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contrastychain · 2021-10-21T12:58:50+00:00

as someone who has had a lot of social anxiety. i can definitely confirm that one should learn basic social skills before trying to get sexual with anyone. otherwise you would get yourself into awkward, creepy, or weird situations when trying to get sexual with people that barely know you or trust you. as you develop your social skill you will start to have an intuition about when is the right moment to be a bit flirty and playful.

very good post sir. this should be talked about waaay more in the PUA community.

donaldtrumpsmistress · 2021-10-21T13:05:16+00:00

Idk I disagree. Doesn't make sense to make step one 'having your life together'. What does that even mean? Financial success? self actualization? Being happy? If you make step one vague and unobtainable then you'll never give yourself permission to start.

Relationships and connection are the key to having a solid life in my experience. Our relationships to others are what make us happy and fulfilled. Connections can easily get you whichever job you want within reason.

If learning and practicing meeting women gives you the motivation to learn how to talk to others and develop your charm and charisma (which in turn is going to help out every other facet of your life) then nothing wrong with it. If you happen to find a relationship or have some wild nights out and plenty of sex then take it as a bonus.

Change2222 · 2021-10-21T17:22:52+00:00

There's literally a homeless guy in NYC who gets by begging for money and sleeping with women for showers and a bed to sleep on half the week. You can look him up, he did an interview. I'm sure everyone here knows a guy or two that has lived on a few friends couches while banging like it's their part time job. Being a dead beat does not mean you are unattractive. There are plenty of seemingly successful men who "have their life together." Money, friends, social connections, etc. Yet they get nowhere with women. The truth is NO ONE feels like they have their life together. It is the human condition. Whenever you solve one problem new ones take their place. The second you "have your life together" is the second you stop growing. And if you realized how many "models" are sleeping on shitty air mattresses on the floor or staying at random guys' places rent free, maybe you wouldn't give yourself and other guys the excuse of "I can't take action yet, I need to get my life handled like everyone else!"

Maybe instead ask: What's MOST important to you right now, and work on just those things that are most important TO YOU, not to what other people tell you you need to have to "have your life together" - whatever that means.

scenesick2 · 2021-10-21T13:26:46+00:00

well, not really. My life could be a total shitshow but I could still talk to random people or make friends. People can still lie about stuff to appear more social, more outgoing or something.
Just because you " have your life together ", you have friends, you can talk to random people, doesn't automatically transform you into james bond. Yeah that helps, but it's not the big picture. If that was the case everyone would get laid by now lol.

Let's say you have all 3 but: you're awkward, you're needy, you're clingy, you're desperate, not assertive, get pushed around, afraid to speak your mind, get intimidated easily by other guys, afraid of everything, unconfident.

Which in case you didn't know is a huge turn off to women and doesn't really help with
" seducing a woman ".

RexTheOnion · 2021-10-21T08:53:21+00:00

True. These are the basic building blocks for anyone trying to be successful in dating/seduction. Unfortunately most people will ignore these, fail to take action, and continue to bombard dating subs with their misery and complaints.

dreameater42 · 2021-10-21T15:40:22+00:00

half the posts on this sub are just a narcissist spewing a load of crap

modidlee · 2021-10-21T15:59:00+00:00

I disagree. You don't have to "have your life together" to be interesting. Some people have their life together but their life revolves around work and that's all they talk about.

barryn13087 · 2021-10-21T16:00:09+00:00

You can gain experience at all levels, just because you lack in some areas doesn’t mean you won’t learn from practice. So you shouldn’t limit yourself think this is too high level.

2021-10-21T19:39:14+00:00

Theres plenty of worthless dudes who get laid all the time. It's your mindset ultimately. You can be a homeless hunchback and still have swagger

2021-10-21T19:11:38+00:00

I remember one time a very awkward young guy trying to hit on random girls in public. It was very cringe to see. He would have been better off just trying to improve his social skills instead of asking out random girls on the street.

hairykitty123 · 2021-10-21T17:15:49+00:00

im fine at conversing with randoms etc... hardest part for me is just having the courage to start that conversation and breaking the ice...

