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Hundreds (feminists) protest vote to raise Swiss women’s retirement age

Razorbladekandyfan

September 27, 2022
421 upvotes
/r/MensRights
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/hundreds-protest-vote-to-raise-swiss-women-s-retirement-age/47930966
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Title Hundreds (feminists) protest vote to raise Swiss women’s retirement age
Author

Razorbladekandyfan

Upvotes 421
Comments 131
Date September 27, 2022 3:10 PM UTC
(3 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/xpje5b/hundreds_feminists_protest_vote_to_raise_swiss/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/hundreds-feminists-protest-vote-to-raise-swiss.1133699
https://theredarchive.com/post/1133699
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Comments

[–]Razorbladekandyfan[S] 279 points280 points281 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

So much for "feminism is for equality".

[–]TFME1 52 points53 points54 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

They've changed the plank: "Feminism is for equity".

Nothing like a moving target to confuse...well, everyone.

[–]TracyMorganFreeman 43 points44 points45 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Equity, eh?

Time to start pouring funding into male Healthcare to fix that life expectancy gap.

That or start cutting funding for women to bring it down to men's.

They aren't really for equality or equity.

It's all buzzwords to weaponize opportunism.

[–]eldred2 20 points21 points22 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

Equity would be them retiring later than men, so they're their average time retired would match.

edit: they're->their

[–]Educational_Prune_45 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I love this this fact.

[–][deleted] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]TFME1 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Confusion is their desired end product. I'm, of course, referring to what constitutes "normal", for the average person, on any given day.

I guess, statistically, it isn't going to work on everyone.

[–]Glum-One816 57 points58 points59 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Shhh, that is not about feminism. They said😂😂😂 It showed that feminism is cowardly from wars.

[–][deleted] 183 points184 points185 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

So much for equal rights eh?

Whats funny. Is they could have cmapaigned to have the mens age dropped to meet women's retirment age. But they didn't. Funny that isn't it?

[–]Punder_man 106 points107 points108 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Or, as feminists keep saying to us: "When you are accustomed to privilege, equality can fell like oppression"

[–]Schadrach 32 points33 points34 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ironically that phrase started as something an MRA posted on Usenet in 97. Look it up.

[–]mattmilli0pics 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Straw man argument

[–]Punder_man 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

How? it is LITERALLY something that feminists say / have said..
Unless you are implying that the argument itself "When you are accustomed to privilege, equality can feel like oppression"

Then yes, I agree with that.

[–]mattmilli0pics 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes the argument itself is a whataboutism and a way to deflect from their hypocrisy.

[–]Punder_man 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Cool, your original reply lacked context, thank you for clarifying.

I agree that it's a strawman but that doesn't stop me from unironically throwing it back at them.

[–]10YB 18 points19 points20 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

someone on reddit once said that if you support equal rights, then you are a femininist.

It got wy too many upvotes

[–][deleted] 26 points27 points28 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

I generally fine with equal rights... and lefts.. eg consequances, responsibility, accountability has to come with it.

The responsible part is missing massivly these days

[–]TFME1 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Facts!

[–]TracyMorganFreeman 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If you are against violence, you're a Jain.

What's that? A particular philosophy composed of multiple moral positions doesn't necessarily have a monopoly on a particular moral position?

You don't say.

[–]jessi387 12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This…

[–]Nated1945 89 points90 points91 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

"More than 10,000 people turned out for a Women’s Strike that was staged across Switzerland in 2019. The day of action called for equal rights between men and women and for action to be taken to stop violence against women."

The irony here is palpable

[–]Razorbladekandyfan[S] 26 points27 points28 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Its painful.

[–]63daddy 81 points82 points83 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Feminists demonstrating against equality. What a surprise.

[–]heeroena 51 points52 points53 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

When equity/equality backfires

[–]Klexosinfreefall 41 points42 points43 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

You guys just don't understand that feminists just want equality and women are more equal than men

/S

[–]Surv1ver 27 points28 points29 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

All animals genders are equal, but some animals genders are more equal then others.

