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Denver nurses suspended for opening body bag to admire man’s genitals

thatsnogood

September 6, 2017
1006 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://www.denverpost.com/2017/09/05/denver-health-medical-center-nurses-suspended-admired-genitals/
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Post Information
Title Denver nurses suspended for opening body bag to admire man’s genitals
Author

thatsnogood

Upvotes 1006
Comments 173
Date September 6, 2017 7:35 PM UTC
(8 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/6yhxt7/denver_nurses_suspended_for_opening_body_bag_to/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/denver-nurses-suspended-for-opening-body-bag-to.914737
https://theredarchive.com/post/914737
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Comments

[–][deleted] 116 points117 points118 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I've heard a couple stories from girls who work at a hospital relating to this. It was humorous to them gossiping about a man's penis but if a group of guys were sneaking a peak at some naked female patient and talking about it, I'm positive they would've been disgusted.

[–]batz_man 45 points46 points47 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Bang on. They would be fired and humiliated.

[–]Benito_Mussolini 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Always gender swap and you will find your answer.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yea good point, men's/boy's rights in such intimate matters are seen as laughable. To many men its of paramount importants to have privacy in intimacy. I've known female nurses and they swopped stories of male patients genitalia and do unnecessary violations of men to inspect their genitals esp if the guys are hot. They're just as interested in men's genitals and as men might be in women, a huge number of women today are addicted to porn which would belie any notion that they don't have an interest in looking at the opposite sex. The whole idea of our rediculous idealisation of women and them not being intested in the naked body of the opposite sex is so far from the truth. A story from a doctor. Joel Sherman MD said... http://patientprivacyreview.blogspot.ie/2011/12/nursing-violations-of-patient-privacy.html

"Joel Sherman MD said... As noted on Bernstein, another thread on allnurses is covering similar territory. This time it concerns gossiping in the OR about sedated patients during surgery. Only a few nurses are defending it, but some do. One commentator even talked about a non nurse who said she couldn't wait to relate to friends the tale of the small genitalia of a hefty fireman on the table. It is undeniable that these incidents, though never formally sanctioned, do occur. There is little formal medical or nursing instruction about this. One also has to wonder if this occurs with trained and licensed nurses, how much worse it could be with nursing assistants."

[–]PWNtimeJamboree 376 points377 points378 points 8 years ago (54 children) | Copy Link

only a suspension?

whew. a man doing that to a female cadaver would face jail time and a registry.

sure glad to see the police allowing the hospital to "handle this internally," seeing as this is not a crime and all.... /s

yay double standards!

[–]Trippymonky 132 points133 points134 points 8 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

Agreed, if this was the other way around CNN would already be at the scene questioning why the men haven't been castrated.

[–]BullsLawDan 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Agreed, if this was the other way around

What other way around?

[+][deleted] -59 points-58 points-57 points 8 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

That's a stretch.

[–]THETRUMPTRUTHTRAIN 33 points34 points35 points 8 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Lmao I guess you haven't watched CNN lately or any MSM

[+][deleted] 8 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Alabast0rr 30 points31 points32 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Does anyone know what hyperbole is?

[–]amisamiamiam8 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (9 children) | Copy Link

Hyperbole: noun, "In 2017 Elon Musk announced his plans to create the hyperbole, a bole that would keep Frosted Flakes crunchy at 500mph."

[–]metric_units 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

500 mph ≈ 800 km/h

metric units bot | feedback | source | block | v0.8.0

[–]Rudrahp72 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Good bot.

[–]GoodBot_BadBot 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Thank you Rudrahp72 for voting on metric_units.

This bot wants to find the best and worst bots on Reddit. You can view results here.


Even if I don't reply to your comment, I'm still listening for votes. Check the webpage to see if your vote registered!

[–]metric_units 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yay ٩(^ᴗ^)۶

[–]fiercealmond 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ya dang goobus

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It really isn't, though.

[–]zurrain 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

This is one of those scenarios where this sub gets grossly carried away. No, the man would not be facing jail time or a registrey. It's not illegal to admire a dead body that you have legal access to.

They may well be fired for unprofessionalism, and the media may make a huge fuss about it... but those are significantly separate issues.

[–]PWNtimeJamboree 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

It is a crime however to admire a live body though, which it states in the article that they did admire his genitals while he was still "incapacitated" before he died.

[–]zurrain 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

I admire live bodies all the time. Even considering he was incapacitated, I suspect every doctor and nurse on the planet is guilty of this. They are human after all.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

There's a difference between admiring someone's looks/body and being a health care professional in a hospital going out of your way to view an incapacitated man's genitals.

