Is life really rough for women? If so, is it a lot rougher than a man's life?

philomexa · 2015-11-02T19:46:55+00:00

Whenever this question is posed (which gender is more disadvantaged?), I try to take it out of the first world perspective and imagine it framed around 3rd dregs.

For example: cheap labor trafficked from Indonesia and forced into slavery in Dubai. Who has it worse? the male laborer living in squalid camps, forced to work 16+ hours 115 degree heat? Or the female maid living in a tiny windowless room, forced to work 24/7 for an Emirati family and silently suffer abuse/rape/sexual harassment?

Hm, as a female, I'd say the maid, because I can intrinsically identify with the fear of abuse/rape/sexual harassment. However I logically know that both (the male laborer and the female maid) have a shit sandwich to deal with, and honestly neither are worse off than the other.

Ultimately, I think life is rough for both genders. Men are expendable, and more often face the brutality of this world (whether its the elements/nature or man-on-man violence). Whereas women are resources (thus highly sought after and denied agency) and will more often be the receivers of abuse (mental, physical, sexual, etc).

T;DR-life can be terrible for everyone.

belletaco · 2015-11-03T01:03:44+00:00

How can anyone decide who's life is harder without expericing life as the other gender? I may not think the school system caters to girls but maybe it does and maybe that does in turn make life harder for guys. Men don't can not and will not understand periods so they can't really say it's not that bad, same with catcalling. It's hard to say without being in each other's shoes.

Iforgotmybucket · 2015-11-02T19:26:29+00:00

Well, I've only ever been a woman so I can only offer my personal perspective. I believe that men and women have unique challenges that can't really be compared in a meaningful way. These standards will effect individuals very differently. Some boys and girls will be damaged by not being able to live up to expectations of their gender, while some will conform effortlessly. I have three older brothers that I'm very close to. One is an alpha, type A personality with charm and brains for days, while the other two are somewhat socially awkward, complete nerds. This gave me valuable perspective. I'm certain one of my brothers would have been incel if he didn't have two attractive sisters who made it their personal mission to get him girlfriends. I have a great deal of empathy for men who struggle to fit the ideal.

For me, I had to "undo" a lot of harmful shit to be happy with myself. I am attractive, and quickly learned that my value was highly dependent on that fact. This caused me to have low self esteem and be distrustful of boys and men when I was a teenager. I was labeled the class slut before I ever even kissed a boy, just because of the way I looked. Having to fight against people's perception of me caused me to be hyper aware of my every word and action. As I got older, I had to work harder to be taken seriously at work and school. I think this was a good thing, as it gave me a push to excel.

I think there are challenges that men just can't understand. Being valued on your appearance, not being taken seriously, being told that you don't know what's best for your own life, being harassed on the street, and of course the power and responsibilities that come with having a uterus. I think they are unique challenges that can't be compared to the challenges of manhood. I always find these discussions pointless. Can't we just acknowledge that manhood and womanhood both come with baggage and damaging societal pressures without making it a competition?

5th_Law_of_Robotics · 2015-11-02T19:14:20+00:00

what a welcoming way to pose this question. i'm sure women will feel really comfortable talking about their struggles now.

OfSpock · 2015-11-02T22:36:08+00:00

People who grow up in abusive households have it much worse than people from privileged backgrounds. Which is why certain red pill members and their trust funds get laughed at so much.

belletaco · 2015-11-02T19:28:56+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Imaginarydog · 2015-11-02T20:33:04+00:00

I just don't understand either sides need to compete in the pity party olympics. Instead of realizing that life can be difficult for anyone, of either gender neither of them are actually special. We all have different strengths, weaknesses, and desires.

The people who hold on to how they were rejected/objectified in high school and try to make people in their current life pay for it need to work on themselves more. Tearing down everyone around you only leads you in to a bitter cycle of insecurity, anger and rejection.

That doesn't mean they have to be all love, peace and bacon grease with everyone they encounter. It's perfectly fine to be cautious or just not like the vibe of somebody. A little bit of caution is healthy.. Shutting everyone of another gender out and treating them like they're the devil seems like an emotionally immature way of dealing with your personal problems.

TL;DR: I think that both Feminists and MRAs need a waaaambulance sometimes, because they feel the need to take their issues out of others instead of working on bettering themselves.

wuboo · 2015-11-02T19:21:20+00:00

It depends. I'd have to ask about the background of the woman in question before being able to say whether or not she is at a disadvantage. For example, if she was raised in a fundamentalist religious family, then yes I'd say her life would rougher than a man who was raised in a similar household. The stories of the women who left the Quiverfull movement are kinda awful.

