Helping our Incels

dyselxiccarrot · 2022-04-18T00:15:06+00:00

Incels is the word we’ve attached to them, but it’s gotten a really horrid connotation attached to it now. If I were to be called an incel, I would be offended. I like your idea, because I agree. There’s toxic members of both sides. Maybe just referring to them as “frustrated men” or something of the like would be more welcoming for conversation.

Really, that conversation is the best way to help. People don’t like to be told they’re outright wrong. But, if we make the effort to talk to people with distorted views and have intelligent conversations that help them see the other side, then that’s the first step to helping them. With that, we can get the opportunity to listen to their side, and it’s easier to help someone when we can fully understand them. Treat them like the humans they still are.

DirtyPartyMan · 2022-04-18T01:34:41+00:00

Using a commonly negative term for people we refer to as brothers undermines our efforts.

Brothers is a good approach.

introspectthis · 2022-04-18T00:28:35+00:00

Incel, by its literal definition, means involuntary celibate. A person (a man) who is celibate not because they want to be, but because of their views on women, physical appearance, inflammatory nature and/or any other number of negative attributes find themselves relegated to sexile (exile of sex- please, hold your applause).

Beyond the fact that even in its initial surfacing as the aforementioned definition, the term has expanded to Include any man who demonstrates distain for any woman, or even just sympathizes with the struggles that men face.. but with the additional graceful remark of, "wowww you're just so angry because no woman will fuck you" "ewww no wonder you're a virgin" and the like..

The irony of shaming a person based on their perceived sexual nature/lack thereof while simultaneously shaming and ridiculing then for allegedly shaming or resenting others for their sexual nature is too gross to even be recognized as a joke..

TAPriceCTR · 2022-04-18T01:17:21+00:00

Incels generally accept the label, just not the venom feminists affix. I have 3 children and we're not done yet... but I still never deny their accusations that I am an incel... I just ask them why they're "promoting toxic masculinity by trying to shame me for a perceived lack of sexual conquest "

KingWhoCared86 · 2022-04-18T00:10:00+00:00

I generally don’t like to be labeled anything to be honest.

awhatfor · 2022-04-18T04:15:49+00:00

I don't think anyone has ever said that incels should have less rights than the rest of the men, or that this movement doesn't include them. I guess you should start asking questions like the latter to them directly, but unfortunately all incel subs were banned.

Ari9000plus · 2022-04-18T09:09:27+00:00

The first way to marginalize someone is to create a group label, and then enroll someone else in it, without their consent....how about you stop worrying about labels and just talk to some people you might feel are down...human to human...not label to label...and stop with the pity...how would you like it if someone came to you and labeled you an Incel, and then hit you with the pitty bullshit? The first thing you can do is stop thinking you are superior and are the savior of anyone but yourself. After that show some compassion for a fellow human being, without bias or judgment. If that person is a man and you care about their rights as a man, stop with the superiority and savior complex, you ain't better than the next guy.

Ok_Machine_681 · 2022-04-18T16:39:42+00:00

These people need support and help. Pushing them away will only do harm. But I think that for someone to get better and have a fresher perspective in life, they need to drop the black pilled doomer ideas. Each one of them need to find a place in society where they can find some level of happiness from life.

DavidByron2 · 2022-04-18T00:44:30+00:00

Feminism has their own misandrist unnatractive bitter members

No shit; they're a hate movement.

Incels (regardless of whether they are "bitter") are not necessarily MRA.

TFME1 · 2022-04-18T03:43:40+00:00

Incel was actually coined by a woman to describe herself and the community she created for fellow Involuntary Celibates. It was RadFem douche-nuggets who twisted the meaning to men alone.

You can just use InCel to describe female involuntary celibates or you can use FemCel.

mistralol · 2022-04-18T01:19:01+00:00

The best thing to actually go is steer them towards something constructive in life that gives them some kinda meaning and to shift their focus away from women.

