What is a positive, masculine spin on "vulnerability"?

HumanSockPuppet · 2015-11-14T17:01:26+00:00

There is nothing wrong with appearing weak when it makes sense to do so.

You're right - as men, we must project strength in order to deter enemies. Meaning, the act of projecting strength is itself the act of deterring enemies.

So, if I watch you project your strength at me, I can only assume you think of me as an enemy - or that I am not trustworthy enough for you to reveal your vulnerabilities to. This is what you're doing. By refusing to show vulnerability, you're shouting "I don't need you."

Every social interaction is really a marketplace - and you always feel disadvantaged whenever you feel like you have nothing to offer at the bargaining table. How am I supposed to buy my way into your life if you don't seem to need anything from me?

You need to show some vulnerability - anything that people can use as an anchoring point to feel valuable to you.

If you are concerned about showing real weakness, then you can fabricate false vulnerabilities and sell those until you trust someone enough to offer them a real one.

VasiliyZaitzev · 2015-11-14T17:20:30+00:00

Whatever you do, don't show vulnerability in front of a woman.

Why? Because the Skipper always knows.

Harden up.

moodyprism · 2015-11-14T15:59:19+00:00

Have you ever heard of the Hedgehog's Dilemma? Essentially is a philosophical analogy that goes like this: You are a hedgehog in a winter storm (life). You have two options. You can huddle together with your fellow hedgehog and you will both wound each other on your barbs. Or you can brave the winter alone and freeze in isolation.

I think the analogy is easy to understand. Human relationships are pain and you will end up getting hurt no matter what you do. Unless you make yourself a stoic uncaring god man. You have to roll the dice in a way that you feel is optimized for you. What do you want from life.

bl33dingr3d · 2015-11-14T19:35:33+00:00

Consider this: asking people for favors, help, or advice is one of the best ways for people to rally around you and like you. It shows them that you're humble enough to seek out advice in areas they may be stronger than you in but also impresses them that you're willing to lower your shield to better yourself.

You can be confident and still ask for help. I suffer from the same problem and I've pushed some good people away in life because I live behind iron walls, but anytime I've forced myself to show people that I'm human they trust me and like me more.

Trpidation · 2015-11-14T17:57:54+00:00

Have you read Models before? That book talks about exactly this. I had shut down my vulnerable side for years but before I had I was getting more pussy than I have in my life to this point. It was merely from showing that I'm ok with my imperfections and that I'm conscious that I have them.

Check out Models of you haven't already. It will key you into a lot of what your asking about.

SlippyToadsWildRide · 2015-11-14T18:04:57+00:00

Read this article by Mark Manson called "Vulnerability and Manipulative Women".

He explains vulnerability very well in a way that is more like "set boundaries for what is acceptable behavior to you". Very good read, IMO.

Vulnerability is not "being weak and needy" like many people seem to think.

SurferMatthew · 2015-11-14T19:28:34+00:00

Attachment theory helped me to understand why some people fear intimacy, some people crave intimacy and are needy and clingy, and some people are comfortable with intimacy and find healthy relationships relatively easily. These three "attachment styles" are called avoidant, anxious, and secure, respectively. It sounds like you have an avoidant attachment style. I have an anxious attachment style, which causes me to be somewhat needy and to do the typical supplicating Nice Guy behaviors. I've been working towards developing a secure attachment style, and things have improved for me. Though I don't fully have secure attachment yet, I at least can recognize a bad relationship and walk away from it, and I can avoid allowing my boundaries to be violated. If you have avoidant attachment, becoming more secure means sharing your feelings more, allowing yourself to be vulnerable, sharing power with your partner, and not running away when you feel the urge to run away. The writings of Mark Manson will also help.

cariboo_j · 2015-11-14T18:20:04+00:00

Turd Flinging Monkey made a video about this topic

Male Vulnerability Need

Basically until a couple of generations ago, men had male spaces where they could bond, talk about their problems and get emotional support from each other.

These days, largely because of feminists stamping out male spaces on the grounds the they are exclusionary and "discrimination" (although it's perfectly fine for the Girl Scouts to exclude boys, but not vice versa) men don't have spaces to to fill that need.

