List of Rights that are being denied to Western Women that Feminists are fighting for.

shady8x · 2010-12-09T20:55:24+00:00

They are fighting for equal/better outcomes, not equal rights.

To get equal/better outcomes in all things they must give women special rights to help were women are behind and keep things from changing where women are ahead.

This is their primary purpose.

Actual equality would be equal access to opportunities and equal treatment under the law. But that wouldn't help them get equal outcomes so it becomes the thing they fight against.

XFDRaven · 2010-12-09T18:41:50+00:00

Abstracts - things you can't objectively measure but you can argue about endlessly.

The really tricky part about it though - is that any group can always list off some things. However listing a few examples doesn't mean the group as a whole is worse off. Feminists are just engaging in a certain trick - you list a few things in isolation, then make broad claims. It is similar to how women will complain about the top 10% of men making more but ignore the bottom 30% who make less. They selectively choose statistics. They selectively choose points.

It is like bad science - they keep the data that supports their view and throw out anything that doesn't.. then surprise! They have proof! Look! Here's the data that supports them!

mean0dean0 · 2010-12-11T01:29:34+00:00

If women have all these "rights" in the Western world, they must therefore be enjoined to shoulder the following responsibilities:

No more will anyone put up with PMS bullshit. People with Crohn's Disease are in pain. You've got cramps. Get over it.
Time to serve. Every woman must be put on Selective Service just like men, and all women in the military now are to be put on active combat duty until combat casualties are uniformly equal between the sexes. Sorry--you wanted to join the military, so time to learn cadence and kill.
Women in aid/shelter/halfway house programs will be ejected onto the street until gender parity is reached in new admissions; similarly, men will get preferential treatment in housing projects, SSI and WIC benefits, food stamps, and welfare until homelessness is similarly divided between the genders.
All alimony will cease, due to women's being just as capable as men of being successful. Child custody will be shared equally unless either partner is revealed to be a scumbag, upon which the children will go to the less scummy partner.
In an effort to encourage diversity, extra women will be sacked from all public and government positions and replaced by men until gender equality is reached. Heaviest layoffs will be expected in the Post Office, the DMV, public schools, and offices of institutional diversity everywhere.
Thanks to their newly liberated status, women's orgasms are no longer the responsibility of their partners. Find your own damn G spot.

InfinitelyThirsting · 2010-12-10T03:28:51+00:00

Okay, this is why I think egalitarianism is what Western society needs, and feminism should be reserved for places like, oh, South Africa and Saudi Arabia.

Edit: To clarify, not a feminist (not for the West anyways), so while my opinions are interjected, these are not all things I entirely agree with, nor are they all big important issues. They're just the only non-abstract rights I can think of that women could/should be fighting for. And some of them have male counterparts, yes, and I support those, but this is specifically a list of women's rights issues. Also, I will argue Devil's Advocate if it seems right./edit

But here are the legal issues and actual rights I can think of. Some of them are shallower than others.

To have Hormonal Birth Control covered under insurance, and not under ridiculous "special" premium copays, where you pay $10 for everything else but $35 for each month of HBC. More often than not, HBC is to regulate periods, not just for WOO SEX, and also, Viagra and other erectile dysfunction pills are not given this discriminatory treatment--many insurance plans cover blue pills but not HBC.
Laws about nudity. Also, societal views on nudity. It should not be obscene for a woman to walk around topless, if a man can. And if anyone tries to tell me that shirtless men aren't sexual like women are, I will laugh in your face. Shirtless men are incredibly sexual--look at magazine ads, bus ads, the magazine pages teen girls put up on their walls. All those moments in TV and movies where the buff leading man takes off his shirt and the girl can't catch her breath. Watch girls watching hot shirtless men in the park or at the beach. It's fucking sexy as hell. The disparity comes both from a disregard of men, and the complete disregard of female desire and the female gaze, from the outdated belief that women "aren't visual creatures".
Easy access to birth control, and to abortion clinics. That's still being denied in many parts of America--there's only one in the entire state of Mississippi.
There are some women who want the right to fight in combat, as women still aren't allowed on the front lines. And the treatment of women in the military is generally atrocious--the rape and sexual assault rates in the military are sickening, and soldiers shouldn't have to be worrying about attack from their fellow soldiers. But I really don't know how to combat that, because it's not a symptom of men, but of war and the military.
This is a case not of equality, but a biological disparity: more lactation rooms, less shaming of mothers breastfeeding in public, more options for mothers with breastfeeding children who still want or need to work. "Breast pumps" you might rattle off, but those are still very time-consuming, and not an easy answer by far. I'm a huge proponent of breastfeeding because it's so much better for the child, so that's one of the few places where I support privileges for women that men would not generally receive, but only because it's necessary for the child.
America is still a bit fucked up about female politicians, though this is from a multitude of causes. People focus on their fashions, or their mothering abilities, or their sexuality, and so on. With how many other countries have had female leaders, it's ridiculous that Hillary Clinton has been our only serious contender (and I really dislike her). But no, I don't want to fabricate female politicians who aren't up to the job--but it's a weird societal thing that both discourages women from seeking political office and disregards the ones who do.
There are a lot of places that still need serious overhauls on how they treat rape victims, like that whole thing about the town Palin's from charging the victims for their rape kits, and the thousands of rape kits that are sitting untested in warehouses. In case you all were unaware:

