[Serious Question] Is the Blue Pill just denial and delusions?

SpaceWhiskey · 2017-11-20T14:37:05+00:00

[permanently deleted]

DebatePony · 2017-11-20T14:31:17+00:00

Men don't wear low cut shirts? Could have fooled me.

Also, have you not seen guys wearing A shirts that are cut so low that you can see their stomach? I mean they may be trying to draw attention to their stomach/arms/chest, but it's more likely that they bought that shirt because it serves some other purpose like being cool/airy whilst they work out.

And sure, some women may be wearing low cut shirts because it draws attention to their cleavage, but it's just as likely that they are wearing it for some other purpose. Like it matches what they are wearing, it's the only clean thing they have, it didn't always fit that way (shrinking of the garment, growth of the chest), it keeps them cool/airy whilst working out, or they just like how it looks.

Electra_Cute · 2017-11-20T14:50:15+00:00

Now, let's keep that in mind when discussing PPD. Whenever there seems to be a disagreement involving a Blue Piller, it's only a matter of time before they start using "It's not like that!" and "There is nothing wrong with ____" arguments. (Not to mention "emotionally charged" insults.)

"Circlejerky" straw-man posts are not exactly healthy for a debate subreddit, I would ask you for evidence of a user doing this specifically, but it would destroy your straw-man and I highly doubt you have any examples of this.

"Women who wear low-cut shirts are trying to bring attention to their cleavage",

Just as u/haunting-you, u/aDoseOfEmpathy pointed out, there could be several reasons. The Red Pill is not concerned with what is actually "true" or "correct", it is concerned with creating a simple model for reality, it is a lot of light switch thinking. The users writing the content wanted to provide 1 simple explanation for every behavior so they could systemitize social interactions.

Grizzlybear_Nobility · 2017-11-20T14:17:45+00:00

There can be many reasons why someone would wear a low cut top. What you consider to be "denial" is really just the fact that not all things are as they seem (edit:...or, if you prefer...not all things HAVE to be a certain way). Not all women are after a man's resources. Not all men are just after sex. Etc, etc etc. The problem with TRP is that everything is in black and white, when in fact life is full of grey and nuance.

SlimLovin · 2017-11-20T15:17:45+00:00

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hyperrreal · 2017-11-21T00:19:49+00:00

removed - OP not engaging in good faith

writingtoc · 2017-11-20T14:59:04+00:00

I feel you OP. I run into delusional people all the time. They're deluded and they live in a comfortable fantasy world and they only have emotional (not rational) arguments.

I suspect you and I also share a similar definition for terms like 'deluded' and 'irrational' and 'living in a fantasy world.' My definition is: 'disagrees with me.'

You realize you're essentially asking us why people disagree with red pill, right? Is that what you're asking? I mean, what do you think? Do you think people who disagree with the notion that red pill = truth could have any reason other than being delusional and emotional? And what would you think if someone said that to you? Oh, you believe red pill is true because you're delusional/irrational/emotional. Do you think that's a good argument?

it's only a matter of time before they start using "It's not like that!"

That's what we call a 'disagreement,' yes. This is a thing that happens in life. Is it a problem?

Mr_Smoogs · 2017-11-20T14:35:50+00:00

This is a revisit of the old makeup question. Do women wear makeup for themselves or for attracting men? It is clear that it is on a sliding scale of wanting to look and feel pretty on one side and attracting attention from the opposite sex on the other. The scale slides to favor one side or the other depending on ovulating cycles and personality types.

2017-11-20T17:04:05+00:00

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Princeso_Bubblegum · 2017-11-20T17:26:50+00:00

Does TBP actually have some explanations\theories like TRP has

Yes, 90% of things red pill points out have feminists explanations, you just don't ever dig far enough to find them.

Women have lower cleavage because of institutional sexism in the fashion industry which makes most women's clothes like that, and that is embedded into them by the Patriarchy as simple the normal way to wear a shirt.