This leads to the recent wave of beta and mangina behavior. Men think they can turn to their wives/girlfriends for emotional support, when in reality most women see that as weak and unattractive. The blue pill man mistakenly believes he can turn the hos into his bros.

scurvy_tail · 2015-11-14T19:07:45+00:00

Vulnerability is not what you were taught it was. It is not mindlessly spilling your emotions, your emotions are meant to wash through you and around you until you are unmoved by them. Vulnerability as a man is accepting that you have limitations and exposing yourself to them. It is a realisation of hardship and discomfort, wherein you face rejection and suffering on a daily basis and, rather than run from them towards comfort, you weigh up your decisions and make the hardest choice because you understand that it is the best one. Male vulnerability is taboo because we all know, in some deep, instinctive way, that vulnerability is alien to us. We know that exposing ourselves in our totality will hurt us, because others will exploit our weaknesses for their gains. Vulnerability is, therefore, something you need to practise with yourself. Maintain a diary in which you are capable of absolute candour - be open with yourself, even if you cannot be open with others. Be understanding and appreciative of your shortcomings. Detail honestly your failures and emotions. Do what you want with it, afterwards. But a large part of our suffering as men is in our unwillingness to face the truths within ourselves. We are all afraid, we all have our regrets. These are not things you should share with others, necessarily, but explore yourself for any malignant sources of suffering.

knitro · 2015-11-14T20:33:54+00:00

Most people go overboard on the vulnerability, or misinterpret it. It has to be earned.

You want to demonstrate that you can be emotionally available, but it happens rarely and only with 'special' people. Its not a demonstration of 'weakness' or frame loss, but showing things can affect you, just like they can affect her.

Easiest place to apply something like this is after she's told a emotionally involved story about loss, fear or whatever. You commiserate (note, not one up) with one of your own, empathizing with her feelings. After telling it, following up with something to the effect of:

"You know, I never really tell anyone that story."

This really solidifies the 'specialness' of the disclosure. She walks away with a feeling that you two now share a bond that not many other people do, and it strengthens her attraction.

It's that shared feeling that will be remembered in her head - it balances against the otherwise alpha qualities you should embody to help her feel she made the 'right' choice (100% alpha is not a winning strategy).

eternal_temptation · 2015-11-14T16:19:32+00:00

you are too wound up tight with your stoicness.

If you want to cry, find an isolated room, do it there.

when we are talking about vulnerability of men. We are talking about how and what they are showing it to the world. Read 48 Laws of power - Law 30 - Make your accomplishment seem effortless

Law 46 - Never appear perfect.

About making friends... Like I said, you are too wound up tight. Find (or fake) a chink or two in your armor. And share it with the world. Let the world know "The YOU", you want them to know.

People need to believe you are like them. You have weakness too.

fcjnews · 2015-11-14T18:57:26+00:00

You need to read the book Models by Mark Manson. This is the central thesis of the book. The message is that you need to learn the distinction from Vulnerability and Neediness and that they are not equal.

Putting your neck on the chopping block and saying 'do what you want, I don't give a shit' is vulnerability. It's why when you see two guys taunting each other they put their arms to the sides. This is the worst possible fighting position but men biologically do this because they are unconsciously trying to communicate to the crowd they're so much stronger that they don't need an overt defense.

What you are doing is needy. You are putting up an overt defense because you don't feel strong enough to show that you have some weak spots. Instead of lifting your chin and exposing your neck you are wearing a turtleneck. That is neediness.

Professor_Red · 2015-11-14T19:01:15+00:00

Its been a while since I've read through it, but one of the main tenets of Mark Manson book Models is vulnerability, so you may want to check that out.

He also has several post on his bog about it too, such as The Vulnerability Primer.

One of the things in his writings that stuck with me is this quote, which sums it up fairly well for me:

The greatest demonstration of power and security is to actually make oneself defenseless, to become as comfortable with one’s weaknesses as possible.

[deleted] · 2015-11-14T16:10:00+00:00

I would say it's more about being inclusive.

Other people need to be able to relate to you, and part of that is sharing stories in the right amounts and ways, and allowing other people to help you and be helped. Good people offer help where they see, but we're not good at telepathy. The story telling is key to the whole thing.

