Need advice: good looking guy with ZERO self-confidence with women

Valor0us · 2017-08-25T15:19:23+00:00

Just from your post I feel like you're looking at seduction with too many guidelines to follow. Some women care more about looks, some less. There's no set percentage of what matters more to all women.

You should never look at women as objects. Look at them as fellow human beings (why does this even have to be stated?). If you want to get to know a fellow human being, you ask them out and talk to them. Find interests. Share stories. If your intent is to find a gf, make that apparent. If you want to just sleep with a woman, tell her that.

Escaping being a "nice guy" isn't becoming a dick. It's making sure that your intentions and thoughts line up with your actions. Be honest and be real. Women sense that and are attracted to that. If you're walking around hiding your intentions and your true self, you look like a creep and women will want nothing to do with you.

I was in your shoes not too long ago. It's a tough process. No more Mr nice guy is a great book to start getting in the right mindset. Good luck.

DavidGolani11 · 2017-08-25T14:43:57+00:00

Nothing wrong with being nice, your problem is you are "Nice", that syndrome where a man tries to use lies and subterfuge to get a woman to like him. You have to be honest about your interests in a woman and express that to them.

soliddrink · 2017-08-25T19:51:08+00:00

The secret to getting a woman is not caring (however, just being a non-caring guy, alone, gets you nothing, because you need to at least care about picking up a woman...heh). It is not so much about being confident, it is about being confident without caring that people may have an opinion. You can walk down the street with your chest pumped out, but it means nothing if you are looking left-and-right for approval. You need to walk down the street with your chest out as if you own the place. Big difference.

You obviously don't need tips on working out or getting dressed. But you need tips on your body language, little tricks to hook a girl, and proper confidence.

Moreover, you need to remember that women are looking for reasons to DISQUALIFY you. Simply, if you approach a girl and she is receptive to you and you can have some semblance of a conversation with smiles, you have qualified yourself to her. Then the game is not to get disqualified. Girls are very fickle and their emotions can change in a heartbeat. So...don't fuck up. The way we guys can sense a hot girl from a mile away is the same way a girl can sense the beta in you from a mile away. Keep in mind, those same things that she would disqualify you when you first meet are things she won't care about when you are in a relationship because, for a QUALITY girl, having a quality guy beats out any of your beliefs or habits. After some time together as a couple, feel free to fart it up, share some of your religious/political opinions, etc. But until that time, you need to be on your BEST game, even in the first few months of your relationship.

Tips:

Honestly, be 30+ years old. Women just subconsciously know when you are mature and you, as a man, don't start having real sexual market value until you hit 30. For women, their value hits its peak around 22-23 and falls off quick. If you are not 30, just be patient and use this time to gain experience.
Learn to lead...in a good way - not in a way that feminists will go apeshit on you. This means like...if you are asking a girl out on a date, have a place already in mind "Want to go out on Friday?" "Sure!" "OK, lets go to Place-XYZ at 8PM." "Cool!". Obviously they always say "women first" and "respect women", and you should, but my rule of thumb is this: if the girl is in unfamiliar territory, she is subconsciously expecting you to lead and guide her. If you are in her domain, or a mutually known domain, ladies first! Generally those first few dates will be YOUR domain, so lead appropriately.
Always hold your chest out when walking. It will eventually become common and you will be doing it without thinking.
When standing, learn contrapposto (Google it).
Learn how to angle yourself TOWARDS the girl, not away. (Only angle yourself away if you are trying to EXIT a conversation, not engage).
Maintain eye contact.
Talk slow and clear with a purposeful voice. Learn to stop saying the following words all the time: "ya know?", "like...", "um/uh...".
Stop interrupting her to be "fun" or "funny". Let her talk. Wait for her questions. Give ambiguous answers to the questions to make her think.
Learn where to put your hands when talking (not in your pockets). If you have a drink in your hand, dont bring the drink above your belly button unless you need a drink.
Learn to touch. Shoulder, arm, back. If you can't naturally touch her, then create fun REASONS to touch her. Make a comment about her hair and touch it. "I've gotta ask. Are these curls natural?" (while touching a curl of hers).
Learn female cues. This is a huge one. This one only comes via many interactions with girls. In the game of seduction poker, women are the worst players. We men are very adept at picking up their NEGATIVE cues (no smiles, angry look, closed arms, low voice), but we are horrible at picking up their POSITIVE ones. You will learn it over time. Some are more obvious than others. This won't make you any more or less attractive to a woman, since you are just analyzing a woman, but it will teach you when to seduce properly to not come off as soft or weak.

