Should a man be able to opt out of a child's life without child support?

BoreDominated · 2022-12-14T02:09:40+00:00

Both parties should have the option to opt out of a pregnancy, unquestionably.

Though I would say if you agree in advance to pay child support and support the mother and then you ditch them both later, that's immoral.

OldEgalitarianMRA · 2022-12-14T04:06:10+00:00

While men should be able to walk away like women do there should also be support for men who want to stay in their child's life but don't have the means. Children need fathers more than they need money. Who would ever say a child needs money more than their mother?

gixxer · 2022-12-14T18:32:11+00:00

Should be the other way around. It should be an opt in. An informed consent must be obtained before any child support can be extracted. If the couple is married, consent can be presumed. Otherwise informed consent must be proven.

BlowDryerrr · 2022-12-14T03:34:41+00:00

I support opt outs because there're too many cases of crazy women trapping men.

By that I mean flat out lying about being on birth control, poking holes in condoms, pretending to not want kids but changes her tune after an "accident" occurs.

I've seen it happened to 3 guys I know, 2 ended up in divorce a year after, one guy was rich and he lost half his shit. Everybody including the kids are then stuck with a shitty situation for 18 years because one woman decided to fuck shit up.

Fuzzy_Department2799 · 2022-12-14T02:47:11+00:00

Yes. If she can make the decision and sue for support without his input, then he should have the right to say no. i dont want to be involved with the kid ever and walk away. If she decides to keep the child, that is her choice. If she chooses to keep the child knowing she can't do it without him writing a check every month knowing he doesn't want a child , that is just as immoral as him walking away.

stopzbleeting · 2022-12-14T10:35:00+00:00

He should have at least one way to get out of being a parent of a child he does not want.

A woman has multiple options if she chooses not to be a mother and nobody shames her for it. A man says he does not want to be a father and he is shamed for it.

Just one of the 7000 different ways there is hypocrisy between men and women.

There would need to be a way that the woman is compensated if the father at some point changes his mind and the final say on that should be with the woman. So say 10 years down the road the father says he wants to be their life.2 things have to happen, the mother has to approve or not approve and there can be no recourse on this decision. Second he must pay back in a lump sum all of the child support he would have paid for those years he was absent.Its not a game, you cannot be changing your mind every 5 mins and so the hill to climb if you do should be steep and failure is likely.

It would also eliminate the problem we have with such a high number of children without fathers. If a woman is forced to consider the fact she has to raise a child on her own and with no financial support then I am guessing that this problem would disappear fairly quickly.

There is significant data from many different sources that show that broken families are not good for society in general, not good for the kids & cause a lot of hardship.

Couple this with making sure that the person who files for divorce (as long as there is no history of domestic violence/drug abuse/addiction etc) has to pay a break of contract fee of say 30K and is not eligable for any financial support then the old "I love you but am not in love with you" rubbish would also disapear.

As a final initiative to the above, education at school on how to find the right partner, the seriousness of marriage and what getting it wrong means for your life would make a huge difference.Education on mental illness, attachment styles and signs to avoid a batshit crazy person as a partner would eliminate so much heart break. Passing the test would be required before a marriage license will be given. It would help both men and women as I think there is a small percentage of scumbags on both sides who ruin it for the majority of people.

EricAllonde · 2022-12-14T08:11:12+00:00

Yes, of course.

At present, men have no reproductive rights. Only women have the legal right to consent to parenthood and it's well overdue that we extend that same legal right to men in order to achieve gender equality/equal rights.

https://www.quora.com/Should-men-have-pro-choice-financial-abortion-rights/answer/Eric-Allonde

Aimless-Nomad · 2022-12-14T07:02:52+00:00

Stupid af last line. 'I will not tolerate' lol. This is the internet, not your house. And if you want to check out hate speech, go to female subs.

But to answer your question, it doesn't matter what people think or want. Child support is just damage control on an unprecedented scale. It won't be removed. The only way to stay away is to not get married and have children. Having a conversation about something that won't change is meaningless (we've had plenty of those already and its always men saying yes and women saying no). The only power a man has is to not get married or have children in the first place.

Message to men, don't do it.

NutsLikeMelons · 2022-12-14T07:17:39+00:00

I believe in equality. Men should have all the same rights a woman has. A woman has the choice to unilaterally abort or surrender a baby. Why shouldn’t a man have the same rights not to be a parent? If you disagree, you are saying women deserve more rights and choices than men, and that’s problematic.