It doesn't need to be alot, but it is part of human interaction.

helolover · 2015-11-14T18:29:53+00:00

You're human - you're vulnerable. We all all, so there it is. Embrace your vulnerability. Don't go showing it to everyone. Some will crush you for it and take advantage of you for it. (Most) women will despise you for it. Some will feel sorry for you, but this is not the right way of getting attention - romantic or platonic. I recommend reading Rollo's article titled "empathy" for more on the subject.

From what you've said, it appears you're not comfortable with yourself. I recommend you take cut yourself a bit of slack. Realize you're going to fuck up sometimes, feel like shit and do dumb things. Keep moving forward. Press your self in the positive directions while moving away from negative self-hating shit. Once you're more comfortable with yourself, you can open yourself up to friendships. You're the foundation of the relationships you choose to enter. When your foundation is fucked up, so is everything else. Keep bettering yourself and molding yourself into what you want to be.

32643264 · 2015-11-14T18:52:00+00:00

We need to think about the context of our vulnerability.

If it's a woman? Continue what you are doing. Don't show your emotions as women love emotionless men. I understand you want to make a connection with someone, especially someone female. Our biology compels us to do this and at the same time, the very vulnerability we wish to share will end up making them despise us. By despise, I mean they will go "awww, hunny its ok, youre so sweet, blah blah blah." At the same time they re saying this, their vagina is drying up faster than ghandi's sandals. This is knowledge from experience. So, you can show a woman that you are vulnerable, but she will not longer want to fuck you. And well, that's just not on my agenda. Girls are for fucking. They make terrible friends because solipsism.

Not being vulnerable is OK man. Its tough, but it means you protect yourself from being hurt, which they inevitably would. I'm yet to meet a female who hasn't been a disappointment.

You can show vulnerability in some ways. Tell them you love puppies. Tell them you love your family. Just don't tell them about your problems. But you know this already.

Letting a female "in" is never a good idea. They just cant handle any sort of adversity, any sort of real world problem. They re just fucking weak as a sex. Its not their fault. It's just in their nature.

So if you can't be vulnerable to women, can you with other men?

The only people who i let "in" are two of my guy friends who have been my boys for 10+ years. Not my dad, not my sister. Two people in the whole fucking world. Sounds lonely, huh? That's life, man. That's enlightenment. Sadness consumed me when I figured that out. Sometimes I still catch feels about that. Has it made my life better? in some aspects yes, other aspects no.

I definitely feel like im a misogynist now. But Id rather be a misogynist than a little bitch who gets manipulated by other people. FUCK. THAT. SHIT.

My suggestion is to find other alpha type men and build a relationship with them. Drink some beers and do some man shit. Go play pool, go build some shit, get drunk and just talk man. If they listen,give a shit and provide advice, then theyre worth your time. If they don't, then fuck them and you were drunk anyway (plausible deniability...thanks, learned that from womens).

Remember, you determine your own happiness. If you need someone to talk with, I'll listen.

Primemale · 2015-11-14T19:05:46+00:00

as you insinuated, you are showing vulnerability by asking for advice now, although I don't believe there is anything wrong with that. Men have always gave and received help/support from their in group of trusted men. we are designed to work in groups, not isolation.

you also sound like you are an overachiever and nothing is ever enough, you have to learn to enjoy the process as that is most of the time, as opposed to the goal being achieved, be content knowing that you are putting in daily effort to be better, not at the results.

I still think being 'overly stoic' is better than overly emotional, at least for a man. Also in all honesty, it sounds like your stoicism stems from an emotional place, namely one of fear (perhaps of not being good enough) the answer here is that self acceptance is required, although this does not mean be complacent but just take solace in knowing you are doing your best to be a better man each day, whatever that means to you.

david_kimba · 2015-11-14T20:41:59+00:00

The realization that there is always something to learn from anyone is my source of vulnerability. I am not perfect and i will never be, but i am willing to sacrifice the flawed parts of what i am right now to become a better version of myself.

I have doubts, i want to learn, i want to absorb the knowledge and struggles of others. I want to learn from people i admire and offer something in return to those i value. This means that for them to teach me, for them to help me, for them to connect i have to show them parts of the real me.