The thing about a lot that I have spoken with (I have helped several) was that many of them had actually nothing which was why they were incels in the first place. When you asked them what hobbies they had. Nothing. What they were interested in? Nothing really appealing came back. Pashion? Very little When you asked them where they expect their life to be by age 25, 30, 35, 40 they had no real answers.... when you started suggesting a position they might like to be in by then... well they started to wake up and thats really what I discovered about many of them is nobody had actually woken them up to life the had basically been abandoned they also tended to have maturity problem and a very skewed sense of reality because of the lies a lot of their own echo chambers has been feeding them.

What it actually took get them outside. Right you are going mountain biking this weekend. Right Archery today. Shooting today, Axe throwing etc.. etc.. etc.. etc..

gamerlololdude · 2022-04-18T03:51:19+00:00

I would say they need access to emotional support. Search up what it is. My overarching understanding of what happens with them is they want emotional support but society conditions people to think this is what a girlfriend is for so they end up chasing this idea of a woman when really they want to talk to someone who cares and encourages them and listens to what bothers them.

Since admitting to wanting this is considered “unmanly” in culture they mask it with the chasing sex idea and chasing the idea of “getting girls” because that one is considered more manly. It’s not sex they are after and sex won’t fix the void they have.

In my country there are like “crisis lines” but they are not for crisis, they are just to talk about what’s bothering you like this: https://www.whatsupwalkin.ca

It is an important part of mental health, as a preventative measure to keep up general well-being. It is masked like “just talking” but talk therapy is what psychotherapy is and just talking to someone who is trained in providing emotional support really helps feel better mentally.

Since there they have mental health professionals they will do a better job than you ever can (it takes a lot of work to be a mental health professional, don’t think it’s just “talking”) unless you want to get a masters degree in social work and end up working in one of these services.

I used to volunteer as a listener at 7cups.com and encountered a fair bit of what you refer as the incel type. You could go there or on incel type subreddit like r/virgin to try to talk to people but please get some training. Like maybe the 7cups listener training at least or some other mental health courses you could do. Take a course that develops emotional intelligence since that will help you understand things better. Emotional intelligence can be learned, it’s not just innate.

nevermock · 2022-04-18T02:06:09+00:00

I honestly see them as brave for engaging the hardest subject ever without copping out.

PikaDicc · 2022-04-18T07:49:05+00:00

People have completely deluded that word and turned it into an insult

Alarming_Draw · 2022-04-18T21:23:30+00:00

Femlurking trolls are trying to use the topic of Incels to divide us in the Mens Rights sub.

Dont fall for it. I am not incel, but I will not shame or insult any-and am aware of the tricks feminists have been using to smear them, such as posting pedo porn on their Reddit pages then quickly reporting it to get it shut down and make them look like pedos.

Yet I have also seen the WOMEN that tried this also admit to being followers of PEDO related pornography THEMSELVES! The fucking irony is amazing.

Dont let femtrolls divide us with fake debates and posts about them. Our sub is for mens rights and thats what we usually talk about. Ask yourself why a poster seems so obsessed with incels if they keep changing the subject to incels, or keep posting about them....you may have just stumbled upon a femlurker.....

raclnp · 2022-04-18T18:10:54+00:00

First of all I would say it's really not about sex or love. As people mature they are forced by society to seek all comfort, loving and care from a romantic partner.

That itself is already wrong. Especially men are mostly forced to seek out cuddling from a romantic partner. Women have much more options.

Conflating those needs with sexual and romantic success is the major issue. Men become lonely or isolated, when they don't have enough friends, who care on a deep enough level.

If that kind of stable care was more natural and common, men would be a lot less desperate.

In other words, we need all to become a lot more inclusive and less judgemental, and that also includes being less agist. Agism is so casual and normalized if it's just against the "right" group/person.

tasfa10 · 2022-04-18T01:12:52+00:00

I like this, something positive instead of just complaining.

