Why would women who have good jobs care about a man's ability to provide? Can't all the issues with women outlined in this subreddit be circumvented by dating women who are financial stable?

redpill_man · 2013-12-23T16:49:43+00:00

Most women want to marry up. That's why you see these career women saying "Where have all the good men gone?" They want to date someone who makes more then they do. The thing is, the guys who do make a lot of money date younger, more attractive women. Financial success isn't attractive to men. Looks are.

_DiscoNinja_ · 2013-12-23T16:04:46+00:00

husband... only sexual partner

The unicorn preaches.

CurveballSI · 2013-12-23T16:09:19+00:00

You're all over the place with your logic and cherry picking certain thoughts and ideals.

If you two didn't know each other right now. You with your Masters and him with his job in sales, you wouldn't give him the time of day. Guaranteed.

So I ask again, why not just date women who have their shit together and who like you for YOU, rather than your monetary value?

Because, spoiler alert, women want to date men who have their shit together, and most of them are much more selective about the men they choose to date/fuck than men are. In fact, most women want a man who is better off financially than they are. Very few want to start a relationship with a man who doesn't make as much money as they do.

2013-12-23T17:00:15+00:00

because most women aren't like you. trust me, i've gone after far, far more women than you have, and it just doesn't work like that. on average, women want a guy who they can look up to in terms of social status and career prestige. i don't care if your opinion is different, because you're just one woman who deviates from the trend. you're dead wrong if you "suspect most women who earn decent salaries would feel the same way - they have the luxury of dating and marrying for love rather than looking for a meal ticket."

i'm a professional in the oil industry, so I've got lots of female friends who are professionals in engineering - mostly civil and environmental stuff. none of them want a guy who has a lesser education than them, and none of them want a guy who chooses to follow a low-paying career even if he does have a respectable degree. they will never "love him just for HIM."

it was found that amongst millionaires looking to date online, the vast majority of millionaire women want to date other millionaires. look at the data from millionairematch.com:

The site surveyed a random sample of nearly 15,000 of their members in order to discern what type of people millionaires prefer to date. The results revealed that the vast majority of millionaire men, 79.6 percent, seek out non-millionaire women, while 84.5 percent of the female millionaires would prefer to date another millionaire.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/24/millionaire-men_n_3983741.html

so, i ask you, why do well-off women so obviously and overwhelmingly care about how much money their partners make? whatever the reason, it is the reality that men have to accept. there are no women who would "love me for me", because my ability to provide and my ability to climb the social ladder is part of "me". it defines "me" as a man.

autoNFA · 2013-12-23T16:42:50+00:00

"I suspect most women who earn decent salaries would feel the same way"

That suspicion is incorrect. This will help explain it a bit, but women in general will resent the man if he earns less. It's not personal, it's innate. You may be an exception.

"why not just date women who have their shit together and who like you for YOU, rather than your monetary value?"

It's not that simple. First of all, we're probably not attracted to them. A university education/good career doesn't make a woman more attractive, at least to me. I already have an amazing career and make more than enough money to support a family. I don't want a woman to bring me more money, I want one who gets satisfaction and fulfilment from being an honest, loyal, affectionate partner who supports me and my career. That woman has my respect, for sure.

A career woman will generally feel a sense of entitlement for doing exactly the same things I did to get there. She's also probably getting into her 30's, and I'm more attracted to women in their early 20's. It's not that women in their 30's can't be attractive, but for anything long term I would only consider that age.

I think in theory what you say sounds like of course it should work, but it completely ignores the reality of men and womens' biology and innate behaviours.

Clauderoughly · 2013-12-23T17:25:47+00:00

You're the exception these days, not the rule.

My former room mate was one of those women who wanted a Dr Lawyer husband, and wouldn't "settle"

Pretty much every female I know in their 20's is like that with maybe one or two exceptions at BEST.

They all want to marry UP the chain, but at the same time spent their 20's competing in the cock rodeo.

the_red_scimitar · 2013-12-23T17:32:40+00:00

You are not representative of pretty much 100% of other women, but the simple answer is: perhaps except you, these well-employed women don't want to be.

As a guy who has tried to date into that pool (successfully), I've found that in every case, after getting to know one, she admits that she really hates the responsibility and just wants to be "taken care of".

At least 3 times now, after my selecting them very specifically because of their apparent independence, success, and responsibility for themselves, this revelation was admitted. Usually accompanied by a very particular doe-eyed look in my direction.

Demonspawn · 2013-12-23T17:34:05+00:00

You are an anomaly.

In the trends department, remember that 50% of women with college degrees are no longer working full time just 10 years after graduation (they have a baby and mommy-track out of the workforce).

