Estrogen/fertility doesn't really decline until late 20s, so what is the logic of only dating teenagers?

MissPearl · 2014-04-11T12:26:48+00:00

Partially because either the audience is <25 (which a lot of RP guys are) and thinks 35 is impossibly old. Others think of the porn "just 18!" or TV show version of an 18 year old are what they are really like, even though the parts are typically played by older actresses.

Some of them have a fetish (school girls being a common male shtick) and/or want to be petulantly shocking . Sometimes they can't stand thinking that a woman had past partners or standards based on same.

There is also the idea that women are on some sort of natural blossoming and wilting trajectory, where the reality is that for a lot of girls 14-19 was awkward body fat or being gawky and thin and acne city. Similarly there is the fantasy that girls poof into sexy and get surrounded by suitors- rather than the sort of stuff most teenagers are dealing with is family baggage and limited access to the outside world and not knowing how to dress or behave in relationships. There is a reason why describing something as "highschool" is a pejorative.

Sometimes it is because they want really shallow, transient relationships, and aren't down for LTRs- and they feel teens and early twenties women are more likely to think they want that deal.

undercook3dchicken · 2014-04-12T03:49:36+00:00

Coming from someone with a forever-teenager face, when older dudes approach me it seems to be about power and a desire for innocence/fun. It's kinda unsettling. It's funny, whenever I approach men (like at a party or a bar) they actually are usually concerned about my age and that I'm "too young."

AdmiralVonJackass · 2014-04-11T01:48:12+00:00

Not opposed to dating quality women that are 25-35, but where are they. Eliminate the ones that are married or taken, that are over-weight, that have substance abuse, children or mental problems, and you are left with maybe 1:100 of them that are even worth seeing. Things usually don't work out with every person you date, so at a 25% success ratio, you would have to meet 400 older women before you find one that can work.

Younger women have less issues with physical appearance, bad histories, less exposure to STDs, and less expectations. At the same level of attractiveness, they are less jaded and easier to impress.

Id say 1:5 younger women are sexy enough to date, and not in any serious form of relationship. So if we take use a compatibility percentage of 25, your success rate will be in the 1:20 range, a much less intimidating figure.

goatismycopilot · 2014-04-11T01:44:54+00:00

This really only applies to women who potentially want a LTR with a TRP so if they all want to date and marry 18 year olds that just means there is a pool of non TRP dudes. I am post wall but even when I was was "pre wall certified" I would not have wanted to date TRP. That is what I find interesting, there seems to be an assumption that women should be in a panic about this because they are going to miss out on a tasty crop of TRP dudes, if you don't want to date them it wasn't an opportunity missed.

If terpers wanna date and marry exclusively in the 18-21 range, oh well.

FortunateBum · 2014-04-14T18:45:31+00:00

I'm sorry, but you have the biology all wrong.

Women are most fertile just after puberty. This is usually around 16. (And no, teen births are not inherently unhealthy.)

There is a slow decline, better described as a plateau from about 16-25. There is a much steeper decline from about 25-35. Modern medicine considers 35+ a "geriatric birth". Many women will start hitting menopause in their mid 30s. Some will remain fertile almost until 60, but it's rarer.

Nature intended us to hit puberty, start fucking, have babies. There's a reason legal marriage age - even today - starts at 16.

My whole life I grew up hearing this BS about the dangers of teen pregnancy and waiting to have babies etc. It's all lies. If you read the literature, you'll see that 16 is about maximum fertility for a woman.

For a man, there is a similar decline from 16 on, but it's much less steep and never falls off a cliff as with menopause. True, there are some sperm quality issues as the man ages, but these are much less important than those of the mother. The mother's body is most responsible for the health of the baby - it's living in her for 9 months, after all. There are non-genetic traits passed on from the mother to the baby so a fit mother is extremely important from a biological perspective.

I'm really sick of the misinformation.

through_a_ways · 2014-04-11T05:48:54+00:00

1.) If it's all about looks (which I can imagine would be the reason for specifically dating 18-year-olds) do you really think women age rapidly between the ages of 18 and 24?

Yes, women really age pretty significantly between the ages of 18 and 24. Not all, but it's certainly very noticeable. Tons of girls I was attracted to in high school look pretty "meh" now, and I'm not even 24 yet.

2.) If it's not about looks, is it that you are turned on by innocence/youth as an "idea" regardless of how a woman looks (ie: a gorgeous 29-year-old who has slept with 10 guys wouldn't do it for you, solely because of her age and history)? Is it a personality thing- are 18-year-olds just nicer and more easy-going than women in their 20s? I will concede that some older women become quite bitter, harsh and rude (i've seen it here...)

Personally, teenaged girls seem a lot nicer to be around. Not in a sexual way, they just seem to act more pleasant and smiley and feminine.

3.) If it is about innocence, I imagine most 18-year-olds who go home with 40-year-old men they just met are probably a lot less innocent than any random woman in her 20s you meet off he street. If innocence is the issue, then would you still be attracted to an 18-year-old who had already slept with loads of guys?

