We are changing the game you know..

intjpua · 2010-05-26T05:29:38+00:00

I think you've made a few assumptions that are probably incorrect.

I doubt that the majority of men will ever have more than passing awareness of the techniques and such, beyond a basic understanding that they saw on the VH1 series or heard second hand from a friend who read The Game. It requires too much study, too much time, too much practice, for most men to ever consider it worth the effort (and reading is way more difficult for most people than those of us who hang out at reddit; we're mostly nerds, we love to read).

Canned routines should never be considered anything more than a crutch to help you get from point AFC to PUA. By the time you're a few weeks or months in, the only canned routines should probably be of your own devising and come from your real-life experiences. But, yes, I suspect that the most common canned routines are becoming more and more like the cheesy pickup lines of old. Everybody knows them, and knows what you're doing when you use them. They are transparent and lack mystery or interestingness needed to challenge women. So, sure, if canned routines become really popular, they'll cease to work entirely.

I think what will probably happen is that this trend of nerdy guys like us getting some knowledge in this area will basically just act to level the playing field a bit. Jocks and stereotypical alphas have never had trouble getting girls, even if they're assholes, criminals, drunks, etc. (I'm not saying that girls only fall for assholes, just that there are types of guy that women very frequently fall for and those types aren't necessarily smart or safe men for women to be hooking up with).

So, relax. The really important thing from the process of learning pickup and seduction is that you become better at interacting with and understanding people, especially women. This is not something a woman can spot or raise defenses against. They can, of course, become more selective...but, the best women already have very high barriers in place. I don't think it'll make much difference overall. And maybe some women will take time to learn what attracts men, and improve the pool of available women.

Speaking of which, women have had dating advice and sex advice and picking up men advice for decades. The majority of women don't study those topics, either, despite it being very commonly available knowledge. This may also be the example we need to look at for how PUA and seduction will shake out in the end, though men in general read even less than the average woman. In the end, it'll be something most men just read casually every once in a while, and very rarely take seriously. And, if they don't follow up by learning the science behind some of the techniques and experimenting on their own, they won't be able to separate the wheat from the chaff.

AdmiralAllahuAckbar · 2010-05-26T04:42:46+00:00

You're silly and solipsistic.

As more and more men start using these techniques AND THEY WILL because THEY WORK, it will change the game.

Sexual attraction and selection have been the game of greatest importance since the dawn of man. To most men, your "strategies and techniques" don't have to be learned, they're simply acted upon. Things like body language or "kino" didn't come into existance because you learned about them or someone gave them an arbitrary name, they've always existed; it's simply the social settings and constructs that change.

Mister_glados · 2010-05-26T06:36:29+00:00

What a ridiculous thread. I'm sick of some of you arrogant, egostical PUAs (notice I said some, not all).

First off, you haven't changed shit. Second, there are plenty of ways to master the game of seduction. In fact, I guarantee there are plenty of men who pull more (and hotter) ass than you do and haven't read a damn seduction book in their lives. You know why? Because PUA is not the only method! There are some guys who go into bars and talk to girls like he would anyone else he just met and gets just as many numbers.

Two rules: A) Be confident, B) Put yourself out there. Follow those two major rules and your guaranteed to find success, and if you master your own strategies, then you'll be just as successful as the others who have practiced.

Get over yourself. This is a message to any PUA/whatever who think they're above someone who does not follow the techniques.

Listro · 2010-05-26T04:48:23+00:00

What about those of us who are non-monogomous (me) and are already in non-monogomous relationships with great women (me again) who wins then?

That's right, those of us who realize there is no such thing as winning and losing, but simply a matter of enjoying the life you make for yourself. Do women have it better? Do men have it better? Who gives a fuck, work to keep your life better. Because regardless of what knowledge is or is not out there, it's only the people who know how to enjoy life for themselves that are actually enjoying their lives.

Casually · 2010-05-26T09:48:08+00:00

Like others have said, game will always work. If you're relying heavily on canned material, you might have to change up the more popular stuff, but the fundamentals will be the same. This is is because:

A) A lot of the stuff taught in the seduction community is just common sense and social intelligence. It is only a big "revelation" to people with poor social skills, i.e. us before we joined the game. PUAs didn't invent game, these are already things that most people know and do to attract mates.