I went to a singles event once. Was talking with a girl who was really into me, so much so that she grabbed my hip extremely quick. I had no idea how strong of a cue that was (I mean I did know she was into me, and we did go on a date, but had I known then what I know now, I'm sure we would have ended up in bed that night). Another girl I met on a date at a bar during winter. By 30 minutes in, she was shedding clothing because she was getting so turned on by me. Off came the scarf, off came the jacket, off came the heavy sweater. She had to go to the bathroom to freshen up. We ended up in bed that night. When I firstttttt started dating (27), I met this girl for a date who was super into me. I had no experience. Thinking back though, I know if I had been a bit more...aggressive...we would have ended in bed. On the date she did so many things I misinterpreted. She touched my hair, my arm, my arm hair, told me I had bedroom eyes. Second date, she showed up super fine dressed, when she got in my car she got in a way to show off her thong to me on purpose. I went super beta (unbeknownst to me at the time) and she went super cold. Another girl...eh...I don't want to remember her. So hot, so easy, I was so inexperienced. Her cues were so overt it wasn't funny.

All these girls gave me pretty clear clues. But most girls are not that open to men (especially if you aren't attractive - I happen to be pretty attractive). In general though, you have to keep a closer eye on cues because they are subtle: lip bite, fix hair, finger to the mouth, play with hair, eyes of interest, smiling (the right kind), clothing adjustment, bashfulness (trust me this is the biggest one - big eyes, turning head away in embarrassment...I love this one), hesitation in her actions.

If you get to that second date, the biggest cue as to whether you are going to have a CHANCE at success is...how is she dressed? If normal, you are kinda screwed. To the 9's (or it looks like she put in a lot of effort to look good), you are in good. Your arousal will indicate to you the difference between normal and good. This one girl I went out with, I thought our first date was pretty OK. I didn't think there would be a second. But she accepted it, and goddamn she showed up dressed to the nines. Tight red dress, black stockings, high heel boots, makeup...and this was just to go to a bar and have a drink and play some billiards. I knew where it was headed.

Don't talk about: money, religion, politics, work, school
Don't ask a girl about her work or her school (boring shit)
Look, honestly, if you are getting a second date, one that was easy to get, you are pretty set - again, don't get disqualified. At that point it becomes your prerogative to be aggressive (not physically aggressive, just aggressive in a way that you imply your interest). Second date = she likes you, and you just need to dictate your interest. The hardest part and the most awkward part is of course the first kiss. The biggest mistake is to put the first kiss at the end of the date. The kiss at the end of the date should be at least your second kiss. What you need to do is make your first kiss sometime in the MIDDLE of the date, that way when you are parting at the end of the night it isn't awkward kiss to end the night, instead you are ending on a high note (not to mention the fact that it offers a chance at redemption for an shitty first kiss earlier). The EASIEST way to get painted as a "nice guy" is to do NOTHING on that second date. I've been there. Most guys do not get a third date on a failed second date. I've had multiple girls give me a third date where I also failed the third date (again, I was probably given a lifeline simply because I'm attractive). But most guys will not be so lucky. So...don't fail.

TL;DR: Confidence without caring of other peoples opinions. Learn female cues. Don't disqualify yourself. Be aggressive and lead when girls subconsciously want it.

DMZ_Dragon · 2017-08-25T15:20:54+00:00

You are stuck in the mindset that to get a girl to like you, you must show her you like to do things for her, talk to her and direct all your attention to only her.

This is counterproductive and is the root cause of the nice guy syndrome.

You need to stop doing that. Be selfish. You have your own life, and any woman should (before you get to know them and start to like them), be a small and insignificant part of it, something you could get rid of and be no worse for wear.

Stick to your own opinion, don't bend your standards for hers and don't invest more into a conversation than she does. You can talk about god knows what if you're enthusiastic about it. Even the Higgs-Boson particle can make a girl want you if you explain it right.

Be okay with the fact that you're perfectly fine off on your own. You simply choose to sometimes devote some of your valuable alone time to a girl. She should appreciate this valuable alone time. You're the one picking out the right girl for you, she isn't the one picking out the man. So in a way, yes, you should treat the act of picking up/getting to know a girl as a shopping trip: you're trying to find what's right for you, not pick up the first thing that you come across. Hammer in this mindset.

And women can be boring too. Don't fake interest if there is none. Never works.