What is with these comparisons? Do you really think those situations are even comparable? Use some common fucking sense. A group of nurses should not go peaking at a patients genitals because they heard it was big let alone opening a fucking body bag to do so.

[–]zurrain 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Don't talk about common sense when you're claiming something that's definitely not illegal is illegal.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

When did I say it was illegal? I didn't. I simply pointed out how fucking stupid it is to compare doctors silently admiring patients once in a while to a group of nurses opening a god damn body bag to check out some guy's big cock.

[–]zurrain 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Read the comment I was commenting on and you'll figure it out.

[–]Mencite -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

His argument is that it is immoral, if a guy opened a body bag to admire a woman vulva then surely this would be seen as sick and a crime. It would be the sickest crime of all.

And the law is an on going work in progress, this maybe added as a new crime or the existing crime abuse of a cadaver should be used.

[–]zurrain 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No, his argument was about legality. Clearly it's immoral.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

obara, not sure you should even try to reason with this slime. Some men will make every excuse for the excesses of women. Who needs feminists when you have scum like zurrain. At best this idiot is a troll. How can someone defend something like this I guess some guys see everything a women does as moral no matter what it is even abusing a cadaver.

[–]Mencite -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Sop being a idiot its nothing like the story these women uncovering his genitals and admiring him. Not sure what you're doing on here.

[–]Pz5 -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

I dont think the subreddit is getting carried away. Switch the genders and the media would be going after the male nurses or doctors like a shark after meat.

[–]zurrain 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I specifically said the media is a different issue entirely

[–]zabby39103 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Eh, maybe the solution is for everyone to chill out rather than get just as hysterical as the other side.

Idgaf about anything that happens to my body after I die. I won't be able to tell the difference.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

On that basis date rape is ok, the woman doesn't feel anything does she. Would you agree with that.

[+][deleted] 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If they don't know they're raped. What about the rape of a dead woman's body? Is that ok?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4998042/Husband-finds-male-nurse-having-sex-wife-s-corpse.html?mrn_rm=als1

and nothing wrong with replying to an old comment if people learn from it.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

We need to start banning these antis. if these people don't think this is a big deal so what but they shouldn't mess up this discussion. They need to keep out of the discussion.

[–]Mencite -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Opening up a body bag and looking at her vagina?? Are you for real he'd be in jail for gods sake. It would be as serious as if the cadaver was alive.

Don't know how idiots like this are left on the Men's Righs board.

[+]turtleenergy33061 -18 points-17 points-16 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

I have trouble believing that would get jail time for anyone.

[–]MyNameIsSaifa 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

http://law.justia.com/codes/oklahoma/2014/title-21/section-21-1161.1

[–]BullsLawDan 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

It's not desecration to look at a corpse.

[–]MyNameIsSaifa 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

I can see how someone could be found guilty under point 6 of that ruling. There's a reason cadavers are kept in body bags.

[–]BullsLawDan -4 points-3 points-2 points 8 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link

No. Paragraph 6 deals with bodies that are involved in an investigation of some sort. There's no evidence of that here. It also requires a lot more than just looking at it.

Also, what you quoted is Oklahoma law and these nurses are in Denver, Colorado.

Edit: OK, downvoters... I'm an actual attorney who is explaining why this isn't a criminal matter. What are you guys that you know better? Supreme Court justices?

[–]recon_johnny 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What are you guys that you know better? Supreme Court justices?

Maybe. You never know which nine are which.

[–]MyNameIsSaifa -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

That second part, office of the state medical examiner, that refers to coroners. If the body bag is opened for some amount of time it can skew his / her findings. The coroner decides whether a death is natural or not, therefore interfering with their findings is just as serious as interfering with an investigation.

I'm well aware. OP said they couldn't see anyone being charged with an offense, I linked an offense that could apply.

[–]BullsLawDan 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It wouldn't apply. That's not what the statute involves.

[+]BullsLawDan -12 points-11 points-10 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

yay double standards!

What do you mean by double standards? Are you referring to the gender of the dead person? I would say male and female dead bodies are generally treated with similar levels of respect.

Are you referring to the treatment of law enforcement and supervisors of the nurses?

[–]Japak121 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

I see you're getting downvoted but nobody has explained for some reason (bad voters, bad!). So please allow me.

The double standard in the above situation is the way in which local law enforcement AND the media have reacted. If the genders of the nurses had been men, and all other details of this case were exactly the same, then the men would likely not only face being fired and jail time, but also public humiliation by local and national news media. Instead none of that has happened, because women are held to a more lenient standard than men with things like this.