B) Human biology doesn't evolve very quickly. The same things that are attractive to women today will likely remain attractive to them in a thousand years. Traits like confidence, height, fitness, and social dominance are traits that women will always find attractive, no matter how many "PUAs" there are.

mtaclof · 2010-05-26T04:03:22+00:00

The widespread proliferation of game does cause changes, but don't think that seddit is any significant amount of people. Additionally, just because there are more people using the proper technique to create attraction in women doesn't diminish the attraction caused. It would take a long time for that to occur. What it may cause though is a drastic increase in competition for long-term relationships, instability in the sexual market, and an increase in the average amount of sexual partners that people have.

AFCGirl · 2010-05-26T05:09:42+00:00

I'm a female who has been lightly following seduction strategies for a little while now. Let me give you an anecdote that is relevant to your concern.

My current boyfriend picked me up at a party in a bar. I've never been particularly attuned to social cues (hence my interest in the PUA game), but I saw him coming a mile away. In fact, I remember thinking that he was using some pretty lame PUA tactics on me. As it turns out, he actually used to teach seduction seminars, but my impression of him was of some guy from the internet trying out some lines for the first few times. I didn't think he was an asshole for it (note: I had known him for a little while before he picked me up, but not well), and I forgave him for being awkward because I know that a lot of guys think they have to follow a formula in order to be successful (much like I forgive a guy at first for telling white lies about my appearance because he's been taught that women are incapable of taking criticism rationally).

Most importantly, this was my clue that he was interested in me (again, I'm dumb about the more subtle cues that people send each other). I hung around him all night, eagerly followed him home, and we had a great night of sex.

I think some of your concerns are valid, but there's one thing in your post I'd like to harp on:

I, the woman, definitely feel like I "won" my encounter, but that doesn't mean he lost it. I don't think of it as an adversarial thing. I don't think you should either, because women are going to pick up on that. Do you want women to think that they're "losing" when they get picked up by you and "winning" when they reject you? Or would you rather both think of getting laid as a win-win situation?

2010-05-26T07:04:16+00:00

I agree with you, and thats why Tyler Durdens's Blueprint Decoded figured this out a long time ago. I found out about it through the IAMA from one of the guys from the game. Basically, it says fuck routines this is about becoming a person you want to be and letting the girls follow. Its not about the girls its about learning to be okay with yourself. No not just "okay" I mean 100% authentic and to know who you are and be God damn proud of it. I suggest you watch it, changed my life.

rmbarnes · 2010-05-26T12:51:16+00:00

Many people will never get fully involved in pick up, for the following reasons:

As soon as a man turns to PUA stuff, he is admitting he sucks with women. Men really hate admitting this, even if it is just to themselves.
Most men find PUA material really odd, so they will never fully study it because they feel like a weirdo for doing so. Even most 'wingmen' I have met via PUA forums don't actually practice formal game, they think it's too odd. They just go out and they talk to slightly more women than the average man on a night out, and they go out very regularly. They have a slightly higher success rate than AFCs, but only because the law of probability kicks in.
Many guys get into this to find a gf. They do it for maybe 3-6 months, never getting really skilled at it, then find a gf. They then drop out of the game for say a year while they are with the girl, during which time they lose the mediocre skills they learned.

That being said, in some cities, some of the more famous routines are very well known, due to countless men doing bootcamps in the same bars / clubs. The women only recognize the routines, not the underlying strategy, so this can be countered by finding new routines.

throwaway543210 · 2010-05-26T07:36:52+00:00

Yeah, go talk to some real chicks. Even the pretty ones are rarely approached unless they're bar sluts or stand out in the crowd.

2010-05-26T05:25:56+00:00

Beauty tips are everywhere and used by many women because they work, and men know all about these techniques that women use to increase their sexual attractiveness. Yet we still go for them.

Whether all men or none are PUA's doesn't change psychology.

tarlack · 2010-05-26T05:16:27+00:00

It is one thing to know how to play the game, but you have to go out and play the game to score.

The game is always changing and it will keep doing so as people change, a true PUA understands this and can make the changes needed.

Title	We are changing the game you know..
Author	melbatoast
Upvotes	2
Comments	40
Date	May 26, 2010 3:49 AM UTC (16 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/c85qv/we_are_changing_the_game_you_know/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/we-are-changing-the-game-you-know.1310418 https://theredarchive.com/post/1310418

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