a five-month CBS News investigation of 24 cities and states has found more than 6,000 rape kits from active investigations waiting months, even years to be tested.

On average, six months in Rhode Island, Alabama and Illinois. It can take nearly a year in Missouri. Up to three years in Anchorage, Alaska. One state, Louisiana, has rape kits dating as far back as 2001 waiting to be tested.

So I guess that's part of my plea to /mensrights personally to cut back on the hyperbole when you say that rape victims are always treated well by the cops and chicks can just throw a man in jail on nothing but say-so. Read the article. False rape accusations are horrible and I fully support anonymity for the accused and so on, but that doesn't mean that the system doesn't screw over rape victims as well. Two distinct, though related, issues. (I personally maintain that it's easier for a false accuser to get charges laid than an actual victim being honest.)

And I don't know if you consider Russia to be quite "the West", but for as much as sexual harassment is annoying in the States and even worse in most of Europe (I can go into detail, having traveled widely and lived abroad for a while, if you really care to know), in Russia, there's no recourse for women. A judge hearing a sexual harassment case--which would have been only the third successful case in Russian history, if it had gone through--officially said "If we had no sexual harassment, we would have no children."
Oh, I also disagree with Britain's laws against mace. The fact remains that most attackers are male, and most men are bigger than women, and all the self-defense training in the world won't help most women against overpowering brute strength. This has less to do with rape and more to do with general violent crime, and applies to smaller men as well, but it's a fairly gendered divide when it comes to physical strength. To make mace or pepper spray illegal is to deprive mainly women of an important and useful tool for self-defense. It really bothered me that I had no way to protect myself against a criminal while I was living over there.

If I can think of more, I'll update my comment, but I think that's most of the important ones.

Quazz · 2010-12-09T18:53:49+00:00

All they're 'fighting for' for western women is...to make them more equal than men!

They state true facts, but leave out important notes to win people over.

As such several myths came to existence, such as the Pay wage gap because of discrimination. The glass ceiling and much other.

Women here have it better than men and anyone claiming otherwise fell for feminist propaganda

exlex · 2010-12-10T16:46:28+00:00

Women make only $0.70 for every $1 men make!!! (Kidding...)

nlakes · 2010-12-09T22:36:22+00:00

It depends what brand of feminist you talk to.

Some fight for female superiority. They want special treatment in all areas and view men as the root of all their ills. In my experience, these feminists are effectively losers just clutching at excuses as to why they've achieved so little in their personal lives. Example: this nut.

Others are of more moderate persuasion and focus on equality of opportunity. They want to change gender expectations; i.e. why is it always women that clear the table after dinner. Stuff like that.

Then you have people who are a bit more radical but not quite radicals; they fight windmills like the wage-gap and 'the glass ceiling', but ultimately they mean well. The problem with this brand of feminism is it doesn't appreciate the complexity of the issues. These feminists have been indoctrinated in a culture that tells women they're victims and men are oppressors and they struggle with the anger this fabricated world-view causes them. To be terse, they're angry and pissed off that so much is "unavailable" to them, that this very emotion is what stops them from obtaining it. Their anger is their real oppressor, not men. However they incorrectly correlate their shortcomings with men, not their anger issues. Unfortunately, these people cannot see the wage-gap is really a priority-in-life gap.

insomniasexx · 2010-12-09T18:36:13+00:00

And ill just refute the most obvious myth: The Pay Gap Myth.