Therefore, yes: even women with jobs care about a man's ability to provide.

johnnight · 2013-12-23T22:48:20+00:00

I've been with my husband since I was 14 - he is my only sexual partner

This explains your loyal behavior. You both managed to avoid the demonic corrupting influence of the Sexual/Marriage Market Place.

The other guys here do not agree with me, but I believe what you have and what is only possible for teenagers is called blue pill love. This is the same as "romantic love".

Once a girl is in her early twenties, her ego is blown to the size of a small moon by the sexual attention given to her by all men in the age range 20-50. This has the reverse impact on guys in the early twenties, because they simply cannot compete.

Furthermore he was you only sexual partner, which means he has been emotionally imprinted on your mind. This good. Studies prove that having many sexual destroys the ability to love and stay together: http://socialpathology.blogspot.com/2010/09/sexual-partner-divorce-risk.html

In my opinion having a first sexual partner who dumps the girl causes her to lose her ability to love to some extent. Ever other partner makes this worse until there is just an empty shell which wants to fuck and get money. This is what is wrong with the hookup culture.

We discussed here a lot of examples, where a woman cheated on her partner and the sex made her stop loving him and start loving the other person. It's not possible to go back, the imprint changed.

HumanSockPuppet · 2013-12-23T16:59:11+00:00

No, and the simple answer is: hypergamy, the driving force behind a woman's sexual selections.

Women don't get turned on by a specific amount of income. They are turned on by men who they perceive as being higher status than them personally.

What you need to understand is that a woman's selection of a sexual partner is a subconscious process - calculations and conclusions which bypass her conscious reasoning and are grounded in thousands of years of evolution.

Think of it this way: let's say that you are on birth control. Let's also say that your husband knows it too. Both of you are fully aware that any attempt at sexual congress will not likely produce a child. Does the fact that both of you are aware of your infertility in any way change your mutual feelings of sexual arousal?

The answer is no, because sexual arousal is not entirely a conscious process.

Same goes for hypergamy.

Now, you're not the first woman to come in here and try to falsify the Red Pill with a personal story. What you're demonstrating now is a different Red Pill principle: the principle of female solipsism, or "Everything is about me" syndrome.

Go read the sidebar and comeback when you're better educated on the subject, darling.

Cold_August · 2013-12-23T16:58:21+00:00

For years a feminized society that is placated by 1,000 channels of nothing on tv and further anesthetized by romance movies that show an incomplete image has told men to not ever be men and instead just be older boys; boys that are treated as defective girls.

What if TRP is just about overcoming that and becoming the men we want to be so that women can like us for who we are rather than who we have abused into becoming?

kupo_moogle · 2013-12-23T17:47:46+00:00

[permanently deleted]

aaron_the_just · 2013-12-23T16:45:59+00:00

I date women who have a job, can afford their own apartment, car, etc.

They still want a guy who gives them tingles, which means a guy with a better job, better apartment, better car.

I deal with this by making sure they have no idea what my job, house, or car look like. (Hint: they're all better than hers, but aloof game wins over honesty every time.)

Your personal experience is irrelevant--women who marry the only guy they've slept with tend to have successful marriages and don't need "gamed" nearly as much as women who've slept around with 25 guys and are an alpha widow.

scottishredpill · 2013-12-23T16:53:10+00:00

" I suspect most women who earn decent salaries would feel the same way - they have the luxury of dating and marrying for love rather than looking for a meal ticket."

How many of this type of women have you slept with?

I've slept with more than a few, and your wrong.

"So I ask again, why not just date women who have their shit together and who like you for YOU, rather than your monetary value?"

I've yet to meet a women in her early 30s and single that has their "shit together"

somethingxsomething · 2013-12-23T16:43:19+00:00

I love the Canadian .gov, some of my favorite women work there.

How attractive are you kupo? (Yes it matters, no I'm not happy that it does.)

2013-12-23T17:29:25+00:00

Find me one of your unicorn women and I'll sign myself a slave for life [read:marriage].

doubleu · 2013-12-23T18:26:19+00:00

This is where my life-lessons with TRP occurred. When you have wife that's driven by success in her job, I realized in hindsight (after divorce) that she wanted my support in a different way. We met at 19, married at 23, kid at 26, built a new house at 28, and divorced at 30. After me repeatedly turning down the idea of having more kids, my ex dropped the bomb that she no longer is in love with me (the new house and thought of more kids were just her way of hamstering the unhappiness away. What a joke...) She jumped ship from me, and shortly thereafter married a guy she worked with that she's currently still married to. Granted this guy is more social and outgoing than I am, but he's also the Mr. Mom she had been hoping I would want to be. She now has the 3 kids she always wanted, baby McMansion, BMW, her husband stays at home with no job; taking care of the kids while she's flies back and forth to NYC pursuing her career.

