Polish parliament approves new rape law making sex without consent a crime | Notes From Poland

63daddy · 2024-06-28T16:23:26+00:00

I think in principle rape law should typically hinge on consent. However, the following make me wonder what other details this legislation also includes:

“This bill introduces a de facto presumption of guilt, a presumption of guilt that every person accused of rape will have to prove that he or she is not a criminal,”

“I am absolutely on the side of women”. Said one politician backing the law. That doesn’t sound very gender neutral to me.

Cold_Mongoose161 · 2024-06-28T16:24:35+00:00

Does it include the consent of men?

Nathaniel66 · 2024-06-28T18:18:13+00:00

Consent is not a problem. The problem is, even if you have written consent she can always say she changed her mind between 3rd and 4th trhust, and if you finished the thrust- you raped her. Extreme example but in general this is the danger here.

Imagine your tinder profile that literally says: looking for a female partner for casual sex, and you meet through tinder and later she says she didn't consent. WTF will the judge say?

Cotehill · 2024-06-28T16:32:19+00:00

Consent is absolutely required.

Men should carry cards with elements to be completed - date, name, address, date of birth, consent, amount of alcohol consumed, signature and whether the woman wants some kind of kink. And should audio record their sex.

There is no other way to protect yourself and it may still not be enough.

Happily in the UK, the police do seem to be seriously investigating accusations and there have been some high profile cases where the women have been arrested.

The laws are much too lax but anyone can accuse anyone else of anything to the police and it is the responsibility of the police to investigate. Sex is no different in that respect, but a presumption of guilt removes the concept of innocent before proven guilty and has been abused

StarZax · 2024-06-28T18:07:27+00:00

Honestly there are some moments when I'm thinking that maybe we should have our phones recording audio all the time and the idea of "proving that you are not guilty" makes it pretty hard to not consider that dystopian idea

solarsalmon777 · 2024-06-28T19:28:24+00:00

Can I rape myself? What if I masturbate and later decide I wasn't into it?

sanitaryinspector · 2024-06-28T18:26:24+00:00

Waiting for articles about how such a law could put many confident women in trouble, because true rape is done by men and they're not supposed to turn a woman down

rohan62442 · 2024-06-28T20:12:58+00:00

Here's the problem with any such law based around consent.

A fair justice system will enshrine the presumption of innocence of an accused. That means that the burden of proof must fall on the prosecution. If this is not true, ipso facto the system is not fair or impartial; nothing more than a kangaroo court.
With the burden of proof upon the prosecution, they now are in the ridiculous situation of having to prove a negative; that is the absence of consent. All the defense needs to do is refute it.

Unless there is forensic evidence or witness testimony, conviction becomes a tall order without compromising an accused's presumption of innocence.

manicmonkeys · 2024-06-29T00:14:03+00:00

Sooo since women virtually never ask for consent...

BEEZ128 · 2024-06-29T02:39:09+00:00

Time to start audio recording ourselves every time we hang out with a woman.

eli_ashe · 2024-06-28T19:25:58+00:00

this looks like a bad, but i am somewhat uncertain.

it sounds like they've adopted a 'yes means yes' doctrine, which is just puritanical nonsense as to what constitutes consent, rather than just holding that consent is the ignoring of a no.

but i am unsure because it really depends on how polish law defines 'consent' which the article doesn't specify.

the law as portrayed in the article says 'lacking consent' is the new criteria, instead of the use of force which is the old criteria, but how is consent defined in polish law?

Title	Polish parliament approves new rape law making sex without consent a crime \| Notes From Poland
Author	Most_Valuable_8070
Upvotes	150
Comments	50
Date	June 28, 2024 4:04 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1dqn8aj/polish_parliament_approves_new_rape_law_making/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/polish-parliament-approves-new-rape-law-making-sex.1522680 https://theredarchive.com/post/1522680

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