Dating apps are Incel factories.

the_sea_witch · 2022-11-04T06:29:00+00:00

Swipe apps definitely changed dating. While the 80/20 rule may be true on those style of apps i don't believe the same is true of women irl. Lots of guys profiles are truly terrible. Serial killer dead eyes, no info and usually holding a dead fish. Lots of guys aren't great at text / flirting either. Unless your smoking hot, women do need to get to know you in order to like you and become attracted to you. Swipe apps basically make that almost impossible. The odds are stacked against you to begin with. 1 in 9 are women on there in the 1st place and of those, you have a significant chunk looking to shift you over to other platforms to make money. All the single ladies I know left OLD in droves years ago due to verbal abuse and just being overwhelmed. Having interesting hobbies where you meet ppl irl is the way.

saito200 · 2022-11-04T09:53:02+00:00

Women like X, men that do Y will Z. All these are wrong. Treating people like statistics will lead you astray. Women like assholes? That is such an oversimplification.

ShitFacedSteve · 2022-11-04T09:13:49+00:00

You’re sooortt of right.

The 80/20 rule is true… ON DATING APPS.

That doesn’t mean it’s true in every single dating context ever.

And while Tinder might seem like an objective way to judge how desirable you are as a man, it’s really not.

First of all, women are typically less interested in online dating than men. So there is usually a high ratio of men to women. Like 10 men to 1 woman.

Obviously if you’re competing with 9 other men then on average every time you talk to a woman it’s going to make her less likely to show interest in you. That doesn’t mean that whoever she picked out of the ten guys she was talking to was the “alpha,” it just means that she clicked with him the best.

In the real world, men and women exist in almost a 1:1 ratio.

On top of that, dating apps can often be a hostile place for women. The men on those apps are like a minefield, one wrong move and suddenly you’re having an unpleasant experience where a guy you politely rejected is calling you a fat ugly whore.

Sure they have plenty of pleasant experiences too, but you can see why women would want to be careful with who they give their time to in the context of a dating app.

And on top of all of that, the app is specifically designed to force people to judge someone mostly on how they look. Sure there is a profile attached to it too, but most people swiping on tinder don’t bother to look at it.

I guarantee you would have had a better chance with anyone who swiped left on you if you had met them in person.

So you can see there are actually a lot of factors and designs about apps like Tinder that encourage women to follow the 80/20 rule. But that almost proves it’s not how humans normally behave.

princessbubbbles · 2022-11-04T10:49:25+00:00

I think most of the reason why people are up in arms about your post is this

Whether we like to recognize it or not, the RedPill 80/20 theory is 100% true

being a bit unclear about whether or not you mean dating apps or are talking about dating in general to support your thesis. Now, not every community or situation will mentally jump to irl dating or all dating when reading your wording, but there are many RP recruiters and people wanting to pick a fight in bad faith who post here. This subreddit community tends to be on edge because of it. Not saying that automatic response is good or bad, it just is.

their idea that women like assholes is 100% right

This is the other issue. If all women like assholes, then they are either a) destined to be assholes themselves or b) destined to always be victims in their relationships.

Anecdote time: I(F) avoided dating while my peers did so. The males who were interested in me were either not great people (trying to not call them assholes here ha), clearly not good fits (ex. hated my hobbies), or were simply too immature at that time in their lives, a case of wrong time wrong place. I met irl a dude in college and was friends with him, he was attracted to me and was respectful about it, I was attracted to him, I contemplated for a bit, began dating him, and eventually decided to marry him. Due to circumstance, we waited ~4yrs to get married and have been married for 2 years. He is only person I have truly loved romantically and one of the few who I am significantly attracted to sexually. He has nurtured and cherished me, and I, him. We talk about being and act as equals. Is he an asshole?

Or do you just mean that women on dating apps like assholes, as with the previous issue?

Would you believe a woman if she said she doesn't like assholes? Would you believe a man who has/is dating if he says he isn't? If not, what kind of evidence would change your mind?

