Low Testosterone, experiences?

CaptJohnLukeDiscard · 2017-03-25T13:21:12+00:00

I had mine measured about 90 days ago. Same symptoms as you. I also had almost zero morning wood, libido that was getting lower and lower, and was not confident / in control of my emotions.

I went to get it tested and it was very low, as in lower than the average for 60-70 yo men... I'm 32. Yikes. Doc said this was because I had put on a ton of belly weight, my diet was trashy, I was sedentary, I slept poorly, and I didn't manage my stress levels proactively.

So I started a regimen based on the Art of Manliness blog on the same subject. I've noticed significant improvements in all areas but I have a long way to go.

For me, raising my test seems to be based on the tripod of sleep, heavy lifting, and eating clean with a focus on healthy fats and protein. Your mileage may vary.

I'm going back in a couple weeks to get measured again. The other option was to do TRT which was not appealing to me because it is usually a permanent substitute that you are reliant on forever, as far as I could tell.

Edit: I recognize you asked about TRT. That's a valid and viable option and if you choose to go down it, be very direct with your doctor and just tell them that's what you want. If he doesn't comply, find another doctor that is willing to treat you. If you have low test, that is a HUGE drain on nearly every aspect of your life.

Kellerdude · 2017-03-25T14:21:47+00:00

I had your typical symptoms: low energy, mild depression, packed on body fat that was hard to lose, low muscle mass, no sex drive. Wasn't interested in my wife at all. I had just turned 40 but have the testosterone level of a 70-80 year old man.

I started TRT nearly 3 years ago, and it was like being reborn. Sex drive came back with a vengeance, but I had created the low-sex marriage. My wife didn't have that switch to bring back so she was lagging behind. Which is what led me to MMSLP and then to MRP.

I hit the gym after reading MMSLP, and I go at it hard. I'm working out minimum 5 times per week, some days I'll do double work-outs and have hit the gym up to 10 times in a week. My diet is strict and disciplined.

I went from 250 lbs at around 35% body fat to 225 lbs at 9% body fat in around 2 years. That's not solely because of the TRT, but it definitely contributed to it.

TRT was a life-changer for me.

JackGetsIt · 2017-03-25T15:18:03+00:00

Listen. I will get downvoted for this but that's just fine.

Stop lifting.

yup. I said it. Or severely cut back that routine. You can't cut to 2000 calories a day and go on a strong lifts 5x5 with lots of HIT and not have issues. I see this approach problem with dieters (myself included) all the time. People try to go balls to the wall on a new diet and exercise and they eventually fail.

My advice to you is to walk a lot. I mean a lot. 2 times a day 60 plus minutes; lots of water as well. Hit the gym lightly 2 or three times a week no more then 45 minutes, with almost no goals and focus 100% on diet.

Personally ketosis dieting is the only thing that got me to cut stubborn fat. Pick a goal weight and body fat percentage and read up on ketosis dieting. Be ready for extreme headaches and pain for 2-6 days as you adjust to the diet. As well as energy loss. But after that your body becomes a fat burning machine, and energy comes back like gangbusters. With all the carb and caloric heavy foods we eat today your body has probably never had to burn much fat (yes I know we are always burning a certain ratio of fat to carbs). At 230 you are lifting a ton of extra body weight as well in the gym, this stresses your joints, back, connective tissues, etc.

Since you were 270 at one point you might have had full blown metabolic syndrome as well.

So you need to not over stress your body as you slowly cut weight. If you were 19 it might not be as big of a deal to cut and lift but at middle age you need to go slower on this whole process.

After you've hit goal weight (be prepared for 3-5 months until you are there). Then slowly start picking up a more intense workout routine and when you do you need to 'increase' caloric intake (responsibly, read IIFYM) not reduce it!

The bonus with all this is regardless of testosterone levels you will simply be a lot healthier after cutting the weight and since you've been walking a ton and still light lifting your heart will be healthier. If you do want to go on testosterone at this point you will be in a lot healthier position to do it.

Good luck. Also please do a follow up post if you have some success and let us know what worked for you!

sites that may help

https://www.reddit.com/r/keto/

https://www.reddit.com/r/ketogains/

duhhhh · 2017-03-25T13:18:22+00:00

I felt awful. Asked primary to test Testosterone, Thryoxine, Thyroid Stimulating Hormone. All three were messed up. My primary said I was fine and to come back for a retest in six months.

I took the teat results to an endocrinologist that did something about it - Hashimotos test, lifetime of Thryoxine, and 9 months of starting and slowly tapering off clomiphene citrate to get T levels normal. I'd suggest you see an endocrinologist first. You may not need lifetime TRT.

InChargeMan · 2017-03-25T16:51:40+00:00

Calories a day are around 2000.

If you can't be honest with a room full of internet strangers, how can you be honest with yourself? You are absolutley NOT consuming 2000 calories while doing this:

I've been lifting. StrongLifts 5x5 for a few months. Buckled down these past 4 weeks. Exercise 6 days a week. 3 days HIIT, 3 days lifting.

