Are women instinctively submissive and seek male leadership? Do men have a protective instinct that is betraying them?

JP_Whoregan · 2015-06-14T02:18:26+00:00

Women trying to be leaders among men is what is making them miserable in the first place. Just peruse the blogs of these women on the internet. They "have it all": a degree, a high paying job, a 20 year career in some HR or other office job, hell, some of them are even raising kids as single mothers from some Alpha Chad that she fucked back in her 20's...

...and yet, they are emotionally and psychologically unfulfilled.

They've spent their entire lives pursuing goals that typically satisfy men, and yet they are unhappy. Women are not built for leadership and the physical and emotional stress that goes along with it. It doesn't make them happy. Being led by a strong man is what makes them happy.

But feminism has convinced women that up is down, left is right, they sky is green, and grass is blue. And women are going along with it hook, line, and sinker, so yes, we do need tough love. Men do need to stop bailing women out of the consequences of their bad decisions. Stop wifing up single mothers. Stop buying into this "cougar" bullshit that the culture is shoving down our throats to try to placate old, single spinsters.

This "empowered women" bullshit is literally destroying the nuclear family, and the destruction of the nuclear family will eventually lead to the crumbling of civilization. Just ask the ancient Romans towards the end of their empire. Women stopped marrying industrious men and soldiers in favor of sport-fucking the alpha slave gladiators hailing from all sorts of exotic locales.

Long story short, unleashing unrestrained female hypergamy leads to the end of societies, no matter how far back in history you look. Simply because all the women start clamoring for the top 20% of men, and the rest of the men who aren't getting laid/married put down their shovels and swords and become recluses, and the society is eventually decayed from within.

TheGreasyPole · 2015-06-14T07:38:23+00:00

Hi Chemist,

If you don't feel this pull that's fine, but many many many do.

And it doesn't seem to be the pull you think it is. Many don't need leadership and protection. Indeed an RP man would be wary of a woman who needed leadership to function. Many desire it because it's a nice position to be in. Comfortable. Safe.

Have you ever done salsa or ballroom dancing ? You should try a few salsa classes with the BF. It's a a lot of fun, and you learn a few things.

The man leads the dance, a touch here, some pressure there, and the girl knows what the next move is. A spin, or a crossover, or just a basic step. You move, as a couple, but on his signal, effortlessly into the next move, you both execute it well, you look good together. Then the mans signals lead the woman into the next move.... And so on...

It's great fun. Married life for us is like the salsa moves. We are both dancing, we are both moving, we complement each other and look good... And it's the light touch on the shoulder, or the tug on the hand, or the change of grip that signals the next move and we move into it together as a unit.

We don't trip over each other's feet because we're confused over who's giving the signals or what is coming next.

That's how the best men lead relationships, and they like a great partner that knows and enjoys being led.

The man takes that responsibility on (and it is often an onerous one). The woman takes her own responsibilities. As a pair you work better together. Smoother, faster, slicker, easier... You glide effortlessly as a couple.

That's how it is for us. Do you want us to teach your BF how to lead a dance ? It really is very easy. Most women who try it out find they love it (even independent women like my wife who thought they wouldn't like it). It's just so nice to be half of a partnership and only have to worry about half of lives problems, not all of them.

And, yes, biologically it's hard to make this work the other way round. Generally the woman resents having to give all the signals, and the man chafes a little at being told what moves are coming next. Go salsa dancing. Experience it the other way round. It feels good to glide effortlessly as a couple.

itsalreadybeenthrown · 2015-06-14T01:25:44+00:00

Most women do not need to be dominated by men. This is how they continually live normal lives without them.

C0UNTdrama · 2015-06-14T18:54:21+00:00

No on both counts. RPers will argue till the end of the Earth that women are biologically submissive and seek male leadership and men are instinctively protective of women, without siting a single shred of relevant evidence.

"But look at history!"

Women were forced into submissive roles in order to survive throughout history (as were most men so don't get your boxers in bunch).

"But women are less satisfied than they were before!"

Which can easily be explained by the fact that women have to work and still fulfill their feminine duties once they get home, because hubby can't be bothered to fend for himself or his kids.

"But look at our primate cousins, like the chimps!"

We're closer to bonobos than chimps and bonobos are matriarchal.

"But female leaders are ineffective!"

Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner, Angela Merkel, Erna Solberg, Helle Thorning-Schmidt, Park Geun-hye, Dilma Rousseff, and Sheik Hasina Wajed, amongst others, have clearly proven that women can be just as effective, if not more so, as male leaders and that having a vagina does not make you incapable of leadership.