  • animal gender farm

[–]ejtoenails -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

you didn't read the article did you? they're protesting against a vote which raised the women's retirement age recently

[–]je97 43 points44 points45 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Thankfully it doesn't matter. One good thing about direct democracy is that a small and very loud group doesn't manage to dictate what happens.

[–][deleted] 33 points34 points35 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Better than the US, at least. The loud ones dictate society, at this point.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

America feels like watching GoT Sparrows cult.

[–]Surv1ver 10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Swiss democracy, is the absolute best way of government there is. I wish we were more like the Swiss.

[–]elebrin 65 points66 points67 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Really, if women are living into their 90s with regularity but men are dying by 76 or so, then women's retirement age should be 80ish. That way both men and women get about a decade of retirement at the end of their life.

[–][deleted] 41 points42 points43 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Not forgetting that in Switzerland there is still a mandatory draft for men

[+]elebrin -29 points-28 points-27 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

The Swiss don't go to war, however, so it's not like there is any great risk of them being called into battle.

I'm not really opposed to the idea of conscription, and I don't particularly think women belong in the military. Sure, women can join up and hold ranks as a noncombat role perhaps, but the real fighting's for men. You won't ever really convince me otherwise. When strong backs, legs, and arms are needed, you want men.

[–]nineteenletterslong_ 17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

if women are unsuited for the military then the shouldn't have the option to participate. if they're not then they should be drafted too. i'l also remind you that men without a strong back are required to serve too

[–][deleted] 22 points23 points24 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Well but it is a waste of time, a woman can start directly her career when she finish her studies while men have to go to the draft. There is something else for people not wanting to go to the draft called civil service, like helping in hospitals or cleaning the street, women can do that.

In my case i was unable to do neither for medical condition and now am forced to pay a tax each year which btw was raised to be paid till 30 year to 37 year last year and no one cared about it...

[–]anonposting987 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Wait, are you saying that in Switzerland EVERY male has to serve time in the military or civil service regardless of war time or not? This would be entirely different from the American version of a draft and I had no clue. That sounds insane.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

In Switzerland there is no professional army like in America that's why every male has to serve in the military to become a reservist

[–]curiossceptic 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Every Swiss men gets drafted when they turn 18 or 19. They then have to go to a multi day evaluation of their physical and psychological fitness. According to the results of those tests there are three options that are chosen by the authorities for the men:

  1. serve in the army
  2. serve in civil protection
  3. unfit to serve, pay 3% higher taxes for at least 11 years

[–]anonposting987 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Wow, that's nuts. I did not know that, thank you. How long are they forced to serve?

[–]curiossceptic 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Around a year, which can either be done all at once or in installments (basic training and then every year for a few weeks). So, at least it's not too long but it is majorly annoying as it delays your career at an early point, i.e. most guys can't start college or their professional career as early as women do. In some cases employers also don't like to hire guys who have to serve as they will be missing from the job for a few weeks.

[–]Alarming_Draw 38 points39 points40 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Laughed my fucking ass off when far right won in Sweden-I have been shouting from the rooftops for YEARS that all feminism achieves is letting the Far right into power.

Because society quickly gets SICK of whiny far left feminism and its man hating so instead turns to the opposite.

And Sweden is yet another example proving my point. Its happening everywhere.

For the record I hate the far right. but feminism is pure fucking evil and eventually turns EVERYBODY off.

[–]BillyDeanMorgan 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

💯

[–]VeganBaguette 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You seem to be confusing Sweden and Switzerland.

[–]NutsLikeMelons 14 points15 points16 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The argument about the impact of motherhood on women’s retirement age is complete BS. “Mothers” are not “women”. The two groups overlap but are not the same. Does this mean feminists would be happy to have non-mothers retire at 65? Or should they retire at 70 to make up for them not having done their part to “carry the country” by raising the children?

[–]Chome_gnompy 12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What's that thing feminists love to say? When you're used to privilege, real equality feels like oppression? ☕

[–]Foreign_Law3727 17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I really wish there women and men on here who speak about each other’s POV. I can’t think of a justification women have for protesting.

