Reproductive rights

Ev1sc4rator · 2021-01-09T21:34:29+00:00

Paternity tests at birth and not being legally required to pay child support if you’re on the birth certificate but not the father

duhhhh · 2021-01-10T00:41:31+00:00

The right not to be a parent. The right not to let their rapist be a parent of their offspring.

After Hermesmann v Seyer set the precedent, courts around the country have decided that male victims of women owe the perpetrators child support for decades, while other precedents and laws generally allow female victims many options to get rid of the product of their rapes.

Hermesmann successfully argued that a woman is entitled to sue the father of her child for child support even if conception occurred as a result of a criminal act committed by the woman.

E.g.

Alabama man - https://law.justia.com/cases/alabama/court-of-appeals-civil/1996/2950025-0.html

Arizona boy - https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/09/02/statutory-rape-victim-child-support/14953965/

California boy - https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1996-12-22-9612220045-story.html

Others in this paper "Victims with responsibilities" -https://lawpublications.barry.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1017&context=cflj

There are many others out there. I do not believe there has yet been a single case where a boy or man has gotten out of paying child support to an adult woman that statutory raped, raped, sperm jacked, etc.

The good news is that in recent years feminist lobbiests have pushed for laws to prevent rapists from getting child custody. Without custody the child wouldn't be raised by a rapist and the victim wouldn't owe child support. So the day that a male doesn't owe his perpetrator may be coming soon. The less good news is that just over half the states that passed these laws passed them as the feminist lobbiests proposed them - only preventing rapist fathers from getting custody. (https://www.ncsl.org/research/human-services/parental-rights-and-sexual-assault.aspx)

Terrell v Torres recently set a precedent and invalidated a signed contract to let a woman use embryos created with her ex and have him owe child support. https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona/2019/03/18/arizona-court-ruling-use-preserved-embryos-without-ex-husbands-consent-ruby-torres/3205867002/

In several other cases women who forged her ex's signature to implant have been awarded child support from the unwilling father. E.G. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5687477/Ex-husband-ordered-pay-child-support-former-wife-forged-signature-undergo-IVF.html

Reproductive coersion of men is also an issue that would be drastically reduced with financial abortion.

approximately 10.4% (or an estimated 11.7 million) of men in the United States reported ever having an intimate partner who tried to get pregnant when they did not want to or tried to stop them from using birth control

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reproductive_coercion

What about IVF with sperm taken from a condom without the man's consent?

https://www.mommyish.com/woman-steals-ex-boyfriends-sperm-has-twins-sues-for-child-support-836/

How about when they only engage in oral sex which should have no pregnancy risk?

https://rollingout.com/2014/02/04/woman-uses-sperm-oral-sex-get-pregnant-force-man-pay-child-support/

Financial abortion would solve all the financial issues for victimized males and remove incentives for women to do these things, but many pro-choice folks immediately start making pro-life talking points that if he didn't want a kid he should have used a condom or kept it in his pants.

UnHope20 · 2021-01-10T01:32:08+00:00

Mandatory paternity tests. Depending on the nation/community 1-34% of children are the result of extra-pair copulation. This is a serious public health issue since people need to know whether or not they have a health issue in their family. This happened to someone that I know. His mother had an affair and told no one. The guy ended up having a serious health issue and almost died. EDIT: Because his dad passed a condition on to him.
Legal financial abortion. Women have the ability to abort a pregnancy, put their child up for adoption or give the child up to the state no questions asked via safe haven laws. Men have to pay, pay or pay. Spurglers can even take a man to court for child support.
Not being obligated to pay for a child who is not a biological relative.
No time limit to present paternity tests to court. In most places, a man is obligated to support a child if he is deceived into believing the kid is his. In the US, once legal paternity has been established (2+ yrs) the court will still require a guy to pay for the kid if he discovers that it isn't his.
Not being obligated to pay for a child that was conceived via the rape of the father. In the US, a man can be obligated to pay child support to a woman who sexually assaults him and gets pregnant. This has even been applied to guys who were molested as kids and managed to impregnate their attacker. This happened to a guy who was molested as a 13 year old.

g1455ofwater · 2021-01-09T22:31:58+00:00

Men should be able to abort all responsibility to the child before birth like women can do to create equality(isn't it weird feminist that claim to be for equality aren't pushing for this). If men want that they can write on a form that they are choosing to abort and send it in before the child is born.

CageyRelic · 2021-01-10T04:29:31+00:00

Give men an equal amount of time to consider financially aborting as a woman is allowed to consider an elective abortion. In the states with six week bans, the great majority of women won't know they're pregnant until the deadline has already passed. To reflect the realistic consequences of these bans, men will not be granted any period of consideration. In places where a woman has a more reasonable amount of time to act, let a man be given the same number of months from the time the mother can prove he was notified of the pregnancy/child existing to decide. Let the laws account for time needed to file whatever paperwork is necessary to terminate his parental rights and responsibilities, but he must prove the process of filing began before the deadline ended. Watch how quickly everyone starts to care about the rights and freedoms of the opposite sex.

craigmunday · 2021-01-10T00:28:03+00:00

Women's coercion of men's reproduction needs a reasonable legal response.

