Feminist decries the use of DNA testing

maynardjk · 2010-11-09T02:33:01+00:00

I feel dumber just for reading that.

nlakes · 2010-11-09T01:50:53+00:00

The author of that article is a horrible, horrible person.

neofool · 2010-11-09T01:45:41+00:00

But in making paternity conditional on a test rather than the say-so of the mother, it has removed from women a powerful instrument of choice.

One cannot choose their own facts. It's as if I was to say that our 43rd president was Ralph Nader. It's not true but trying to say that one person's belief can change reality requires a huge amount of delusion.

That being said choosing the father of the child should have occurred before the pregnancy not after the birth.

charleycoyote · 2010-11-09T02:01:17+00:00

She says the DNA test has relieved men of their "moral obligation." How delusional do you have to be to make that statement in an article being published for general circulation.

It is not a matter of choice for the mother. The child, if anointed the prodigy of the wrong father, presents an incorrect medical history his/her entire life. They patronize the wrong lineage, never meet their actual relatives. God forbid they ever actually need a kidney.

I can't get my head around how someone's beliefs, essentially political in nature, kill off any sense of logic or "moral obligation."

zshe41 · 2010-11-09T00:52:01+00:00

Putting the generalization aside,

She wants to have the power to pick innocent guy as the dad of her children (child support as well)?

REALLYhappyme · 2010-11-09T02:47:39+00:00

This crazy person makes it seem that women shouldn't be held to the basic standards of human ethics because they have been historically oppressed. Men, I don't know how you put up with this crap. I am a woman and I feel like men have endured an unreal amount of bullshit since women's lib. Why is it someone has to lose for another group to not be on the bottom wrungs. The goal never really seems to be about equality, it is only recycling of the upper hand. I love good people and scummy ones should be slapped. End of story.

ordinaryrendition · 2010-11-09T02:27:07+00:00

Disregard this female

Acquire logic

Salahdin · 2010-11-09T03:02:51+00:00

I can't tell if this is witty satire or genuine crazy.

SarahC · 2010-11-09T05:56:13+00:00

It has health concerns too!

If a doctor asks if heart attacks run in your family - how can you answer accurately if you don't know who your genetic farther is?

serume · 2010-11-09T08:46:03+00:00

If raising your biological child isn't important, why not just have a raffle in the maternity ward? You get to bring a baby home (2 if you had twins), but you won't know who provided the genetic material for said baby.

DutchUncle · 2010-11-09T09:03:38+00:00

[permanently deleted]

2010-11-09T09:12:03+00:00

Many men have, of course, ended up raising children who were not genetically their own, but really, does it matter?

My head exploded.

Thirsty101 · 2010-11-09T12:48:18+00:00

This is a long but very thorough analysis and critique of this article. I only wrote it because the article was so infuriating. It is too complicated for a TLDR , so if you don’t read it your loss.

“For the entire course of human history, men have nursed profound, troubling doubts about the fundamental question of whether or not they were fathers to their own children; women, by contrast, usually enjoyed a reasonable level of certainty about the matter.”

And what a great thing this is, the ability to provide reassurance and to remove these fundamental and troubling doubts that some men have that will undermine the relationship and could lead to deep emotional unhappiness and the breakdown of the family unit. If these were doubts that affected women the author, the author would be a great supporter of paternity tests. Her opposition to them and her callous disregard for the rights and emotions of men reveal her misandry.

“At a stroke, the one thing that women had going for them has been taken away, the one respect in which they had the last laugh over their husbands and lovers.”

Yes before women were always certain that the kid was theirs’ and had the ability to lie to a man if she so wanted. The man would then be a cuckold, tricked into supporting offspring that was not his, possibly even forced into maintain a loveless and inherently deceitful relationship. Also note the use of the word “laugh”, her portrayal of how it was good and even useful for women to be able to mockingly deceive men and trick them into financially and emotionally supporting other people’s children does nothing but tarnish the nature of women and again show her hatred of men.

“...he asked for a DNA test; it duly turned out that he was not, after all, the father. Poor child.”

I sympathise with the child, it’s not his or her fault and it must be emotionally devastating and destabilising to meet the man you think that is your father only to have that later ripped away from you. We cannot know whether the mother genuinely believed that the TV host was the father or simply saw him as a free and convenient ATM that she could exploit. However unlike the author of the article, i would say, poor child, poor man. Ignoring the financial exploitation for a minute, what of his emotions, his feelings of loss? He was led to believe that he had a child and when he finally meets the child he discovers that he is not the father and has been lied to, emotionally blackmailed and financially exploited for all these years.

“The actor Jude Law recently found himself in just this position, and unhesitatingly and ungallantly demanded a DNA test.”