To get something you want you have to take risks. That is vulnerability, exposing yourself to discomfort, pushing yourself, putting yourself in a position where you can fail and where you can not control all the odds around you.

I beat depression, self harm and haunting thoughts of suicide in the past. So for me it is very different. No one can hurt me as bad as i hurt myself in the past. No one will ever be able to hate me as much as i once did. And nowadays no one will break me because i love being myself.

When you truly accept yourself, there is nothing to be afraid of. No shame. Just pain, and pain never goes away, but thats okay, pain is your most reliable teacher.

How many thinkers, artists, scientists, warriors died for expressing themselves, for making themselves vulnerable for a cause.

Expressing your true opinion is being vulnerable. Being yourself is being vulnerable. Going against the tide and working with your will and guts is being vulnerable. Vulnerable is the opposite of comformism. And vulnerabilty is a source of strenght. Not a source of attention and pity.

I admire the man who paints his dreams, who breaks his destiny, who molds reality, who masters himself, because he had to risk his ego constantly and in doing so evolved and inspired others and himself.

You can live your life with a mask. It works. We all use different masks for different ocasions. But we will never value the interactions people have with fake masks as much as the ones they have with our real face. It would be a shame to die without anyone having seen your true face.

Tldr: Vulnerability to me is to take risks, moving out of your comfort zone, being mature enough to ask for help and having the willingness to change in order to better yourself and express your true identity without shame because you accept yourself.

Vulerability is NOT: Telling adorned dramatic PUA stories about your stripper girlfriend to girls or spitting your guts out for attention or pity any time you have the chance, especially with people that have no business knowing them, like plates or idiots.

GayLubeOil · 2015-11-14T22:15:54+00:00

Sounds like you're asking a question. Off to Ask TRP with you!

bigcitytruth · 2015-11-14T22:59:46+00:00

It's okay to be vulnerable, just make sure it's not in front of a woman. Your male friends are the only ones who truly can help you out. A woman, no matter how much she says she loves you, will subconsciously see weakness, no matter what.

So stay stoic in front of your woman, even if she bitches about it. It's what makes you a man. To her, you're a rock. Your male friends are for your emotional release and they won't judge you like a woman will. Brotherhood is important.

NakedAndBehindYou · 2015-11-15T09:03:22+00:00

Right way to be vulnerable: confidently tell her how you feel while maintaining composure.

Wrong way to be vulnerable: cry on her shoulder about your fee-fees while her pussy simultaneously dries up.

great_artists_steal · 2015-11-14T16:25:16+00:00

I like the saying, "Real winners don't compete." In general, I also live according to the principle "Nothing can hurt me." My perception of my own self-worth is almost completely independent from the external world, therefore almost nothing anyone can do can hurt me.

(Above, I use "hurt" in the sense of "emotional vulnerability" - obviously people can hurt me by damaging my body or taking my money away... but those two have almost nothing to do with vulnerability.)

muh-soggy-knee · 2015-11-14T16:57:09+00:00

Vulnerability is natural, unavoidable, and in many ways can be leveraged in a Machiavellian sense also, women are the masters of this but it can be done by men, if properly applied. But it needs to be controlled. You can let them see you fight your demons, but you can't ever let them see your demons break you.

bonerfleximus · 2015-11-14T18:12:00+00:00

Letting your fear of emotional pain dictate your behavior (aloofness) is just as bad as people who dive headfirst into their emotions. There's a certain amount of masculine strength and courage displayed in vulnerability that will draw people to you. I'm not talking about crying about your problems, that's needy shit. I'm talking about taking emotional risks as small as being the first person to laugh in a group or as large as letting yourself feel love.

TonyB79 · 2015-11-15T23:37:14+00:00

Don't express your feelings or talk about your problems to others with a view toward venting, whining, complaining, or making them feel sorry for you. Instead, solicit advice from people you respect and talk constructively about ways of dealing with your issues.

As far as the whole "boys don't cry" thing is concerned... hey, if you're upset enough or you've got enough on your emotional plate to be breaking down in tears, maybe don't worry so much about how others perceive you and focus on taking care of yourself and getting your own issues dealt with. Everybody needs a release from time to time -- whether that comes in the form of a good cry, a scream, punching the wall, or whatever -- and as long as you aren't hurting yourself or anyone else, I truly don't think that's anything to be ashamed of.