[–]BullsLawDan 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

The double standard in the above situation is the way in which local law enforcement AND the media have reacted. If the genders of the nurses had been men, and all other details of this case were exactly the same, then the men would likely not only face being fired and jail time, but also public humiliation by local and national news media. Instead none of that has happened, because women are held to a more lenient standard than men with things like this.

Thanks for the response. You seem reasonable so I'll explain why I asked about a double standard:

Read the article (or any of the articles out there on this, I checked thoroughly) again.

The gender of the nurses is never specified. In an incredibly ironic bit of sexism and stereotyping, most of the posters here, including OP, have assumed that "nurse" = woman. So I was questioning how we can say this is a double standard based on gender when we don't even know the genders involved.

[–]PWNtimeJamboree 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Sorry I didn't have a chance to respond to you until now, but Japak hit the nail on the head.

To counter your point about gender, what IS specified is the gender of the person whose genitals were admired. The main part of my "double standard" point comes from the ideology in our culture today that men cannot be raped or sexually assaulted, only women can. Regardless of whether the parties violating this man were male or female, it isn't a big deal because he's just a man and "guys don't care about that kind of thing," or "I bet he would appreciate us checking out his package."

Were it a female cadaver, the male parties involved would absolutely be fired and at minimum face a hefty fine and probation. So it's not really about the nurses being female, it's that the body was of a male and not a female.

EDIT: Also, sorry you were downvoted for a legit question.

[–]Japak121 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I'll be damned, I hadn't even noticed that myself. You're absolutely right in that we don't know for sure that all the nurses involved are women. It's entirely possible that one or even all of the ones involved are men.

Nice catch. Hope others take the time to read your response.

[–]recon_johnny 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Agreed, but in an occupation that has over 90% women (91.2-ish), I'm guessing that likely/probably these were all women. And since they were "admiring the junk" of a male, I'm guessing that the rate would go up to most likely/most probably all women (even though I know many gay male nurses, because I work in healthcare).

[–]Japak121 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Right, but I think the overall point is that assumptions are bad, especially for a sub about right's. For all we know, one of the nurses is a gay male and that makes the statements most have been making completely moot points. We should be careful about crying foul if we don't have the important information about gender.

In all likelihood you and all the rest are right, but at the end of the day no one can say for certainty because we don't have the necessary information.

[–]recon_johnny 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah yeah. I know.

But it's like saying 91% of people committing a crime are 'X'. You're going to look for those folks first.

And if one or two are male, there's three or four that aren't. Gay is also considered a protected class, like "non-male" (gay, female, trans, whatever).

Anywhoos, I'll bet it's exactly what I figured. The nurse who complained was listed as female, but the others mysteriously didn't have a sex associated....interesting, that.

[–][deleted] 147 points148 points149 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Bottom line it for me, how is this the fault of the patriarchy?

[–]machingunwhhore 105 points106 points107 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Men have conditioned women to be more sexual, years of brain washing forced that woman to open the body bad admire the genitals of a dead man.

/s

[–]Singulaire 35 points36 points37 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Are you kidding? It's literally an example of women being punished for their sexuality. So what if it was gross misuse of a corpse, it's just not the same because of millions of years of women being sexually oppressed. /s.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This is a clear example of slut shaming. These women were expressing themselves, the man presumably consented, and they were punished by a society that hates empowered female sexuality.

Also rape culture? Yeah why not.

[–]pm_your_nudes_women 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

A deceased man sued for flashing his genitals for young female nurses at a hospital (intentionally not wearing any underwear under body bag).

[–]jeff_the_nurse 39 points40 points41 points 8 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

3 weeks? A man would gotten 100!

[–]Jex117 39 points40 points41 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Male nurses would never work in the field again

[–][deleted] 19 points20 points21 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Male nurses would never work in the field again

FTFY

[+]BullsLawDan -7 points-6 points-5 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Male nurses would never work in the field again

Reread the article and show me where it says none of these 5 nurses were male.

[–]Jex117 -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Well considering less than 10% of nurses are men, and less than 10% of men are gay, it's pretty safe to assume that these nurses were women.

