"I Was a Men's Rights Activist" — A former MRA recounts how he became involved in the movement and left it behind to become a feminist academic who studies gender theory.

MalusMalorum · 2016-04-15T18:44:09+00:00

Fascinating how when he goes on about all the evidence being weak and femnism being that powerful and convincing that he does kot really put out mich more than "it is other men, not women who police male gender roles".

Congratulation, that is actually something most MRAs will happily tell you applied to both women and men. Policing of gender roles will be often predominantly done by other people of said gender, what a big surprise.

Also, I have not really seen any serious MRA arguing about the evils of metrosexuality. ...which is not really a "new" thing either when you look at history and the rise and decline of various styles and movements concerned with a more appearance conscious style of manliness.

I started skimming through that article pretty soon, but it is just so pathetically superficial.

Oh, also, I frankly see hardly any MRA being all that unaware of the situation of gay men, just to speak from the one field where I have personal experience. Most MRAs are quite respectful and certainly seem to be more aware of gay male issues than the average straight man, at least that is my own impression.

civilsaint · 2016-04-15T19:08:42+00:00

I'm truly sorry all you see in MRA is negativity, rage, hate and bitterness. The one thing that drew me to this group was that these things are not tolerated and the trolls are not fed. Apparently, I am having a much different experience than you.

You discuss the turning point in your conversion from MRA to feminism is when a feminist told you that all of the evils that concerned you were caused by 'the patriarchy'. Do you realize that ALL HUMANS have a propensity toward evil that we, as a society, strive daily to overcome. 'The matriarchy' is no more humane than the so-called 'patriarchy'. Women can be just as vicious and cruel. The only difference between the sexes in that regard is that men have more physical strength, so are prone to outward forms of aggression while women are prone to being more calculating and manipulative. But the desire to harm others is equal in both sexes.

It was assumed before that females of primate species were passive, until Jane Goodall caught two female chimpanzees killing and eating the offspring of others in an apparent effort to protect their dominion within the group. This was believed to be isolated, but later was found to not be.

The point is it is dangerous to equate a word like 'feminism' with 'equality', given that the word itself gives dominance to one gender over the other.

And I don't buy the notion that feminism fights for minorities. Minority men are usually the ones most affected by the presumption of guilt in domestic violence issues. First, they are less likely to afford to defend themselves, and second, juries have a bias against minority men. They are therefore more likely to be falsely convicted.

I would just recommend to keep your mind open and question all claims. Personally, I am for equality. I am not in a Men's Rights forum to argue that men should have privilege. I want to see true equality for the genders.

I thought of myself as a feminist for years until I had a crash with reality that I was always seen as the enemy, either a rapist or potential rapist, or rapist sympathizer, or spy for the patriarchy by any member of the third wave feminist movement with whom I disagreed. There were many abusive feminists that had no problem bullying me.

Best of luck in your journey.

omegaphallic · 2016-04-15T21:53:39+00:00

His prepective on Tool Time is wrong, yes Tim had a successful show, but he supported his wife while she went to school to get her degree, and theN when she got a really great job opportunity in another city, Tim sacrificed his entire career for hers, ending the show Tool Time (admittedly he hated the new owners) and he ended up moving to another city. He even moved the house, because it was what SHE wanted.

Also you should tell people in the article that you searched under every rock in the MRM to find this guy, people deserve to know that this article is just propaganda.

Maybe a more interesting question would be how many MRAs are former Feminists (puts hand up).

TBFProgrammer · 2016-04-15T23:14:01+00:00

This is the same Edwin Hodge: http://freethoughtblogs.com/crommunist/2012/07/09/introducing-edwin-hodge/

In this article, he states that he had only just gotten involved with feminism in 2012, directly contradicting his claims to you. I don't think Hodge was ever an MRA.

DevilishRogue · 2016-04-15T22:20:39+00:00

Sorry, John, but either you've been lied to or made this up.

I always believed it was women and feminism putting men in this box. But these feminist texts not only validated the crisis of masculinity, they pointed out men are the biggest policers of masculinity. Men beat each other down for being “girly,” for liking sewing or baking, for crying.

Any MRA knows both how male emotion is policed (hint, it's not by men any where near as much as by women) and why it is policed (because men are disposable and not entitled to the same feelings as women).

MRAs and feminists were acknowledging the same problems, but the MRAs weren’t locating the right cause. The feminists pointed out, “No, actually this is rooted in the same patriarchal institutions that are harming women.” It was subtle but profound.

Patriarchy hurts men too? Are you serious?

And feminism showed that men of color and queer men experience the world differently than the straight white men who dominate MRA groups and assume all men are fundamentally the same and like them.

Intersectionality? Ignoring shared common experience?

I realized all the arguments about male oppression I had bought into were weak. And all the evidence I needed was in feminism.

Except anyone who understands them knows that it is the feminist arguments that are weak (other than gilded cage theory) and that male oppression is rampant.

