Do I have to appeal to the female gaze?

Xx_SwordWords_xX · 2022-03-31T14:02:42+00:00

I LOVE looking like a unhygenic, sad sack, trashy, depressed doomer

Go find you an unhygienic, sad sack woman.

Naus1987 · 2022-03-31T14:26:59+00:00

I'm sure there are women out there who value the same things you do. But if they don't value 'looking good' then they obviously won't look the best. So maybe approach some women who look like their clothes don't fit right or they don't comb their hair.

But more realistically, you should be finding people who enjoy the same hobbies you do. Then some woman might not like your shirt, but she may totally dig your painting skills.

Empathy is a good start. It's always best to think about yourself first, and then project that onto other people. And then follow it up by projecting them onto you. Run through a situation with many different lens to get a more clear picture.

Say you want to be desired by a woman. It's easy for you to understand it through your lens. Then switch to their lens. What about you would make you appealing to a random woman's eyes? If you see nothing. Then you flip it back to your lens, and it's like an "ah-ha!" moment. Now you get an idea of what to work on.

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Also, remember if you're into long-term relationships, it's important that you guys share a lot of common interests, philosophical, and political views. So you know, make sure you KNOW the person you're trying to dating.

And then alternatively, if you're just looking for a hook-up, you can replace good looks with money or skill, and go that route.

But personally, I'd always recommend finding ways to be content all on your own. Because if you rely on other people -- they can always let you down.

Inareskai · 2022-03-31T14:36:11+00:00

So, for starters, that's not what the female or male gaze is. They're really quite specifically about film/art making theory about thinking about the who the 'watcher' or 'observer' of a piece of art is and catering (or not) to what the expected desires of those viewers are. It assumes a lot about the watcher/what those people want, it's much more about agency and not objectifying someone more than it's about showing what is desirable to a given gender. It's what society expects people of certain genders to want, but that rarely (if ever) is actually what every single person watching wants.

The thing is, there are going to be women who like what you offer. You talk about how you don't see a masculine and feminine side, it's just 'you'. So why would you assume that any masculine/feminine distinction really exists? Society sure as fuck pushes us to have that split, and some people do buy into it, but you're by no means the only person who thinks it's bullshit. You're probably best looking for people who share a similar mindset because they're also the people who are more likely to be interested in you rather than being interested in buying into societal ideas of gender conformity.

resoredo · 2022-03-31T19:41:10+00:00

I LOVE looking like a

unhygenic,

Nope, drop that. That's just a general turn off, and, tbh, makes you fall deeper into your depression and other traits. it's bad for your health, bad for your mind, bad for your body, and has NOTHING positive about it. please take care of yourself, even if 'tis hard. it's okay to start slow and with smol steps - wash your face - wear the tshirt not 6 days, but maybe five days - find yourself a soap or shampoo or body wash that you like to smell (personally: citrus, lime, orange, and cinamon, are so nice, i love using them because how quirky they smell)

sad sack,

im not sure how a sad sack looks - dont conflate looks with personality, or you will conflate personality with looks. drop that. especially, since sad sack is not a look, and not even quite a personality trait - sad sack is onyl a self description you give yourself, which other people may pick on, but is totally subjective and your mind playing you dirty.

trashy,

some dig that. maybe not *too* much trashy, but you can make it work i guess. are we talking kurt cobain level? or heroine chic? or do you mean more like homeless hobo?

depressed

it's okay to be depressed. but it is nothing that defines you as a person. depression is serious, it's a mental health issue and illness, but not a personality trait. don't let your depression or hopelessnes define you, even if the depression is gnawing at you. try to seek help, get a therapist, meds, or even some supplements like st john wort. check your vit d levels, and - even if you ahte it - get some sunlight. (i hate sunlight too)

doomer,

some dig that *very much*. personally, i kinda like dark circles, it gives a quite nice and weird emo look. and, if you are a doomer without a crude sense of humor, dark and sinister humor, or some sarcastic gallowshumor, - well, you cant call yourself a doomer then. nihilism should come with a special kind of comical hatred, because nothing matters and everything is a joke and can and should be laughed and made fun of. especailly oneself.