Edit: I do appreciate your thoughts on being comfortable being single. Both my husband and I were definitely comfortable being single before we started dating. Dating was an added life-complication with benefits that outweighed detriments for us.

Also note: I am aware of my youth. My hope is that what I say here is what is debated as opposed to me as the speaker.

Academic_Type624 · 2022-11-04T14:25:25+00:00

I appreciate my experience a woman on the dating apps was different but honestly it sucked.

Even if I was clear I was only looking for a relationship 90% of the message s I got were looking for short term only. It was exhausting. Also the fact that guys would straight up say wanna come round for sex just isn't appealing. There were some exceptions and i always responded to the guys who took time to read my profile and start a conversation. But they stood out because they were the exception.

I was single for a while and a married friend kept bugging me to go on Tinder, so to shut her up I downloaded it and gave her my phone. Her confusion as she looked through profiles with nothing on them grew and grew. Afterwards she never mentions it again.

So yes women are inundated with men but quantity doesn't equal quality.

PutsWomenOnPedestal · 2022-11-04T02:15:39+00:00

Although your belief about dating statistics and RP is most likely wrong, your message that being single is wonderful seems healthy and well-intentioned.

Edit: I agree that sex with someone is not a big deal. Personally I prefer solo as the most enjoyable with the least hassle. Lots of people in this sub will disagree and will go on about how great connection and intimacy are, but since I don’t really understand that I can’t comment on it

seeyouonthelanai · 2022-11-04T07:06:18+00:00

That 80/20 rule came from an Okcupid blog abd Redpillers took ONE part and spread it all over the internet. The reality is that yes women graded men harshly on looks, but were actually quite receptive to the 80% of men they considered below average in looks. Men were more generous in rating women, but mostly only messaged women of above average looks.

A copy of the infamous blog https://archive.ph/489UV

If you want to enjoy your singledom on a permanent basis, then power to you.

But if you want to date at some point then just remember real life exists and apps aren't for everyone. I'm a woman and I hate apps. I have to get to know someone before I develop any sort of real attraction to them, so I have a hard time sorting through matches. Real life may be where a lot of so called "nerds" could do well.

Exis007 · 2022-11-04T01:58:04+00:00

I feel like you've not really done a lot of research on this with actual numbers. This feels like it's just your gut talking. But the research actually contradicts a lot of this. Just at face value, the argument you're making doesn't make sense.

Like, let's just poke holes at the math level of this. Right off the bat we know that men outnumber women on dating apps by different degrees in different regions, but I'll suffice to say "by a lot". You have a numbers game problem. That doesn't back up the 80/20 rule. And we know it doesn't because we have data on how much sex people are having. We know! For the 80/20 rule to be happening, you'd see two sets of data for men and women. There'd be a small group of men with a high number of partners and a much larger group of men with few to no partners. Meanwhile, women would have something that looks closer to your normal bell curve. But we know that's not the case. Men and women, divided by ages, match each other pretty closely in terms of categorical percentages of sex partners. That means at age 25 or whatever [x] percent of women and [y] percent of men have had more than 50 sex partners, wereas [a] percent of women and [b] percent of men have had 2-4 sex partners, and so on and so forth. Those percentages are pretty close for men and women and remain so as both groups age. Obviously, as people get older they have more sex partners so the people who have had none to one and 2-4 get smaller, but there's not significant disparities between gender. You don't see the 80/20 division in the data. So, that's not happening.

Also, I don't know what pickiness has to do with disappointment and low self-esteem on dating apps. If you have 100 guys in a room and 4 women, what does it matter what criteria the woman is using to pick a date? The richest? The best looking? Her real and true soul mate? Who knows? Either way, you're still going to have 96 decent guys otherwise worthy of love going home empty-handed. No matter how you slice it, that situation breeds disappointment. Pickiness is irrelevant if there's a huge gender disparity between people signing up to be on that apps in the first place. There's nothing wrong with being picky about dating! That's a good thing. But that's not the central problem here.