Deevoid · 2015-11-14T18:32:24+00:00

Read 'Daring Greatly' by Brene Brown.

DoerOfStuffAndThings · 2015-11-14T20:35:58+00:00

Afraid that you might intimidate everyone around you with your awesomeness?

MattyAnon · 2015-11-14T21:02:53+00:00

Well definitely keep the neediness out of all your human interactions, that's for sure. Neediness and weakness are not attractive to anyone except those looking for their next victim (and there are plenty of those people around).

People will talk about interdependence, and I kinda hate that too because it sounds like codependence. I guess instead look at it all as an exchange. What people do you like the best? Who do you want a drink with? Who do you want to go into battle with? (These are often not the same people). Be like those people. I doubt you're thinking "Wow, I really like Jim because Jim is so vulnerable to me".

Generally it is sociable positive people with something to offer that make friends easily, because other people have something to gain, just by being around them. Usually in terms of mood. Occasionally more tangible benefits. Leading is good (in all ways). Don't be too dominant with other men. Do be too dominant with women. I fail to see how any sort of vulnerability is helpful in any of it. Honesty is good. Indifference to outcome is good.

OP... thinking this through ... maybe you need more openness instead of more vulnerability. Show your emotions (but not in a needy way.. don't be a victim nor expect others to sort you out). Emotionally leading is good. Leading means you go first, you direct things, you forge the path. Others follow. Emotions are contagious, and people like a variety. Be the adventurer leading forth, not the rock in the stream unaffected by surroundings.

wittymore · 2015-11-14T21:58:21+00:00

There is only one reason why people hide their weaknesses...and that is the fear of others exploiting those weaknesses. By hiding you are (secretly) expressing your vulnerability...and you are so vulnerable that you've become neurotic about not being vulnerable.

No man is an island. Every action you make has an impact on other people, their actions have an impact on you. The only way to get rid of vulnerabilities and weakness is to show them, have others hit you hard on them...and learn from the process. One day, you'll find, the soft sports are a little less soft and can take the abuse.

That's the trick to developing yourself...and why most people won't develop themselves.

Ladd_MaccAodh · 2015-11-14T23:05:42+00:00

This comes down to your frame. Right now, your frame is about obdurate strength and certainty. That's great, but if you'll excuse a little pop-psychology, you're experiencing cognitive dissonance because it's not getting you the lifestyle and happiness you want. Eventually your frame is going to crack.

"Vulnerability" is an inward-focused word. It describes you, and your state of being at a particular time. You don't like it because it means you're weak. Women don't like it because it means you're weak.

Instead, focus outward. Call it the "Inner Circle" or the Thede or the Team or Squad or whatever you want. Your doubts, weaknesses, and misgivings are for the Inner Circle alone. Being able to see your flaws means someone is part of that Inner Circle. They know your frame doesn't crack out in public, so the experience is about your approval of them and your trust in them, not about your flaws. It also allows you to take off the metaphorical armor once in a while without feeling like you've done something wrong.

The Inner Circle probably isn't very large. Your family, if you're lucky, and maybe a few close friends. Possibly your girlfriend if she's very, very close. But before she gets to be part of the Inner Circle, she needs to know that it's an audition. She preys on the weakness, or gossips about it, she's out forever, no retries. You wouldn't do that to her, and you expect the same from her. This is a different frame than the one you seem to be using now, and hopefully will resolve your concerns.

Outside of the Inner Circle, keep a lid on it. It does not help your career to show doubt - mistakes, sure, we all make them, but admit to them, fix them and move on without agonizing over it. It does not help with women to show doubt too early - she should see you as a pillar of strength with a human side, not a weak guy putting up a strong front. Even your friends and family want to know they can count on you. Act accordingly.

babydocnorman · 2015-11-15T04:25:08+00:00

We shouldn't confuse vulnerability with weakness.

In the right context, vulnerability is a display of strength and confidence. A good example is open body language: arms and legs open, palms relaxed, chin up leaving the next exposed. This leaves the body in a vulnerable position but conveys an attitude of confidence and dominance: "I am so powerful and you are so weak, you are unable to attack me even when I am exposed."