Richardssss · 2017-08-25T14:39:44+00:00

Two books: 1. Way of the superior man - David Deida 2. No more mister nice guy - Robert A. Glover

DirkDieGurke · 2017-08-25T16:03:45+00:00

I know this may sound odd, but it may help to realize that women want you to approach, and women want you to be sexual towards them. You may have some attitudes that stifle you around women. Women like sex, and they appreciate it when you appreciate them. IMO.

ImJustSo · 2017-08-25T16:45:31+00:00

You could take a martial art, and it might help, especially something like Brazilian jiujitsu. All the guys I know that are into it are chill. Plus they get to roll with girls, too.

As far as how you should be treating women, you treat them however you feel like treating them, but the thing is that you're just being a shit head to the one person that's supposed to matter above all else: you.

Here's the thing, people that haven't figured it out yet don't realize you can get what you want and still be kind to others. You can be wholesome and stick to strong morals, etc. You just can't give over your agency to others. It's impossible to make impartial and fair judgements about others if you can't even make those fair judgements for yourself.

Stop being a jerk to yourself, because you're not really a nice guy otherwise.

eenergabeener · 2017-08-25T16:54:28+00:00

What are you passionate about? What do you enjoy doing and talking about? Talk to women about these things. Ask her questions about herself. Compliment her outfit, purse, hair, shoes, ect. Above all, have your own life and activities going on. Plan things, organize fun events with your friends. Become a leader in your social group.

What do you give to your friends and to other people? What do you have to offer people? Are you an empathetic listener? Do you give good advice? Do you plan things and include others?

Think about what you have to offer a woman. But it can start by what you offer other people in general.

jerema · 2017-08-25T22:36:58+00:00

I think me and you are very similar in this regard. I am going to assume you're not really a fighter type. What helps me be more "alpha" is engaging in physical contact sports like BJJ, wrestling or whatever, even hot yoga does wonders. Bonus question: is your posture perfect? Plus, saying what I actually think, helps to keep conversation more entertaining. Throw in jokes that are borderline inappropriate (but not insulting or whatever). No edits, for the most part. Don't try to figure out what you should say or they want to hear. Just be in the moment. Try to have fun. Go out with friends and just let loose, and in the process, invite others to have fun too.

TheSurge11 · 2017-08-25T23:18:41+00:00

Just read or listen to the audiobook The Art of Seduction by Robert Greene. Only by developing a deeper understanding of the mastery of seduction will you be able to get any confidence to seduce any person you'd like, as well as releasing all anxieties that are the sole thing that is in between you and your desires.It did wonders for me! audiobookbay is the way to go.

OpMan91 · 2017-08-25T23:31:41+00:00

Ima tell you what I tell all my friends. They always ask me. How does someone who looks like tom cruise have trouble getting girls? I tell them I'm not Tom Cruise I don't have his money or social status. That's all you need, money or status and you can get almost any girl you want. Good looks just make it's more enjoyable for the girl. She gets her successful man regardless and he's good looking.

FALLENV3GAS · 2017-08-25T23:54:47+00:00

So confidence is key to women and general life. You want to get confidence? Pretend like you are confident. Seriously. Now before you are thinking that does not work, I was quite uncomfortable and unconfident till I just acted as I was. Then I began to be confident. Somewhat like a placebo effect. Also look it like this - they say no and what, you move on. Or they say Yes and you end up with someone for life? Easy choice.

insert___here · 2017-08-26T00:22:46+00:00

I had absolutely no idea how to talk to women up until a couple years ago. I had all guy friends, all guy acquaintances and I all guy coworkers. Then I started a new job. Where I was the only guy working with 15 women. Within 2 weeks I realized how wrong I was about women and how to really talk to them. The first thing you have to realize is that you're probably not going to be attracted 70-90% of women, so why would you ever treat them differently. They're just people. No sexual agenda. Just be normal. Now for the other 10-30%; you need to treat them exactly the same as everyone else but here's the tricky part: make your intentions known as quickly as possible. When women say you're too nice, generally they mean you're not being forward enough. "Youre too nice" is the nice way of saying you're not being assertive. That turns women off. Be forward, be affectionate but don't be disrespectful. Objectifying women is NEVER OKAY. there are two interpretations to that. Women are not objects. You can't try to obtain them and you can't covet them as such. Just be yourself. It's impossible to found a good relationship on a fake personality. For the right person, you are perfect. Exploit that, not people. Find her by being yourself.

Zoidberg22 · 2017-08-26T00:58:49+00:00

I'm not as good looking as this guy, but I'm above average by a small bit and my problem is how to not be the platonic bend. Every single time I'm talk to a girl I am interested in and it's not on a dating site, I forget that I'm interested sexually. I can do small compliments but opening up sexually to her is hard for me to do in person. My problems worse as I can approach a girl, talk to her but then never close that well since she never thinks of me sexually. Just take more risks myself included.

ack567 · 2017-08-26T02:36:38+00:00

OP, I'm just barely starting to get over this issue...at 30. You just have to be honest and comfortable with yourself. I know...much easier said than done.