I understand that there are complexities and difficulties to a woman's life but on the other side of the coin there are also complexities and difficulties to a man's life.

Agreed.

2015-11-03T13:43:34+00:00

Life can be hard for people regardless of their genders. It's retarded to say that all men have it hard or all women have it hard.

2015-11-03T02:10:14+00:00

I wouldn't wanna be a woman. Sure they get more free stuff, but they seem to live such boring lives. I hardly ever see women hunting, fishing, building things, or fixing cars. All which are hobbies I enjoy. Sure they technically can do ask that, but for some reason or another they seem to do nothing but talk or play on their phone.

Also I'm pretty stoked about peeing while standing and not bleeding out of my dick for a week..

As far as divorce rape, I've never been married so it hasn't been an issue

LeaneGenova · 2015-11-02T19:38:23+00:00

OP, I'm going to ask that you edit to make the contents of your post a bit more neutral. You're circlejerking with the way you've phrased this.

hyperrreal · 2015-11-02T19:40:27+00:00

This question is totally fine in general, but your post text is way too circlejerky. You need to re-write this, and then I can reapprove. Edit: /u/RedManBearPig it's back up

2015-11-02T23:48:30+00:00

While I have respect for women

This is an ambiguous statement. What does respect mean in this case?

between being brain washed by the media,

Plausible, but too vague, what's being referred to? Men are brainwashed by the media in different ways (porn, movies, body image etc.)

and religion teaching them to be subserviant to man

Not very widespread, in modern societies, this only really makes sense if the OP is from a rural, religious community, or some muslim country.

All that shit and their bodys basically shutdown and leak for a week.

So all women are simply in hibernation for a week out of every month?

And that doesnt seem worth getting a free drink here and there at a bar.

Alright, valid opinion.

Especially when the attention is unwanted.

Ah, here is the rock-bottom one, where there is much controversy. You see, some men, more conservative men, are under the guise that women do not really like sexual attention or sex in general. Further more, women are not aroused or accepting of any expression of male sexuality. This is perhaps the one key trait that marks the alpha-beta divide TRP describes. Confident men, will feel confident about expressing their sexuality, and comfortable doing so, while beta men feel it is unwanted.

SocialIQof0 · 2015-11-03T02:39:41+00:00

I don't think you can say based on gender. I'm a white, female from an upper middle class home. I've had hardships, disappointment, etc. I've experienced sexism here and there, but it hasn't been really harmful. But overall my life has been comfortable.

I worked in corrections for a few years. I saw a lot of people WAY worse off than myself. Homeless men and women. Drug addicts. Impoverished people. People with a lot of problems.

Personally, I think that society says, "sexism, racism, intolerance, exists...so it MUST be harder to be X kind of person." I think the reality is sexism, racism, intolerance exist and if you're a minority you are bound to run into it here and there in life - maybe certain people more than others because of individual circumstance. But it doesn't automatically mean being a minority means your life is harder or worse than someone else.

cxj · 2015-11-03T05:38:04+00:00

Life is brutal. I just watched a C Section today, and suddenly years of solitude, sexual frustration, and being disposable didn't seem too bad.

The main thing that makes me glad to be a male is the absence of periods, and after that childbirth.

eclba · 2015-11-03T09:17:38+00:00

If your a woman just look sexy and everythings fine

2015-11-03T12:50:38+00:00

Almost immediately the women will take an example from Nigeria or Saudi Arabia and then argue that's why she needs more feminism in the first world. As if the fact that the air conditioining is too cold in her office because she chose to wear a business-inappropriate kicky sundress is akin to having your clitoris hacked off with a rusty flint.

But a lot of guys don't realize life sucks for an ugly or a fat girl - she basically has to work and get to where she wants on her own merits. It's why so many of them are so bitter and want to tear down the prettier girls' privileges.

Life for the average-to-good looking woman is typically better than the man's, up until about 30+ or so. Then her looks plummet and many haven't figured out how to do things for themselves other than bat their eyelids. That "sassy" personality men used to love now they can't stand to live with, and once a man's libido drops off he has little interest in dealing with her bullshit.

Gnometard · 2015-11-03T14:44:20+00:00

It's not about us vs them. This is the mentality that needs to fucking stop. In my experience, women get it easier in life. But. That is based off of my values which are shaped by my experience.

