What are shit tests?

moggymojo · 2014-09-30T03:33:49+00:00

I read a description on TRP that said something like - if a woman says or does something with the intention of rattling you, putting you on the back foot etc then it is pretty much a test, to see how you handle being rattled/put on the back foot. How you respond let's her know whether you are someone who can easily be made uncomfortable, or whether you are someone who can stay congruent ('frame') in the face of various levels of obstruction/challenge.

That makes sense to me, and generally I would say they are delivered unconsciously in the AWALT sense. I would guess that higher SMV women probably use these more deliberately as a screening tool.

Locastor · 2014-09-30T02:34:40+00:00

Shit tests are designed to determine a male's level of dominance and supremacy. I honestly believe women generate them subconsciously.

Here's a typical example: You're on a first date, the girl has facebook-stalked you, she knows there are many pictures of you tagged up with other women at what look to be wild parties.

She asks you: "So, are you like...a man slut or what?"

Bad responses: Anything that directly answers the question. "I've had 5 long term relationships and I guess I hook up a lot"

Worse responses: Supplicating to her by disavowing what is obviously your actual past in a blatant attempt to seek approval. "No, I'm really careful before I commit to anything and I take relationships seriously."

Good responses: Dismissing the question/premise or her authority to ask. "Slut is a really pejorative term! Are you against healthy exploration of sex?"

Better responses: Flipping the question. "Does it take one to know one? Is that why you're asking?"

EDIT: You can fiddle the nuance on all of these replies a massive amount by your posture and tone of voice.

phasetwenty · 2014-09-30T06:44:37+00:00

The all-time classic one is "do I look fat in this?" Why is it classic? Because it's well-known among that answering both honestly ("yes.") or to spare her feelings ("no, you've never looked better!") don't end well for the victim.

It's a bullshit question, helping to inspire the name.

an_absolute_rose · 2014-09-30T02:36:35+00:00

They're also referred to as fitness tests which is my preferred nomenclature.

Fitness tests are tests women and men do to test the potential compatibility with their significant other. These tests are often not a conscience action when discussed on TRP, but fitness tests can be premeditated. I advocate RP men use fitness tests to screen out girls who aren't LTR material.

Examples of some fitness tests men can use include:

Radio silence for a weekend
Faking sick for a week
Asking her to make some sandwiches
Other beta behavior that might lead her to nexting you

We_Are_Legion · 2014-09-30T15:36:26+00:00

I'm going to explain this away from the fixation on woman and dating for once. Let me illustrate shit-tests in a way you'll recognize in every day life.

While people often see very little going on worth noticing in day to day interactions, there is sometimes more than meets the eye. Completely unrelated btw, but this article I was reading yesterday illustrates just how complex some of the seemingly tiny things we do are: http://tinyurl.com/yh6vw86

So onto shit-tests... the important bit to understand about shit-test(wacky RP lingo) is it isn't always in the same form. Everyone does it really. Even... mothers to their children apparently (as Usherai explains, but don't worry, i'll assume tl;dr here too, keep reading for now)

See, the way Usherai put it in that post is the way it made sense to me the most. Think of it like this; shit-tests are usually seemingly inconsequential stuff. They can come in million different forms, and they're very subtle, to the point of almost being unnoticed by most people, who are caught completely clueless and off-guard even when it affects them. Why? Because not many people(besides sociopaths) commonly understand and process subtext consciously. And what's common to shit-tests is that the subtext matters(they say only 7% of communication is verbal). The deeper meaning of the words/actions effect social change.

Ultimately, shit-tests are micro-changes in social hierarchy. They are competition. They hurt and degrade your ego, and subsequently modify your behaviour. In fact, if you consciously apply them, you can actually observe how they modify people's behaviour(weaker ego/confidence = more self-conscious / less assertion of independent behaviour, especially with that person). You can try this out at the end. But don't feel bad about testing it though. You're a pro by birth.

So, lets take an example. Of a very very simplistic shit-test and shit-test response(before we move to the type of shit-tests RP addresses):

Someone belittles you and you react, and they acquiesce, what was the net change in hierarchy? Do you think you passed that shit-test? If you're rolling your eyes, think of it in a less subtle form to better visualize what's happening; a bully starts calling you names. You glare at him and speak back calmly, "Wawuz that, bitch?" or even "Please don't do that", and the bully backs off in response(the reason you can imagine but it doesn't really matter). What is the net change in monkey hierarchy? In your favour, right? Do you think future associations between bully and you will be affected, even though nothing's really changed, and the world is "fair" again? Do you think there would be some sort of "respect" cultivated from this encounter? Fear? Shame? Imagine I'm an alien, and you have to explain your answer(and I assume its yes). You would probably sum it up as ego change. You would describe to the alien, that there's a feeling in your chest for when it happens(too badly or for when you did really well). You'd tell him your ego actually influences your feelings and its trained you about how you behave around other people. There is always a social hierarchy, and all of our moves inherently help to identify where it is. And we all treat each other according to our respective places. I think a good 50-60% of our fights can be summed up as people breaking ranks. Now the example of the bully I gave is pretty unsubtle. In fact, even middle schoolers would chant "ooooooooooooh" or "burn" at witnessing something like this. Testing or asserting FRAMES of interaction.... places in social hierarchy is a shit-test. Being repulsed is a shit-test response. In the real world, few interactions are as dramatic, but the effect is just as real. We monkeys are not rational. Shame is one of the most irrational and random emotions there is, and where and how it presents itself never fails to baffle psychologists. As a strange example, young babies experience shame when their mother walks in the room and happens to ignore them while the baby is openly displaying happy expectation of attention and love. If the mother is busy and doesn't give the expected attention, they display strong signs of shame in their body language, their disappointment shows and their brain lights up in the right areas. Its ego was simplistic and overreached. It feels bad.