[–]Mencite 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Good point,

Yea good point, men's/boy's rights in such intimate matters are seen as laughable. To many men its of paramount importants to have privacy in intimacy. I've known female nurses and they swopped stories of male patients genitalia and do unnecessary violations of men to inspect their genitals esp if the guys are hot. They're just as interested in men's genitals and as men might be in women, a huge number of women today are addicted to porn which would belie any notion that they don't have an interest in looking at the opposite sex. The whole idea of our rediculous idealisation of women and them not being intested in the naked body of the opposite sex is so far from the truth. A story from a doctor. Joel Sherman MD said... http://patientprivacyreview.blogspot.ie/2011/12/nursing-violations-of-patient-privacy.html Joel Sherman MD said... As noted on Bernstein, another thread on allnurses is covering similar territory. This time it concerns gossiping in the OR about sedated patients during surgery. Only a few nurses are defending it, but some do. One commentator even talked about a non nurse who said she couldn't wait to relate to friends the tale of the small genitalia of a hefty fireman on the table. It is undeniable that these incidents, though never formally sanctioned, do occur. There is little formal medical or nursing instruction about this. One also has to wonder if this occurs with trained and licensed nurses, how much worse it could be with nursing assistants. February 13, 2012 at 7:01 PM

[+]BullsLawDan -6 points-5 points-4 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

3 weeks? A man would gotten 100!

Please show me in the article where it says these weren't men.

This whole sub is assuming "nurses" = female. Who's perpetuating stereotypes and double standards now?

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 15 points16 points17 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

They didn't say the gender.

Which in this case means they were all women.

If they were men that would have been a crucial detail placed in the title and repeated throughout.

[–]bastion72 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

True. "Five nurses including one male nurse..."

[–]recon_johnny 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

With a 90+% rate of women being nurses, and this crucial fact you state (as has been shown many, many times)....I'll bet my last donut that you are correct, sir.

[–]jeff_the_nurse -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I saw in another article that they were women.

[–]BullsLawDan 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Which article? Link me to it.

Because their identities haven't been released, so I'm curious where this article got that information.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points17 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Seeing a lot of questioning "what's the big deal". I get the gender argument but that aside if I found that a nurse or other professional did this to a deceased love one of mine, regardless of gender, I would be upset and already in a state of grief I would be inclined to hurt the perpetrator physically or by law. To those saying it's no big deal, picture it being your 80 year old Grandmother or 18 year old brother and someone's laughing at their body - fair to say it you would demand an explanation and want some action taken.

[–]HeroWords 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It's pointless discussing this here "gender aside". The double standard is the only part that's relevant to the subreddit.

Personally (and totally off topic, as I said) I think we're way too uptight about dead bodies. I don't know if laughing at one is a good thing or not, but I definitely don't think it should carry jail time for anyone.

It's almost like they become a bigger deal once they're not the vessel for a human consciousness anymore. A dead body is just an object, and I think it'd be healthier for the people still alive if we didn't make them such a powerful symbol. You're basically not allowed to even look at your loved one's corpse until they've sewn their mouth shut with metal wires and filled it with cotton to make it look "normal". We put make-up on them just so they don't look like a dead body is supposed to look. It's not even the default option to donate the useful organs left in them, just cause "ew". I think it's all kind of fucked up, and I think that's the kind of cultural thing that makes us so sensitive to shit like this.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The gender aside comment refers to it being just plain wrong regardless of the posts location. I get that men would likely be punished more as they are by default "disgusting perverts" - I did mention that I get the point.

As for dead bodies, I am not squeamish about them but the sanctity of them, if not religiously, should be preserved for the sake of the survivors of the deceased. If they are nothing more than a shell for consciousness that become void upon death why go to the trouble of all the stitching and stuffing when they could just be thrown in a biohazard wheelie bin? Perhaps more extremely, if it's nothing but a shell what's the big deal with people putting their dicks in them? :) They are maintained and presented for the comfort of their loved ones who, in their grief, want to celebrate them somehow. These nurses didn't do anything wrong to the dead but to the people left behind. Laughing, admiring or whatever they were doing - they were disrespectful and they didn't have the right.

You don't sit on another mans bike, you don't enter another persons house without invite and you shouldn't fuck around with a loved ones corpse.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes but HeroWords we never make those arguments when a female cadaver is violated so don't bother making it here.

[–]Japak121 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I know this might not make a difference to some, but I'd like to be clear that the nurses in this case were 'admiring' and not 'laughing'.

Big difference between appreciation and humiliation.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Don't be rediculous its far worse, makes the old haggs far more perverted.

[–]MyNameIsSaifa -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Not saying the nurses are in the right here, but if you ever check out documentaries on CID when they first find a body or similar roles you'll find there's a lot of gallows humour goes on. Helps them to deal with the job apparently.

[–]anonlymouse 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

That's different from going out of your way to open up the body bag.

[–]MyNameIsSaifa -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I know :)

Picture your 80 yo Grandmother or 18 year old son being laughed at

Happens all the time.

[+][deleted] 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]NolanHarlow 15 points16 points17 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Meh. Even here in MR, I think this is ok to say:

When it's my time to go, should nurses be reprimanded for admiring my junk, I'll be entirely ok with it.