Women need to be held accountable for this form of intimate partner violence and governments need to stop telling men to take responsibility for women's abuse

MRMRising · 2021-01-10T14:17:32+00:00

" If a woman makes a unilateral decision to bring pregnancy to term, and the biological father does not, and cannot, share in this decision, he should not be liable for 21 years of support... autonomous women making independent decisions about their lives should not expect men to finance their choice. "

- Karen DeCrow

Bzaren · 2021-01-11T04:05:00+00:00

The right to sign away your rights as a parent.

if a woman gets pregnant because she didn't take necessary precautions to avoid it, then she can get an abortion to avoid the responsibilities of being a parent.

if a man gets a woman pregnant because he didn't take necessary precautions to avoid it, then tough luck, should have worn a condom, you're a father now, man up, look after the kid, or spend the next 18 years giving over a percentage of your paycheque.

Obviously we can't go around forcing women to have abortions if you knock them up, as abortions can possibly have long term health negatives. and it's nobodies place to decide that risk for someone else.
But what we can do is say "look, i never wanted to be a parent, i'm out, if you chose to have this pregnancy, i'll have no contact with the child, no parental rights, and i'm not funding their life either."

Dikki93 · 2021-01-10T02:03:22+00:00

I'm not sure if it is a legal issue or just something countries don't practice but being able to adopt as single man

craigmunday · 2021-01-10T11:04:54+00:00

Men need access to human egg banks and reasonable surrogacy laws so we can decide whether the or not we are going to have our own children

craigmunday · 2021-01-10T00:25:50+00:00

Men need to be offered support when women abort their unborn children. Currently there is absolutely not empathy given to men when women abort our children

romeomorphism · 2021-01-09T22:47:08+00:00

Every human has half their mother and half their father's DNA.
You can't get around that women have to carry it while it's growing.
Just b/c she does biologically does NOT mean she gets sole control over it.
If a woman wants to abort it and he doesn't it should be taken to court WITH an unbiased physician. Not his or her doctor.
Fact: They both had their 'fun' and it's too late to course correct. She can give it up for adoption after she gives birth. The father can relinquish any rights to the child and likewise does NOT owe can spousal support if they are married.
If a married woman is so willing to kill a baby then she can lose her 'precious' marital support as well.

boundarychimps · 2021-01-10T03:38:44+00:00

The fundamental problem is that reality isn't equal. Women have the ability to induce miscarriage or in the modern world get an abortion, and also can't not know that they're having a kid. Men don't necessarily have to know (ONS etc) and can't actually do anything absent interpersonal violence which would be rightly prosecuted.

Probably the closest we can get is that a man's right to abdicate responsibility (financially) for unwanted children should be the same as a woman's right to abdicate responsibility (by giving them up for adoption or whatever). Which actually is a completely separate issue from abortion, which is what I usually see this question interpreted as being about.

UnorthodoxThinker · 2021-01-09T21:53:01+00:00

If abortion has to be legal then child support shouldn't be able to be court mandated. Also the father should have to consent before the mother can have an abortion. If a woman makes a false pregnancy claim to manipulate a man into paying child support but isnt actually pregnant he should be reinbursed.

Ye_olde_quagswagger · 2021-01-10T19:29:59+00:00

I've thought a lot about abortion. A woman can abort a child but that child is just as much the father's as it is the mother's. Imagine having your partner abort your baby behind your back. A horrifying thing to happen to anyone.

I think we can all agree that dragging a pregnant woman off to force an abortion is terrible; take China's one child policy for example.

But where is the justice in it being legal to do practically the same to fathers? The problem here is how to solve it. You could have couples sign an agreement when they try to conceive that says both parents want the child. Should one of them choose not to honour that agreement, it could then be settled in a court of law.

This seems the most plausible solution to me, though perhaps a little inconvenient. My first solution was that both parents would need to officially agree to an abortion, but that's a shitty solution since there are so many possibilities unaccounted for. Like rapists who want to keep the child and then sue for money, or a couple that's broken up where one tries to screw over the other for fun.

The only issues I can see with my current solution are unforseen pregnancies, emotional blackmail and putting your trust in the courts. All if which are very capable of screwing over someone's life very well. Now, unforseen pregnancies might still be solved by coming to an agreement together and putting that on paper, though there's obviously no guarantee that there will be an agreement.

It's tricky this. I'd like to see fathers have more say in their kid's life, so very much. But I can't seem to find a proper working solution for this one.

Anyway, I guess that's what I was thinking about. Any thoughts anyone?

DebateAI · 2021-01-11T11:38:34+00:00

Ban abortion. Both parents can forfeit parenthood at birth. Until then, they are the legal guardians of the kid and share the costs. like pre natal care, vitamins etc.

Done. Full equality, and the child gets to live

Echo_llama · 2021-01-10T04:11:56+00:00

Being able to choice to have sole custody of a baby if the mother wants to abort. Two people made that baby and the choice to kill an innocent child against one of the parents wishes isn’t right.

SukiSaito · 2021-01-10T04:24:20+00:00

The OP asks a question which is very difficult to answer for an entire population of men.

Each situation is different, that's the problem, and the reality.

It all depends on if the man sticks around. That's just what I believe, I don't know anything.

ImplodedPotatoSalad · 2021-01-10T14:10:35+00:00

Right to retract consent to be a parent no matter why, or when, or under what circumstances. With all previous financial expenses returned with apropriate interest, without question, by the mother.

Diesel-66 · 2021-01-10T01:02:11+00:00

Wear a condom. Get a vasectomy. Get a paternity test before paying/signing anything

Title	Reproductive rights
Author	jessi387
Upvotes	108
Comments	144
Date	January 9, 2021 9:29 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/ktzv9u/reproductive_rights/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/reproductive-rights.836378 https://theredarchive.com/post/836378

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