I would let them decide what they want to get called but if you asked me, since incel has become an insult, to reject the term would be the opposite of reclaiming the word. Gays have reclaimed the word "gay" that used to be pejorative and now it's lost its strength as an insult. I think that's the right approach.

From what I understand many incels are not very permeable to help tho. I'm not saying to give up, but know there's this "black pill" mindset and I suspect more often than not you'd be wasting your time talking to people who don't want to hear their bias challenged. They're often fully convinced there's some physical aspect that makes them unlovable when that's very very rarely the case. Stephen Hawking was married twice and it doesn't get any more physically disadvantaged than him. I'm not diminishing how much of a difference looks can make, but you are virtually never a basket case just because of looks. The truth is, social skills are both the most important aspect of dating and one of the most malleable things. That is the good news. The bad news is you can't teach social skills over the internet to someone you don't know. Unless there are any other resources I'm unaware of that can help with the development of social skills, the main thing you should be doing is getting off the internet and finding a suitable therapist who can work with you on your social skills. I'm afraid looking for help on the internet may be more detrimental than good.

UnconventionalXY · 2022-04-18T13:31:50+00:00

In centuries past, being shunned by society literally meant a death sentence: being shunned by women today is merely being shunned by women; your life is not being threatened; your ability to experience an orgasm is not being threatened; your ability to do and experience amazing things is not threatened; the only thing being threatened is the likelihood of divorce and being fleeced of your assets, so from one aspect, consider yourself lucky to be saved from potentially decades of misery.

Nature has always been unfair: not all males have an opportunity even for sex due to competition with other males, quite apart from being rejected by women too; it's just the nature of things and you aren't being singled out specially. Whilst civilisation should be striving for a higher order outcome than nature for everyone, it's a slow process, so in the meanwhile live your life (which has never been about sex or relationships for more than a fraction of the time); consider what it is you fundamentally want (sexual fulfillment, friendship, occupation, unconditional love, etc?), don't just keep up with the Joneses or listen to the influencers peddling the latest fad, use that male brain of yours to look into other legal avenues of achieving what you want, by separate means; women are not the only source for those things (and often were a fickle source anyway).

Use that male brain of yours to realise that women are cutting off their nose to spite their face: every man they push away is one less man for a woman to have a relationship with and so they have to compete with each other for the remaining smaller subset of men. Pity women for not being able to see that they are doing to themselves what they are doing to you: they will inevitably live by the sword and die by the sword at their own hand, no need to assist them.

Understand that what people say to you tells you more about them than about you personally, so focus only on what they are saying about themself: it's a potent antidote to feeling shame when you can see its about them and not you. Women create the very involuntarily celibate men they complain about.

It's said that you have to love yourself before you can love another, so start learning how to love yourself and becoming comfortable with who you are right now because it is about you, not anyone else. Right now, who you are is okay: tomorrow you may decide you want to be different for your own reason, but today you are okay as you are regardless what anyone says.

Pursue what is interesting to you and eventually you will attract others of like mind: pursue what you think others want and it will not be the genuine you, plus they are also likely to change their mind and you will have wasted the effort.

Some might interpret men going their own way as individual men wandering off into the wilderness, alone and lonely and bitter, however I prefer to interpret it in the plural sense: men as a group embarking on a journey of discovery together as brothers, helping and supporting each other and listening to the experiences of their gay brethren who have preceded them on the journey; it's the beginning of an adventure or a kind of road trip along the road less traveled.

Darkwolf90 · 2022-04-18T18:09:59+00:00

Push for legalized prostitution? I mean this is something that benefits women too, particularly existing black market sex workers, so we could end up with Allies that create good PR given the current misandrist, pro-woman misogyny state of society. Also men need to learn casual sex is just a "high end" version of masturbation, women tend to be incredibly bad at intercourse so by probabilistic standards they are probably getting better by themselves 🤣

endersoul48 · 2022-04-18T05:27:32+00:00

incel is a negative term and can be taped onto any man who disagrees with women. but just from the subreddit incels before it got deleted. if u say ur an incel or support or people who are. go fuck your self get the fuck away from me

sbrbrsre43 · 2022-04-18T20:26:41+00:00

Incels can't be helped. Womens hipergamy, being ugly, losing genetic roulette and wased youth cannot be changed therefore they cant be helped - talking from expirience.

