My feminist studies class will hate me for this one.

AnnArchist · 2013-01-10T01:20:39+00:00

Lol. You gonna fail that class bro.

That said, start with the sidebar.

themountaingoat · 2013-01-10T01:20:27+00:00

Girlwriteswhat's videos are excellent, and her blog has the transcripts of some of them as well. A voice for men also is a very good resource. If you need more academic sources Christina Hoff Summers and Warren Farrell are probably the two biggest MRM authors.

OuiCrudites · 2013-01-10T01:56:46+00:00

You have balls made of fucking titanium.

A Voice For Men is huge, I would also cite Glenn Sacks (father's rights) Warren Farrell and Christina Hoff Sommers. The Spearhead is another big one. On youtube Barbarossaaaa is bi-racial and would make a great example of the diversity of the MRM.

giegerwasright · 2013-01-10T05:01:23+00:00

If you're a dude, the prof will fail you. If (when) she does, file charges.

2013-01-10T01:46:53+00:00

It's not clear what your agenda is. I take it you're in the class voluntarily and you've said you want to get a good mark, so I understand by that that you're some sort of feminist, for example you think the world can be explained by concepts like patriarchy and gender oppression. But your title would indicate that you don't take the class seriously and you don't have any principled intellectual basis for your project. Or maybe you chose that title to appeal to this subreddit?

You want blogs? How many? Two dozen? A few hundred? We can supply you with all the blogs you need, we pile 'em high and sell 'em cheap here, but what is the point of this? What are you trying to find out? What hypothesis are you trying to prove/disprove?

If you're serious, I would suggest that the men's rights movement is too diverse for a coherent project. Pick a single issue for your project, gender differences in suicide rates for example, or child custody for divorced fathers.

half-human · 2013-01-10T11:50:46+00:00

Yes, yes they will (hate you). Be prepared to have any issues you bring up nonchalantly trivialized and reframed in feminist terms.

I think one of the strongest cases among the issues we deal with in MRM is the hazardous jobs and disposability issue (aka the "glass cellar"--I think this term is very effective). If you focus on this, expect a counterpoint of "Well that's just because Patriarchy. Men are seen as stronger and tougher, so that's why they get all the insanely hazardous jobs."

Of course the reverse is never imagined. You don't have someone looking at say, a conservative Islamic country and dismissing the situation of women there by saying "That's just Matriarchy. Women are the most cherished and valued of society, so that's why they are kept safe at home most of the time and always have male relatives with them to protect them."

It's really important for feminists to maintain the tacit assumption that all men actively and intentionally oppress all women with patriarchy, because it allows them to trivialize all men's issues, since the men are "doing it to themselves." They will vehemently deny that they believe this, but without that assumption, none of their rebuttals to men's issues make sense. If they really believed patriarchy was just a bunch of attitudes that pervade society, they would actually care about men's issues, since men are also victims of these toxic attitudes about gender. Trivializing them because they come from patriarchy only makes sense if you believe that men are out there every day thinking "How can I make the world better for men at the expense of women today?" and just sometimes fucking it up for themselves. (This is the idea of male hyperagency in action. "Men" in the abstract are actually thought to intentionally control the form of society.)

Unfortunately, feminist scholarship is horrendously bad at actually sussing out what their assumptions are and how they inform their reasoning. I've read a lot of feminist literature. A great deal of it is idea soup, all unsupported assertions straight from the feels, sweeping generalizations, and vaguely lofty musings. To say that there's a consistent line of reasoning in many of these texts, even if only underlying them, is extremely generous.

tl;dr Yeah you probably shouldn't have read that, I somehow derailed myself halfway through the post.

Green_armour · 2013-01-10T03:10:26+00:00

Let us know how you go bud, I'd be interested to know if u have a professor or a whackjob

KingRBPII · 2013-01-10T05:24:02+00:00

Please let me know how this turns out for you. As a fellow activist I am very interested into how academia receives this issue.

ExiledSenpai · 2013-01-10T05:49:03+00:00

Talk about custody discrimination.

rightsbot · 2013-01-10T01:18:18+00:00

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2013-01-10T02:42:55+00:00

The Amazing Atheist has some good men's rights rants in youtube.

Also don't forget to sift through ManWomanMyth.com... that was my red pill moment.

If you need personal accounts of males who fell victim to female rapists all you have to do is ask.

2013-01-10T03:38:18+00:00

Video tape the presentation and upload it here.

overtmind · 2013-01-10T06:04:29+00:00

We've seen this before. You're going to fail this project because you're not following the typical dogma.

Do report back though

BlackKnighter · 2013-01-10T06:34:18+00:00

Upvoted for balls.

2013-01-10T01:26:08+00:00

You might want something a bit more reliable than blogs. Go to the primary sources linked from those blogs.