[–]Amazing-Bit6140 13 points14 points15 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

It equalizes things in the wrong direction, apparently.

Seriously, feminism has convinced these people that women are flat out Oppressedtm and that all issues should be looked at in this lens. It's how feminism justifies all the other blatant discrimination against men.

So anything that helps men more than women must be attacked as attacking equality as a whole. The international Gender Equality Index has codified this (literally, it's in the code of the algorithm). If men get better in any category relative to women, the gender "equality" rating goes down

[–]PricklyGoober 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If men get better in any category relative to women, the gender "equality" rating goes down

The more egregious part is that at the same time women having it better off in a certain category is considered “equal”. Thus the Gender Equality Index should really be renamed to “Female Privilege Index”.

[–]StickyBlackMess69420 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They want equal rights without equal responsibilities

[–]eldred2 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

We want equality! But not that equality!

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points17 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Schwitzerland or Schweiz in German shows us the real face of feminism. Female superiority. Nothing more, nothing less.

[–]EvilMorty137 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

What is the male retirement age in Switzerland?

[–]Stinky_Stephen 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Apparently is was recently made the same for women.

The feminists in the article claim that women should retire earlier than men because of "unpaid labor".

[–]Rich_Ad_7493 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There should be some way to help Swiss men, drafted or to be drafted, leave the country.

[–]Dr_RxRedpill 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Rights for me, but not for thee!

[–]DavidByron2 14 points15 points16 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Sure; feminists lie.

They lie when they say they want equality.

But of course they don't lie when they say they are left wing. They'd never lie about THAT. They're definitely not right wing and lying about what they are.

[–]nineteenletterslong_ 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

thank you so much. a hug

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Feminism is basically a hard core conservative mind set guised under liberal views. They basically take the worst parts of both extreme ideologies and wrap them into one package. They play the moral high ground bull shit like the extreme left - shaming people, demanding their view is the morally correct way, while also playing the wanna be fascist like the extreme right - basically demanding you do and think as they say, if you don't, you're a horrible human who should be exterminated (ya know, like fucking Hitler).

[–]DavidByron2 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

And they feel under constant threat from idiotic things like the "War on Christmas" but "the male gaze" instead.

[–]tiredweaboo 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

protest vote to raise swiss women’s retirement age

Go out and protest! Good for them!

to be the same as men’s

Oh…

[–]TheeBattleMedic 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes equality aka preferential treatment. And yes they need less work and more money to go and bash more men. While they mock the men that work themselves to death and benefitting from the work the men do.

[–]RifleShower 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They sure hate equality when they get it.

[–]MultistanForLife1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (35 children) | Copy Link

This makes me, as a feminist, really disappointed. The people who protest against this gives the whole ideology a bad reputation when they clearly go against what we are supposed to stand for.

[–]Surv1ver 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

I couldn’t agree more. Not only are they giving us a bad reputation, but they’re actively hurting our sex’ position in society. I remember this great line from the red pill documentary:

Look around. Everything you see was put there by a man.

I really love that line, because it highlights how the traditional gender roles disenfranchised us from contributing to society, by assigning us to the domestic realm, instead of being a part of the workforce alongside men. It’s not fair to us nor them.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

Believe me in Switzerland this was a big deal not only feminist but lot of women are angry about this vote. Forgeting that in 2014 there was a vote to stop the mandatory draft for men and most women voted against it....

At least thanks to direct democracy we can see that feminism are not realy for equality.

[–]Surv1ver 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

Didn’t the Swiss voters also reject two previous attempts in 2004 and 2017, on equalizing the retirement age?

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Yeah this one passed at only 50,6 %

[–]Surv1ver 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

But it did pass, which is a sign that things are moving in the right direction. Now the interesting question is why that is. Are men becoming more aware of themselves as a collective group and realizing their need for equal rights, or is it women who have growing up to take more responsibility for society at large?

[–]Fearless-File-3625 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It is certainly not women taking responsibility because the polls show 60% of all votes against it were by women compared to 40% by men.

[–]Surv1ver 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

That’s a bummer.

