best thing she's tasted, then you know that she's gotta be feeling tingles for you. If you are not generating dem tingles, well, let's just say you get what you pay for.

EDIT: you say she initiated. There is a difference between initiating because she can't resist having your cock in her mouth any longer, and initiating because she knows that if she doesn't, you are gonna go all butt hurt and her life will be miserable for a while. That's probably where I'd focus if I was you. When you withdraw your attention, you don't want that to appear as a punishment. Rather, you subtly withdraw it so that when you give your attention again, she feels rewarded for something. Like she is basking in your light periodically, rather than her feeling like she is living in your shadow periodically.

TRPhd · 2015-11-25T17:43:25+00:00

Your description comes across as butthurt-pouting.

Freiling · 2015-11-25T18:35:12+00:00

This makes you sound like a huge asshole, and I'm not hostile to RP ideas. I'm guessing you left out a lot of context, if she's saying something like "we're not sexually compatible." This isn't about the BJ, it's about something else, and neither of you appear to be approaching it maturely.

At least IME, that phrase means I'm not attracted to someone. Are those 50+ hours of work leading to a lot of lazy eating out?

Renaissance__Man · 2015-11-28T05:34:23+00:00

/u/RPcoyote's advice got buried deep in a thread but I'd like to repeat it for those just scanning:

https://www.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/3u7wxi/i_reject_a_lackluster_bj_ends_in_fight/cxd8ezs

After trying that with no improvement in attitude, I'd kiss her on the forehead and tell her "You're tired." and walk away to do something else. No butt hurt there, just causally pushing her money back over the counter because you genuinely don't want it. Whether or not she's tired, she'll identify herself as the weak link and hamster over it.

But, that's without the background you gave. As others pointed out:

after two days of promises for a BJ - she initiates.

Is negotiating desire. It'd be a miracle if you got anything better than what you ended up with when you're doing that. You said she's been a freak before, but tingles only care about the here and now. You can't cash in on two days of rain checks like that—she's not sexually attracted to her own promises.

BluepillProfessor · 2015-11-25T17:00:25+00:00

The way to handle this after you have played your mean card is to act as if nothing has happened (because nothing has happened) and carry on providing positive energy to your family.

Play your nice card- all the way to initiating again. Then if she plays her mean card again (hard denial) then play you mean card for a bit longer next time.

I have said before, I don't think the takeaway is a good response to lackluster Starfish sex. The Takeaway should be used for a hard sexual denial and ONLY for a hard sexual denial.

Next time you get Starfish, throw her around, bend her over, and fuck her from behind.

She sees you are angry and rightous anger is a good thing. Was it rigthous? Or was it a little boy being denied his candy?

Carpy1982 · 2015-11-25T16:38:11+00:00

Well this just sucks. No pun intended. I had a fucking horrible experience last night that was very similar but not quite the same thing. I don't post here much but I got on here this morning to post a question about my situation and looks like someone beat me to the punch. Haha! The situation is this, me and my wife have been together for 15 years. The first 5-6 years she didn't want me to cum in her mouth. So I didnt. Then she started doing it and it became a given that she was going to. She's great at giving head so this just made it better. Although she hasn't always given a 100% best blowjob every time she always has no issue with me cumming in her mouth. So all of a sudden she starts giving me WAAAAAY better head than she has im years, in the last couple of days. BUT, she says she doesn't want me to cum in her mouth anymore. So I say, well I'm not letting you trade me one thing and take away another. She says she'll go back to it in her own time but doesn't want to feel forced. I said, well you do what you gotta do but you're not sucking my dick if you're not going to do it right. I smiled and just went to work. We've been making very good strides between us regarding sex lately. Now this.... Obviously it's a fucked mind game shit test and I'm not going for it. I feel like frame is very important here and I have no idea how this will play out. But like you ATH im not accepting this subpar performance from her. She says she wants to get back into enjoying sucking my dick (which is great) but I think I'll be royally fucking up by allowing this to go her way. Anyone have any thoughts on this??

plein_old · 2015-11-26T01:27:46+00:00

I completely agree with what cholomite said, but for me the real mindfuck is for us.

We don't get to complain or blame or feel annoyed, no matter what happens. For me, that is a real mind fuck.

Glennus626 · 2015-11-25T17:46:03+00:00

Sometimes you just need to shut up and take a shitty blowjob, since a shitty one is better than none at all. Considering the stress and bad work schedules lately, the fact that she followed through at all is admirable.

ApexApron · 2015-11-25T17:54:46+00:00

You're both busy people, lackluster sex is a waste of time for both of you

TheOakenshield · 2015-11-25T18:42:03+00:00

Lackluster sexual performance is a waste of time. Do not accept it. Let her know you will not accept it and that you have better things to do with your time and then do them.

No need to act a certain way. Know that you control how you spend your time and if you want to spend your time with shitty sex, by all means go ahead. If there are other better things you can be doing, then fucking do them.