Another example is approaching women, which leaves men vulnerable to rejection and sometimes even ridicule. Starting a new business is a calculated risk that usually leaves an entrepreneur financially vulnerable. Starting any new relationship, male or female, can leave one emotionally vulnerable, at least until you really start to understand the other person.

IMO vulnerability = the willingness to expose oneself by taking risks, a necessity to live an awesome life.

kaiwanxiaode · 2015-11-15T04:36:48+00:00

I know a lot of people, but I'm friends with almost no one.

I know this feeling too well!

[deleted] · 2015-11-15T05:50:34+00:00

Don't be afraid to fail. Youre probably doing it right now anyway, so you may as well accept that you will and just try to get other men to accept you for who you are. You don't need to Game your friends. Also, caveat emptor, don't make your male friends be emotional tampons either. A man needs to know his limitations, as they say, so my advice to making friends is to allow some of your goofy or foolish side to come out around men you can trust and they will in turn trust you. If they can't give you shit from time to time they will not trust you.

mtndewlover · 2015-11-15T08:40:48+00:00

Vulnerability isn't negative when displaying it helps you or others make progress. Otherwise, any display of vulnerability is just self-pity. It might also help to appreciate that vulnerable comes from the latin vulnus, for wound. So, although etymology isn't destiny, you could reframe the question: when it is it good to show myself as wound-able?

For example, let's say that you do BJJ. When you roll and tap, you are displaying vulnerability. You're announcing that the person who tapped you could have killed or severly injured you. You could have never tapped (held frame until unconsciouness or snap), but you would have at least risked severe injury or death (depending on the submission).

By tapping, literally declaring that you are about to be wounded, you preserve yourself. This will allow you to improve. It tells your opponent or training partner that he's doing a good job, which allows him to improve. Crucially, it allows both of you to learn this lesson and then compete again, so that you can continue to learn. This is good for you, for your competitor, and for all the people you know who want to get better. Vulnerability in this sense is essential to progress in anything remotely difficult or perilous.

I think this applies to relationships as well. When emotional vulnerabilty would serve a purpose display it. It's another question as to when to display vulnerability in relationships. But I hope this is a useful way to frame it: display woundableness when it helps you or your pack make progress. Otherwise, it's just self-pity.

da-way · 2015-11-15T18:17:18+00:00

I think we dislike vulnerability because it opens the door to shame. Being vulnerable is allowing others to see into the dirty corners of your life and personality, those you would otherwise hide. The places you are ashamed of.

It is handing others a club and asking them to "not hit you with it, especially not in that really sore spot right there, the one I don't want anyone to know about"

Being vulnerable is displaying your shame to the world. It opens you up to attack and manipulation but it is the fastest way I know to come to accept and love your-self if you can stand it. And, in time, it makes you invulnerable. Your frame will be like the walls of Constantinople for shame is the greatest manipulator we know(see Catholicism).

As to what shame is, as far as I can get is that Shame is a believe that goes: "I should be some way that I am not and because I can't fulfill my standard I am unworthy of life/happiness/success/intimacy/XYZ". This is very often a thought that is to painful to deal with so we suppress it making it damn near impossible to deal with.

I refuse to ever cut myself any slack, pressure myself ridiculously, and take responsibility for all of the world's problems. I force myself to "man up" all the time

You as much as say that that you are responsible for all(/some) of the worlds problems and when you encounter a problem you feel shame because "This is your fault and you should be better" this in turn makes you feel shame and hinders you from being vulnerable.

Typing all this out and opening up feels a bit healing, yet awkward at the same time. I'm glad I fought through the awkward and did it.

Just writing this out on the internet is you acknowledging the problem and the first step is identifying that there is a problem, the next is figuring out what to do about it.

Here is a very good TED talk on the subject. [22:00]

tl;dr: Being vulnerable divests us of our most reliable defense from shame. We dislike vulnerability immensely because it is both painful & it opens us to attack and manipulation. If we however manage to be vulnerable it leads to self acceptance and self love making us invulnerable to shame and builds our frame up to hitherto unreachable levels.