[–]Fearless-File-3625 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Women always vote against equality when it negatively affects but men don't that.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Actually it is part of a reform of the retirement, most people that voted for did not do it for the puropse of equality but for the puropse of having better retirement(or even normal since the actual situation).

[–]Surv1ver 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

See, that’s interesting. What was the main purpose of the bill and how did it improve people’ retirement situation?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Raising retirement age of 1 year for women would save money for the state that will be redistributed. The vote was 2 parts the other vote was elevating the tax on value added. The 2 had to be accepted or rejected together.

[–]Surv1ver 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

What would the money be redistributed towards?

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Many women who never vote only vote on those matters

[–]Surv1ver 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

That is just sad.

Women, just like men, shouldn’t be restrained to mere idiots, i.e. a private person, someone who is only concerned about themselves and those close to them/their own private sphere. Instead we should all be concerned by the political realm /society at large.

[–]denyjunctionfunction 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Did/does Switzerland provide statistics of who voted for what?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There are survey that show approximately

[–]MultistanForLife1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (16 children) | Copy Link

Okay this really isn’t what I was saying. Feminism does not stand for this. These "feminists" who are protesting goes against their own ideology. Don’t put all feminists under the same umbrella as these

[–]Amazing-Bit6140 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

So what you're saying is that you, a commenter using a username on an internet forum are the true feminist, and the feminists actually responsible for changing the laws, writing the academic theory, teaching the courses, influencing the public policies, and the massive, well-funded feminist organizations with thousands and thousands of members all of whom call themselves feminists... they are not "real feminists".

That's not just "no true Scotsman". That's delusional self deception.

Listen, if you want to call yourself a feminist, I don't care. I've been investigating feminism for more than 9 years now, and people like you used to piss me off, because to my mind all you were doing was providing cover and ballast for the powerful political and academic feminists you claim are just jerks. And believe me, they ARE jerks. If you knew half of what I know about the things they've done under the banner of feminism, maybe you'd stop calling yourself one.

But I want you to know. You don't matter. You're not the director of the Feminist Majority Foundation and editor of Ms. Magazine, Katherine Spillar, who said of domestic violence: "Well, that's just a clean-up word for wife-beating," and went on to add that regarding male victims of dating violence, "we know it's not girls beating up boys, it's boys beating up girls."

You're not Jan Reimer, former mayor of Edmonton and long-time head of Alberta's Network of Women's Shelters, who just a few years ago refused to appear on a TV program discussing male victims of domestic violence, because for her to even show up and discuss it would lend legitimacy to the idea that they exist.

You're not Mary P Koss, who describes male victims of female rapists in her academic papers as being not rape victims because they were "ambivalent about their sexual desires" (if you don't know what that means, it's that they actually wanted it), and then went on to define them out of the definition of rape in the CDC's research because it's inappropriate to consider what happened to them rape.

You're not the National Organization for Women, and its associated legal foundations, who lobbied to replace the gender neutral federal Family Violence Prevention and Services Act of 1984 with the obscenely gendered Violence Against Women Act of 1994. The passing of that law cut male victims out of support services and legal assistance in more than 60 passages, just because they were male.

You're not the Florida chapter of the NOW, who successfully lobbied to have Governor Rick Scott veto not one, but two alimony reform bills in the last ten years, bills that had passed both houses with overwhelming bipartisan support, and were supported by more than 70% of the electorate.

You're not the feminist group in Maryland who convinced every female member of the House on both sides of the aisle to walk off the floor when a shared parenting bill came up for a vote, meaning the quorum could not be met and the bill died then and there.

You're not the feminists in Canada agitating to remove sexual assault from the normal criminal courts, into quasi-criminal courts of equity where the burden of proof would be lowered, the defendant could be compelled to testify, discovery would go both ways, and defendants would not be entitled to a public defender.

You're not Professor Elizabeth Sheehy, who wrote a book advocating that women not only have the right to murder their husbands without fear of prosecution if they make a claim of abuse, but that they have the moral responsibility to murder their husbands.

You're not the feminist legal scholars and advocates who successfully changed rape laws such that a woman's history of making multiple false allegations of rape can be excluded from evidence at trial because it's "part of her sexual history."