SnooMarzipans5669 · 2022-04-18T20:10:49+00:00

Professional wingman here. Get off your duff, get help, GET THE GIRL.

Not all girls are bad. This is insane. The echo chamber is crazy on the internet.

Most girls are waiting for a guy. I never said it would be easy, but it is out there. Don't give up. Get offline. Start brushing your damn teeth. Go run. I didn't say jog. Go run. Do your pushups. Shit will happen.

throwawayincelacc · 2022-04-18T20:18:31+00:00

Incels started by calling themselves incels. The whole point of it was a group of men that, to the best of their knowledge, tried to be suitable dating partners but for whatever reason were disregarded. It spiraled out as the echo chamber just grew increasingly bitter as men would chain many bad experiences and then share them online in these groups. Comments would most likely point out that if they were richer / born handsome they wouldn't have this issue.

I only ever read a few comments there but second hand accounts often describe the men in those groups as "expecting" sex. I wouldn't doubt there are incels that expect sex, however what I did read from there was just extreme frustration at the extreme power imbalance between men and women in dating / relationships. The frustration that women are basically born gods and men can be born with such undesirable features / not be rich enough that they are, as they describe themselves, involuntarily celibate. Then feminist reddit admins decided to nuke the subreddit and the term incel just devolved into an insult without any purpose. Given that there's no group around specifically to label yourself as an incel, I doubt these frustrated men would want to be labeled as one, especially with current connotations.

MGTOW is easily the most effective way of approaching this. MRA can't just magically fix dating. Women can't be expected to accommodate every man. There's no single person that can fix this. The sad part is that when bad dates happen to women there's another #Metoo movement. When bad dates happen to men it becomes an insult to all men. As much as it goes against instinct, these men need to find something else to throw themselves towards. And I'd wager that most, if not all, men have hobbies they enjoy and can dedicate that time towards. More men in the MGTOW movement = less available men in the dating pool = more power to the men that are continuing to date = hopefully a brighter future.

ribps · 2022-04-18T01:59:36+00:00

Bro everyday I match girls on dating sites and destroy their lives

I do it all for my incel brothers

EpicHajsownik · 2022-04-18T20:44:54+00:00

I'm an Incel and I feel like people don't really understand what do we want.
We want equal rights and responsibilities for both genders.

People think, that we want a traditional gender roles etc. Yeah gender roles like men dying on war and women having just to cook. Seriously why tf assign gender roles?

Incels don't view women as some other species. Actually they don't like when women are treated like one for example at war when they are evacuated. Incels are like: Why should a woman be treated differently than me?

Fearless-File-3625 · 2022-04-18T17:51:33+00:00

We need therapists specialising in fixing INCELS.

ascendsouthafrica · 2022-04-18T08:25:07+00:00

Maybe create a discord server and moderate. Appoint men and women who are willing to help and work hard to prevent the server from derailing on its objective.

boomboxspence · 2022-04-18T10:16:26+00:00

I am but I don't know what would help

doggosrbabies · 2022-04-18T22:45:15+00:00

I don't agree that'd stain the MRM's reputation even more than what's already stained

keepinitreal567 · 2024-02-13T08:43:14+00:00

I think the term "incel" is overrated. These are people who are either grew up with behavioral disabilities, who don't have a socially smart father, who are just unlucky in relationships and have bad experiences. Just because some woman are shallow chad chasers and money chasers, doesn't mean all are that way. You have a small select few which are normal. So all is good!

Title	Helping our Incels
Author	ribps
Upvotes	72
Comments	74
Date	April 18, 2022 12:08 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/u5zw1x/helping_our_incels/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/helping-our-incels.1112247 https://theredarchive.com/post/1112247