IckyStickyPoo · 2017-11-20T17:56:55+00:00

The question "is the blue pill just denial and delusions" is a circlejerk. If that title was posted about RP, it would be zapped by mods within minutes.

It's unanswerable.

AlanHalworth · 2017-11-20T18:46:05+00:00

Yes, I think TBP does have a theory for the case you mentioned. On some level when people wear a certain type of clothing, it's probably because (a) it's comfortable, (b) it's inexpensive, or (c) someone, somewhere decided it would win others' approval. However (c) is a social statement; it may not apply to individuals. If a particularly glamorous actress wears a low cut shirt, women or teenage girls may think "I want to look like that." That doesn't mean all of them are thinking of how men will perceive it. Maybe they are thinking of how women will perceive it (even if they're not attracted to women, people care what friends think.) Maybe they just admire that particular actress.

EliteSpartanRanger · 2017-11-20T19:57:02+00:00

Like for example, if someone says "Women who wear low-cut shirts are trying to bring attention to their cleavage", that sounds like a reasonable point, right?

regardless, it's not an excuse to harass her, so why does it matter at all

sadomasochrist · 2017-11-20T14:41:27+00:00

Essentially yes. I'm going to swing way deeper than the surface you're touching though.

Male

NAWALT
Experiences AWALT
"You picked wrong" or "you fucked up" (some variation of your fault)
Refine "algorithm"
Experiences AWALT
"You picked wrong" or "you fucked up" (some variation of your fault)
Refine "algorithm"
Experiences AWALT
"You picked wrong" or "you fucked up" (some variation of your fault)
Refine "algorithm"

Then either lose your god damn mind (literally going insane honestly) or accept AWALT.

Female

I'm not like that
Do things like that
"The reason why I did that is because of him"
Do things like that
"The reason why I did that is because of him"
Do things like that
"The reason why I did that is because of him"
Do things like that
"The reason why I did that is because of him"
Do things like that
"The reason why I did that is because of him"
Do things like that
"The reason why I did that is because of him"

The wall will introduce some cognitive dissonance here but I'm not really sure if hypoagency can be solved or ever really dealt with. That's the point I'm at with my research into this. It's the last point I have to really analyze. But I'm not sure if a woman can ever make it past this stage. Plenty do the "cat woman" routine, some decide being a spinster is fine, but I don't know what happens when a woman accepts responsibility for herself truly.

So like I've been saying, fundamentally the issue at it's core is hypoagency and self rationalization. Hypoagency is the real nasty mother fucker here. If you remove it, we'd live in a completely different world. Not unique to women, but central to the mindset of their dating pathology.

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Entropy-7 · 2017-11-20T14:58:17+00:00

TBP as a sub is just a place to satarize the the TRP sub, especially when then have no intellectual heft behind their criticisms.

"Blue Pill" by Red Pill definition is denial and delusion. When you start mixing and matching the subs with the overall philosophies then weird things start to happen when you try to debate them.

TBP is completely incoherent because it is a circle jerk for a yuck.

Blue Pillers generally have no unifying theory or explanation for anything other than "TRP is wrong." But you get 10 bloppers in a room they will have a dozen reasons as to why TRP is wrong.

Most, if not all Blue Pill "explanations" are coloured by:

a) naivety

b) blind luck

c) unacknowledged personal advantages and

d) none of which they are aware of or can describe in detail or can give you a roadmap on how to get there from here.

RP writ large as an idea or even a philosophy is a lot harder to deal with than the TRP sub.

Reasonable minds will have reasonable disagreements on any particular point.

Title	[Serious Question] Is the Blue Pill just denial and delusions?
Author	DebatesNotBans
Upvotes	0
Comments	130
Date	November 20, 2017 2:10 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/7e93fg/serious_question_is_the_blue_pill_just_denial_and/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/serious-question-is-the-blue-pill-just-denial-and.264795 https://theredarchive.com/post/264795

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