Paying for Dates

Strange_Dragons · 2012-06-24T12:45:27+00:00

[permanently deleted]

dakru · 2012-06-24T12:19:12+00:00

To me it's the idea that a woman is valuable in herself, just for existing as a woman, but a man has to earn it, to prove his value by what he can do for her.

2012-06-24T14:03:39+00:00

I'm not a man but I find it offensive. I struggle to understand the mindset of someone who thinks it's okay to view dating in that way.

wArchi · 2012-06-24T09:51:09+00:00

If you're not paying, you're the product. The same goes for free entry to women in clubs.

Every (first) date != Relationship. If you go on a lot of (first) dates eventually the costs add up.

Oriumpor · 2012-06-24T17:33:36+00:00

Think about this from a homosexual/lesbian perspective, there is no gender role so you have to verbally communicate your request.

The language and protocol of going on a dutch date is simple:

You like to go dutch with me at <place>? (Request to accompany) not:

Would you like to go to dinner? (Invitation with you organizing.)

and definitely not:

Lemme buy you dinner. (Dumbass)

PemCorgiSelphie · 2012-06-24T22:18:26+00:00

I recently went on a first date (i'm a female) and I paid for everything except his lemonade that he wanted to buy, that meant popcorn at a street concert, a soda at the same place, and then some drinks at a bar.

Ulime · 2012-06-24T23:43:33+00:00

It works both ways. Took a chick out 1st date, paid her 2 drinks while she paid back none. Paid her 2 drinks 2nd date, and still nothing back (faking to look for a wallet in her deep handbag lol right). Guess what happens ? I didn't call her back. She called back, told her i wasn't interested. Result : it's be best way to know who you're dealing with ! She doesn't pay drinks back ? You only lost $14 and you know she's not a catch :)

rightsbot · 2012-06-24T08:34:18+00:00

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chavelah · 2012-06-24T13:28:28+00:00

As another person pointed out, "If you're not paying, you're the product." I think that's a fair assessment of the situation - and I don't think it's a problem unless the one of the people involved has a problem with it. Men compensate women via dinner-and-a-movie in return for a chance at sexual access.

So what makes their hoo-hahs so goddamned precious that potential mates will vie for the opportunity just to be near them for an evening? Men who are looking for dates zone in on a specific subset of the single female population - not too old, not too fat, not too ugly, etc. Which is fine, but when ALL the single men (including the old, the fat, and the ugly) are zoning in on this subset, the demand is going to exceed the supply.

As a woman, if you have a problem with being a high-value commodity in this specific and limited context, then you had better go Dutch on your dates. As a man, if you have a problem with treating a woman like a high-value commodity in this specific and limited context, then you had better not pay for dates. I think people tend to take extreme stances on both sides of this issue, when a smarter approach might be to consider each date on a case-by-case basis.

saturdayd · 2012-06-24T18:38:10+00:00

From a female perspective: Unless the guy is really insistant-and I'll still offer to pay when the check comes- I'm uncomfortable with the guy paying for everything. I see the cost of the date less of an investment and more of a way to indicate to my partner that I'm self-sufficient. I did date a man who saw it as an opening to financially use me for years until I wisened up and left him. His unwillingness to contribute to anything was a good indicator of how he was in every aspect of the relationship.

sostopher · 2012-06-24T10:26:34+00:00

I view it the same way as chivalry. It's a nice thing to do, but should not be 'expected' every time.

AnthonyCharlesXavier · 2012-06-24T22:52:59+00:00

I pay out of some weird sense of pride, not because my date expects it. I know the concept is outdated but I can't get it out of my head.

justsomeguyudontknow · 2012-06-24T13:26:51+00:00

I think the man paying for a date taps into some deep mating instincts, and as such will remain the convention.

I believe humans are an evolved species of animals with deeply ingrained mating behaviors. These evolved behaviors are much more powerful than our ideologies and mores about gender, and will re-assert themselves despite our best efforts to render them obsolete.

Humans have both promiscuous and pair bonding mating behaviors. Dating is generally the medium for the latter. I think that in a pair bonding relationship, women have an instinct to extract resources from a man, such as food, shelter, protection, emotional support. This is what women mean when they say they want to feel "taken care of". When the man pays for the date, it helps meet this female desire. And that's OK as long as the woman gives something that the man wants in return.

