Can someone help me understand what this guy means when he says that feminism's price for women has been that it shuts many poor women out of marriage and limits marriage to the rich? I don't follow his logic at all.

fuxdpus · 2017-03-10T16:29:22+00:00

Women want richer men, especially when they settle down. Women in the lower income ranges have access to shitty jobs, but they typically don't have access to men who are much richer than them. The men in their class don't have access to better jobs than the women do. When women can't find richer provider men, they tend to go for sleazy player bad boy manipulative types who give them tingles. When men can't afford to be providers, they tend to adopt the player lifestyle cause that's the best way for them to get girls.

LewisCross · 2017-03-10T16:38:46+00:00

Men are conditioned not to marry until they are financially self sufficient and mature enough to live with and support a woman in every way. More and more men are increasingly falling short in the finances department, as more women go to college and take jobs that would otherwise be filled by men.

All of society is stacked and set up against men. Everything from their earliest education to their first jobs to their careers to their social lives, is limited and restricted, mostly by women. This is true for all but the most attractive men, who pretty much rule.

Most men aren't attractive. They aren't and they never will be. So they see a society that at every point along the way is set up for their failure, and say "fuck it, i'll go work at BigBoxRetail Store and make just enough to support myself and buy beer, weed and porn". Those guys will never marry. They aren't marriage material and never will be. Why should they work their asses off when their failure is practically guaranteed?

Society is set up currently to destroy all but the most attractive men.

sunkindonut149 · 2017-03-10T15:47:31+00:00

The majority of Americans under age 35 who have children have them outside of marriage.

The problem isnt feminism the problem is more related to low income and unemployment. They can't afford the wedding so they wanna put off the whole marriage until they can do it right.

Averagegirl101 · 2017-03-10T16:35:20+00:00

I like this video and it is excellent. This is exactly why I am a non-feminist woman and feel so hopeless about marriage.

I am from an upper middle class background. My dad works full time and long crazy hours, and my mom stays home and volunteers a lot.

I grew up wanting a family like my own. I wanted to stay home and be a mom, and work part time or from home to keep busy and have some relevant skills.

I chose nursing, which is middle middle class if 2 nurses have a family or for a single person, but to raise a family on a nurse's salary alone drops you down to lower middle class or even poor.

The thing is, thanks to feminism and the high cost of living, I would only be able to afford a lifestyle staying at home if I marry someone upper middle class (e.g. Dentist, doctor, pharmacist, engineer, etc) or I move to the midwest. OR I just don't have kids (which is fine if I meet the right man).

And since I don't live in the Midwest, and work mostly with women, I am stuck in a weird situation where I don't meet men at all, never mind upper middle class men.

Men expect me to work, contribute a good amount of money financially to the family, raise the kids, maintain the home, etc and all the burdens will fall on me.

My coworkers have this kind of life. They work full time, leave the kids at daycare all day, come home tired, and then spend their evenings teaching the kids things. I don't even know how they do it, how they have time to balance it all.

rreliable · 2017-03-10T17:30:34+00:00

In reality few women are willing to marry a man who is not above her on the societal scale. Yeah yeah yeah, all of the women on this subreddit would have no issue marrying down, I'm sure, but we are not a cross section of society.

speltspelt · 2017-03-10T16:03:27+00:00

Eh... Being married to a high externality guy is going to make their lives worse, not better. Retail is not necessarily a worse 'job' than marriage .

ppdthrowawai · 2017-03-10T17:00:06+00:00

Didn't watch the whole video but he's probably talking about the massive economic expansion that happened after women starting entering the workplace. Cost of living has gone up and what was once easily done in a family with a SAHM requires dual income families or being rich. All that shit is tied together.

squidracer · 2017-03-10T17:07:52+00:00

It's not so much that poor women can't get married, it's that umc men more refuse to marry women below a certain income level(guilty myself)

Feminism looks at the top 30% in society and ignores the struggles of the bottom 70%

rreliable · 2017-03-10T19:15:12+00:00

I'm confused how people are having such a hard time with what seems to me a pretty clear argument (regardless of whether you agree with the content). Here is my best interpretation:

1: Anyone can get married, so how is marriage "restricted to the rich?"

Not in the real world. For an enormous percentage of women, marriage is a psychological impossibility. They'd rather die than marry whatever grim prospects are available. Only the rich are able to be stress-free enough to get over this.

2: And how did women's rights lead to this restriction of marriage to the rich?

Women (present company excepted) are mostly incapable of feeling attraction to somebody below her in the social hierarchy. That's why ugly men suddenly become sexy when they obtain control over a large amount of resources.

But as women are given superior status to men, their pool of men to whom they can feel attraction shrinks to near-nothing.

I know that every woman here is going to claim to be an exception. I believe all of you and will not read anything more you have to post on the matter.

3: And how exactly does all this tie in with the fact that women have terrible retail jobs?

It's a contributory factor to making women less inclined to marry, as she is desperate to be alone after a day talking to asshole customers, she rarely has a chance to meet someone she likes.

trail22 · 2017-03-10T16:40:41+00:00

Well the beginning part is true women are less happier.

He is claiming that with the ability to have freedom, there is also a responsibility that leads to unhappiness. Yes the women who are part of the elite and have careers gain, but the women of lower classes who would be happier as house wifes are suffering because society now demands they get jobs instead of get married and start a family.

not that I agree with this.

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Mattcwu · 2017-03-10T15:53:32+00:00

I think because women have more financial security now.

figthief · 2017-03-10T16:26:44+00:00

A combination of it being socially acceptable to have children out of wedlock, hypergamy, and stagnant wages. There is no need to keep a man around if a combination of section 8, chip, food stamps, tax credits, welfare, SSDI, etc can supersede him. This is especially true when men in that social strata are less faithful and more likely to bring about other problems like domestic violence.

This man is blaming feminism rather than the multifaceted changes because he is likely conservative, even if he identifies himself in some sort of "alternative" way. Because of his political predilections he is unwilling to blame the economic disregulation that made so many men obsolete to women. Even if he is red pilled, if he is like most red pilled men, he cannot accept that his worth as a man was artificially buoyed by obligatory monogamy, he prefers to see things in reverse from the a short term perspective "feminism robbed men of their innate value".

EsauTheRed · 2017-03-10T19:14:52+00:00

Maybe millennials are just a bunch of little coddled bitches who refuse to live life if they can't have exactly the life they imagined they would have when younger

Subway_Bernie_Goetz · 2017-03-16T19:02:27+00:00

The reasoning goes like this: A lot of the cultural changes associated with the feminist movement and 1960's, such as removing the stigma of single motherhood (think about how their children were once called bastards, now single mothers are heroes), social acceptance of promiscuity, etc. have hurt the lower classes harder because they don't have a lot of self-control and those social pressures helped keep them in line and prevented them from making decisions that would ruin their lives. Those cultural changes haven't hit the high IQ, upper classes as much because they tend to be more monogamous and less sexually impulsive anyways.

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