And not losing weight. No fucking way. Based on the info you provided your maintenance calories is probably nearing 3000 calories.

Learn some self discipline and stop being a fat tub of goo.

rebbit_reddit · 2017-03-25T21:40:21+00:00

I think there's a good chance you have sleep apnea. That would account for being tired and grumpy. There is evidence to show that it can contribute to weight gain. Consider getting a sleep study done. Apparently there are home kits so you don't have to go to a sleep lab. If you have sleep apnea, it's generally solved by using a CPAP machine when you sleep to keep your airways open

bourbonhipster · 2017-03-26T10:15:24+00:00

You are 230# eating 2000 calories a day and struggling to lose weight?

I call bullshit.

You don't need T shots. You need a food scale and a calculator and some self accountability.

The_Litz · 2017-03-25T13:42:53+00:00

Not much background, do you lift and eat right? Are you overweight? Basically I am asking if you have gone through the trouble to remedy it by diet and lifting.

Judging by your post you have not put in any effort in these departments but instead you are looking for a magic elixir to make you feel 'right' immediately.

atlhart · 2017-03-25T14:07:10+00:00

Judging your own progress can be tough, especially if you have a long way to go. As part of trying to figure out what's going on, I recommend you take and record some body measurements. Your gym can probably measure your BF% and BMi for you so it's not guess work. Also measure your waist at the belly button. You could do the whole navy method if you want. Measure thighs, arms, etc...

See where those go over the next month of working out and recording your calories.

On the calorie note, if you aren't actually logging your calories, it's very likely you are consuming more than you think. A decent kitchen scale isn't ver expensive and it takes a lot of guess work out.

screechhater · 2017-03-25T14:11:18+00:00

Vitamin D, Vitamin K and Calcium supplements Kill the sugar and starch Look @ the Whole 30 diet You will be shocked with reuslts

Look @ your diet and time outside Vit D deficiency and diet are killing 1/2 the population

Rebuildingtom · 2017-03-25T14:55:49+00:00

My symptoms were tiredness, no concentration, anxiety, low libido and intermittent problems keeping it up. I wasn't overweight but an endurance runner and had issues in my relationship which were causing anxiety (pre me finding RP). Initially the doc wouldn't test me, I had to demand it and I came back at 12.3 nmol/l ref range 10-31 nmol/l and was told it was normal. I'm 33 and this was not normal. Have a look at the art of manliness blog that's been mentioned as it has some reference tables.

I spent a lot of time researching it and went back a couple of months later to request another test for T as well as other hormones. Doctor would only test for T as I was in the "normal" range but as it was the afternoon he couldn't test then (bloods need to be pre 9am) so gave me a bloods slip on which I then wrote the other hormones on before having my bloods done the next day by the nurse. My T was 10.3 nmol, just in the reference range. LH and FSH were very low (off the scale indicating that the issue was secondary i.e. Not my balls) but cortisol, prolactin, oestrogen, SGBH all normal. Got referred for an MRI to confirm no pituitary tumour, but 3 month wait. In that time I found the Testshock program and forum (Testshock is a purchase but I still think it was worth it now) and incorporated the workouts (I made a hybrid up with 5X5, had already been doing 5X5 for 4 months), fasting, rest, diet, supplements and by the time I had my MRI (all clear) my T had gone up to 19.0. I knew before it was going to be higher as I felt 100 times better.

Everything I have said above comes with a big caveat. I am now fairly certain that my issues were physiological caused by anxiety as I have recently had issues that have made me feel more anxious recently and symptoms are returning - but my anxiety could be being driven by low T again. I'm still broadly following the program I was doing before and I'm waiting for my latest test results to come back - I'm expecting my T to have fallen.

Doctors and endocrinologist were not really interested as I was in the "normal" range. Not sure what would have happened if it hadn't have gone up. Just going by what you have written I would start by looking at your diet, make sure you are consuming enough of the right calories and ensure you are getting adequate rest, but I'm no expert so do the research. Make sure you are 100% on top of it when you go to the doctors so they can't fob you off.

BobbyPeru · 2017-03-25T18:37:19+00:00

I have them test my T levels at every physical. A couple years ago, it was on the lower end in overall testosterone and low on free test testosterone on. I started doing vitamin D and zinc supplements… And my testosterone went up about 30% and my free testosterone is well into the normal range now.

I've been doing squats, adding 5 pounds a week for a few months now. It will be interesting to see how that affects my testosterone when I get my physical in a couple months

SteelToeShitKicker · 2017-03-25T18:53:59+00:00

Yep, you might have low T and it's probably compounded with high estradiol because you are fat.

Go here, pay 32$ go get tested.

http://www.discountedlabs.com/testosterone-test-total-and-free-regular/

Based on the outcome of that, you will find out if you can go to an endo or if you are borderline low and would need a lifestyle doc.

that_italia_guy · 2017-03-25T23:57:39+00:00

Sounds like overtraining. I'd go for a rest week or two. 3 weeks on 1 week off. I train 6 days a week.

discobolus_ · 2017-03-26T03:30:00+00:00

You have the symptoms of a guy who reduced calories too severely.

