MRP - Negotiating Desire v. Dread?

alreadyredschool · 2015-11-23T17:55:56+00:00

You can do things to make her more attracted to you. But those are not beta things. You cannot say "I mowed the lawn, love me!". You can get toned abs and see her desire for you rise.

It's a overt vs covert communication thing, attraction and desire are primal emotions, let her figure it out, don't tell her.

PemBayliss · 2015-11-23T18:12:31+00:00

Even in a situation where a woman is having sex with her man because of dread, i.e., she is compliant and is meeting his wants, needs and desires because she is afraid of losing him, it is because she desires him.

If she didn't desire him, she'd just let him go. If she weren't attracted to him and didn't want what he has to offer, she can just let the relationship end.

As I've said elsewhere, a woman has power in an RP relationship. She has the power to leave. She always has that power. So if she is staying, then there must be something in the relationship, something about him, she desires.

And what she recognizes in a man she "dreads" will leave, is that the man has options too. He doesn't have to stay in the relationship. He can replace her, even if he 'replaces' her with things he wants to do instead of another woman. She hates the feeling that she's not special to him. She hates the feeling that he might see her as disposable or interchangeable. If she really wants him, wants her relationship with him, it will cause her to increase her work on the relationship. If anything, she'll qualify herself to him, instead of him constantly working his ass off to show her why she should stay. He doesn't have to do anything to "make her stay" -- she can stay, or go; her choice. She ALWAYS has that choice.

So if she stays and he's getting sex and BJs because she is a bit afraid of losing him, that indicates her desire for him. Because if she didn't desire him, she'd be gone -- especially in this society, which has done literally everything it can do to empower her to leave a relationship any time, for any reason she deems suitable.

Archwinger · 2015-11-23T19:55:28+00:00

Sometimes, a woman will fuck you because she wants to. Other times, a woman will fuck you because she's married to you and she feels like she has to to keep the wheels greased and keep your paychecks coming in -- even though she doesn't really want to.

If you're a loser, whiny guy who doesn't look great and no other women want you and you couldn't leave/cheat if your life depended on it, you have nearly zero chance of getting that first kind of sex. Most likely, any sex you get will be from that second category, and only after a lot of whining and nagging and raging and being a little bitch about it.

If you're hot, have a nice body, dress well, look awesome, etc., you're a confident leader around your house, and everywhere you go, other women check you out, your wife might be genuinely attracted to that. Or she could just be fucking you out of desperation because she's afraid she'll lose you if she doesn't. Let's say your odds of this are 50-50. That's still a 50% chance she's actually attracted to you versus a near 0% chance.

trp132 · 2015-11-23T19:57:03+00:00

The crux of my question: if you're only getting BJ's and sex because of dread, isn't she only fucking you because of her own insecurities and not because she actually desires you?

Dread game isn't about making her feel worthless or insecure. It's about reminding her that you have options and are a valuable person and will remain one even if she's not in your life. Dread game can be as subtle as simply smiling back when a waitress hits on you, or not being super needy about taking up her alone time.

RU_Crazy · 2015-11-23T18:50:37+00:00

You're missing the point of dread game. It increases attraction because it operates as a form abundance and preselection . The target of the dread games observes that the actor has an abundance of options thereby raising his perceived SMV. The insecurity of the woman then manifests itself in the form of fear of losing the man (i.e. dread of losing him). She alleviates that dread through copulation.

Make no mistake that she now truly desires the man. The insecurity (i.e. dread) is the fear of losing that which is now desirable.

nomdplume · 2015-11-24T01:16:22+00:00

What you are missing is something that many TRPers miss as well - you are not getting BJs and sex because you have made the person consciously insecure. You are getting them because a lot of the actions that people decry as being "manipulative" or "insecurity provoking" are, properly implemented, actually attractive in and of themselves.

Flirting with others can cause someone to react with insecurity and jealousy (seen it happen a lot, in fact) if that person is insecure and jealous to begin with (which, I would argue, would make the need for dread game with them unnecessary).

But a confident individual with no dependency/codependency issues will see that as actually attraction affirming and sexy, especially if the guy is responding rather than attempting (the approach often advised by those advocating for dread game). If the guy is attempting, he needs to know two things: A) that the interaction will 100% make him look good (i.e., that he will not get rebuffed or otherwise look weak/inappropriate) and B) where the lines are such that he doesn't lose plausible deniability and start a fight.

Attraction requires a certain amount of distance. When two people have been so close for so long that they no longer know where the boundaries are and they take each other for granted, you have to find ways to make yourself separate, to be seen as an "other." That's the context inside of which attraction was first felt by your partner. You are just find ways to recreate that context again such that your partner finds you attractive again.

Guys need to once again become the guy who got their partner all kinds of aroused. Dread Game is an attempt at get a guy back into that personae.

fundude12 · 2015-11-23T18:11:15+00:00

PUA tactics are mostly bullshit

teeay · 2015-11-23T18:47:53+00:00

If there was a better option on the table, we wouldn't use the dread.

TheGreasyPole · 2015-11-24T11:12:55+00:00

How about I reverse it....

If you talk her into having sex with you even though she is no longer physically attracted to you isn't THAT the approach that really "Gets you sex, but not because she actually desires you" ?

It would seem to me it is. You have, in a sense, persuaded her to go against her innate physical instinctive attraction and have sex with you anyway.

In contrast, Dread Game seeks to build that natural physical attraction by employment of a strategy designed to encourage the development of that innate attraction.

Consequently, if you have employed DG correctly.... and your wife is responsive to it... She is physically attracted to you again, instinctively and naturally. So if you DG her and create THAT.... THIS is when you actually get to sleep with a woman who physically desires to do so based on her own innate instinctive attraction.

So we'd say you've got the way this actually works in practice reversed.

Negotating attraction does not work. You can negotiate some kind of sex quota, but you can't negotiate her wanting to have sex with you.

The only way to get that is to build a man that she is sexually attracted to and thats what DG does.

I had a stab at a summary of the process here, writing up DG for a PPD audience.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/3l0ryg/a_shortish_summary_of_rp_dread_game_in/

Go and have a look, it outlines how this is supposed to work. As you'll see, it's intent is as I have outlined above.

cxj · 2015-11-23T22:31:22+00:00

I think the reality is that what men are after out of relationships is a sex partner, and men value sex way, way more than women do, primarily for biological reasons. I actually did a post on this fairly recently. So, to an extent, the "got sex, don't care" mentality is present, however, if all the guy ever gets is duty sex, he is likely to be fairly unhappy. To be happy in an LTR, guys need to get fucked enthusiastically and regularly. Realistically, most of them are unlikely to get this. Life sucks.

betterdeadthanbeta · 2015-11-24T17:40:20+00:00

The crux of my question: if you're only getting BJ's and sex because of dread, isn't she only fucking you because of her own insecurities and not because she actually desires you?

False dichotomy. Part of the whole premise of dread is that women DO innately desire men who have options. It ties into preselection.

Title	MRP - Negotiating Desire v. Dread?
Author	0909a0909
Upvotes	8
Comments	100
Date	November 23, 2015 5:43 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/3tys6y/mrp_negotiating_desire_v_dread/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/mrp-negotiating-desire-v-dread.278297 https://theredarchive.com/post/278297

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