Think of it like this: What can you "offer" her?

For myself I was a former rescue swimmer in the navy, I'm a fairly devout Catholic with a solid moral and charitable background. I've been through depression, body image issues, and other problems before. I'm financially stable, know how to cook, and am currently raising a puppy.

I use these qualities I know of myself to find my own confidence, and it's been working very well.

bbhatti12 · 2017-08-28T12:22:03+00:00

To pretty much add to the echo chamber, I am/was exactly you. Just be friends with everyone, and you'd be amazed at how much more people are going to want to hang out with you.

Being friendly and not treating women like objects is actually a quality trait, and it gets people to like you for you. When you are fun to hang out with in general, it makes it easier for people wanting to hang out with you.

Women are just men with boobs and a vagina. Treat them as a human, and you would be surprised how good the results are. I learned this late into my college years, and when you treat everyone with kindness women would be more amicable to want to hang out with you.

When you are friendly with someone even in a superficial status, it is much easier to hit them up with a text and say "Hey, there is "x" going on and I know you are into "x". Do you want to join me in "x"?"

boodie1961 · 2017-11-19T12:30:59+00:00

The best / worst advice is find your way, by trial and error. Worst, because "just be yourself" is the typical female advice to guys and it's too vague, plus exposing vulnerabilities to women is the worst thing to do. The issue here is to develop (or better said "discover") a style of interaction that suits your personality. Being rough and rude suits the macho "outlaw" type, but is this you? The cultivated and brainy interaction fits the "intellectual" type. Chances are that the girl attracted to the brute will not be attracted to the intellectual and there is no point trying to change their tastes. Do you have hobbies? These will characterize you more than anything. I did martial arts for years and years. Martial arts (the real ones) are fine arts for the body and the mind, they require commitment, time, concentration ... they are not a mean to transform you into an alpha stud of some sort, just to get chicks. A musical instrument works the same, so does DIY, any sport, singing in a choir, rock climbing and so on. How old are you? Are you still studying? I started being attractive as soon as I finished uni and got a job, mainly because this gave me confidence. Being economically self sufficient is very important. I suggest, and this is shared opinion that a hobby, a sport or a regular gym routine are important things to cultivate. Finally: forget about seduction tips & tricks, invest in yourself, intimacy with women must not be a goal, but a byproduct of your self investment in your happy future.

orezavi · 2017-08-25T20:05:28+00:00

I can talk with men endlessly, but I can't small-talk with women.

Talk to women like they are men. Watch the difference and the ease. Flirt cautiously along the way. Should help with confidence.

firewireflow · 2017-08-25T16:49:44+00:00

Read Models! Changed my life

HasALittleFaith · 2017-08-26T06:03:59+00:00

No photos to back it up ?? boo.

rickrossroll · 2017-08-25T23:41:59+00:00

Download tinder. Swipe girls. Talk to them like you would guys, and work your way up to a cold one. Women are humans like everyone else. Get a backbone and treat them like you would your male friends.

Shipcake · 2017-08-25T19:19:12+00:00

Imagine them blowing you as you're talking to them, or them tweaking kn your dick.

Lift heavy

Tdlr stop being gay

Estrogenoxygen · 2017-08-25T16:21:22+00:00

force yourself to talk to every single women you encounter everywhere, get way out of your comfort zone. You're deep in your own comfort zone. Learn some cheesy pick up artist stuff. Work on yourself. Shoot for little wins. It'd say its more like 95% confidence and swag and only 5% looks. Your looks won't hurt but they defiantly won't help either. it's kinda like the icing on the cake but women care way more about confidence and how you handle yourself around other men and at work and stuff.

pohudwer38 · 2017-08-25T16:39:58+00:00

who exactly told you were good-looking? 60 year old lady at work? if you were really good looking you would not have any problem whatsoever with women.

if you had problems talking, the women would keep the conversation going no matter what stupid crap you would say...

clearly, you disgust them.

Title	Need advice: good looking guy with ZERO self-confidence with women
Author	jensen100
Upvotes	101
Comments	60
Date	August 25, 2017 12:51 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/6vy7ss/need_advice_good_looking_guy_with_zero/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/need-advice-good-looking-guy-with-zero-self.1432582 https://theredarchive.com/post/1432582

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