In response to that comment.... am I the ONLY person who thinks women are more capable than to be brainwashed by the media? Seriously, women can make choices. Quit telling them they can't.

gregariousnefarious · 2015-11-03T20:44:29+00:00

I think each gender has unique challenges. In the world of work (at least in my field), being a woman is a distinct disadvantage due to benevolent and not so benevolent sexism. Since career is important to me, I have to put in a lot of extra effort that's not expected of my male colleagues in order to excel and be taken seriously. That is not to say men don't have work related challenges, but it's a pretty big factor that negatively affects a lot of women who choose aggressive and fast paced careers.

Also, periods suck. Being taught to fear men also sucks, causes a lot of women to see the world from a purely self preservation perspective rather than approaching the world fearlessly. If raised in a religious home (as I was) it is also a struggle to find a positive adult identity that doesn't revolve around your SO/husband, plus it can lead to mondo inferiority complexes (women are the cause of sin, all that) and a rather unhealthy view of men, expecting them to both be better than you and expecting that they'll never let you down.

I could go on, but those are a few things that spring to mind that suck about being a woman. Like the troubles that come to men, it takes grit and tenacity to get through these issues but it's doable, especially if you've got good mentors (both men and women) who can give you perspective.

gregariousnefarious · 2015-11-03T20:44:29+00:00

I think each gender has unique challenges. In the world of work (at least in my field), being a woman is a distinct disadvantage due to benevolent and not so benevolent sexism. Since career is important to me, I have to put in a lot of extra effort that's not expected of my male colleagues in order to excel and be taken seriously. That is not to say men don't have work related challenges, but it's a pretty big factor that negatively affects a lot of women who choose aggressive and fast paced careers.

Also, periods suck. Being taught to fear men also sucks, causes a lot of women to see the world from a purely self preservation perspective rather than approaching the world fearlessly. If raised in a religious home (as I was) it is also a struggle to find a positive adult identity that doesn't revolve around your SO/husband, plus it can lead to mondo inferiority complexes (women are the cause of sin, all that) and a rather unhealthy view of men, expecting them to both be better than you and expecting that they'll never let you down.

I could go on, but those are a few things that spring to mind that suck about being a woman. Like the troubles that come to men, it takes grit and tenacity to get through these issues but it's doable, especially if you've got good mentors (both men and women) who can give you perspective.

2015-11-03T22:29:16+00:00

Probably. But it is subtle and takes a lot of empathy for men to understand, the kind of empathy that is sorely lacking in Red Pillers, who don't look beneath the surface.

2015-11-03T22:39:46+00:00

I don't know that this question can ever be satisfactorily answered, or even discussed in a meaningful way.

My personal thoughts are that it sucks to be a man and it sucks to be a woman, but in different ways, and whether you find that one sex has it rougher than the other one probably depends on your personal values.

I also don't really get the investment of either side in winning the victimhood olympics.

That being said, that dude's attempt at empathy is pretty vomitous, I agree.

2015-11-03T22:39:49+00:00

I don't know that this question can ever be satisfactorily answered, or even discussed in a meaningful way.

My personal thoughts are that it sucks to be a man and it sucks to be a woman, but in different ways, and whether you find that one sex has it rougher than the other one probably depends on your personal values.

I also don't really get the investment of either side in winning the victimhood olympics.

That being said, that dude's attempt at empathy is pretty vomitous, I agree.

ManRAh · 2015-11-02T22:39:30+00:00

Compare homelessness between men and women. All you need to know to answer that question.

Whoever wrote that post about women having it "infinatly" more difficult, is detached from reality. Media and religious brainwashing? Please. He thinks women have no agency and can't think for themselves. He's literally the type of guy feminists complain about, he's just hiding it behind his white-knighting.

Free drinks are the only "privilege" to womanhood? Fucking lel.

2015-11-02T22:31:54+00:00

I think what's between someone's legs, if that person is born in the west, has very little to do with how hard or not-hard their life is. That's my answer as succinctly as I can put it. Men and women face some different challenges and many similiar ones, imo.

5th_Law_of_Robotics · 2015-11-03T03:30:32+00:00

Guys are far more likely to kill themselves or turn to drugs to numb the pain.

So I'd guess being male is harder.

And female to male transsexuals generally confirm that they were treated better when they were viewed as women.

Title	Is life really rough for women? If so, is it a lot rougher than a man's life?
Author	RedManBearPig
Upvotes	5
Comments	96
Date	November 2, 2015 6:50 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/3r8ssi/is_life_really_rough_for_women_if_so_is_it_a_lot/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/is-life-really-rough-for-women-if-so-is-it-a-lot.278684 https://theredarchive.com/post/278684

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