Clearly I was a stepping stone for the early part of her career, and now her current husband is the stepping stone for her 30s, 40s, and who-knows-how-long. I wonder if he's asking himself when his time will come? I predict the next husband will be a rich, 50-something, salt-and-pepper haired, viagra-commercial actor looking guy. In my opinion, this is what you should be concerned with if you are a beta-provider for a career-driven woman; being replaced.

reddishman · 2013-12-23T18:00:27+00:00

Looks like your husband is getting the better end of the deal. The end which is usually reserved for woman. 10 years from now you will probably look at each other and wonder why is that one of you is aging faster then the other and working more then the other.

How much access to other men do you have in your area ? Honestly if you have actually managed to control your hypergamy then you probably have something that you can teach.

IM_PRETTY_RACIST · 2013-12-23T19:27:27+00:00

| So I ask again, why not just date women who have their shit together and who like you for YOU, rather than your monetary value?

If only...

insickness · 2013-12-23T20:15:10+00:00

Did I give a fuck? Only because it bothered him, otherwise I wouldn't have cared at all.

This is one of the biggest excuses women use when dismissing men for objective measures. A woman will eliminate a man because he's too short, he doesn't earn enough, his job is too low-status, or he's too ugly. Some women are honest with themselves and say that this is the reason they aren't attracted. And yes, less attractive men tend to be low confidence, making them even less attractive. But your excuse is one of the lamest and most common that women use so they don't have to take responsibility for their own feelings.

kupo_moogle · 2013-12-23T16:49:33+00:00

In my mind, I keep him around because he is awesome, not because of the money he brings in.

Wow. That's not at all offensive, he must be estatic that you deign to "keep him around." Good to know that your husband's entertainment value hasn't yet waned. I'm sure your husband would be so happy to know that as long as he "stays awesome" he'll have a job as your husband.

Also, you are merely substituting the criteria by which you (a woman) determine your man's value, i.e. not his earning potential but his "awesomeness;" which, by the way is a riduculously subjective criteria. How is your husband supposed to ensure that he always remains "awesome" so as to "keep" you as a partner? How is he to know when his "awesomeness" is slipping, and along with it, your attraction? Finally, if he does manage to realize this how does he go about re-establishing his "awesomeness?"

How would you feel if your husband posted the following: "In my mind, I keep her around because she is awesome in bed, not because of the money she brings in."

tl/dr: You will find no validation here. Try /r/redpillwomen or, more likely for you, /r/relationships .

NillaThunda · 2013-12-23T17:00:43+00:00

Women care because if they are used to certain things, they need a partner to provide while they raise the children.

The only caveat to this is if the male is the stay at home parent, but this usually results in resentment because the woman will want to do the "mom" things.

Glorious_Master · 2013-12-23T17:31:06+00:00

you knew him from age 14, this is different than age 24
hypergamy, girls usually admit that they want someone equal or better but this usually translates to someone who is way outside their social status/legue.

ar10308 · 2013-12-23T17:45:13+00:00

How submisssive are you to him?

bgny · 2013-12-23T19:57:25+00:00

What about your friends and women you are familiar with? Do they think and act like you or are they more like the women we are talking about?

alt30313 · 2013-12-23T22:09:37+00:00

I suspect most women who earn decent salaries would feel the same way - they have the luxury of dating and marrying for love rather than looking for a meal ticket.

Haha this is laughable. If the studies didn't disprove this personal experience has shown me time and time again that this is not the case.

why not just date women who have their shit together and who like you for YOU, rather than your monetary value?

Sound practical advice for men and women. If only both genders could be convinced.

lucasmello · 2013-12-23T22:42:02+00:00

When you "have their shit together" you are basically saying that we should only date women who have the same or a bigger salaries than us, wouldnt that be gold-digging in a way? Also, a lot of women who dont have their financial situation sorted out are amazing, they have their shit together emotionally and that is what I care

2013-12-24T01:49:12+00:00

Just because they don need a man with resources doesn't mean a million years of evolution goes out the door. It'd be the same as saying people instantly lose their sex drive the moment they decide they don't want kids.

Well it doesn't work that way.

Brobody · 2013-12-24T02:11:33+00:00

Go look at any dating website. Look at what they're interested in.

A man with a master's degree will be interested in women with some college.

A woman with an undergraduate's degree is not at all interested in men without a degree. You could own your own plumbing service, be making great money, but the fact you are a plumber and not college educated is all they care about.

Most women who make it to your situation will start to think "my husband isn't pulling his weight, I'm the only person doing anything to provide for this family so why do I need him around anyway, he hasn't tried all these years" and divorce him.