The avg man makes 20-something percent more than a women according to the census.

But it's a LIFETIME average and its due to the fact that women get to stay home and raise the children while the man has to work.

This gap doesnt exist in countries like Sweden where there is equal paternity leave time. So if you hate the "pay gap" then you must be a paternity leave advocate, but ive never seen a feminist give a crap about mens rights.

2010-12-09T19:53:13+00:00

They aren't fighting for rights, they are fighting to get everything they can. They only care about equality up to the point that they get it, then they will keep on taking.

fishwish · 2010-12-09T18:54:21+00:00

You are asking the wrong reddit.

TheEnlightener · 2010-12-10T05:28:49+00:00

A comment I made in the feminisms thread (I am now banned):

I subscribe to the National Women's Law Center. All I ever get is a bunch of rubbish about how women get paid less than men for equal work and deserve special healthcare privileges and blah blah blah all supported by bogus statistics which they know are false.

So when you say "criminal justice, reproductive, employment, and violence, there is plenty" I think you mean there is plenty of utter bullshit.

Criminal justice: The number one indicator of the sentence you receive for a crime is whether you are male.

Reproductive: men have zero reproductive rights

Employment: men are discriminated against in hiring and promotions, it is called diversity, and they have no recourse

Violence: men are much more likely to be victims of violence than women

Do you get the point? In each of these areas, the most compelling and ubiquitous injustices are committed against men for the benefit of women. All these areas are areas where women are given great privileges over men.

Criminal justice: No man receives justice in court due to the bias against him. Reproduction: Men literally have no rights at all. Violence: Men are the vast majority of victims of violence. In these areas, the odds are fundamentally stacked against men, so much so that the privileges women gain completely outshine the minor inconveniences they may face in particular cases.

It's like men are taking a pineapple in the ass and women are complaining because they can't eat the pineapple.

Women are given great privileges over men in virtually every aspect of society, so it should not be surprising that it's true in these particular areas as well.

2010-12-09T19:18:18+00:00

Most feminists are marxists. Hence, they think they have the right to be equal in every result of society. So, basically anywhere they perceive women as having a disadvantage to men is a lack of equality. No, it doesn't work the other way.

Quazz · 2010-12-09T19:08:50+00:00

[permanently deleted]

truthiness79 · 2010-12-09T20:00:07+00:00

outside of abortion, i dont think feminists have anything left to fight for. its why im pro-choice, so the "feminist movement" can finally die already. meanwhile, mensrights have a shit ton to fight-paternity fraud, child support-induced bankruptcy, ridiculously high/long alimony, and something to curb the ever growing number of false rape accusers. but telling women that men are being marginalized by them is sexist. i dont really understand it.

TexSC · 2010-12-09T18:57:03+00:00

Are we talking about rights in general, civil rights specifically, or human rights specifically?

Because it does make a difference.

PeriscopeDepth · 2010-12-10T01:55:52+00:00

I actually came to this thread hoping to see that exact list. I am disappoint.

valerie_z · 2010-12-09T18:38:20+00:00

Equality. It's an issue in several areas.

TheEnlightener · 2010-12-10T05:41:56+00:00

I don't normally go to r/feminisms but after going now, I can see that as soon as you disagree with a feminist and they are unable to provide a counter-argument, you're banned. So I would suggest you don't even bother linking there. They can shrivel up in their little hole.

btinc · 2010-12-09T21:45:13+00:00

I do believe that they are fighting for the right to be treated equally as men, but that they make the mistake in assuming that equally is possible. In many ways, women and men will never be equal. Men will always be physically stronger and more competitive. But that ain't so bad. We women have our own things that we are better at than men. Instead of today's feminists striving for equality, they should be striving for respect, which is something I think is currently lacking for almost all human beings.

Maschalismos · 2010-12-09T18:36:16+00:00

Equal pay.

Title	List of Rights that are being denied to Western Women that Feminists are fighting for.
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	15
Comments	248
Date	December 9, 2010 6:34 PM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/ej2al/list_of_rights_that_are_being_denied_to_western/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/list-of-rights-that-are-being-denied-to-western.1045334 https://theredarchive.com/post/1045334

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