My transformation didn’t happen overnight, though. There wasn’t really an “Aha!” moment, but more of a progression. I had to deconstruct all the MRA beliefs I had internalized.

Your interview 'subject' hadn't internalised any MRA beliefs because that isn't how MRA works. That's how feminism works, stifling dissent and censoring argument. MRA is the opposite, welcoming debate and not internalising beliefs so that argument can become stronger rather than needing to be sheltered from criticism to withstand debate.

At one point, I made the argument that metrosexualism was oppressive to men, that it was an attempt to feminize us because we were too hairy; because we weren’t good enough as we were.

You'll have to point me to any post here that argues such a banal point as I've never heard of such a ridiculous argument.

Despite my best efforts, I’m an idealist, and I honestly, truly believe sociology can be an activist discipline.

Where you get course credit for writing to your state representative about the importance of access to abortion how can you think sociology is anything other than an activist discipline?

I appreciate you posting it here, OP delivers and all that, but either you are full of shit or Edwin Hodge is.

2016-04-15T19:36:51+00:00

If you're comparing Spreading Misandry to "white supremacist literature," it's safe to say you've never read Spreading Misandry, which is one of the most tame and academically-written books in men's issues.

I question just about everything this guy is saying.

2016-04-15T22:24:09+00:00

this whole article is the same old line feminists use when we ask what exactly has their "gender equality group" been doing for men.

"if men stop behaving badly and defer to feminism than all your problems will go away".

meanwhile they just sit on their hands, attacking masculinity and claiming that theyre helping. mras call it trickle down gender equality.

2016-04-15T20:41:50+00:00

Sounds like the average fundie, "I was an atheist before I saw the light and joined the Westboro Baptist Church!"

Ingsoc226 · 2016-04-15T23:56:01+00:00

The reason discussion of men's issues needs to take place independently of feminism is because feminism has developed into a hate movement. Websites like Jezebel routinely produce articles that sneer with laughter over male victims of extreme domestic violence, the movement is steeped in transphobia and anti-male bigotry and seeks to advance social attitudes in which men and boys are treated with contempt because of their gender, they want to bully and discriminate against boys in education and normalise the idea in schools that their point's of view are worthless simply because they are male.

Feminists have selfishly redefined equality in the Orwellian sense. Justice Ruth Bader Ginsberg for example has said that she wants every single judge on the supreme court to be a woman. You would expect an equality movement to be opposed to outright declarations of supremacism, but not so: it features regularly in feminist media.

The reason I oppose feminism is because it's not just about the elimination of oppression and misogyny (which I support) but because it's an ideology like Marxism that constitutes a total worldview and which is genuinely misandric in a way that goes far beyond railing against injustice. It's not an equality movement by any definition.

Impacatus · 2016-04-15T19:10:57+00:00

But these feminist texts not only validated the crisis of masculinity, they pointed out men are the biggest policers of masculinity. Men beat each other down for being “girly,” for liking sewing or baking, for crying. For being “faggots.” “You gotta man up.” “You can’t be a pussy, right?”

...

At one point, I made the argument that metrosexualism was oppressive to men, that it was an attempt to feminize us because we were too hairy; because we weren’t good enough as we were. One of my female peers turned to me, lifted up her skirt and said, “I shave my legs every day. Don’t talk to me about the cosmetics industry oppressing men.”

So, let me get this straight. When men, and only men are looked down on for exhibiting feminine behavior, it's misogyny. When women and men are both looked down on for exhibiting a masculine feature, it's... still misogyny.

Granted, it is pretty silly to consider a fashion trend oppression, but it's the kind of thing feminists do all the time.

The point is, feminism fails as a tool of analysis precisely because it holds on to the narrative so strongly. This is one of many examples of two or more contradictory pieces of evidence held up in support of the same conclusion.

I would like to ask the interviewee: If you acknowledge that the status quo isn't good for men, and you believe that feminism is unambiguously good for men, then why do you think there's an anti-feminist movement? Is it just because none of us have looked up the dictionary definition of "feminism"?

redditorriot · 2016-04-15T19:40:08+00:00

Archive: http://archive.is/xS9Ki

TheDude41 · 2016-04-15T22:47:50+00:00

He was never a men's rights activist. He was a feeble-minded, fawning mangina, who thought he had read something that would appeal to his liberal-minded female colleagues, then put it down as soon as he realized they disapproved.

And nothing changed.

lostapwbm · 2016-04-15T19:15:56+00:00

I'm a journalist at MEL, a new men's lifestyle publication, and I'd like to interview a reformed MRA. Specifically, I'd like to hear about how he became a men's rights activist and how evolved out of it.

If you or anyone you know would be interested in speaking with me, please either private message here or email me at [email protected].

Glad to see you found someone stupid enough to interview. Or you just made some shit up. Either way.