I would be sexually attracted to a woman based on what she looks like. If the 18 year old had slept with loads of guys, it wouldn't change my attraction, but it would change what I thought of her consciously.

GaiusScaevolus · 2014-04-11T04:27:41+00:00

I approach it more from the socialization aspect of it all. A 25 year old has already (probably) spent 4+ years getting feminism (and probably more than a few dicks) drilled into her. She's been told a lot of the inane leftist, self entitled feminist bullsh*t that unfortunately increasingly defines the culture of the American collegiate system. She has also, in all likelihood, gained a noticable amount of weight and made herself less physically attractive as well.

Not that this is always the case, but the younger the woman, the less 'baggage' I have to deal with and fewer undesirable habits she has.

Aerobus · 2014-04-11T02:13:58+00:00

As someone who is very red, let me give you my perspective:

But anyway, fertility begins its decline at 30 and then drops more severely at 35. A 25-year-old woman is going to have a pretty easy time getting pregnant, not too different from an 18-year-old.

Suppose a man wants to have kids before fertility even becomes problematic. With that being said, he'd like to have all of his kids by his wife's age being 25/26 at the latest. This means she'll have to get pregnant at age 24/25 at the latest. Assume that the man wants two kids--she'll have to get pregnant at 21/22 (this is giving a little over a year gap in between pregnancies which is pretty much required (unless you're wonder woman)).

Now, RP men heavily are against marriage, but there are a few men who still want to. Those men want to be able to trust that woman as much as possible, so he needs to know her for at least 2-3 years during which period they have been dating and engaged in an LTR. This means they will have to have met when she's 18/19.

This is one reason why Men want to date women that are very young.

Also, the men I see who exclusively pursue teenagers also seem not to want children or marriage,

Another reason is simply because men like younger women. You have to understand, the mentality of TRP is basically to stop giving a fuck what people think and do what you want for yourself. Provided that you aren't breaking any laws, a lot of members on TRP see no qualms in having sex with teenage women. Historically, older men--30s, 40s--have had children with teenage women and even pre-teen women. Is this morally wrong? TRP would probably debate this as more extreme members would find no problem while some moderates would find it repulsive. The point is, as long as he isn't doing anything illegal, he'll go for these young women simply because biologically, men are attracted to youth. This phrase for some reason doesn't resonate in the minds of women as it should. When a man says that a 19 year old is hotter than a 21 year old, although the difference is 2 years, chances are that he means it.

This is the second reason why Men will look to date young women.

My responses to parts of your post:

So given that 25-year-olds and 18-year-olds don't actually look that different, why do so many red pillers see a distinct difference between the two?

Wrong. Differences are noticeable (at least for me).

In addition, at 18 many women don't have good skin (I had acne) and don't have a fully developed body (my breasts got bigger after 21, as did my hips).

If you ask any man there, he's not envisioning an 18 year old or a 25 year old with acne. He's envisioning a woman without any.

have a fully developed body (my breasts got bigger after 21, as did my hips).

Another man who sees this post may want to take me up on this. For me personally, youth trumps the particular size of the breast/ass or length of the leg, etc.

I can tell from the level of attention I get now vs. then, I am physically more appealing in my mid 20s than I was at 18, by a long shot.

This is true for some women and false for others. What I have noticed however is that the naked body of a younger woman is more attractive, but women in their 20s don't really wear kid clothes anymore. I start to see more professional, or feminine, or classy attire. I'm not trying to write this off as a change happening simply because of clothing, but clothing plays a large part.

Finally, responses to your questions at the end of the post:

1) Women do not have to age rapidly during 18-24 years of age. If you take good care of yourself emotionally and physically, you can definitely postpone the wall.

And, its not all about looks, but it is something like 60~80% for most men if I'd have to guess.

2) It is about looks as I mentioned above.

We need to define innocence. Low partner count/ Virgin = / = innocent to me. Low partner count simply means she has standards and is not a slut. Innocence I define as actual innocence (which women simply can't have): not having knowledge about sex, having the mind of a child, not understanding harsh realities of the world. That's what I think of when I think of the word innocent.

Innocence to me is a turn on, but I can see the argument for why it isn't for other men.

Yes, women in their older teenage years on average are kinder and more laidback than women in their 20s. Since women in their 20s are getting flooded with attention, they don't really treat men with the same level of respect as 18 year old women do.

3) I discussed innocence above. I am not interested in a woman who's slept with many guys. Unlike most of TRP, I actually do want to get married, and what I'm doing is basically creating a Unicorn checklist full of a large number of requirements that are not easily attainable. After the research I've done, I'd rather live alone (this might change, I am young) than settle. For me, virginity is a must. (Incidentally, although I doubt women care as much as men do about virginity, I am also a virgin and I plan to wait until marriage. Casual sex doesn't appeal to me).