“Ungallantly”, here we see that she is not a gender egalitarian, as were the feminists of old. Instead she desires chivalry and gallant behaviour of men, some sort of special treatment for women for simply being women. This kind of best of both worlds thinking is a highly flawed approach that has infected some areas of modern feminism. It reduces women to less than men, by suggesting that men should make allowances for women because they are women. It actually demeans women by insinuating that they are less capable then men of being a fully functioning member of, and equal participants in society. It suggests that they should be dealt with as emotionally and intellectually weaker.

“By contrast, the old situation, in which women presented men with a child, and the man either did the decent thing and offered support, or made a run for it, allowed women a certain leeway”

This is one of the more stupid comments in this article though it was hard to distinguish because the article itself is so very unintelligent. This nostalgia for an idealised past, that never existed, appears everywhere in modern thought. In the hypothetical she presents, the woman informs the man she is pregnant and that he is the father and either he supports the child or he does not. Somehow this provides the woman with more options and “leeway”. Obviously this is not the case; the days before the mandatory child support system were in no way more advantageous to woman. Only a person truly ignorant of history could suggest this. Regardless of the many flaws in the current system of child support, (of which there are many), it is clear that women are better off, as are the children.

“Many men have, of course, ended up raising children who were not genetically their own, but really, does it matter? You can feel quite as much tenderness for a child you mistakenly think to be yours as for one who is.”

“But really, does it matter?” Here is the problem, the author and many feminists who have expressed this depressingly common argument against paternity tests seem to miss the point. Yes it matters, why, because a child is an investment in the future, there is no greater legacy. Why do we as a society not expect people to put the same efforts, both emotionally and financially towards other people children? The answer is, that it’s not your legacy it’s not your investment in the future of our species. “You can feel quite as much tenderness for a child you mistakenly think to be yours as for one who is”. Yes, you can, adoption is a very noble thing, something that I have coincided doing it the future myself. Giving a loving home to an abandoned child is selfless and kind, the key difference between adoption and paternity fraud is choice. The choice of a man, of course the author does not care about men and cares even less about their rights to choose.

“But in making paternity conditional on a test rather than the say-so of the mother, it has removed from women a powerful instrument of choice. I’m not sure that many people are much happier for it.”

Paternity testing should be either on the say so of the father, if it is it should be confidential, or it should be mandatory. The idea that the father should not get a say is sickeningly offensive. It has only removed the ability of women to deceive men, when men use fraud to get sex from women it is called rape, when women use fraud to emotionally blackmail and financially exploit men it’s called “a powerful instrument of choice”. The only people who are not so happy about this development are women who have been caught out as cheaters and radical man hating feminists.

dskoziol · 2010-11-09T03:48:46+00:00

Well, at least it makes me feel good to scan through the comments on that article. Men and women alike seem unanimously opposed to what the author was trying to say.

pahncrd · 2010-11-09T03:58:34+00:00

I completely believe that it would be fair for every child to be paternity tested by default as a preventative health measure (and since so much fraud by women exists). Seriously, I hate these women who want to commit fraud and relegate a man to slavery for the next couple of decades when he is not even able to pass on his own blood.

People can argue that genetic relation doesn't matter, but why not just pick a man at random then? This attitude wreaks of whorish entitlement. It is the idea that a woman shouldn't be held accountable for committing one of the worst crimes that she can victimize a trusting and kind father with.

I love looking at my children and seeing myself and my wife in them in a tangible manner. It is incredible to see my true family blood line going back to the beginning of time and forward into the unknown future. Blood isn't everything, but it is still important. It is the bond that exists forever as long as life exists. A man should have the express choice as to whether he cares about that or not, not the choice of some entitled female that cannot control her amygdala.

It is not anyones right to deny a man the knowledge of the paternity of what is potentially his child. It needs to be up to him whether he wants to spend the next two decades in time and an absolutely insane amount of resources raising the child of some Lothario.

crocodile7 · 2010-11-09T08:29:16+00:00

DNA testing can cut both ways.

Why would a man automatically accept a child as his, and be obliged to pay child support, just on the woman's say-so that the child is his? Even in a stable relationship, she could have easily cheated.

If we discard DNA testing as a tool, why wouldn't the man's say-so ("child is not mine") be sufficient to get him out of all paternal obligations?

The author is counting on the man's sense of honor and duty to pay for an unverified claim.

I think it's only fair that:

All paternity / child support claims require paternity testing.
If woman makes the claim, the father is required to consent to such testing.

Trillian_Astra · 2010-11-09T05:35:07+00:00

I'm a girl, and this article makes me want to punch someone. Truth isn't something you choose.

PukeHammer · 2010-11-09T03:45:07+00:00

Sickening. I don't want to believe she's serious.

ex_ample · 2010-11-09T09:55:15+00:00

Sometimes people are like the worst parodies of what they represent.