You're not the feminists who splattered the media with the false claim that putting your penis in a passed-out woman's mouth is "not a crime" in Oklahoma, because the prosecutor was incompetent and charged the defendant under an inappropriate statute (forcible sodomy) and the higher court refused to expand the definition of that statute beyond its intended scope when there was already a perfectly good one (sexual battery) already there. You're not the idiot feminists lying to the public and potentially putting women in Oklahoma at risk by telling potential offenders there's a "legal" way to rape them.

And you're none of the hundreds or thousands of feminist scholars, writers, thinkers, researchers, teachers and philosophers who constructed and propagate the body of bunkum theories upon which all of these atrocities are based.

You're the true feminist. Some random person on the internet.


Pasted response from Karen Straughn for your "those aren't 'good' feminists" bullshit

And yes, i will keep posting this, so long as you make these claims

[–]MultistanForLife1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link

Listen, I am not claiming any of the things that you’ve listed in your little essay. I just don’t understand why you refuse to see all the good feminism has done. Without it we wouldn’t be allowed to vote, work in all professions, inherit, report people for assault (yes they do happen in case you forgot), etc.

[–]Amazing-Bit6140 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

you’ve listed in your little essay

minimizing issues that affect, men, again.

How about you take your little opinions and fuck off? We deal with facts and logic here.

I just don’t understand why you refuse to see all the good feminism has done

It hasn't done any. It's done good thing for the bigots that benefit from it, it has not done good for society as a whole, and your refusal to address or even fucking read the "little essay" just proves how accurate that is.

Without it we wouldn’t be allowed to vote,

Vote without the responsibility of the draft men are subject to, you mean? Special privileges (also men as a class couldn't vote long before that either, so stupid point)

work in all professions

bullshit

inherit

bullshit

report people for assault (yes they do happen in case you forgot), etc.

FUCKING LOL

As if men weren't literally killed on the whim of women using this excuse since the beginning of time. Emmet Till, anyone?

Also how conveniently you forget that feminism will defend abusers whenever it benefits them. Not exactly a paragon of victims rights.

Get your head out of your own ass, the air is nice out here.

[–]MultistanForLife1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Also, I’m not "minimising issues that affect, men, again". It was interesting points but you could’ve summarised it a bit more that’s all.

[–]Amazing-Bit6140 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Also, I’m not "minimising issues that affect, men, again". It was interesting points but you could’ve summarized it a bit more that’s all.

"Little essay"

Kind of hard to summarize a whole bunch of unique information. Not that it would have mattered, you ignore points you can't argue anyway.

[–]MultistanForLife1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

You are so pathetic I can’t believe it. "We deal with facts here" oh okay well then how about you actually read them. Men have been allowed to vote since it was invented and in the US all men was allowed to vote in most states by 1828, while women gained the same rights first in 1920.

First in 1922 were women allowed to inherit property and they were allowed to hold and dispose of property on the same terms as men in 1926. Men has always had those rights.

Why are you so fucking afraid of admitting that women get assaulted? They get called after and ruched without permission in a way men aren’t, so I really don’t think I’m the one with my head up my ass.

[–]Amazing-Bit6140 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Men have been allowed to vote since it was invented and in the US all men was allowed to vote in most states by 1828, while women gained the same rights first in 1920.

Black men would like a word, and since history class failed you: it was "Landowners" who could vote, not men as a social class

First in 1922 were women allowed to inherit property and they were allowed to hold and dispose of property on the same terms as men in 1926. Men has always had those rights.

Bullshit. Married women couldn't inherit property, because her husband was legally responsible for all her choices. If she fucked something up, it was his fault. There were good reasons married women couldn't do many things, because they didn't have any of the responsibility of those things.

Single women could do all of those things, since long before that.

Why are you so fucking afraid of admitting that women get assaulted?

No one is afraid to admit that, no one denied it. The only one dismissing/denying reality here is you pretending women don't use false rape allegations in the same way men use rape to feel power over another.

You are so pathetic I can’t believe it.