Hooosreddit · 2021-10-21T09:12:41+00:00

Also seduction is not completely necessary to do on a high level in order to maintain a healthy relationship

Not saying it's not a plus. Or that you don't have to also seduce your partner regularly. However with intent and familiarity this gets way easier with your partner compared to seducing random strangers

ringchef · 2021-10-21T18:06:56+00:00

Girls don't wanna be with a pick-up artist. They want to be with a cool and interesting guy with shit going on in his life.

greenray009 · 2021-10-21T13:22:38+00:00

or just be an extp.

oh wait this isnt an mbti subreddit

AntiqueShopping5832 · 2021-10-21T14:22:39+00:00

how to talkto a woman is what confuses me, how do you show interest, and know when shes ready to go for a kiss without being me too'ed

RedditTipiak · 2021-10-21T16:39:24+00:00

I think I will print this and stick it everywhere I look

GotThaAcid5tab · 2021-10-21T18:04:31+00:00

Im growing weary of this sub

decapitate_the_rich · 2021-10-21T17:28:35+00:00

I have realized this too and have backed off completely from trying to date over the last few weeks, deactivated my Tinder. At my age (40s) I doubt I have a chance of ever getting it. I need to put more effort into making enough money to move somewhere not so socially isolating, and then maybe I will have the ability to start working on my social skills consistently. But by the time I pull that off I will be 50. I need to accept that it is over, time ran out for me, I should unsubscribe from this sub.

LandscapeClear1630 · 2021-10-21T19:00:52+00:00

completly disagree

there are guys who their life is a total mess, they don't have friends and they just hook up with random girls to have a place to stay the night

I know this is a meme at this point, but I've seen it irl

and no, they are not particularly good looking.

Moikepdx · 2021-10-21T20:50:42+00:00

This is an interesting post, but I approach this issue from nearly the exact opposite direction. Taking the steps you listed will vastly improve your success with women. Accordingly, doing those things IS learning seduction. Sure, you can learn things from there that are more advanced, but an extremely high percentage of the advice on this subreddit is focused on getting your own life together, learning to be gregarious, learning to read social and body language cues, etc. These things benefit you physically, mentally, socially, financially, and ultimately sexually.

It doesn't make much sense to tell people not to come here to learn until AFTER they have mastered aspects that are commonly discussed on this subreddit.

TLDR: Lurk more?

jbo99 · 2021-10-21T22:44:35+00:00

This is 100% the correct answer. Seduction is an extension of general social skills and basic charisma. You master these things by first talking to the old lady in line next to you or the guy behind the counter. Get comfortable being yourself w strangers first

Sovereign1ne · 2021-10-22T01:05:37+00:00

I agree with this 110% guys! Learning seduction out of the gate is like trying to run as soon as you come out of your Mom's vagina. Its not going to happen. You have to learn base fundamentals first, then calibrate your Game as you implement new tactics into your arsenal. And I do mean arsenal, the dating pool is psychological warfare.

axe122 · 2021-10-22T02:17:58+00:00

Way to many people are trying to twist the having your life together part and making it like it’s subjective when realistically it’s not. Are you able to be independent on your own? You can definitely still get girls like this but the guys that do that will usually already have the skill down.
If you don’t have a place to take a girl how do you plan on seducing her? You can def seduce a girl and sleep with her in her car or at her place (if she has one which many don’t) but when your first starting out your already at a huge disadvantage and then your gonna add not having a place to bring her……

You should def work on a your seduction skills while your putting your life together. A lot of guys make that mistake of waiting until they have their whole life in order minus relationships and by then the girls have been in the game since they were like 13 having the guys who learned young talking to them. By the time the girl is 27 she’s got 14 years of experience with men and relationship dynamics over you……… a lot of guys will get stuck like this too, you gotta find some balance.