But the world of shit-tests isn't just about belittling or pointed insults. It doesn't even have to be insulting. It can be much much more subtle. Say, me and my boss attend a party. I take the liberty of breaking ranks from normal heirarchy that exists between us in office in front of the others. I go around introducing him. Become his pal. Speak about his goodpoints and what he's like. But there's a subtext to all this. By showing people that I am evaluating him(even positively), in our monkey brains, I become his equal or superior. Now several things can happen. For instance, if [1] my boss is meek in response to me. He fails the shit-test. He probably will treat me differently in the office tomorrow too. Boss doesn't feel comfortable yelling at me anymore. It feels wrong. He gives a bit of respect. There is extremely subtle latent resentment. But he will hide it. He's too meek to call out the blatant break in social ranks while they were at the party. He's a big CEO and I'm a keyboard monkey. But he's been shown up.

But other outcomes can happen to. What can happen is [2] my boss doesn't fall for it... he's confident too. And he asserts a bit of authority on his own. He tells stories about me to counter those of mine. He captures attention to compete with me. Both of us are equally positive or competitive about each other. We end up coming off as equals. Which is still a win for me. No animosity. Boss gives ground. Tomorrow relationship becomes a bit more friendly.

Or, [3] boss can choose to out-compete me in my own game. He completely nails it. He shows who's the more dominant and likable man. Nothing changes tomorrow. Boss doesn't yell though a bit of self-satisfaction and smugness rubs off. OR [4] Boss can even choose not to entertain this blatant break from heirarchy at all. He can choose to crush me and make the risk I took in doing this shit-test backfire horribly and plunge me in hierarchy(look bad). He tells me to get my hand off his shoulders(for reference, the more subtle "out-competing" version might be that he takes them off himself). He tells me to address him as Sir and he'll see me at work and he wants this or that done. This is kind of douchey. On the red pill side-bar, this'd be like "nuclear option" or "command respect", depending on how douchey it is. It creates confrontation.

Now, social interactions are really varied. And as you can see from the bully & boss examples I used for this PPD explanation, shit-tests can come in a million different forms. So for now, bear in mind, the principle of social hierarchy change. All our examples achieve it. But with what after-effects?

Notice the differences in the four shit-test responses. 1 and 4 create resentment. 1 results in loss, as well as emasculation, resentment and perhaps even scorn from the one who lost. 4 results in gain, but confrontation and resentment in both. 2 and 3 are the ones where Boss-man draws or wins. Sometimes a draw is what he is going for. Same shit-test. Different responses.

As a RP man, you are usually going for options 2 and 3. Sometimes 2 is actually better than 3. Depending on your purposes. Remember, this isn't a zero-sum game. A good example of 2 is negging, which when done properly is the equivalent of teasing. You shit-test her, in response to her shit-test of being a stuck up bitch. You make her qualify to you. The result is rapport.

Now, to the part where RP addresses shit-tests. RP assumes women want dominant, confident, assertive men(add cocky for good measure). They want a man who is in control of any social situation he is in. A guy she knows other guys are respectful to, like and even defer to. And girls as well. People like him. This kind of behaviour makes him seem CONFIDENT. And alpha. In a word, attractive. It displays his social acumen. This means having a dominant frame in interactions. Sometimes that may mean you have to compete with other people's frames.

Women also routinely apply shit-tests to men they're with. In an effort to feel that they're dominant and fit. Women want a man who is better than them.

Shit-tests from women(and perhaps most people) are subconscious patterns in conversation where there'd be a marked rapport break on one answer.

Like I said, everyone shit-tests, but it just so happens, shit-tests are consequential to attraction in a relationship for a man, because not only do all women do them(more with men they're comfortable with), but they also seemingly respond negatively/positively in terms of attraction to how well you perform. Making them cognizant of the fact they're doing them is a weak action that may as well be worse or equivalent to failing the shit-tests(dip in hierarchy). (Lemme illustrate: Its like saying "Why do you bully me, bully? :'C I cannot defend myself. I am weak. I feel so bad" to your bully(which in this case is just a woman), which results in (1) you continuing to smash your ego, and nosedive in the social hierarchy and (2) the bully pitying you/feeling bad about himself and likely to react in the way that the average dumb monkey does: get defensive or not engage with you later because the conversation ended in a bad rapport. Just a bad experience overall. Instead imagine a witty exchange between your two favourite protagonists in a TV show. Think Beatrice and Benedick in Much Ado About Nothing. Much better and more fun way to settle the urge for all.)

EDIT: This reply is hurried mish-mash of an earlier reply. I'm sory I couldn't do you a dedicated one.

soylentblueissmurfs · 2014-09-30T14:38:52+00:00

This thread right here is all about a shit test, the top commenters actually know how to handle it but look as the majority of answers and you see wrong answers or guys just sweating because they've been subject to it and recognize it for a trap.

powerkick · 2014-09-30T05:06:41+00:00

Anything said or asked by a woman to TRPers that deems to not serve the TRPer's purpose. Instead of communicating about said question or action, TRP recommends passive-aggressiveness (dread gaming) to counteract the "shit test".

[deleted] · 2014-09-30T03:13:26+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	What are shit tests?
Author	usobitter
Upvotes	12
Comments	113
Date	September 30, 2014 2:10 AM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/2humh6/what_are_shit_tests/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/what-are-shit-tests.284734 https://theredarchive.com/post/284734

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