Wylanderuk · 2022-12-14T11:41:03+00:00

Yes he should be able to get out of all of it, but it needs to have the same timescales that abortion has.

There does have to be safeguards so she can't run out the clock.

If they are married? That is complicated and IDK.

2022-12-14T02:43:38+00:00

Sounds like a spin off of my topic. I'll still say yes. He should have an opt out.

coco_is_boss · 2022-12-14T06:10:01+00:00

What if guys have birth control bc women have almost all the ways to prevent it? We have like 1 and we get fucked over most of the time

2022-12-14T17:37:39+00:00

As long as a woman can withhold man's child from him without his knowledge, yes.

When that starts getting treated like the kidnapping it is, we can talk about duty to pay.

hendrixski · 2022-12-14T04:02:04+00:00

Why is this question always gendered? This is a sub about equality.

I believe that before birth every human being should have a choice about being a parent.

If you're studying to be a doctor and are not ready to drop out of school for kids then don't become a parent. Wait, finish the degree, then have kids when you're ready.

If you're a drug addict trying to get your life together it's probably not a good idea to be a parent. Wait, sober up, then become a parent when you're ready.

And no human being should be told that it's their fault for spreading their legs or sowing their seed and therefore now they must be forced into parenthood.

SecondEldenLord · 2022-12-14T08:43:35+00:00

If eshe can have an abortion, then I should be able to opt out from chld support. He body her choice, my wallet my choice.

Spirited-Road-4345 · 2022-12-14T14:27:46+00:00

Damn right

Nickolas_Bowen · 2022-12-14T14:53:16+00:00

The man or the woman should be allowed to opt for the abortion. If the woman wants to keep it anyways, the man should not have to pay child support. If they agree to have the kid and the man leaves after this decision, he should pay child support.

elebrin · 2022-12-14T15:57:27+00:00

Yes, with some caveats.

Either men or women should be able to opt out during the period of pregnancy - men, by abandoning the relationship and women, by having an abortion or preparing adoption paperwork. If the woman is going with an option that requires the child be carried to term, then she should have some grace period to deal with medical needs and make arrangements.

After birth, men should be allowed to opt out of fatherhood only if something has changed. If she gets married to another man, it's discovered you aren't the genetic father, if she moves such that you cannot have contact, or so on that should give you the option to re-evaluate within a grace period of you finding out. The same grace period system should be used in the case that she doesn't inform you of the child or pregnancy before birth.

WildernessBarbie · 2022-12-14T23:56:54+00:00

If a man is able, at will, to opt out of financially supporting his children, what government program should be created to then help support those children and their mothers, and how should it be funded?

If he opts out financially, it’s assumed that he is also simultaneously opting out of any custodial/visitation rights as well, correct?

What happens if he changes his mind later and wants to meet his child/ren? Or if they want to meet their father & have a relationship with him? Should that be allowed after his decision to abandon them? Should he have to first pay back pay on all the missed support?

How might allowing men to abandon their children without repercussions weaken the Men’s Rights argument for strengthening rights for willing fathers?

If, as a culture, we agree that a father doesn’t offer enough value to be compelled to participate in the support/raising of his child, then how might that logic carry over to custodial rights and general attitudes towards fathers as a whole?

seii7 · 2022-12-14T09:36:44+00:00

No. This is the one disagreement I have with the MRA community in general, I don’t think the solution is to let men opt out of the responsibility of creating a child because women have that privilege. The solution is to make women equally responsible.

[deleted] · 2022-12-14T14:48:47+00:00

No, I don't think so.

I understand that it's a woman's choice. But ultimately, it's not the child's choice. And whilst it may be unpalatable for some, the man has more choice than the child.

I don't think a child should be born into poverty.

theWolf371 · 2022-12-14T16:28:42+00:00

Calijewles · 2022-12-14T06:25:15+00:00

No. In the event of an abortion, no child exists to care for. In the event of adoption, both parents are off the hook for supporting a child that exists. If a child is born & kept, both parents are responsible for that child.

Abortion is an alternative to pregnancy. Pregnancy is HARD on a woman. Also, pregnancy can be life threatening. Women get the choice to abort bc it takes place in their bodies.

Abortions are HARD for most women. It isn't a simple process. It has physical, mental, emotional, & financial ramifications. As soon as implantation happens, a woman's body starts producing massive quantities of hormones that are pumped throughout her body. Unless your a woman who has been pregnant before, you can't possibly imagine what that feels like. Personally, I turn into an emotional trainwreck during the first trimester. I'm not in my right mind. Try making rational decisions about a HUGE life changing event while your hormones are making you... not yourself.