[–]adamdavid85 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

You won't really be ok with it... dead people can't consent ;)

[–]Cthulu2013 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Dead people aren't people.

[–]recon_johnny 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah...maybe you haven't seen your junk lately. Doubtful you'll get many "admirers".

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's nice.

[–]mstrmatt[🍰] 31 points32 points33 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Jesus fucking christ, throw the book at them. They should not be allowed to practice medicine before some serious remediation.

[+][deleted] 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Wine_Country -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

😂

[–]theothermod[M] [score hidden] 8 years ago stickied comment (5 children) | Copy Link

Hello and welcome to /r/MensRights. If you are not a subscriber of this subreddit, please take a moment to read this comment and understand what you are seeing.

This subreddit is dedicated to discussions surrounding the issues currently faced by men in our society. Don't think that men have any issues? Please visit our wiki and see for yourself the kinds of issues that we are discussing.

You don't have to agree with these points of view to take part in the discussion - we won't ban you for disagreeing. While it is common for people here to disagree with the feminist ideology, that doesn't mean we are anti-women or anti-equal rights. Keep in mind that feminism is a full fledged philosophy and not simply a statement about the rights of women. There are alternatives to feminism that focus on equal rights. Either way, we would still welcome your contributions to discussions on such topics. Only through discussion will people's minds change.

If you want a quick review of some of the most interesting discussions that have occurred on this subreddit, please check out this link. If you are interested in understanding the views of a feminist who investigate the men's rights movement, please check out this link to her documentary all about it. If you want to know more about the issues we are concerned with, try these books: The War Against Boys by Christina Hoff Sommers or Who Stole Feminism by Christina Hoff Sommers or The Myth of Male Power.

Thank you for reading this and not judging us before you know more about us.

[–]rocelot7 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I think you may need to reformat and edit it again. This just does not read well, and if this is going to be a stock response it should.

[–]theothermod 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

What do you think should be changed?

[–]rocelot7 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Hello and welcome to /r/MensRights. If you are not a subscriber of this subreddit, please take a moment to read this comment and understand what you are seeing.

This subreddit is dedicated to discussions surrounding the issues currently faced by men in our society. Don't think that men have any issues? Please visit our wiki and see for yourself the kinds of issues that we are discussing.

This could be condensed into one paragraph with the mission statement of this sub put up front and "Don't think that men have any issues?" should just be removed. Its utterly unnecessary.

You don't have to agree with these points of view to take part in the discussion - we won't ban you for disagreeing. While it is common for people here to disagree with the feminist ideology, that doesn't mean we are anti-women or anti-equal rights. Keep in mind that feminism is a full fledged philosophy and not simply a statement about the rights of women. There are alternatives to feminism that focus on equal rights. Either way, we would still welcome your contributions to discussions on such topics.

This just reiterates the same point about three different times. A more simple statement on allowing disagreements and freedom of discussions and how feminism is and will be treated as an ideology.

Only through discussion will people's minds change.

This read really poorly since and could be misinterpreted. A more general encouragement towards having an open mind would more polite.

If you want a quick review of some of the most interesting discussions that have occurred on this subreddit, please check out this link. If you are interested in understanding the views of a feminist who investigate the men's rights movement, please check out this link to her documentary all about it. If you want to know more about the issues we are concerned with, try these books: The War Against Boys by Christina Hoff Sommers or Who Stole Feminism by Christina Hoff Sommers or The Myth of Male Power.

The links are messily put together and doesn't state who writes The Myth of the Male Power, almost reading like Hoff Sommers wrote it, and her name doesn't need to written twice. Maybe if the links where listed instead of written out it would be better, but do what you think is best.

The general theme and ideas expressed are fine but this for people ignorant of mens rights, not those necessarily hostile to the idea.

[–]theothermod 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thanks. I'll take these comments into consideration and edit the post template accordingly.

[–]WikiTextBot 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Who Stole Feminism?

Who Stole Feminism? How Women Have Betrayed Women is a 1994 book about American feminism by Christina Hoff Sommers, a writer who was at that time a philosophy professor at Clark University. Sommers argues that there is a split within between equity feminism and what she terms "gender feminism". Sommers contends that equity feminists seek equal legal rights for women and men, while gender feminists seek to counteract historical inequalities based on gender.


The Myth of Male Power

The Myth of Male Power: Why Men are the Disposable Sex is a 1993 book by Warren Farrell, in which Farrell argues that the widespread perception of men having inordinate social and economic power is false, and that men are systematically disadvantaged in many ways.

Like Herb Goldberg's The Hazards of Being Male, Farrell's The Myth of Male Power is considered a standard of the men's movement, and has been translated into several languages, including German and Italian.