2021-10-22T02:55:07+00:00

I see your point, but most people will never get their lives together enough to develop "advanced" social skills. Predicating learning seduction on that is too much pressure. Let dudes learn how to say hi to pretty ladies, man.. =)

2021-10-22T03:15:07+00:00

100% agree. If you can't hold a conversation with a person you are not romantically interested in how the fuck can you hold a conversation with someone you wanna fuck you'll be all nervous and shit

bonebrithchugger · 2021-10-22T05:13:58+00:00

"And if you dont know how to make friends with a woman, she won't want to sleep with you." Wrong. Too simple. Actual friendship with a woman your age and in your social circle, dude. Those guys are in the friendzone; they're just not feeling it. In her mind she's pegged you as a possiblity or not so. If so, and she hangs out with you, she's not hanging out, she's waiting for you to get a move on. If not so, she's comfortable meeting her friends with you, hanging out with you, maybe changing a garment in front of you oh, of course she is, she has you under her control. Why wouldn't she like to show off her lackey to her friends? I doubt most of this is conscious most of the time, but these are the motivations. Few things appeal to a woman's narcissism more then the ability to control a male, IE, get something for him from him without sex. If she can get support (money or validation it doesn't matter. In their head it's just a blunt "I need") from a bunch of guys dumb enough to let her in their life without boundaries or standards of how they are to be treated, be her partial slaves, while she goes off and fucks the guy she likes, why wouldn't she? She doesn't understand her Primal motivations, so she'll probably come to you crying about what a jerk he is, but after you validate her and make her feel good about herself for a while, show us a picture of the same behavior. You're an emotional tampon, get out.

Crixusgannicus · 2021-10-22T05:58:30+00:00

1) That's excellent advice as far as overall life goals go and putting seduction into perspective.

2) That's total bullshit on the macro level. "Macro" means "the big picture" for those of you in Rio Linda.

Here's why:

You can be good at seduction "without having your shite together". Starting in HIGH SCHOOL. I was good at it before I even ever heard of what you might call "scientific" seduction or PUA or whatever you want to call it.

Who hell has there shite together in high school or at least the first couple of years at uni?

NO ONE!

Does that mean you cannot learn and benefit from the fine are of seduction "without having your shite together"?

Fuck no!

In fact, I say being a master (or at least skilled seducer) as early as possible can be maximally beneficial.

Here's why:

What is the number one thing on the mind of a ah...hmm when do guys hit puberty now. I started puberty at 13( including craving pussy) but with all the hormones in food now, who knows?

Anyway. The number one thing on a young feller's mind is not "getting your shite together", it is getting pussy.

Now, the easier it is to get pussy, the more you have time to devote your mind to "getting your shite together" and "keep your shite together" after you get it together.

Savvy?

mainag13 · 2021-10-22T17:39:44+00:00

I can confirm that is 100%. I need to work on my social skills as well as I am introverted. I will bookmark this. You need more awards for this post👏👏

2021-10-26T20:21:06+00:00

Twice now I've matched with girls on Tinder and have asked them out for this weekend. I understand its Halloween and people want to be social with friends but they keep trying to get me to do karaoke with their friend group or something else.

My impulse is that its going to be impossible to make moves on a girl in front of her friends because she'll feel self conscious. Is it worth going and if so how do I not just come across as platonic?

Not sure if I should bother.

wolfbee16 · 2021-11-15T05:04:45+00:00

I would add getting good at fun banter with anyone. Banter with women wherever I go is always fun and basically is practice sessions for me when it comes to seduction. See to me, banter is such a key attribute to my own success. Bantering with people you talk to for a bit never really is sexual at all, but mostly just me being cheerful and cracking jokes or something.

I think this is such an easy way to increase your success ten fold because seduction is mostly witty banter with ladies. If I’m not joking around with her, and vibing with her then I kinda get a feel for her right away as someone I don’t think I’ll vibe with. Throw in some flirtatious quips and KINO and your good. Practicing Banter will make conversations much more and lighthearted and enjoyable because of your vibe

sunkized · 2021-11-17T22:08:39+00:00

Yes! I would say I'm intermidate with normal socializing. I can talk with anyone, but I'm still working on my inner self. Finally having success though.

Title	[deleted by user]
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	696
Comments	84
Date	October 21, 2021 7:59 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/qcmra0/seduction_is_actually_high_level_if_you_dont_have/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/deleted-by-user.1273878 https://theredarchive.com/post/1273878

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