"But men have an instinct to protect women becuase they are weaker."

Humans have an instinct to protect eachother so your point is moot. Hamster it all you want.

wombatinaburrow · 2015-06-14T11:49:45+00:00

Most people are inherently submissive to some degree. That is why you have lots of workers, but only one CEO.

TheGreasyPole · 2015-06-14T04:50:36+00:00

Women are not instinctively submissive and they don't seek male leadership (when talking about true female nature).

The size, strength and neoteny of women that led to their physical protection by men also led to them being abused and also treated as children, with little recourse to change things. This ignorance of who women are continued on until very recent times.

These factors have led men to protect women under some circumstances and abuse them physically under others. It's been a protect/abuse thing forever.

Women in history have looked at men as protectors/abusers. In many circumstances, they've had no choice but to submit.

But this submission isn't women's real nature. And it's harmful for everyone to suppress women's real natures. Women will still want family and will still want to raise children. But they can't do anything real if being led by men in their relationships. It's unnatural. Why does she need to be led? How can a man possibly lead her? He can't. And neither can she lead him.

Smilingbluekitties · 2015-06-14T06:13:21+00:00

Yes, I purposefully act stupid and helpless at all times. It is my nature, even though my IQ is 160, I need someone to tell me what to do. My Gina Drippins' get in the way of my thought process. So yes, I need a high school boy on steroids to tell me what to do. It is nature's Way.

wazzup987 · 2015-06-13T23:37:38+00:00

No on both counts its just intense cultural conditioning

RareBlur · 2015-06-14T06:53:27+00:00

TRP is not about finding love. It's about how to get women to have sex with you while not needing to actually have a conversation with them. It not about finding your soul mate it's about finding your sex friend.

Men should not bowdown or obey women and women should not bowdown and obey men on mass. People are individuals and responsibility and leadership usually sorts itself out in a healthy relationship. Sometimes the woman is more capable of handling stresses and sometimes it's the opposite. Sometimes that dynamic might be always in flux depending on the issue.

the op says that women have abandoned their natural state but then says men need to apply tough love and not give in to their instincts to protect women so I'm not sure which way he would prefer the world to be. If women don't want protection then his tough love or refusing the protection and support is exactly what the women want.

He makes the assumption that women are not happy in this 'new' dymanic. But that's not really based on anything and he might be projecting.

Everyone's natural state is to be protected and cared for, it how we are as children. Everyone wants stability and the feeling of being loved. Men and women.

[deleted] · 2015-06-13T23:55:36+00:00

I never really believed that men and women loved differently , I think it mostly depends on the individual . I personally always feel very protective of the people I love and I can be very sacrificial .

However , when it comes to relationships , we notice that usually one partner takes a role that is considered more "feminine" , while the other takes the "masculine" role. Someone usually has to be more submissive and yielding for it to work.

[deleted] · 2015-06-15T01:46:20+00:00

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thereddespair · 2015-06-15T19:48:19+00:00

on instinct, i have that urge i admit.

but at one point i think that urge can be overtaken by experience and will. you need to submit, but then you can realize, you do not have to.

you feel a man should protect you, then you realize you can protect yourself. a man can get success, and upon getting him you get tied to that success - but then you can also just take it for yourself on your own, and that his success doesnt really extend to you, and you delude yourself

on another note i remember a line from a man: by nature man does not want a weak woman. a man wants a strong woman, so that he knows his home and litter are safe when he is out hunting. which comes the idea, are you a partner or are you a stay at home tenure prostitute that he just fucks?

you may not be able to do everything a man does, but you do not have to also. yes you cant lead big things, but can you not atleast lead your own life. if a man already has to lead his company and his other duties, must you bring him the burden to have to lead you in his time of supposed comfort? at the least you can go for a middle ground and be capable of stand alone function.

it is the instinct and temptation, it is tempting because it is so convenient. why go through all this work, when you can just get all of it in a single package from a man.

kick6 · 2015-06-15T20:52:54+00:00

I am constantly watching them and questioning their actions

it's called shit testing. This too is biologically ingrained

I don't think it is a gendered thing, or biologically ingrained

based on what? think about the amount of women in leadership...do you think that's a mistake?

[deleted] · 2015-06-14T03:23:53+00:00

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Title	Are women instinctively submissive and seek male leadership? Do men have a protective instinct that is betraying them?
Author	TheChemist158
Upvotes	10
Comments	166
Date	June 13, 2015 11:16 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/39r5yz/are_women_instinctively_submissive_and_seek_male/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/are-women-instinctively-submissive-and-seek-male.281623 https://theredarchive.com/post/281623

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