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You need consent for everything, except for literally mutilating a babys genitals for no reason.

themightywatchtower

January 18, 2019

475 upvotes

/r/MensRights

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Post Information

Title	You need consent for everything, except for literally mutilating a babys genitals for no reason.
Author	themightywatchtower
Upvotes	475
Comments	98
Date	January 18, 2019 6:47 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/ahdm3e/you_need_consent_for_everything_except_for/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/you-need-consent-for-everything-except-for.1182372 https://theredarchive.com/post/1182372

Comments

[–]MasterChris725 45 points46 points47 points 7 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

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[–]auMatech 4 points5 points6 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]PurpleAngel23 2 points3 points4 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ironically enough, my husband and I didn’t have the conversation until we thought we were pregnant. But we had talked about it when we were dating. I knew he wasn’t circumcised, and I didn’t hide the fact that I really wasn’t in to it. So we were basically on the same page when we got married. He told me multiple times how circumcision affected a man’s sexual experience (my dad told me the same thing). I trusted his judgement, seeing as he’s a man and I would have no way of knowing otherwise as a woman. Personally, I always found the idea of cutting off a part of a man’s penis to be detestable.

Like I said, the conversation didn’t happen until after we thought we were pregnant and the doctor asked us about it. I said I thought it was mutilation; my husband laughed and was like, “Yeah, we’re not doing that.” But we had plenty of conversations beforehand where we expressed the same belief: No on circumcision. So at the time, we didn’t need to go any deeper than that.

Sorry for the long-wonder answer.

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[–]BigGreyAlpaca 9 points10 points11 points 7 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I'm not gonna comment on the other stuff

Because you know you were being misleading, the intent on the others were clear.

I'm not gonna comment on the other stuff, but the reason the first one is a problem isn't because it's hateful or conspiratorial, it's because it turns an active attempt at genocide into something more coincidental. And when you start to claim that something like the holocaust was simply an unfortunate consequence of a supply lines falling apart, you're creating a slippery slope to making holocaust denial an acceptable thing, which can eventually result in even worse stuff happening overall.

Literally slippery slope fallacy, you should be dismissed on that alone, your argument doesn't hinge on reality but some fictional potential future reality that you believe in without evidence. Your "If you don't attack people who have conspiracy theories they'll commit mass genocide!" argument is a fantasy, it makes you somewhat of a conspiracy theorist yourself.

It's a conspiracy theory, while stupid it isn't a human rights violation. Much like the Russian conspiracy theories currently being peddled by the left - they're stupid, they're childish, but they're not a real issue.

You see this happen with a lot of conspiracy theories, and it's really the kind of thing we shouldn't be giving a pass to.

No, you don't. I can't think of a single time in human history where someone went "Hey remember that conspiracy theory? Let's go commit genocide!". I have yet to see a 9/11 truther leading the new Wehrmacht.

Let's be grown adults and be prepared to agree with people we disagree with rather than saying "NO NO NO NO I DON'T CARE IF HE'S DOING THE RIGHT THING HE'S WRONG SOMETIMES".

[–]dangsoggyoatmeal 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]BigGreyAlpaca 2 points3 points4 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]aditopian0 points 7 years ago* [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

No, I didn't respond to the other's because I'm currently in the midst of traveling and it was 2AM when I wrote that, so forgive me if I didn't have the energy to respond to all 3. If you wan't me to comment on the other two I'll happily take a look at those now that it's early afternoon for me.
If you're so obsessed with fallacies, might I recommend looking into the Fallacy Fallacy (also called Argument From Fallacy) and the Straw-Man Fallacy, as they're both relevant to what you responded with. Especially the Straw-Man Fallacy, because at no point did I say, "If you don't attack people who have conspiracy theories they'll commit mass genocide!". My argument was that if you permit small or otherwise harmless conspiracy theories to grow then that'll make room for larger or more insidious ones to become accepted, and that this process is a potentially dangerous one which could result in larger negative ramifications. Examples of this include, but are not limited to, the resurgence of diseases that had been thought long dead due to vaccine denial, the locking up of Japanese Americans during WWII because people of false information about their allegiance resulting in overall distrust of them, and the locking up of migrants and separating of said migrants from their children, due to the belief that they are dangerous to the US. These are just some examples of relevant cases, but it's also absolutely reasonable to argue that conspiracies about people, historical events, or reality could, can, and have been, easily be used to validate things that aren't good, to get people to ignore otherwise pressing issues, or to get to get people to support bad things which they otherwise wouldn't support. 2.5. Now, it is possible that I miswrote my original argument leading to a misunderstanding, and for that I apologize.
My reason for saying that we should shun conspiracy theorists is twofold:

a. It's bad optics. When people look at the MRM they see the most vocal and outstanding members of our movement saying things that make us all look bad by association, which hurts our image. If we shun them and call them out on their bullshit, this will help with that image and will give us a leg up over our opponents who advocate not listening to us because of said members.

b. By using the work made by said conspiracy theorists, we risk exposing their ideas less acceptable beliefs to more people, which in turn risks more people being swayed to their arguments. It also helps give them resources to do things which are potentially negative overall by providing them with a wider audience and potentially more funds. It's the age old question of, 'is it okay to buy a book written by a terrible person?' You might say yes, but I don't agree, and that's fine for you to think. But it isn't something all of us are comfortable with doing, especially due to point a.

[–]BigGreyAlpaca 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]aditopian1 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Of course it doesn't mean we agree with them, but when we don't call them out on their bullshit and continue to give them a platform that will make everyone else look at use like we do. This is something that hurts many, many movements. Extremists turn moderates off from the movement, which is something we cannot play with as it will hurt any progress we intend to make. And I never said that we had to agree with 100% of what someone says, that is a straw man. But I do believe that we have to be discerning with whom we give a platform to, especially considering that we catch more flies with honey and any vinegar we put out will be even more bitter because of what people already think of us.

Also it isn't nonsense. There are plenty of articles about the 'evils' of certain moments, the MRM included, which use the most extreme members and events to turn people away from the movement, and to suggest that that isn't going to ruin our public image and the chances that people will hear us out is anything but absurd.

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Comments

And the only reason for it is to sell to skin care corporations so women can wear baby foreskin on their face.