[–]Halafax 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You're on fire today. Well spoken, accurate, and eloquent.

Thank you.

[–]Punder_man 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Except, most of the time when stuff like this happens we get feminists either supporting these women, telling us were 'wrong' and that this won't bring equality or on the other end of the spectrum we have people saying "Those aren't true feminists"

Now, granted you are calling them out which is better than 99% of feminists i've encountered..

The other issue here is that if someone labels themselves as 'feminist' then that gives them a lot more political weight to throw around and so we should be calling them out when those views are distinctly anti-equality.

[–]MultistanForLife1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

So you think we should call out all feminists? Even if they work really hard to help women who are oppressed?

[–]Amazing-Bit6140 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Which ones were helping women who are oppressed, instead of helping women who are already a privileged class gain more privileges?

Feminism isn't in Iran helping those women, it's men defending them.

Feminism isn't in Ukraine defending the country, it's men doing that (and being forced to, i might add)

Feminism isn't even in the states fighting to end genital mutilation, because they put in sexist legislation that only protects women and decided they were done, and then claim all resources that might help to end the horrific practice for men, while at the same time having their members defend it as protecting a "mother's choice".

Feminism is fucking disgusting, and that you see it as an unequivocal good only shows how privileged of a life you must have led.

Do you not even realize many of the men you are talking to had genital mutilation performed on them by their caregivers and doctors? and were manipulated into thinking their own body parts were disgusting to justify the practice? Something women are 100% protected from in the west?

Where is all of this supposed good feminism is doing? Because it all seems like bratty entitlement and demanding men do more things for you while you greedily accumulate power at men's expense.

[–]Punder_man 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Should we call out MRA's when they display blatant misogyny even IF "they work really hard to help men who are oppressed by the systems of today?"

The answer is: YES

We should call out anyone / everyone for their bigotry, this is not exclusive to feminists..

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Sorry, you already statet it without deleting.

[–]BreakinLiberty 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Wait what? They want the age to be raised? Why

[–]HikuroMishiro 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

The retirement age for women was one year earlier than for men. Recently there was a vote to raise the retirement age for women (to be the same as men's) so the pension fund wouldn't run out of money, so now women are protesting that they are being treated equally to a man.

[–]BreakinLiberty 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Ohhh the wording on the title was confusing.

So they are protesting AGAINTS the vote for womens retirement age to be raised? The logic 🤣

So women get maternity leave and then get earlier retirement? Wow

[–]HikuroMishiro 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Indeed. At least things are equal now, I doubt the protests will come to anything. Governments may like catering to certain demographics, but they like money more.

[–]RatDontPanic 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

What is the current retirement age for men in Switzerland? If they're making it higher for women than men then I'd protest, too. If they're making it equal to men then these feminists can piss off.

[–]curiossceptic 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

it was already 65 for men and 64 for women. With this vote we equalized the retirement ages for men and women.

[–]RatDontPanic 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Oh! The MISOGYNY! /s

[–]curiossceptic 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Unfortunately not the only and not the most impactful discrimination of Swiss men by constitution or by law.

Others are mandatory conscription for men (which includes two different duties to serve, the duty to serve in the military and the duty to serve in civil protection), exemption tax for men if they are deemed not fit to serve due to disability, not the same protection of bodily autonomy of boys, different treatment of widowers and widows with regards to financial support.

The European court of human rights has already ruled points two and four (exemption tax and widowers financial aid) as discrimination. But those rulings have little to no effect unfortunately.

[–]RatDontPanic 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Men make laws that favor women.

Men protest this.

Feminists then defend it by saying patriarchy hurts men.

The law gets changed in favor of equality

Feminists protest.

I must conclude from this that the Earth is neither flat nor round but cube shaped like Bizarro's homeworld.

[–]aigars2 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

True colours

[–]CuntPaoChicken 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No morality in feminism

[–]ijustdontcare74 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The feminists tried this in the UK when the gov made retirement age the same, they lost every court case and the screeching was biblical. I'll try and find it but there was a news anchor that asked one of these feminists why they didn't support equality under the law in this case....you could practically hear her brain failing on camera.