The disappointment you're talking about is real. The thing that's hard to understand is that it is intentional. Dating apps are worth billions of dollars. That FOMO is worth cash. The marks for that are the men not getting matches. And what's interesting to me is that the money bought into this industry is paying for a lot of media pieces and social media effort to make this statement you made seem true:

It's very sad that dating apps have gone so mainstream. Not only that, dating IRL is becoming less and less common, with the pandemic also playing a role on that.

Only 19% of Internet users say they are using a dating app. Roughly half of people between 18-29 aren't using one. But the way Dating Apps report this data is often squirrelly. They'll tell you how many people have, at one time, used a dating app. They'll tell you how many people met their partner "online". Dating apps try very hard to convince people this is how everyone is meeting now. But the data doesn't back that up. I found one source where they asked 2300 people between the ages of 18 and 34 how they met their partner and only 9% say dating apps. Most people are still dating IRL. That's just how it is.

If your point is that dating apps are disappointment factories? True. Can you be perfectly happy being single? Sure. But the rest of this is kind of a garbage argument. Dating apps are a scam, most people meet in real life, there's not some imaginary 20% of men getting all the sex, and women aren't responsible for this hellscape.

Soggy-Stretch-37 · 2022-11-04T04:32:27+00:00

have you considered the fact that 1) it's most likely because 80% of tinder users are men, 2) women are way more selective because women are far more likely to get killed/raped by the opposite sex than vice versa and there's a risk of pregnancy every single time you have sex with a man, 3) women are taught to put a lot of effort into their appearance and properly take photos, while most men on dating apps are just... well yk

Rook_Cross · 2022-11-04T17:09:09+00:00

"First I have to make clear that I am a man who chooses to be celibate because of religious/spiritual reasons along with mental health issues, so the issue I am going to rant has no direct impact on me, so I believe this leaves in a position of objectivity from which I can formulate a more or less neutral and selfless opinion."----- You can convince yourself you are impartial but it's very, very easy to see through that you are not. You're red pilled and regurgitating the same incorrect stuff they do, just trying to make it more palatable because you're desperate to have other people listen to and validate you. You need to get it off your chest because you've been obsessing over it like every other RP/incel and think you are saying something unique. This is what they post constantly, everyday, on various pill forums, even this flavor of it, saying they are "impartial" because they claim they are out of the game. Modernity has created many problems. There are issues in our society. But incels create themselves to a degree, coupled with their genetics, not dating apps. The Pareto Principle is that you get 80% of results from 20% of the group, roughly. The results are dates, not women. The top 20% of men were getting 80% of the dates. "Top" doesn't necessarily mean the best looking, richest, tallest either, it should be noted. The Pareto Principle was also shown on the other side of the equation, with the same women, I think closer to 30% rather than 20% if I recall, getting the majority of the dates. RPers need to stop abusing the Pareto Principle if they don't know what it means. It is not responsible for turning men into incels, nor women. you are very clearly MGTOW or RP, even if you don't want to admit it to yourself and you're very clearly looking for validation. Go to an RP forum and preach to the choir, they'll echo you right back.

VigilanteJusticia · 2022-11-04T18:46:51+00:00

One thing I’ll say about this 80/20 thing is that you assume there’s an equal number of male to female users. Most dating apps are over-saturated with men. By some statistics, 75% of users are men. So really there’s more competition. Men getting less swipes is not so much about women’s preference vs just not that many swipes to go around. And by the time a woman would have gotten to your profile, she would have seen way more candidates than you can think of. Women being picky is not the issue. The virtual sausage fest is.