Not to say you don't have low T, you probably do. But any 230 lb guy who cuts down to 2000 calories and starts up HIIT is going to feel grumpy, tired, and struggle getting it up.

CaptainJackSorrow · 2017-03-26T02:30:57+00:00

I think that advice for new guys here should be, "Lift, Read the Sidebar, and get your testosterone checked." It is literally what makes us men, and without it, it's impossible to be manly.

I had mine checked a year ago and I was at 120 (low normal for a man is 300, normal for a woman is 75). I was tired, grumpy, and lazy. I had severe anxiety (I GAF about everything) and depression. I had never been able to make any gains in the gym. I thought I had a normal sexual appetite and didn't have any problems with erections. I had an injury to my nuts when I was in grade school, and looking back, that probably contributed to my issues.

I went to one of those men's health clinics and after all the necessary testing, they started me on weekly testosterone injections. Within four weeks, I felt like a new man. I had confidence. I was ambitious. I slept better. My libido was through the roof. My GF and I had a pretty good sex life before, but on testosterone it was insane! She'd bite and claw me. Fat melted away and I had definition in my shoulders, forearms, and shoulders that I never had before.

I had to discontinue my injections due to high blood cell count, but got that under control and am back on it. Pretty much all of my previous symptoms returned in the last four months and my relationship has suffered as a result. Excited for the old new me to return in the next month or so.

My balls shrank, but my erections are bigger and harder. I have acne (back, neck, and chest). I'm probably infertile and will need testosterone the rest of my life, but my body wasn't making enough on its own as it was. A high libido isn't always convenient. It can be tricky balancing estrogen and getting the right amount of testosterone dialed in, but it is, without question, the best thing I ever did for myself.

sixdownsevenup · 2017-03-25T15:00:21+00:00

OK - so first off - just be aware that what could be going on may be hormonal but "Total Testosterone" can be misleading (Free T and some of the other hormones are very important too). Another warning is that it can be very difficult to find a Dr. that gives a flying fuck. I have a detailed post regarding my struggles over at r/steroids.

If I was in your position, would look into getting an independent male hormone panel right now as a baseline (if you are in a place where you are allowed to do that, in the US there are some states that won't allow testing laboratories to provide you with the results - fuckers). I can recommend Spectracell Laboratories - for about $150 you can get a comprehensive male hormone panel.

Given your present weight, the first thing to do is to get down under 20% body fat and get another panel. My pre/post weight-loss labs showed some significant differences. It helped a lot in some areas, but other areas got way worse.

In my case, my Total T is in low-mid normal range (btw, be careful about ranges - they are different from lab to lab, and you cannot directly compare, say, Labcorps to Spectracell values) but my Free T is profoundly low. I believe that this has caused most of my symptoms (ED, low-to-no libido at times, brain fog, low motivation/masculine aggression, long recovery times, hard to gain lean mass, hard to lose fat mass).

I think that having hormonal problems makes MRP more difficult in some areas. For me, particularly in initiating and staying Outcome Independent. When you have a screwed up T/estrogen ratio it definitely impacts feelz and ability to maintain frame IMO.

I have been through 3 drs. and am giving my endo one last chance. If they don't come through by the end of the month with some concrete analysis & recommendation, I am going to a Dr. I know that runs a men's clinic and just start trying some things to see if it works.

Good luck to you.

(edit: typos)

rebbit_reddit · 2017-03-25T21:40:21+00:00

I think there's a good chance you have sleep apnea. That would account for being tired and grumpy. There is evidence to show that it can contribute to weight gain. Consider getting a sleep study done. Apparently there are home kits so you don't have to go to a sleep lab. If you have sleep apnea, it's generally solved by using a CPAP machine when you sleep to keep your airways open

brasslizzard · 2017-03-29T17:22:19+00:00

Was at 260, now at 250 and falling. Low carbing it mostly. Off and on the wagon. Good luck to you. It's a hard road.

trp_ocd · 2017-04-02T11:02:30+00:00

Leg day every day, and lose weight. The body wants to make its own T, but you're in the way.

saltybull · 2017-04-22T02:09:35+00:00

Well did you get your testosterone level tested? I put it off for about a year and became so T-low I had zero motivation, weight gain and couldn't get a decent erection or have any orgasm control. My T was 170. Started TRT injections 200mg IM once a week and my T levels stay around 850 all the time now. I feel great again and enjoy a rock solid functioning tool like I am 18 again.

Title	Low Testosterone, experiences?
Author	prematureredpill
Upvotes	14
Comments	64
Date	March 25, 2017 12:56 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/askMRP
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/61fe8n/low_testosterone_experiences/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/askMRP/low-testosterone-experiences.206355 https://theredarchive.com/post/206355

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