So to answer the very last part of your post, I'd rather date a 22 year old woman who's a virgin than an 18 year old with 10 partners; however, there are men on TRP who would say the opposite.

[deleted] · 2014-04-11T02:55:59+00:00

Younger women have less experience, have seen less cocks. So, they're more easily impressed. I don't have this arbitrary age standard ("under 21 only" or whatever. Although I enjoy a tight 18 year old high school senior as much as the next guy, don't get me wrong.) but that's just a guess as to why some do.

JohnnK · 2014-04-11T03:07:17+00:00

Because they're generally hotter.

W_Edwards_Deming · 2014-04-11T08:40:15+00:00

Physical attractiveness
Inexperience / innocence (not jaded, more virginal, willing to learn)
Reliving / reclaiming their own youth
More breeding years / eggs left
Age based dominance
Instinct

I think it comes down to some combination of these, with preferences regarding "virgin v. whore" or other dichotomies ranging across the spectrum.

pillburt · 2014-04-11T15:21:48+00:00

Fertility is inherently sexy to men, because that's literally how sexual selection works. So the younger they are, the more time they have to be fertile.

It's like asking why a guy who makes $40,000 isn't as desirable as a guy who makes $4 Million. They both can survive and buy a car, but one can buy more.

buddhabullshit · 2014-04-11T19:13:37+00:00

White women can age quite a bit in that time period. When you're 16-18, either gender can eat whatever and however much they want and still look great. But after 18 the metabolism shuts down and by the age of 25 you'll know whether or not that person eats right and works out.

AshleyYakeley · 2014-04-12T04:09:22+00:00

I personally don't mind if they date much younger women (if they can find them, good for them) but I've often wondered what the logic is behind it.

It's feels (desire), not logic. The question is whether that desire has some plausible evolutionary basis the way RP sometimes claims it does.

But anyway, fertility begins its decline at 30 and then drops more severely at 35. A 25-year-old woman is going to have a pretty easy time getting pregnant, not too different from an 18-year-old.

The only thing I can think of is that if you intend to have more than one child with the same woman, you'll want to start earlier rather than later in her fertile years.

[deleted] · 2014-04-14T18:04:57+00:00

The majority of RPs are young and immature. They can't handle older women. But they don't want to admit they can't handle older women, so they incorrectly call them uggos.

Classic RP. They've got a buttload of insecurity, and put down someone else in order to feel better about themselves.

Why anyone would want to date an RP is beyond me.

spongegloss00 · 2014-04-11T01:28:27+00:00

Most humans that ever lived in the pre-agricultural era never made it past the age of 40. That may be why women mature slightly sooner than men too. If that's your expected lifespan, you don't have any time to waste.

For LTRs, a 25 year old is as hot as a 20 year old, but she is 5 years closer to the age of decline. It's analagous to buying a used car versus a new one, except in marriage it's the last car you'll ever have. The used one might be great, but parts age, mileage counts.

drok007 · 2014-04-11T01:10:47+00:00

A lot of what you said is correct.

It's not a drastic change from that age(18-24), but if a 10 turns into a 9 you're still going to prefer the 10 if you are basing it on looks alone.

The biggest thing is probably that expectations change, and history can become tarnished which may cause them to become bitter, harsh or rude like you said. They become more entitled really.

As far as 18-year-old sluts, that depends on your intentions. If you want to wife them, you are probably looking for innocence, if you are just want sex, it doesn't really matter, it probably helps at that point actually.

All in all, this is being really picky even on part of the TRP. If a man thinks it's worth it to only go for 18-20 y/o that's fine, it's his choice, but I think that most would think there are more important things for look for than that 4 year age difference. It's a bigger point that the rapid decline starts after 30, and that's where a lot of people draw the line on TRP.

spongegloss00 · 2014-04-11T07:11:37+00:00

I just want to point out there has been a lot if down voting which is a pussy move and not allowed on this sub. I don't make weird ad hominem insults even if I think people are being weirdos , so if you disagree with me that's fine but either respond normally or just ignore me, as down voting is against this subs policy.

dousche · 2014-04-11T01:06:52+00:00

Well, as I'm 23 I'm sure as hell not going for anything >23.

The age between 18-25 is probably the most common carousel years, so you want to get them just before that, if you're looking for LTR-material. After that, it's some guys left overs.

If you can have a freshly made dish or a microwaved one, you go for the fresh one, don't you? Especially if you can choose.

Also, god damn are 18-yo girls horny. They never get enough. And I never get enough of them.

[deleted] · 2014-04-11T01:40:51+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	Estrogen/fertility doesn't really decline until late 20s, so what is the logic of only dating teenagers?
Author	spongegloss00
Upvotes	16
Comments	158
Date	April 11, 2014 12:47 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/22qoap/estrogenfertility_doesnt_really_decline_until/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/estrogenfertility-doesnt-really-decline-until-late.285932 https://theredarchive.com/post/285932

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