SquareWheel · 2010-11-09T03:09:43+00:00

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Oh good, now I know the site is fair and balanced.

2010-11-09T06:09:24+00:00

Now, a cotton-wool swab with a bit of saliva, plus a small fee, less than £200, can settle the matter. At a stroke, the one thing that women had going for them has been taken away

wat

cmykify · 2010-11-09T08:35:35+00:00

Defending the right to choose who the father is. Great.

cpolito87 · 2010-11-09T00:55:43+00:00

Wasn't this on the front page like... a week ago? Also this is just one woman's opinion. Most of the women over at r/feminism also thought this author was pretty much completely wrong.

philipkd · 2010-11-09T06:05:40+00:00

Is this satire?

2010-11-09T08:54:28+00:00

Someone needa take this bitch on Maury!

HerbalEssence · 2010-11-09T03:30:11+00:00

I think all men should DNA test their newborns. Women in this day and age no longer deserve the benefit of the doubt.

wanna_dance · 2010-11-09T05:58:16+00:00

the impact a DNA paternity test can have: ‘The result can be shattering, leading to divorce, marital violence, mental health difficulties for all parties including the children.’

Hopefully only for the current generation who didn't have the benefit of DNA testing that we do now. Kinda sucks for them, sure, but isn't the point that testing would save future generations of this kind of bullshit?

At a stroke, the one thing that women had going for them has been taken away, the one respect in which they had the last laugh over their husbands and lovers.

I think I'd prefer other things, like equality and respect. The ability to treat my husband/lover as a second-class citizen because I'm withholding information does not appeal to me at all. Friends don't let friends act like assholes.

frickendevil · 2010-11-09T07:03:36+00:00

It really empowers women, gives them the proof that the man is the father, and then if he doesn't want to support it, he is undoubtedly in the moral grey zone.

FreddyDeus · 2010-11-09T14:05:30+00:00

DNA tests are an anti-feminist appliance of science, a change in the balance of power between the sexes...

This is absolutely true. DNA tests relieve women of the power to destroy a man's life, aspirations, ambitions and options. It relieves women of the power to force a man into 18 years of financial servitude. It relieves women of the power to force men into lifelong commitments to women they do not want to be with. It relieves women of the power to divorce the man she forced into marriage and denies her the subsequent benefits of alimony and child-support, while the 'father' rarely if ever gets to see 'his' child again.

2010-11-09T02:41:09+00:00

So she's angry because truth become the enemy of whores? That's just hilarious. Anyway, I'm sure most woman and feminists will agree that she's a crazy in her period.

bcguitar33 · 2010-11-09T17:26:13+00:00

The most logically offensive part to me was the quote blaming paternity tests for the onset of problems: ‘The result can be shattering, leading to divorce, marital violence, mental health difficulties for all parties including the children.’

Really? The fact that the mother lied in the first place wasn't the cause of this problem? If a man murders somebody, and then the police tear him away from his family to arrest him, do we blame the murder for shattering his family life or the police?

FreddyDeus · 2010-11-09T00:04:32+00:00

This article is illustrative of the feminist state of mind. They don't care about logic, fairness or equality. It's always me, me, me. When the balance of power shifts, it must always be for the benefit of the womyn and to the detriment of men. Anything else is myosginistic anti-feminism. "Justice" is how woman feels it's just. Man is duped into raising a child that is not his own? He should be grateful that a womyn blessed him with an opportunity to enjoy fatherhood!

When girls were underrepresented at colleges it was due to "class oppression" and "unequal opportunity". Now that the boys are being underrepresented with a falling trend in the last few decedes - there is no problem for feminists. When millions of men lost jobs in the 2007-2009 crisis in the manufacturing and construction - something that even got it's own name due to heavy gender bias: "mancession" - nobody was bothered in the feminist circles. But when the government stimulus $$$ get allocated fembots are the first to notice that it's not distributed "in the spirit of equality" sex-wise, favoring real industry and not the female-friendly jobs in the public sector. And so on in a myriad of other similar cases.

The picture that emerges is that we're dealing with selfish, short-sighted creatures that have no logic, honor or sense of morality. Feminism is a cancer to the society, one that is parasitically sucking blood out of producitive forces and continually entrenching itself with ever-rising number of privileges for its supporters.