[ PM | Exclude me | Exclude from subreddit | FAQ / Information | Source ] Downvote to remove | v0.27

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ofc it was dealt with internally.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

These nurses are disgusting individuals and should lose their jobs.

[–]Shantotto11 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

r/NotTheOnion...

[–]Silvystreak 11 points12 points13 points 8 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

Its just a fucking body

[–]Exactly_what_I_think16 points 8 years ago [recovered] (12 children) | Copy Link

Correct. That makes it Abuse of Corpse.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Looking at something isn't what I'd classify as an abuse... I don't know, I really don't get why this is such a huge deal. I see why it's wrong, but not as big of a deal as you all are making it out to be.

[–]elmstfreddie12 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link

It's extremely unprofessional and shockingly unethical for people in healthcare. It's an important concept in healthcare ethics that people have the right to decide what happens to their body after death. This is a violation of that ethic.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Hmmm... like I said, I see where it's wrong, but I don't see where it's shocking or horrific.

[–]Dancing_Anatolia 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I find anything within a 10-foot pole of necrophilia disgusting. This is like, 7 feet deep in that radius.

[–]metric_units 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

10 ft ≈ 3 metres

metric units bot | feedback | source | block | v0.8.0

[–]elmstfreddie11 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Professional ethics (healthcare or otherwise) are drilled into you during university. Flagrantly violating them is shocking to me.

I don't believe in life after death so I don't care what happens to my body. But lots of people do care and it's really important that, for them, healthcare professionals aren't pulling this kind of shit.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's fair, I can definitely understand your perspective. They are probably expected to hold to a higher standard than "normal" people.

[–]BullsLawDan 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah, I mean these professionals lost 3 weeks of pay and will have a black mark on their careers for years. I'd say the punishment fit the crime and I don't see why everyone here is losing their minds.

Actually, I do. Everyone here had assumed, in a hilariously ironic example of sexism and stereotyping, that these are all women, because they are nurses.

[–]contractor808 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

and will have a black mark on their careers for years.

Is there some kind of "permanent record" or is that just BS like in grade school?

[–]BullsLawDan 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Correct. That makes it Abuse of Corpse.

Haha, no. Looking at is not abuse.

[–]batz_man 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Reverse the genders

[–]Silvystreak -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Again, its a body

[–]Mencite -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Again reverse the genders and its not just a body.

[–]Aeponix 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Am I the only one here asking who the hell cares?

It's just people blowing off steam. If the guy's dead, he certainly doesn't care. They didn't even disturb the body, they just opened the body bag (according to the article).

If they had actually done something to the body, fair enough, but all they did was admire a corpse's junk.

Can we get worked up about something that actually matters? There are plenty of real issues to handle.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Would you be brushing it off like that if it were a gang of doctors sneaking a look at a dead woman's vagina and breasts for personal pleasure?

[–]cheesepythons 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

FFS, if they were fucking it sure, but who gives a fuck, they are looking at a dead body

[–]zurrain 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thats what's so sly about it the same people would say it was so evil if it was done to women.

[–]Capt_Zapp 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What a dick move

[–]kartu3 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Already posted

http://nypost.com/2017/09/06/nurses-fired-for-admiring-dead-mans-genitals/

[–]deville05 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I haven't read the article but what does admire mean? Like just take a look or like jerk off a cadaver?

[–]pm_your_nudes_women 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

"A deceased man sued for flashing his genitals for young female nurses at a hospital (intentionally not wearing any underwear under body bag)."

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Idiot, Stop trying to make light of it and pretend your pro men. The cadaver should be treated with respect if a pervert man abused a female corpse he's be in jail for a long time.

[–]realister 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I wish to go out the same way

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

what the fuck??

[+]23-and10 -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Who hasn't wanted to do this at some point?

I work in a funeral home. It happens all the time. I don't do it, personally. But I don't want to be judgmental, either.

Live and let live, like the Bible says.

[–]Mencite 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What you open up a bag and admire a womans vagina.

[+][deleted] -6 points-5 points-4 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Wew! Thank god a dead man can't get an erection, otherwise i'm sure the sick little monkeys would have gone a lot further than just looking!

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Without the pumping heart to pressurize the blood evenly throughout, blood pools in the lowest portions of the body. So technically, all it takes is to rest the body on an incline, or flip it over. There have been documented cases of autonomic ejaculation after death, as well. It is entirely possible for a woman to fuck a dead man and become pregnant. Just in case you weren't scarred enough by the absurdity of nature for today.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It is entirely possible for a woman to fuck a dead man and become pregnant.

