Why aren't gender diversity quotas by companies sexist?

a-man-from-earth · 2021-05-31T08:59:38+00:00

It's obviously sexist.

funkynotorious · 2021-05-31T07:31:12+00:00

I am so tired of this argument that there is need of a gender diversity in computer science because companies need to make products for both men and women so there is a need of equal representation. In my college a lot of companies came but just to hire women(It's legal in my country because my country doesn't give a fuck about men). I had to go to linkedin for 6 months literally begging people for referals. After these 6 months fortunately I got placed in a good company

I had to work so much for the same opportunity that girl candidates were given for free. And when I pointed this out a lot of people went ballistic on me saying this the need of the hour and shit like that. They showed me articles which said we need more women in engineering these articles talked about studies which I couldn't find on the internet. The studies that I found were so poorly written and seemed to me like just giving opinions and had no facts to back their opinion.

And I just can't wrap my head around this that how can other male employees not speaking up. Why are they so much silent about this. Aren't their opportunities being taken away.

DistrictAccurate · 2021-05-31T11:48:17+00:00

Well, it would be a start if they were gender neutral and implemented in a gender neutral way.

Currently, they are one-sided or otherwise abolished once they would give men an advantage. Places where men are underrepresented usually don't feature quotas.

Of course it is questionable why quotas are not relative to the portion of applicants of a certain gender. Some claim that static quotas would be needed for women to apply, yet this is a non-argument considering that, as long as the quota actually encourages applications, the relative quota would rise as well as long as women actually apply. If we assumed all genders to be equally qualified, on average a 20% rate of female applicants should lead to 20% of employees being female as well.

The only thing I might consider somewhat valid would be the intention to pump underrepresented people into certain areas to strip those off their gendered stereotypes - yet, I don't see men being pumped into law, medicine, dentistry, biology or psychology courses of universities. In fact, gendered scholarships still do the opposite.

Robble93 · 2021-05-31T09:33:50+00:00

It is sexist. And it's based on cherry picked data. A company will automatically have a gender-diverse workforce if:

The jobs they offer require a completed education in fields that are about equally popular among men and women.
They don't care about gender during the hiring process.
They provide the possibility for employees to create their preferred work-life balance in case they have children at home.

Diversity hiring is simply putting the cart before the horse. Not all companies will have a gender diverse workforce if all things go naturally and that's OK. What's not OK, is discriminating based on factors that people have no control over (like gender or race).

lightning_palm · 2021-05-31T14:42:11+00:00

They strive for equality of outcome but by doing this reduce equality of opportunity.

Say a company needs to fill 20 positions. If 10 female and 90 male applications apply for that job and the goal is a 50/50 representation of men and women, then the company would have to accept all 10 women (100%) and 10 men (roughly 11%).

Thus, women are roughly 10 times more likely to be accepted in this hypothetical scenario.

In conclusion, gender diversity quota are, by their very nature, extremely discriminating and sexist.

Skirt_Douglas · 2021-05-31T14:58:16+00:00

Some times it’s racist too. There is already plenty of criticism of companies that define “diversity” as just having lots of white women.

MrElderwood · 2021-05-31T16:44:03+00:00

They are sexist, just it's 'good' sexism.

It's 'Good, wholesome social justice' sexism.

It's sexism 'lite'.

It's 'I can't believe it's not sexism' sexism!

(Props to Steve Hughes)!

onefreeshot · 2021-05-31T09:40:58+00:00

My thoughts exactly, it makes absolutely no fucking sense to complain about the ratio of male:female employees in computer science or software engineer jobs (or most likely any other domain for that matter) that the ratio is 80:20 and then say you need to hire more women. Like how does the gender make enough of a trait to make an employee more capable at doing their job than actual knowledge/experience, it's pathetic and depressing that we've reached this point and we only double down in this direction. Like at work, there's talk about wanting to bring women ratio in IT from 20 to some 40% or so, but I do wonder how they are going to do it other than favouring women. And this shit also happens only for the well paid jobs, almost no one gives a damn about helping men in female-dominated jobs and no one incentivises women to get into the less well-paid men-dominated jobs, because why would women try to go into jobs that are dirty/physically hard/dangerous and not always paid well, so fucking much for a balanced workplace.

Blauwpetje · 2021-05-31T11:52:00+00:00

Well, if you're convinced that men and women don't differ on average in interests and abilities, you might very well argue that these quota just make up for the sexism that made men get these high positions in the first place. There will be no other explanation for how those men got there. That's what I always heard leftists say.

Only when you think (as I do) nature plays a role, or that we're simply not sure about that, you can really criticize affirmative action. But you know that's a hard discussion and virtually a taboo.

nocturnefox · 2021-05-31T18:31:53+00:00

Where I work it's very liberal by nature and at meetings they kept making a point of their policy that they try to promote women in equal numbers to leadership positions. It doesn't make sense to me to have to prove you aren't discriminating by being forced to promote at least as many or women or close to as many. Especially since there is nothing to suggest they would discriminate in the first place.

Russelsteapot42 · 2021-06-01T00:30:34+00:00

What's sexist is that there never seems to be any effort to recruit men into careers in which they are underrepresented.

austin101123 · 2021-05-31T13:09:28+00:00

they are

DavidByron2 · 2021-05-31T13:34:13+00:00

They are sexist. Often illegal also.

Burlerevyy · 2021-06-01T00:05:00+00:00

They are sexist.

turbulance4 · 2021-05-31T13:41:04+00:00

Not only sexist, but literally illegal. It violates The Civil Rights Act of 1964

hendrixski · 2021-06-01T04:20:50+00:00

I would say that

Diversity has benefits. I'm a manager, I see it with my own eyes.
The problem isn't companies seeking diversity. The problem is them ONLY seeking diversity in safe male-dominated fields. They fail to seek diversity in female dominated fields or in dangerous occupations.

Void1702 · 2021-05-31T12:49:22+00:00

Basically, by forcing gender diversity, that helps to create diverse models for next generations to look at, and thus will help destroy gender stereotypes

Yes, it's taking away from more effective people, and possibly reducing the money made by the group hiring, but that's a sacrifice that is worth

It's a small sacrifice today to better destroy gender roles in the futur

az226 · 2021-05-31T17:28:16+00:00

It’s like all D&I quotas are only for the US. Global companies don’t give a shit about diversity outside of the US.

atheist343434 · 2021-05-31T18:30:55+00:00

They are an attempt to reverse some of the entrenched social norms that lead to male domination in organizations. There are some arguments around implementation and scope of the measures but the basic idea is pretty sound I think.

Title	Why aren't gender diversity quotas by companies sexist?
Author	funkynotorious
Upvotes	169
Comments	119
Date	May 31, 2021 7:21 AM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/noxhq0/why_arent_gender_diversity_quotas_by_companies/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/why-arent-gender-diversity-quotas-by-companies.1061206 https://theredarchive.com/post/1061206

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