I would write these pro-men’s rights arguments that I thought made sense, but my instructors would say, “This is a tautology.”

checks the CV

Yeah, this guy was such an MRA that he produced no scholarship relating to men's rights, but he does publish a lot of shit about how Christian Identity racism is due to "masculinity."

You fellas really need to try harder.

mcdermottj · 2016-04-15T18:35:47+00:00

Wait a minute. You were the guy who was asking about "reformed" MRA's a few weeks back. Is this you shilling yourself?

redditorriot · 2016-04-15T19:54:20+00:00

Poor guy :(

Sasha_ · 2016-04-15T21:32:12+00:00

I'm sorry Edwin, but - perhaps as you'd expect - I don't find this article of yours terribly convincing. Perhaps it's just that you seem to have read only one book slightly challenging of feminist ideology, or that you trot-out a lot of very tired-old feminist cliches (i.e. that men are taught to be stoic and unemotional brutes, er, except for Shakespeare, Picasso, and millions of other examples of men who expressed emotions really well...?)

I think perhaps feminism is the right home for you. You seem to be more comfortable trotting-out a tired-old dogma than critically questioning it.

I also note that like many feminists you're unable to avoid using a snarky, insulting tone when discussing feminism with anyone who you think may not adhere to you doctrine.

YabuSama2k · 2016-04-15T23:26:05+00:00

This sounds like a very impressionable young man read one book and fell hard for it, then took a gender studies class and fell hard for it.

I read them and it didn’t take long for my men’s rights beliefs to start falling away. They didn’t stand up to all the empirical evidence I was finally reading — research that was informed by feminist theory and offered actual solutions.

What is conspicuously absent here is any clue as to what "empirical evidence" he is talking about. I don't see any reason to believe that this guy wouldn't just fall headlong into any philosophy or world view he reads about. Again, this strikes me as a collection of anecdotes from a very highly impressionable person. The way this is all written makes it look like nothing more than erotic fiction for people who dislike MRAs.

ralphswanson · 2016-04-16T04:03:26+00:00

I wonder whether this dude is proclaiming feminism to further his career. It's very difficult for man with a PhD in Sociology to find employment in Canada because of affirmative action instituted by feminists. Colleges are overwhelmingly feminist and certainly aren't going to hire heretics.

Regardless, feminism does not have answers for men, or even care about male problems, especially in Canada. Feminism may not be the root of all gender problems, but it continually demonizes and silences men and belittles their problems. And how is a continuing the 50 year feminist monopoly of the gender discussion in academia good for men or sociology?

Spoonwood · 2016-04-16T17:26:18+00:00

I was in the self-help section “facing” our most popular books — arranging them so their covers, and not their spines, faced outward — when I noticed the title Spreading Misandry: The Teaching of Contempt for Men in Popular Culture.

laughing. For all of it's merits, Spreading Misandry is a little known academic volume. Even though published more than 10 years ago now, it has a mere 31 reviews on Amazon.com Plenty of college textbooks have more reviews... say those on calculus... and plenty of people prefer to read anything else than a textbook. It is scarcely believable that this book would lie in the "most popular book section" at any book store.

I had never seen anything that said I — a white, heterosexual male — was actually the one being discriminated against.

I don't believe that most MRAs think of white, heterosexual males as "the ones" getting discriminated against. It isn't like the sentencing length for white men is longer than the sentencing length for black men. It isn't like white men get profiled more than black men by the police. At least, not in most parts of America and Canada. This guy doesn't sound like he ever was an MRA.

Looking back, I realize Home Improvement was actually reproducing 1950s gender dynamics.

In the 1950s we had a show called Father Knows Best. The father in Home Improvement is an idiot who pretty much knows worst.

Spreading Misandry was a recruitment piece and I was an easy target.

Neither author of that book is a men's rights activist. Paul Nathanson has said that he just does scholarship.

I looked at the syllabus and saw Masculinities and The Men and the Boys by Raewyn Connell, both about gender from the perspective of men’s lived experiences. I just thought, Well, shit.

I read them and it didn’t take long for my men’s rights beliefs to start falling away.

Then clearly his beliefs were not about men's rights. Because, rights are NOT about 'lived experiences'.

2016-04-15T18:32:02+00:00

I read them and it didn’t take long for my men’s rights beliefs to start falling away. They didn’t stand up to all the empirical evidence I was finally reading — research that was informed by feminist theory and offered actual solutions.

Reading feminist textbooks made you decide that men don't need rights. K.

IronWolve · 2016-04-16T23:14:53+00:00

Looked at the site, they are running a bunch of anti-male articles pretending to be chic. 1 article, maybe, a dozen? Its a trend. Trying to make its name in the SJW cycles. The old trick of targeting a core demographic and writing stories to confirm their biases to help sell their site. Even checked to see how mel social network push, its big, all targeting feminists, sjw and far left readers.

Rasalom72 · 2016-04-15T18:19:02+00:00

I’ve been dating the same woman since 2004,

Wonder how much she hates having sex with him (if any)... or how many other guys she's banging....

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