FaultyLogik · 2010-11-09T05:59:20+00:00

This woman is the epitome of a Feminist. By Feminist I mean someone who is geared toward the accrual of "rights" for women (read: status and power) rather than the goal of equality. There's no doubt that there is inequality in the world, and the funny thing is: it all comes from the same basic place in all of us. It comes from our natural instinct to form groups we identify with and protect that group. Therein lies the impossibility of the statement "All men (and woman) are created equal":

"When you call yourself an Indian or a Muslim or a Christian or a European, or anything else, you are being violent. Do you see why it is violent? It is because you are separating yourself from the rest of mankind. When you separate yourself by belief, by nationality, by tradition, it breeds violence. So a man who is seeking to understand violence does not belong to any country, to any religion, to any political party or partial system; he is concerned with the total understanding of mankind. -- J. Krishnamurthi

Woman's rights will never work so long as there are women like this propagating the belief of "Feminism"; the "us against them mentality" makes it impossible to gain true equality.

It can be necessary for a specific group to form to gain initial impact in the movement for equality, this is proven by looking back at history; however after that initial point it is essential to transition to a universal approach to gain actual progress. I dont know why we cant just rename every activist group egalitarians...

Khathaar · 2010-11-09T10:17:44+00:00

That woman is fucking insane.

ima_coder · 2010-11-09T11:18:17+00:00

The truth is never the problem, only what you do with it.

tehnico · 2010-11-09T12:54:23+00:00

That's the dumbest thing I'll read all week.

ConfirmedCynic · 2010-11-09T15:06:32+00:00

Bottom line: feminists are pushing for:

Women does whatever she wants, immoral and irresponsible or not.

Men pay.

Ais3 · 2010-11-09T09:57:45+00:00

I tought of something else than Bridget Jones when she shortened it to BJ.

justaverage · 2010-11-09T16:03:44+00:00

In all complete honesty, I just threw up

Peritract · 2010-11-09T16:23:56+00:00

I didn't read this past the first few sentences, because I can't understand how DNA testing is a bad thing and how she could argue against it .

Can anyone tell me if she actually makes any points, regardless of their validity, or does she just spew hatred?

zouhair · 2010-11-09T16:28:58+00:00

This is just trolling.

ExistentialEnso · 2010-11-09T18:49:35+00:00

If it doesn't matter if biologically it's your own kid, why not do maternity wards all Yankee Swap Christmas style. It'll be fun! And break racial barriers and shit.

You might not come home with YOUR kid, but that doesn't matter, right?

Krase · 2010-11-09T20:39:26+00:00

Since when is truth an option? I didn't know it was something we could choose.

knitram · 2010-11-09T21:32:30+00:00

We rush to put this type of article on here to make feminists as a whole look bad. there are outliers in groups.

macdunc · 2010-11-09T21:55:33+00:00

DNA testing... well thats only the start.

Roll on the male pill.....

HerbalEssence · 2010-11-10T00:31:48+00:00

This is actually a good question we could ask women to sort out the nutjobs from the decent ones: Do you believe that paternity testing should be mandatory? If not, why not?

InfusedTea · 2010-11-09T04:31:57+00:00

While, as most people here have rightly pointed out, she is an idiot, I thought that at the end she did make one point worth considering.

Many men have, of course, ended up raising children who were not >genetically their own, but really, does it matter? You can feel quite as much tenderness for a child you mistakenly think to be yours as for one who is

I agree that for couples that are married with children, it is best if the child is raised in a single home with loving parents, even if the women at some point was unfaithful. Better to ignore that than to ruin the child's life. And since the man would be with the woman anyway, it isn't unjust in the same way roping a non-related man into a child support arrangement (which is what this author seemed to be advocating for most of the article. which is stupid)

SwampySoccerField · 2010-11-09T05:46:15+00:00

Stupid $&!# My Feminist Dad Says

FreddyDeus · 2010-11-09T14:44:18+00:00

This is one of my 'favourite' comments:

I don't see the big deal. How else can you get a bloke to hang around and give you a chance to live your own life and not just be a mummy. Women are at a distinct disadvantage because they get stuck with the main consequences of pleasure and passion. It is unfair that Father Nature is such a misogynist and forces us to make up constraints like marriage, fidelity, chastity, and all that customary conceit just to get men to grant women some basis of commonality, partnership, and equal trust with them so we can fool around without paying for it like they can if they don't buy into society's lies about sexual honor and decency. Until wombs can be safely removed and cared for by science, we have to keep men in line and held to a standard of responsibility by which the rightful Priestesses of Gaia can judge them. I say take what you can for now, girls, while he's still blind to the truth. Once we free them from this burden they will run wild and only cause trouble for everyone. There is no other option, for now.

2010-11-09T15:43:30+00:00

I'm a feminist and this bitch be crazy.

jay76 · 2010-11-09T03:33:54+00:00

Fucking women.

Title	Feminist decries the use of DNA testing
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	170
Comments	172
Date	November 8, 2010 11:41 PM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/e3687/feminist_decries_the_use_of_dna_testing/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/feminist-decries-the-use-of-dna-testing.1046107 https://theredarchive.com/post/1046107

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