Be honest with your wife and direct in this. No manipulation needed. Your time is valuable, she should treat it as such otherwise she will not be getting it. Nothing to talk about other than your time is valuable and you don't want low quality sex.

th3STlG · 2015-11-25T20:16:58+00:00

This is sort of where I am at. It is painfully obvious, even with effective dread and doing things mostly right, the sex feels like duty sex. While dating I had a woman that would leave my pelvic region soaked. The best sex I get now is mostly when she is ovulating and biologically craving it. Typically it starts with some back and forth oral or 69 and evolves into missionary and then into doggy so I can finish while she rubs it out. For quite some time I tried to get back to what it was, but you are right.... lackluster is worst than not getting any, so I am currently in a "no initiation" situation. I absolutely will not try. And if she does I am not accepting. I have had a better frame of mind removing the concept of sex from my day, and no fap. The right answer is to take the wheel and give her the tingles. I am still somewhat angry in general at our relationship. Even though I am managing things and aspects that really upset me are in my control now, I still don't feel the urge to put up with trying to get some. I know everyone will tell me I am doing it wrong, but at this point it is my decision I have made.

RedDeadWolverine · 2015-11-25T14:46:42+00:00

She'll run out of steam and appologize eventually. Just hold your frame and don't over think it. That's the kind of stuff my 4 year old daughter does when I correct her about being a brat. Once the hamster starts to spin that wheel just let it run until it falls over. She's using more mental resources then you are.

Ferocian · 2015-11-25T19:55:10+00:00

Whatever this is about, it's not BJ's. I get the sense that she wants some kind of comfort and is starting to believe you're not invested in her. It doesn't mean you need to put up with her shit, but I get the sense that she feels unappreciated and devalued. Sometimes being a good captain isn't about punishment and consequences, it's about inspiring the crew.

I'm not saying to reward her behavior, but she's possibly confused about her place in the marriage and how you see her. I'd say that I don't take kindly to threats about the thanksgiving thing, but that she clearly has something on her mind, and let's hear it. Make sure it's at a time you're focused and feeling good, like when you're freshly back from the gym and are on your game. Keep her on topic, ignore bullshit tangents, listen to what she says, come up with a plan of action and let her feel valued. Afterwards, if she isn't a bitch who tries to blow things up, reward her with sex. Afterwards, move on with your life and aside from following up any action you chose to take, consider the problem solved and bring positive energy.

Edit/Addendum: In my experience, confronting certain behaviors will make her be introspective about her own behavior in future. For example, let's say when you listen to her, her complaints end up being utterly bullshit. If that's the case, she wasn't expecting to be called on it, therefore just allowed her "mood" to come through onto you, which could've been caused simply by tiredness, but now she's making it your problem. Listening to your wife's grievances from time to time can actually help you, not necessarily because she has something to say that's worth listening to (although sometimes that is the case), but because she knows she'll need to present a case. That forces her to examine her own problems. If they're bullshit, you simply pick them apart, she realizes she's mad about nothing having to do with you, she apologizes and you've got your sex kitten back. As I said at the start of this paragraph, that forces her to put more critical thought into her own behavior in future rather than just making it your problem.

That only really works if you're good at it though. If it's not one of your stronger areas, you're better off ignoring her shitty behavior and if she has something concrete to say, wait to let her spell it out.

TrainingTheBrain · 2015-11-25T14:43:29+00:00

Driving long distances, working 50 + hr weeks. Needless to say sex, for both of us is not a high priority due to the exhaustion we both feel

Failure of leadership man, you need to make time. As /u/[deleted] said, these are excuses WE ARE ALL BUSY AS FUCK

She's very good at doing it - not always when I want but thats fine because Ive become outcome independent

Outcome Independence does not mean you accept sub par performance.

after two days of promises for a BJ

You don't plan that type of shit, like Nike you Just Do It. Also, is this your wife? It seems like you aren't leading your family and now you're experiencing the entirely avoidable shit show.

She'd blow a dominant male like a champ if she felt he deserved it.

cegh · 2015-11-30T14:47:21+00:00

There are many options you can use:

Give her a pat on the head to tell her to stop and say "that's enough". If she asks why, tell her you're not feeling it. She will understand it's because of her and question how you are so calm, thinking you are getting it from somewhere else and better. As someone else stated, she is losing her power.

Either she will ask to try again, or hamster for a bit and give better next time.

The better solution by far. Teach your woman how to give a good BJ that you enjoy and tell her when she does things you like. Reward it with a moan and by telling her you really like that. Give it a name so next time when your BJ suck, she knows what you like.

If she doesn't do it like she did before, then feel free to move to option A due to lack luster.

After she finishes you off, tell her what you enjoyed and what you didn't(if any) and then something else you enjoyed (the sandwich technique).

Eventually you won't have to do this again as she will know exactly how you like your BJs.

For guys where their woman suddenly stops you from cumming on the face or mouth. You do it anyway. If it is mid BJ and she says that, it's a shit test. You pass by saying "we'll see about that" and push her on you more.

Your woman shouldn't dictate how you enjoy a BJ, so don't let her.

Title	I reject a lackluster BJ -ends in fight
Author	AgainstTheHerd
Upvotes	3
Comments	75
Date	November 25, 2015 2:33 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MarriedRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/3u7wxi/i_reject_a_lackluster_bj_ends_in_fight/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MarriedRedPill/i-reject-a-lackluster-bj-ends-in-fight.200660 https://theredarchive.com/post/200660

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