Yeah, if she just happens to be riding his dick when one of those rare posthumous ejaculations happen...

[–]OneCanSpeak 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Tf! How is this possible, cite a source.

[–]POSVT 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Re: posthumous erections, I can confirm. When we did our cadaver dissections many of the male cadavers had engorged dicks. Made the pelvis dissection easier at least.

[–]OneCanSpeak 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Ok, sorry wasn't clear on my post. How does a cadaver ejaculate during post mortem and how long does sperm survive afterwards to even get a woman prego?

[–]POSVT 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

So erections and ejaculation are spinal things (there's brain input as well, but that's optional), you could have a headless guy and as long as there was enough blood pressure & the spinal nerves aren't dead - boom. Add to that blood pooling, and the local chemical environment can be pretty favorable for random muscle spasms, twitches, ect.

Sperm viability, I'm not sure but probably not longer than a few days at most, extrapolating from the fact that sperm can remain viable after ejaculation inside the vagina/uterus/ect for a few days.

[–]Bittlegeuss 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

there's brain input as well, but that's optional

/r/2meirl4meirl

[–]OneCanSpeak 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

TIL a man can be headless and boom ejaculate.

[–]wackoman 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What was the Robin Williams movie that claimed this urban legend? Life of garp or something?

[–]Cool_Names_Evade_Me 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It'd be a rather interesting court case once she would file a lawsuit assuming she regretted it.

"So now Mr. Richards, appears as though you died some time ago, care to elaborate to the court why you were incapable of such an act...?"

And as likely it's his fault and he is thrown in jail and put on a list all while being deceased, because it's not like there's a difference in how much of a difference a dead man and a living man's testimonial is taken into account, given the fact the dead man can't give one.

[+][deleted] 8 years ago (40 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]wallyroos 11 points12 points13 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Get some help buddy.

[+][deleted] -7 points-6 points-5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Too late -- Ayn Rand fans are waaaay beyond help.

[+][deleted] -16 points-15 points-14 points 8 years ago (37 children) | Copy Link

This is the kind of idiocy i expect from someone who names himself after a character in a third rate novel about how wonderful capitalism is.

[–]bluman855 12 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (36 children) | Copy Link

Name one country where communism had worked out.

[–]HasAnArchmageFetish-1 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Name one communist country that America didn't try to fuck up.

[–]bluman855 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Name one communist country that America didn't try to fuck up.

That is the longest name of any country I've heard of so far.

[+][deleted] -17 points-16 points-15 points 8 years ago (33 children) | Copy Link

Name one country in which communism has been tried. That's actual communism, not something just claiming to be communism. Come on, which country has actually taken all the wealth from the rich and then handed it out to the peasants? First step has happened a few times, the second never has. The Soviets were no more communists than John Dillinger.

[–]F33N1X 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

DERRR UHHH

COMMUNISM HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED SILLY DUHHHH

ALL THOSE COMMUNIST COUNTRIES IN THE PAST WERE ACTUALLY CAPITALIST IDIOT

KARL MARX IS AN OFT MISUNDERSTOOD GENIUS

[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points-3 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

LOL! You're the kind of idiot who thinks North Korea is a democracy, right? It must be a democracy because it calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea! Unless, of course, it can call itself a democracy without being one, in which case it is possible for the Soviets to call themselves socialists without being socialists. LOL!

Thank you, sir or madam, for reminding me that post-modern pseudo-leftists are not the only retards on today's political scene.

[–]Cool_Names_Evade_Me 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I don't know why this is a debate in the men's rights sub, but the difference is that the "democracy" in NK is not the most shining example or even the average example of democracy, however the examples of communism had been a struggle to implement and even the best examples fell short of the overly idealistic and theoretical communism that is impossible given the fact that communism requires perfect humans and humans aren't perfect as all it takes is one to topple a system.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The point is that NK is not a democracy at all, but it calls itself such. Hence a state can call itself something that it is not, as the Soviets called themselves socialists even though they were obviously not. Until a state not only takes it from the rich but gives it to the poor, it cannot honestly call itself communist, socialist and so on.

[–]F33N1X 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Definitely not a false equivalence

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I see, you are just a troll. Go away, the adults are trying to have a serious discussion.

[–]F33N1X 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Shit you're right, sorry

My mom's kicking me off the computer for the night anyway

[–]FruitierGnome 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

So are you the pigman in animal farm then?

[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points-3 points 8 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

There is no pigman in Animal Farm, you ignoramus. Pigs yes, pigmen, no.

PS

Can you name a country that has tried actual communism?