Source: Me. I was the joke

bearfruit_ · 2022-03-31T17:57:09+00:00

Whenever you see "women want x/women want y" don't let your head spin - just ignore it. those are completely reductive, there's a lot of variety of women and with that a huge variety in what they want. The "female gaze" only helps with extremely superficial interaction (like apps). If you want to connect in a relationship way, don't worry about the female gaze. Just try to be the type of person you would want to be around, whatever that looks like (positive energy? easy smile?). When people enjoy being around you, they'll want to do it more often, and a relationship is basically just wanting to be around the same person in all of life's situations.

Celesteisme · 2022-03-31T22:43:51+00:00

Grow up. Hygiene and skincare is really important, not just for attracting women.

pyrotechnic-looter · 2022-04-01T01:38:12+00:00

You can’t appeal to what “women” want 100%, because each wants something a bit different. It will work better if you just find activities you like and then meet people (some women) who are into the same activities.

wiwoo · 2022-04-01T02:36:07+00:00

Your body needs to look:

Healthy
Clean
Strong

Your style needs to convey:

Intellectual ease
Monetary ease
Emotional ease

Who cares what you think you look like in the mirror? Are you trying to date yourself?

rumpots420 · 2022-03-31T14:08:25+00:00

Yes. I know. I prefer to have an Oscar Wilde Style look, but I understand that women like but better if I look super masculine, which I just find repulsive

AutoModerator · 2022-03-31T21:05:34+00:00

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2022-03-31T15:21:29+00:00

But the female gaze just ends up making me feel gross, ashamed and inadequate.

No its your response to the female gaze that makes you feel gross. There is a balance between being non-needy and looking good for your self-esteem, and looking good so you get better reponses from other people.

From what I can tell they are seeking kindness and thoughtfulness, but how can you get that from aesthetics?

Women don't completely know what they want. In reality women care about looks almost as much as men do and many like bad boys and most like masculine men more than nice guys.

I see things said like 'you need a skincare routine, you need to wear clothes that fit, you need to smile more'.

Most men don't need a skincare routine unless its really bad. Men who smile too much are actually unattractive, but it is a problem if you look upset all the time.

Why don't people consider what we find attractive on ourselves?

People aren't thinking too hard about how attractive you are and are mostly thinking about themselves. They just look at you and make first impressions of you.

I LOVE looking like a unhygenic, sad sack, trashy, depressed doomer

I'm having trouble believing this by just the way you are describing this.

I wear nail polish, and crop tops and have started wearing eyeliner.

Are you sure you don't have some transgendered tendancies?

I just want to be my grotty-ass self and be loved for it, but that just isn't how things work

Many guys don't put much effort into their appearance and get into relationships. But they aren't as appealing and tend to find girls who also don't care about appearance as much.

snailsandstars · 2022-04-01T01:12:18+00:00

The female gaze is usually a term used in the fields of art, literature, and film. Why exactly are you using it to talk about how you dress in real life?

I'll be honest, I can't really understand why you want to look unhygienic, it's not something I've ever felt so I can't really relate. Yet, I think the struggle between being widely appealing and true to yourself is a very common one. It can manifest in different ways, but the main gist of the issue is quite the same.

In my personal experience, staying true to yourself while constantly introspecting on your choices is a good middle road. I know I won't change to appeal to society, but sometimes that gives me a kind of inertia towards changing at all. You've gotten so comfortable with your identity being "not like the others" that changing to be socially acceptable in some ways might feel like you're "selling out" or "betraying" yourself. As long as you don't fall into that vicious cycle, you should be good to go.

Meiguishui · 2022-04-01T11:52:53+00:00

What do you like? If you have preferences so do women. Don’t worry about what women in general like. You are you and the woman you will find will be the kind that you like and likes you in return. Don’t despair, just keep your smelly areas clean and floss.

JonF1 · 2022-04-01T16:48:31+00:00

No.

You don't have to do anything, others also don't have to approve of those actions or lack of actions.

heytheredelilah91 · 2022-04-01T17:33:51+00:00

I'm not sure how much guys understand it, but it absolutely is possible to pick up on someone's personality and attitude from their expressions and how they carry themselves. Women are probably more socialized to figure it out.

Title	Do I have to appeal to the female gaze?
Author	WhoDoomsTheDoomer
Upvotes	6
Comments	34
Date	March 31, 2022 1:49 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/tt068k/do_i_have_to_appeal_to_the_female_gaze/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/do-i-have-to-appeal-to-the-female-gaze.1109288 https://theredarchive.com/post/1109288

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