Aggravating-Grab-241 · 2022-11-04T03:38:32+00:00

Dating apps don’t matter. If someone doesn’t have luck on dating apps, that doesn’t stop them from meeting people in real life. Dating apps didn’t take away the option for people to meet in real life. If someone doesn’t like dating apps they can easily just stop using them. There are hundreds of other ways to meet people.

tinasnow-poty · 2022-11-04T15:38:55+00:00

I think men shouldn’t use dating apps their primary source of dating. The ratio is anything from 1:3 to 1:9 women to men, and like you say a lot of the female accounts are bots, OF and insta shills. So how many female accounts are actually there to date? 1:15? 1:20? It’s terrible odds. I know the amount of couples meeting online are rising but I still don’t believe that most or even a small majority (51%) of women are using dating apps. Out of 9 friends only 2 of us used dating apps. Most of my gfs met their boyfriends through work, family friends, parties/clubs and Instagram actually. Any man putting his whole dating life in the hands of apps apps is shooting himself in the foot. And putting your self esteem in its hands…

FellasImSorry · 2022-11-04T06:35:01+00:00

You realize that the 80/20 thing red pill people base their worldview upon came from a press release from a dating site?

This is the level of scientific rigor of red pill. It’s laughable.

And even if it wasn’t made up bullshit, how does it lead to the idea that women like assholes? Why assume that this (mythical) top 20 percent aren’t super nice guys?

And how would you, of all people, have any idea what womens experiences are like? you aren’t a woman, and I assume you don’t have any close friends who are women or have ever been in a romantic relationship with a woman, so how would you know?

It’s just all so unspeakably stupid.

azucarleta · 2022-11-04T14:58:34+00:00

I think to make your argument more serious and robust, you have to go back to a pre-app world, look closely at how hetero men's self-esteem was eviscerated by the hetero dating world in that era, and then make an argument that somehow dating apps made that worse. I don't think they changed as much as they may seem.

Because dude, cis-het to cis-het courting in post-feminist patriarchy is fucked up. It just is. The apps are reflecting that fuckedupedness, not as much creating it much less initiating it.

Fact is, patriarchy was fucked up for the cis-hets to begin with (though it seemed to favor men by empowering them, power corrupts, and patriarchy is and was bad for everyone). And, feminism despite the tears of fragile boys everywhere and especially the reactionary outrage of islamic/jewish/christo-fascists, feminism has done very little to slay the dragon, it has only confused it. And so we date and fuck and marry in this warzone between, like, a confused evil and a less powerful but more agile and more popular anti-evil, and real good is nowhere to be seen (something like "good" is a tradition we gave up on long ago and perhaps we'll never have it back until the battle between patriarchy and feminism has concluded in feminism's favor).

Toughen up bros. It's a pretty bitter world. No reason to blame others tho, no reason to blame women. They are enduring the same fuckery you are. Team up and wither the horrible social storm together. Don't blame each other.

edit: "Dating is detrimental for life in terms of happiness, health and longevity." I agree with this FOR ME (not everyone agrees). However, it's also obvious, isn't it? Driving long distance is not the fun part of a "road trip." Dating is the means to an end, of course, not an end to itself; so it's like you are missing the point. It's like investing; defer some short-term enjoyment for future returns.

Jelly_Crusade · 2022-11-06T01:51:29+00:00

This sub will say something about how "its not like that in real life"

Online dating is real life. This is reality now. Its how most couples are meeting, and its still fucking terrible. Its as bad as it seems.

The future of dating is unsustainable, incels are going to be an increasingly growing problem. I hate everything about dating today.

Andre27 · 2022-11-09T21:04:11+00:00

"Are all men going to become assholes in order to get laid? That would create a very shitty society to live in."

Sounds good to me. Couldnt care less about society.

ktooss · 2022-11-24T06:25:40+00:00

I wish more men would think like you

miarivola · 2025-06-10T00:53:59+00:00

Found quality matches on Laylooper, worth the investment.

Title	Dating apps are Incel factories.
Author	Troklokhan
Upvotes	30
Comments	73
Date	November 4, 2022 1:23 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/yll0q7/dating_apps_are_incel_factories/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/dating-apps-are-incel-factories.1144652 https://theredarchive.com/post/1144652

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