Would the effects of a more honest society be beneficial or detrimental for society at large? Honesty regarding intentions and personal history...

c_dolly · 2020-07-16T05:02:39+00:00

It would crash and burn. We are not even that honest, clear and robotic with ourselves, let alone with each other.

LittyKitsune · 2020-07-16T05:08:29+00:00

Considering how men respond to dating app profiles where women are "too" transparent about their requirements I honestly don't know if this would help at all.

Men being transparent about their desire for multiple partners would be embraced by women who also aren't into monogamy. The problem? Some say it's in male nature to expect monogamy from the woman while he gets to sleep around, which most definitely isn't a popular arrangement outside of fundie cults and a few Reds who claim to have that.

goatismycopilot · 2020-07-16T11:22:35+00:00

My experience is people in general do not like directness and honesty in all social/personal aspects. It really depends on how the message as delivered. I often find when I am honest and say I want XYZ men either try and argue me out of it explaining why I am wrong or they dismiss it. Honesty work if the other person percieves that they are XYZ or have XYZ.

Kaisha001 · 2020-07-16T08:04:57+00:00

I think most men would like it. I know I would've. Heck most of TRP is just trying to figure out how women work, if they were honest and upfront from the get-go, TRP wouldn't exist.

Men work very hard when given clear objectives and goals. In fact most of the life experience of men is do 'X' get 'Y'. Very simple, linear, cause and effect. Get an 'A' in school get a scholarship, get 'whatever' on SATs to get into 'important' school. Get experience for resume to get job. Lift weights get buff. Give a guy a clear challenge and a concrete reward and they will move mountains (well... a large number of them, there are lazy ones).

If women came right out and said, you need 'X' 'Y' and 'Z' to date me, most men would be happy to know and would either deem it an appropriate challenge/goal, or walk away.

Women I think would hate it. Not only do they love to leave things ambiguous (even on these forums, and anywhere else, any attempt to quantify female behavior is immediately attacked as dehumanizing), in many cases I don't think even they know what they want.

SslimReaperr · 2020-07-16T05:44:48+00:00

Males cry and cry that “women lie!!!!” Yet they cry and cry when women bluntly say what they want.

Woman: I’m just interested in you, sorry.

Males: She’s a cunt hoe slut for chad only!!! She only gets wet for 6’10 chads with jaws that can cut gLASS.

Woman: I like tall males, no males under 5’10 please.

Males: Wow what a cunt whore slut bitch!!!!!

Males don’t want the truth or the lie. Males themselves will lie that they want the “truth” but many are too fragile to actually handle it.

SaBahRub · 2020-07-16T04:51:22+00:00

Repression, redirection and obfuscation of one’s individual selfish desires in favor of the many is the very definition of society, is it not?

InternalOperator1 · 2020-07-16T06:27:33+00:00

Reprucussion number one would be the first person to start lying would out reproduce and out compete the honest people.

SplushkaMcOwlFace · 2020-07-16T11:04:05+00:00

It would be much the same as now. I could always say what man wants from me. I know if man a fuckboy and then he say "hello I want only sex with you and everyone else" Well that would not be a big surprise. The other thing if people are honest with themselves. Very ofyer we all guilty of self lie. To get rid of it would be helpful and make everyone more happy.

NinjaOfTheSouth · 2020-07-16T13:05:37+00:00

Basically, let’s be real here, this Mostly would detrimental for women. For guys, I mean they really wouldn’t affected as they don’t care.

GhostTheEternal · 2020-07-16T05:33:27+00:00

You would have to genetically engineer humans to be incapable of deception for such a society to actually exist. Humans benefit from deception which is why we're all guilty of it on one level or another.

Relationships would be awful without it. If you're completely up front about every thought and feeling we'd upset each other a LOT and have all of the information we need to exploit each other.

2020-07-16T05:17:58+00:00

Verbal deception is the stand in for flinging shit at each other/beating each other to death with clubs. It would probably be an improvement

NarniaFox · 2020-07-16T07:50:38+00:00

To begin with people should start being honest with themselves and do a lot of self-reflection. Most people have no idea what they really want and why.

TheBookOfSeil · 2020-07-16T08:13:00+00:00

More beneficial for some. Less beneficial for others.

Expensive-Guitar3609 · 2020-07-16T19:38:42+00:00

You are underestimating the importance romantic views about love and relationships have in the cultural narrative and the way modern societies view and understand the world, and build systems that resemble those ideas.

This is one of the problems with moderm dating, we are trying to remove "romance" and "love" from the dating equation, and we are only left with the transactional part of it, and a bunch of biological imperatives that serve nobody but natural selection.

It's like asking "what would happen if we remove humanism from our culture and political views?"

Well, dude, that's a shitty question don't you think?

All in all, when humans remove the methaphisic concepts, espiritual-transcendent ideas and moral principles from their lives we become animals, and animals know only one rule: the jungle law, the survival of the strongest.

And that's a world the weaker don't want to live in.

So... Keep the appearences ok?

Prismatic_Symphony · 2020-07-17T06:59:31+00:00

Society would most certainly be better off in some respects, as far as the frustrations of people who've been misled, and there'd be little to no cheating, and much less, if any, STD propagation. I've long said that I wish we could treat the early dating process a bit more like job interviews - be up front. Call my past partners as "references, etc.

It'd be a more boring affair, but I'm for it. Doesn't mean there wouldn't be ANY mystery. You'd still get to know things over time about your partner. You'd get to plan surprises for them(and your surprises would always be well-received cause you know their wants/desires).

Men wouldn't have to worry about women taking advantage of them in divorce. Some relationships just wouldn't ever get started in the first place. But everyone, both women and men, would be better equipped to handle rejection. And people would still have to compromise or settle in some respects; you'd just be aware of how your partner is settling from the get-go.

87AudreyHorne · 2020-07-17T08:08:53+00:00

The choice between the blue and the red pill is not really a choice between illusion and reality. Of course Matrix is a machine for fictions, but these are fictions which already structure our reality. If you take away from our reality the symbolic fictions that regulate it, you lose reality itself. I want a third pill: a pill which will enables me not to see the reality behind the illusion, but the reality in illusion itself.

Zizek

I think it applies here.

WilliamWyattD · 2020-07-18T03:58:05+00:00

No. We need rituals and even some deception at the individual level because that is how we are built when it comes to these things. Nobody is a Vulcan.

But on a societal level, when discussing these matters more academically and deciding how to structure society for the best, then we could use a lot more honesty.

potemkinsolutions · 2020-07-16T04:39:24+00:00

Not possible. These deceptions are not done deliberately the first person deceived is the "deceiver". So what you are truly asking for is that we no longer deceive ourselves which would require that we no longer have to in order to get through to the next day.

You're asking for people to grock a feeling into a knowledge that can be communicated through words, not through poems, songs, or tales. We struggle with this it's not deliberate that we can't turn our feelings into logical robot words.

You might as well ask if it would be beneficial or a detriment to immamitize the eschaton.

But I'll answer. Detrimental. This would be the world an AI ruler would give us. This is the world of the autist. A cold world where nothing excites and their is nothing to find, nothing to explore or expose, and we have no journey left.

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Title	Would the effects of a more honest society be beneficial or detrimental for society at large? Honesty regarding intentions and personal history...
Author	MerryVegetableGarden
Upvotes	11
Comments	75
Date	July 16, 2020 4:29 AM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/hs36jk/would_the_effects_of_a_more_honest_society_be/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/would-the-effects-of-a-more-honest-society-be.713743 https://theredarchive.com/post/713743

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