2013-01-10T02:37:32+00:00

Go to nationalpost.com and look up the articles of Barbara Kay.

l1febuild34 · 2013-01-10T02:37:34+00:00

you shouldn't it take,your teacher is going to make you fail the class

PMSlimeKing · 2013-01-10T03:35:31+00:00

Please tell us how it goes. Good Luck.

Lecks · 2013-01-10T06:11:25+00:00

All I can say is good luck and I hope your teacher is one of the good ones willing to think critically.

2013-01-10T11:19:30+00:00

My two cents is to stay away from rape entirely. It is far too emotional and any discussion is automatically seen as an attack. Focus on the biggest problems men face. Over 95% of workplace deaths and injuries are men. The overwhelming majority of military deaths are men. Males are somewhere in the range of three times more likely to die by suicide.

Ask the class members to raise their hand if their fathers were in the military. Ask the ones that raised their hands if they know why their fathers joined up. Use that as a discussion about the societal pressures men face.

5th_Law_of_Robotics · 2013-01-10T14:01:29+00:00

Good luck.

I hope getting an F in that class won't harm your GPA too much.

thadjohnson · 2013-01-10T02:57:29+00:00

Aw, go for it. If you meet the criteria for the paper, the instructor can go fuck herself. Universities have deans for a reason, you know.

ballgame · 2013-01-10T07:09:33+00:00

Hey Cekarix: I'd like to pimp our own blog, Feminist Critics. I know a lot of r/MensRights are familiar with us and we probably have something of a mixed rep, given that we bloggers don't explicitly identify as MRA (and in fact I identify as an egalitarian feminist). However, I think you may find our blog particularly helpful for your purposes, since many of our posts take a highly academic approach to critiquing (gynocentric) feminism, and we've always tried to be scrupulously fair to mainstream feminist commenters and the mainstream feminist POV. In particular, we try to avoid inflammatory rhetoric that can galvanize MR followers but be particularly offputting to mainstream and gynocentric feminists.

Anyway, good luck with your course. I'm definitely interested in how your project turns out.

HoundDogs · 2013-01-10T07:11:24+00:00

You need to make sure you tell the dean of the college or your adviser what you intend to do. I would think there is an ethical issue for a professor to fail you just for disagreeing, but stranger things have happened.

Do the paper well and do it right. Then turn it in.

Trigunesq · 2013-01-10T07:59:44+00:00

please come back and tell us how it went and what grade you got!

vintermann · 2013-01-10T08:11:08+00:00

Feckblog is a great blog which is really serious about sourcing data.

Feminist critics is a good semi-academic blog, engaging more moderate feminists in debate.

GendErratic has some excellent writing.

A Voice for Men is, despite its occasional talk radio character, pretty good at showing the diversity in the movement.

As you probably know, people who see themselves as pro-men fall on a spectrum from egalitarian to traditionalist. Traditionalists want some degree of return to traditional gender roles. Dalrock is an example of a traditionalist, and a pretty good writer. It's worth noting that while most traditionalists are on the right, not all on the right are traditionalists (the AVfM founder Paul Elam for instance, is decidedly not a traditionalist).

The Spearhead is pretty far out on the right politically, and the audience is further judging by the comment sections. There is some bad overlap there with far-right ideas (islamophobia/antijihadism, anti-political equality). Not a very sympathetic site IMO, but possibly something to include if you cover the internet phenomenon.

rapiertwit · 2013-01-10T15:18:03+00:00

If the assignment is to analyze the situation of a marginalized group, I suggest you go to great lengths to make it clear that the marginalized group is not men, but men's rights activists. Men aren't a marginalized group - men suffer from certain legal and cultural disadvantages, in addition to benefitting from certain advantages. People, both male and female, who actively try to draw attention to the disadvantage side of that equation, are the marginalized group. At least that's the position I would take.

This isn't just about mollifying your instructor, this is about clarity.

For reasons of both balance and persuasion, I would also advise that you present evidence of resistance to the MRM from both left and right.

PlayMeWhile · 2013-01-10T17:15:36+00:00

If you are going to go through with it, consider adding Doris Lessing: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2001/aug/14/edinburghfestival2001.edinburghbookfestival2001

Not only was she given a Nobel prize, but she is also a woman and many feminists regarded her as one of them for a long time.

frostek · 2013-01-10T20:46:31+00:00

...for some reason I have the music to "Mission : Impossible" stuck in my head again.

MRMRising · 2013-01-10T22:32:54+00:00

Since this is a radical feminism class

My tax dollars at work.

SuperUppercut · 2013-01-10T02:12:19+00:00

Good luck buddy.

2013-01-10T03:50:42+00:00

U need blogs as sources for an academic paper??? Something smells "Fishy" about this requirement!!

bucketh3ad · 2013-01-10T09:43:54+00:00

I would say that whatever you choose to present, I would make sure all the material focuses on the injustice and suffering faced by men and boys, and definitely not anything about "and this is why feminism is responsible."