[–]FruitierGnome 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

He is a pigman. Actual pigs can't speak or make phony socalist farms.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Speech alone does not make a pigman. If it does, Babe is a pigboy and the average parrot is a birdman! Also, pretty sure he doesn't "speak" in the human sense but only in the sense of communicating with other animals. Does he, for example, hold a conversation with the farmer? Not as i recall. Like i said, you is ignorant.

[–]FruitierGnome 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Ignorant. Says the guy trying to make the case for commumism and for pigs being able to talk to other species.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Ignorant. Says the guy who can't even spell communism, much less understand it. And you do realize that the book was fiction, right? That's the context in which the pig is "talking" to the other animals. Duh.

[–]Dancing_Anatolia 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, plenty of times. And they were all autocratic shitholes, because humans don't work that way. It's like trying to make ants democratic: it's never going to work (among other reasons), because ant society isn't designed to have coagulated power.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

LOL! You can name such a country, yet you don't! It has never been tried, that's all there is to it. The Alt Left can call Trump a Nazi, it does not make him one. Idiot right wingers can call the USSR communist, it does not make it so.

[–]Dancing_Anatolia 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah, but they called themselves communists. So I guess the Soviets knew what they were least of all? Sounds kinda like a No True Scotsman fallacy: "What? Communism's never worked? Well, that wasn't real communism, so it doesn't count!"

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

North Korea calls itself democratic, so by your standards it must be democratic. Hell, Bruce Jenner calls himself a woman, so by your idiotic logic he must be a woman!

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Communism will never work short of a post-scarcity utopia. And even then, there's plenty of room for abuse and acquisition of power. The evils of human nature are a bitch.

Ultimately, even the idealists like you will have to resort to gulags and eugenics programs as you try to breed out undesirables who would corrupt your perfect system.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I see, it has never been tried yet you know it will never work! And, apparently i, who have not stated that communism would work ( only that it has never been tried) am an idealist! You know what else might or might not work but has never been tried? Adam Smith's version of capitalism. I guess that makes me an idealist twice over!

Nice to know that not all the idiots are on the Left!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

It's been tried plenty. Human nature. Thousands and thousands of years of evidence.

Also, I didn't say it will never work. I stated that it won't work unless certain conditions are in place.

Btw I've never voted Republican in 16 years.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

LOL! Communism has been tried plenty, and for thousand of years before it was even invented! LOL! As for not voting Republican, who cares when the Dems act exactly the same way? Vote Green, do you?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

No, I can see that was unclear.

I meant that communism has been tried plenty, which it has. It is corrupted by human nature every time. Human nature, the state of which we have thousands of years of evidence to attest.

And yes, I voted green this election and have endured the slander that comes with that. I argue that both mainstream parties are corrupt, and that the bipartisan system is a trap that benefits the establishment all the time. But thats a different discussion.

Edit- I'm not downvoting you, btw. Because I like you.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I meant that communism has been tried plenty,

I agree with the rest of what you say, but the above is bull. Calling it communism does not make it communism.

[–]MyNameIsSaifa 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Redistribution of wealth is not communism, abolishment of wealth is.The core principle of Communism is not that every person should be equally wealthy, it's that every person should have only what they need and give what needs to be given, hence "to each according to his needs, from each according to his ability". This is why what you think of as "wealth" becomes controllers by the state in every Communist society.

Marx himself was a prominent member of the Soviet government for several years, many of his ideas were implemented in to law. To say that Soviet Russia or Mao's China weren't Communist states is to be ignorant of the last 100 years of political history.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Marx himself was a prominent member of the Soviet government

LOL! You are totally, irreparably, insane! He died decades before the Russian revolution even happened! What the fuck was in the Soviet government, his fucking ghost?!?!?

[–]MyNameIsSaifa -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Whoops, thinking of Lenin.

Do continue to ad hominem myself and the other commenters without addressing any of their points though.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Dude, you are clearly a moron. Who the fuck mistakes Marx with Lenin? And get this straight -- communism has never been tried.

[–]MyNameIsSaifa 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

People who are distracted and have other things to do than argue on Reddit about the virtues of Communism. I'd be more concerned about getting the formal definition correct. Please stop personally insulting me.

Communism has been tried, and it has failed. The utopian Communism you have in your head simply cannot exist perpetually in human society. Even if the necessary preconditions for a successful Communist society were in place, it would still fail because it relies on every member of that society being in total agreement. That's why you end up with volumes like The Black Book of Communism, because every Communist society has killed people who disagree because they get in the way of their utopia. As it turns out, when resources are limited and people are starving, the number of people who disagree with an all-powerful Communist state deciding what work they need to do and what pittance they receive in exchange is quite high.

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