Shanguerrilla · 2015-11-16T04:17:36+00:00

I don't believe that is stoicism. This reads like something I very much relate to. Coming from whatever my family is, I learned to not have needs, I was always proud of not being needy and never showing emotions (or controlling them) there was no room for it. To the point where I didn't feel or really know how I felt. I still have to fight that. It is the opposite of stoicism and it is the opposite of 'not' being vulnerable (at least when I let that influence me). Could it possibly be more like a defense mechanism where there is a vulnerability rather than the opposite?

You did an great job talking about this, it is something I've been working on myself.

aherne18 · 2015-11-16T07:02:02+00:00

Man my only advice is to keep it on! You must never show vulnerability to anyone, but you can OCCASIONALLY show some "slaveowner's kindness": appearing "close" to men and women that gravitate around you (because power is a magnet).

You DO NOT want to know how it is on the opposite side!

rpscrote · 2015-11-16T20:00:21+00:00

You just took the first step. Not getting near people is the denial stage, you were denying you even had an issue. Clearly this is not normal behavior even for strong men. But now that you have admitted it you are in new territory.

You can turn your weakness into strength by fully, totally owning it. If it is in your control, you start working on it and own where you are. You take heart in the process and not the result.

If you can't control it, you just own it. I'm balding. I dont avoid talking about hair. I dont go out of my way to talk about it. When I go to my barber I say "well I'm thinking about something that works with the ol' receding hairline." He laughs, I laugh, it's a non issue. Own perceived weaknesses as simply an objective fact, a part of who you are without any judging factor of good or bad.

This entire post is brought to you by Stoic philosophy. So read Meditations or other stoic works.

0xdada · 2015-11-14T21:41:53+00:00

Depends on what you mean by "vulnerable."

If it means needing sympathy or approval, there is no positive masculine equivalent.

If it means acceptance, of yourself and circumstances being what they are, and sometimes being subject to things you don't control, then that's just self-acceptance.

If it means you would like companionship to share your awesomeness with, then that's what it is.

If it means needing relief from a burden, it could be that.

If it means needing assurance or a sign you are on the right path, or that it's all still worth it, asking for that from a woman is death.

scamper_22 · 2015-11-14T21:54:46+00:00

There is a time and a place for everything.

Appear vulnerable in front of the wrong people and it is taken a weakness that they can exploit or it lowers your status.

Becoming hysteric from a vulnerability is also a problem. It doesn't serve a productive purpose and should be discouraged.

Just the other night I was at a bar with some coworkers/friends. I guess you could call it vulnerable conversation. He mentioned his really shitty relationship with his dad. He can't even be in the same room. We all kind of talked a little. No tears or anything. But just talked about it.

We all have issues. It's just how you handle them and who you reveal them to.

I'm very similar to you though. I was always just toughening it up and trying to take responsibility when it is not there. I'm working on doing less of that.

stpauley45 · 2015-11-16T00:43:51+00:00

Your biggest strength lies in your ability to be vulnerable. Knowing yourself and your past, failures, strengths, weaknesses, fears etc....this is your greatest asset. The asset can be used or revealed to others you come to trust, be them women or men etc. Everyone is vulnerable. Those who know themselves rest calmly in their vulnerability and are not "afraid of being found out" in any way whatsoever. They are "free from themselves" and the ego has little sway over their stance. Supreme frame holding skills.

pimpxavier · 2015-11-16T01:04:58+00:00

Read Models by Mark Manson. Incredible conceptual work on why strength and vulnerability are not opposites but actually intimately related. Being able to be completely vulnerable is the purest form of strength and the best way to DHV. It totally changed me life, cant recommend it enough

NeoreactionSafe · 2015-11-14T16:51:36+00:00

.

This is a fake post.

.

The author of it is trying to justify Blue Pill thought patterns.

Just be aware of the manipulation he (or she) is attempting.

.

Title	What is a positive, masculine spin on "vulnerability"?
Author	_social_caterpillar
Upvotes	74
Comments	77
Date	November 14, 2015 3:54 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3ssgab/what_is_a_positive_masculine_spin_on_vulnerability/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/what-is-a-positive-masculine-spin-on-vulnerability.38127 https://theredarchive.com/post/38127

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