I don't know the specific requirements, but if you can, focus on legal over social discrimination, since that's institutional marginalization in practice, rather than just personal blogs or statistical trends. I anticipate that many of your classmates will end up relying on those softer sources to demonstrate modern day marginalization rather than presenting ways that a group is purposefully disadvantaged by law. Such hard factual data should give you the edge as long as you stay on message and do not get derailed by blaming the faults of feminism for the condition of men in the middle of a feminist studies course.

For example, infant genital mutilation is a gendered law in most countries. If I were you, that's where I would start. I mean, with a woman's mothering instinct, how could they not care about unjust suffering of baby boys? If you need sources, http://www.reddit.com/r/Intactivists/ is a good place to start.

2013-01-10T10:26:11+00:00

Try A Shrink For Men

Gamerp4 · 2013-01-10T13:46:50+00:00

You are already failed by your gender, because feminist HATE men so basically you are already a vermin infront of them, you cannot compete with girls in feminist studies class, its either you emasculation and reeducation.

Estephe · 2013-01-10T14:29:37+00:00

Consider doing something on soldiers who are scammed by female predators:

“War-Marriage Vampires” & “Allotment Annies” http://unknownmisandry.blogspot.com/2011/09/war-marriage-vampires-alimony-annies.html

This is a fascinating and surprising subject.

Estephe · 2013-01-10T14:41:14+00:00

Here is an introductory article in history that is jam-packed with historical facts (FACTS, not theories) that refute what your professors will tell you. Things are so feminism-damaged at this point that the professors actually believe the false information they give to you (because they were themselves were taught by liars). I wrote this article as a "required reading" sort of item that is meant to help people get rid of a large amount of fake-history baggage in quick order.

"Setting the Record Straight"

http://www.avoiceformen.com/men/mens-issues/setting-the-record-straight/

EleisonJoy · 2013-01-10T16:01:51+00:00

I hope you do well in your studies and that your well-researched, well-reasoned arguments help some feminists question their beliefs. I'm rooting for you!

cd124 · 2013-01-10T16:17:27+00:00

I believe if an academic (not a perverted American Quack-ademic) but an academic, was to study the rhetoric that is being promoted by university American gender-studies classes, they would quickly find that the only "gender" that its politically correct to discriminate against are "hetero-males".

lastmanjack · 2013-01-10T18:31:47+00:00

jack-donovan.com

qwertytard · 2013-01-10T18:52:57+00:00

thanks for taking the harder road. goodluck!

franklye · 2013-01-10T21:10:26+00:00

Since this is a radical feminism class, I will need to start going to your school.

Bobsutan · 2013-01-11T10:34:13+00:00

I'd do something more specific. Boys in school would be my ideal topic of a marginalized group for this sort of project.

unexpecteditem · 2013-01-12T22:01:21+00:00

If it's marginalised men you want, why not start with Travis Alexander? http://www.hlntv.com/video/2013/01/11/did-travis-alexander-predict-his-own-death

SenorSpicyBeans · 2013-01-10T05:45:58+00:00

Yeah, this doesn't smell like a troll or anything.

2013-01-10T09:35:41+00:00

Don't use the term "Men's Rights Movement." Instead say "Masculist," as it's linguistically more akin to "Feminist."

tectonic9 · 2013-01-11T06:37:47+00:00

Sounds too general, and possibly not on topic. MRAs are not so much a marginalized population, rather they are people with a counter-cultural set of views. You could present the case that men are a marginalized population, but I'd suggest you get more specific so that you can make a focussed argument with rock solid support, rather than shallowly touching on a lot of issues. For example, you could choose more a more specific group such as:

fathers
male employees
soldiers
prisoners
homeless men
divorcing men
men in criminal court
male business owners ( eg. check out anti-male discrimination in gov't contract application)
male students (you could break this down into a subgroup, like college students, elementary students, college applicants, etc.)

Also, expect that the teacher or class will attempt to counter via oppression olympics:

"But women have it so much worse because XXXXXX." That's a red herring. Women certainly have a number of valid discrimination complaints in our society, but that does not warrant ignoring men's equally valid discrimination complaints.
"But most politicians are men, so men have all the power." But most voters are women. There are organizations that exist solely to lobby for women's issues. Politicians rarely address men's rights issues for a variety of reasons.
"But that's not the fault of women/feminists." Mostly true, for a number of male disadvantages. But a lot of this stuff is the result of deliberate, sustained, funded efforts on the part of feminist organizations - family court biases, anti-father biases, VAWA mandatory arrest biases. Do not bother delving into this point without quotes and/or money trails. It's not hard to find feminist quotes stating intent to destroy nuclear families and trivialize fatherhood.

edit: fixed bullet formatting

Title	My feminist studies class will hate me for this one.
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	145
Comments	74
Date	January 10, 2013 1:16 AM UTC (13 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/mensrights/comments/16a9um/my-feminist-studies-class-will-hate-me-for-this-/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/my-feminist-studies-class-will-hate-me-for-this.1603726 https://theredarchive.com/post/1603726

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