For a man to be like, "well, you could abort, so if you don't, I should be able to have a paper abortion. FAiR iS fAir!" Nope. Biology isn't fair. Life isn't fucking fair. Real abortions aren't comparable to paper abortions AT ALL. They aren't even in the same realm.

17 weeks ago, I decided to abort a baby. It was a HARD decision, but we agreed it was "for the best." It broke my heart, but I followed through. My medical abortion failed. Tomorrow, I'll be 26 weeks pregnant with a baby I tried to abort. The dad blocked me & left me to deal with the fallout (his choice). Nope, I don't think that I should have to absorb ALL of the consequences from this unwanted pregnancy. I'm not going to stretch all of my resources I use to care for my other kids even thinner to cover his part of the responsibilities for this child just bc "he didn't want it." Neither did I, but it's happening. That's LIFE!

Roddy0608 · 2022-12-14T07:17:15+00:00

Many do end up not paying. Some find illegal ways but I think unemployed men tend to be exempt. Sometimes the child's mother doesn't even want money from the father because she doesn't want to depend on him.

green_bean_lord · 2022-12-14T02:35:30+00:00

I don't think it's right to force a woman to have an abortion, or to raise a kid on her own. There are alternatives, however, like giving the child up for adoption. But the man should help pay anything relating to pregnancy issues *not all of it*

vasjpan02 · 2022-12-14T02:16:10+00:00

only if castrated

AlienAmerican1 · 2022-12-14T18:55:27+00:00

Yes.

TendoJul · 2022-12-14T20:41:57+00:00

Men are completely and utterly fucked when it comes to kids. I’m thinking of building out a truck bed and living on the road, public land and beaches. Fuck society

AdAcademic4290 · 2022-12-14T20:54:31+00:00

Only if the child is put up for adoption.

After all, he is not beholden to the mother.

He is, however, beholden to the child.

Just as, if a woman left a child with its father, the woman would be beholden to the child, but not beholden to the father.

Not only legally, but also morally, we cannot leave children to grow up destitute, or even die for lack of food, or medical care, lack of the necessities of life, or unhealthy or dangerous living conditions. .

Octopower0815 · 2022-12-14T21:19:33+00:00

if a woman can get an abortion, then a man must not pay CS

ebony-mori · 2022-12-14T23:03:50+00:00

I think there should be a grace period where the father gets the option to choose if he wants to be a part of the child’s life. If not, then he shouldn’t have any rights to the child, nor should have to pay toward it.

WTFOMGBBQ · 2022-12-14T23:25:07+00:00

I support a woman’s right to choose. I also support a man’s right to choose. A man can obviously not force an abortion, so he gets to vote with his wallet. As long as a woman has a right to choose, which they should, then so should a man. Such a ridiculous pile of shit gotcha law.

NeoNotNeo · 2022-12-14T23:52:24+00:00

Yes. Consent should prevail with everything related to having children.

TenuousOgre · 2022-12-15T17:47:18+00:00

Of course. Both people have a way to reduce the odds with BC. If that fails, the woman has a way of opting out via abortion. My body, my choice. But that phrase misses the final piece, "my responsibility". Since she's the one who gets to decide to abort, if she chooses to keep it she should bear all responsibility legally. If the man chooses to step up, great. But he shouldn't be forced to be a parent by a decision he can't make.

sharksville · 2022-12-17T00:07:50+00:00

When you put it that way. Then yes. 100% yes

Qantourisc · 2023-01-06T07:14:52+00:00

Posted something in childfree; like you'd expect a childfree reddit to understand why someone would want to opt out.

But even there you get a lot of downvotes for saying something about paper abortions !

quietlyobserving123 · 2023-02-24T00:43:41+00:00

Could you live with yourself knowing that you have a child that you'll never know and walked away from. In 5, 10, 15 years could you still live with that decsion. It's not about you or the woman because the kids coming if she decides to have it and so it's about them. I don't think I could justify that but if you can fair enough

Title	Should a man be able to opt out of a child's life without child support?
Author	RW_42_AW
Upvotes	137
Comments	112
Date	December 14, 2022 12:34 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/zlc7qi/should_a_man_be_able_to_opt_out_of_a_childs_life/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/should-a-man-be-able-to-opt-out-of-a-childs-life.1208139 https://theredarchive.com/post/1208139

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