2013-12-24T02:31:29+00:00

Trust me, the female libido doesn't give two shits about money.

Financial stability is something they look for in their beta bitches sitting in the corner, sipping Chardonnay, not in the protecting authority of her desires: the bad boy blue collar guy arm wrestling in the center of the room.

The brain controls the desire for the former. The libido controls the desire for the latter.

You know which one is winning that contest by the company she keeps...

vengefully_yours · 2013-12-24T06:30:29+00:00

I did, treated her right, supported her through school to get the degree she put on hold to come live with me, treated her right, she is very intelligent, old fashioned to a large extent, I was her first everything....

It would have been ten years yesterday if she hadn't left for a kid 7 years her junior back in May. She keft just because I was injured by paint chemicals while restoring a car for her dad. I am 20 years older than her boyfriend who can't keep a job and lives with his parents.

Face it dear, some women are fucking stupid no matter how smart or well educated they are. Its impossible to tell just which ones are stupid despite intellect. You just can't tell, but I have yet to meet a woman who thinks ahead rather than just jumping in without looking.

kupo_moogle · 2013-12-23T16:42:05+00:00

Because when the babies rabies hit, you're not going to be stable and employed for long.

FortunateBum · 2013-12-24T01:30:57+00:00

Guys, let this be a lesson:

I've been with my husband since I was 14
he is my only sexual partner

2013-12-23T22:13:12+00:00

Hey kupo_moogle, solid question, something I've thought about for a while as well. Hopefully the replies here have provided some insight.

I'd say Piroko might be onto something, how you might be the exception to the general application of the red pill theories. The low sexual partner count, and seems like a good upbringing have setup your mentality.

There will be some talk about how over time, resentment of the income disparity and your wanting children (not sure if you do, but possibility as the window for reproduction closes) will slowly edge on the relationship. My young age (low twenties) probably doesn't allow me to say that'll happen, but i've seen it happen to other solid relationships (where they're happy, then wife starts making a lot, 5 years later 'doesn't feel the spark with the guy' and moves on).

I go back to saying that you may actually be not a part of the averages. Best of luck!

2013-12-24T00:24:52+00:00

My wife makes more money than me, double in fact. I'm not exactly a pauper by any means either, seeing that I have a STEM degree and been working in field since 1999. She does extremely well financially.

Having said all that, I can tell you that being married to a woman that you know isn't in it for the money adds a pleasant dynamic to our relationship. I'm pretty sure she's ecstatic about things. Keep in mind also that I utilize some RP philosophy in my relationship. She doesn't rule the roost, I do. Once she figured out that I'm responsible and good at making the bulk of our cooperative planning decisions, she was all about it. She verbalizes that she likes having a man step up and take charge of things. Not only does it give her the tingles, but her quality of living has jumped up quite a bit in the process. Having me around is a good thing anyway you slice it.

Now we are talking about taking our professional lives to the next level in a private venture that blends our two skills. Our estimation is that we are going to double our household income - or more!

Having a wife who isn't "the most responsible teenager in the house" is quite a luxury. It's not like I'm a bad catch, either... It works.

I realize that I might not have a typical example, but I would recommend to any guy on this sub - If you can combine an RP approach to your relationship with a reasonably successful woman with a good head on her shoulders - you might not think badly of the situation.

I'd say it's a bit better than having a Michael's Story situation, where you know every woman you meet is game-planning a move into your beach house and a new set of credit cards. Is it for love and gina tingles? If it isn't, how much loyalty and trust can you truly bestow? How hard do you have to play the game in order to keep shit in line? Who wants to continually look over their shoulder at an advancing bigger better deal that might lure a fickle gold digger away? Not me. Fuck that noise. Filter out and next the opportunists.

A woman who feels the way the OP does is rare and precious "I got my money and security, now all I need is love." In that situation, all you got to do man up and take care of business. They love you to death for it.

through_a_ways · 2013-12-24T05:53:16+00:00

I've been with my husband since I was 14 - he is my only sexual partner and we get along great.

Good for you, I've heard there's a couple of guys with IQs of 175 somewhere out there.

2013-12-24T15:21:42+00:00

Maybe you are a unicorn and your husband is a lucky guy, but what you have to remember is that a woman's mating strategy isn't conscious like a plan she has made. Women are naturally attracted to men above them, so if a woman is very successful in her life, she will just be attracted to even more successful men.

luridlurker · 2013-12-23T17:35:37+00:00

[permanently deleted]

ar10308 · 2013-12-23T19:47:30+00:00

Lets talk about your job. It is for the government and you aren't active military. This means your job is irrelevant and not subject to market forces. You don't produce any product nor create any wealth and probably got the job due policies prioritising you over men. I speak from experience working as a government contractor for several years.

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