[–]Zipdox 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Women have longer life expectancies and less workplace accidents and deaths, yet they want a lower retirement age?

[–]SadGruffman 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Lower everyone’s retirement age

[–]KochiraJin 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

After reading the article, I don't think that's an option. They are raising it to keep the pension system from collapsing.

[–]SadGruffman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

We could do several things as a society to prevent this, all of which are inclusive and provide additional jobs and healthcare to men.

1-government funded and supported health programs

2-male maternity leave

3-expanded healthcare unrelated to the job market. Living should not be a privilege, but a right.

4-universal income. Simply being a citizen guarantees you can put food and basic living amenities (housing, water, electric, public transport) on the table.

Honestly if we just -required- our corporate overlords to pay living wages and -held our government responsible- men and probably women too would be more well off, and retiring early…

[–]KochiraJin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

None of that actually fixes the problem their pension system is having. Some of them would likely make it worse. Universal income for instance would essentially be pension for all. That has to be funded somehow.

[–]SadGruffman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Funding won’t be a problem, I have a profound idea

We’re going to actually tax the rich, and corporations that fit into various categories.

This should resolve our pension issues.

[–]KochiraJin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If your solution is to increase taxes then you should say so.

[–]SadGruffman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I did that?

[–]Shaundorian 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Where are the protests for the men who are being drafted to War against their will? in Both Ukraine and Russia? Forced to fight when they just want to live their lives?

​

Ahh I forgot, the Swiss Retirement Age is going up that's more important..

[–]Razorbladekandyfan[S] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You can see videos of Russians fighting the police trying to draft them. in Ukraine there were petitions to the government to lift the ban on men from leaving. They got a response from Zelensky that he won't do that.

[–]Pitiful_Row_8253 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Reddit user try to understand that people can care about multiple things at the same time challenge (impossible)

[–]the-lone-squid -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The boomer generation would rather the government go completely bankrupt then yield any small changes to their precious retirement.. abolish the whole system and let them all go back to work

[+]Livabetes99 -7 points-6 points-5 points 3 years ago* (9 children) | Copy Link

Guys, I got to be honest, the person who wrote this article is obviously a feminist, but I don't think the protest itself is about feminism. I wouldn't want my government putting me farther from retirement regardless of what gender I was. I don't blame the women for being pissed :/.

Edit: I was unaware that the retirement ages for men and women were different. Yeah, this is bullshit, they should have lowered the age for men to make it equal with women

[–]Fearless-File-3625 21 points22 points23 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

Men die 5 years earlier than women. Men pay majority of taxes. Men do compulsory conscription.

The retirement ages should be 5 years, at the very least, less for men.

Women have 0 rational grounds to protest, if anything it is men who should protest.

[–]Livabetes99 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, that makes sense. Personally, I'd be in favor of everyone having the right to tell the government to fuck off when they want us to fight their land/money grabbing operations for them

[–]Razorbladekandyfan[S] 11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

But then again they were not lowering it for men, so why do women get to retire earlier? what kind of logic is that.

[–]Livabetes99 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I think I'm missing a fundamental piece of information somewhere. Are you saying that they should both raise the retirement age for women and lower it for men? I'm sure I'm misunderstanding something

[–]Livabetes99 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Wait, did I miss something? Is there retirement age for men and women not the same?

[–]NutsLikeMelons 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Men at 65, women at 64 currently. Hence - inequality.

[–]Livabetes99 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

OOOOHHHH... okay, now it makes sense. Yeah, fuck them hoes. Now I get what OP was saying about lowering men's age in this thread. Yeah, that definitely should have been done

[–]Fearless-File-3625 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No, it was one year more for men.

[–]curiossceptic 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, this is bullshit, they should have lowered the age for men to make it equal with women

The main reason for this mini reform of the public pension system was to financially stabilize it. Lowering the retirement age of men would not have achieved that.

[–]A69dupere -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Stop bitching and get back to work!

[–]Icy-Start5536 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Equality?

[–]Dry-Imagination2727 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Women tend to live longer than men, on average. Arguably, they should retire later too

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