What I like from a woman in a date is deferential behavior. The women who've been attracted to me have all been submissive in their romantic and sexual responses. The exchange of submission for care is also a fundamental social behavior, not only in humans and other primates but in other social animals such as wolves. By being deferential to me, she evokes my protective instincts that make me want to take care of her. We both end up with what we want. She grants me status, I make her feel taken care of.

After 20 years of marriage I still take my wife on "date nights". I plan the outing, I lead her during it, and I pay. It is an expression of dominance, caring, and commitment on my part. My wife is pleased because it reconfirms my willingness to invest resources in her. I am pleased because afterwards, she lets me do as I please with her.

2012-06-24T22:11:33+00:00

If your first 'date' costs more than a cup of coffee, you're doing it wrong.

2012-06-25T00:29:32+00:00

I've been married 9 years now and have two daughters. My first "date" with my wife I believe I paid for. It was so adorable in hindsight. I asked her out during a D&d game. We were both so nervous that we didn't eat any of our food and forgot to get take out containers.

Would I have paid for it if I hadn't already known her for over a year and really liked her? BLEEP NO! We would have split it halfsies. A woman who expects me to treat her like a trophy deserves to belong to a man who wants to treat her like a trophy (i.e. getting replaced for a shinier one every few years). I like my woman because she knows her value and she knows mine (among many other reasons).

These days we have a joint bank account, but we each have spending money (i.e. allowance). Sometimes when one of us wants to eat out but is broke the other will pay for it. Not because I'm the man or she's the woman, but because we like making each other happy.

Colcut · 2012-06-25T07:09:50+00:00

My first date with my wife was at starbucks, we split the bill - and have since ( except my car+ insurance but we do split petrol).

Sometimes we don't square up what we owe each other for months, usually ends up at around a few hundred pound difference.

Being 'tight' I just wouldn't want to pay for someone else's products - its a little different now ( been with her 3-4 years) but I still think if you have the funds available to split the bill why not? I'll be dammed if I'm paying for an item I'm not going to use.

Charwinger21 · 2012-06-25T07:30:13+00:00

Honestly, I haven't gone on a traditional date in so long that I can barely remember.

For the last couple traditional dates that I went on it was all either dutch or her paying, and that was always just how it played out.

Recently I've been just avoiding the whole dating structure altogether. I've just been doing stuff like inviting a girl to accompany as I go buy some bitters to restock my bartending supplies and stuff like that (and then "buying some bitters" turns into "exploring downtown", and then you can turn it into anything from there).

timw11 · 2012-06-25T00:10:48+00:00

I said after our first date (and once we'd agreed we wanted to go out again) with my current GF that I'm not going to be paying for everything and that I expect to split things going forward. I made it clear I was not a gravy train and we've been together for almost 2 years now. As long as you make it clear you can save yourself and your bank account some stress.

airodynamic1000 · 2012-06-24T13:09:44+00:00

This is not a mensrights issues any more than facebook conversations are.

On that note it's only logical that since women have started working, they can start paying for dates. I have no idea why this is or would be a topic for discussion.

Most of the women I've met and talk to understand this. Don't waste your time with women who don't.

2012-06-24T14:36:17+00:00

If expected from her, I won't offer and will tell her to pay /and/or walk off.

If never brought up until the check arrives or she offers, I will happily pay the bill... Unless she ordered some really expensive food and drink.

RedBarclay · 2012-06-24T20:00:35+00:00

The person who asks traditionally pays in my opinion. I have also always maintained a dutch lifestyle on other dates, but now my husband and I trade one for one on a general basis. If you don't pay now, you pick up the next one.

Hamakua · 2012-06-24T10:28:44+00:00

The person who asks is the person who pays.

*edit

To the downvoter: If a total stranger asked you to take time out of your schedule to get to know you, wouldn't you rather them pay for it? I'm not talking about throughout the entire relationship, I'm talking about who asks the other on the first date.

Title	Paying for Dates
Author	Sabrey
Upvotes	25
Comments	63
Date	June 24, 2012 8:32 AM UTC (14 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/viovn/paying_for_dates/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/paying-for-dates.1019177 https://theredarchive.com/post/1019177

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