Toxic femininity?

Sharpie_Nomad · 2022-09-29T12:29:09+00:00

Gossip, slutshaming, and cancel culture. I work in a field with mostly women, with usually no problem most of the time. The level of petty drama that gets in the way of good work dynamics is astounding. I don't care if Karen wears a dress that is a bit risque for her age. She looks cute, and the last thing I give a fuck about is their dress (obviously corporate will care about dress code). I care that she works well with my team and is a good person.

And don't get me started on the constant power-trips between women wanting to be the "alpha boss bitch" in a corporate or office environment. Men USED to be that way, but that era is largely over I feel. Most of us are WAY too simpleminded to do anything other than clock in, do our thing, clock out, and get the fuck away from work.

IronJohnMRA · 2022-09-29T18:23:49+00:00

Let's just drop "toxic masculinity" and "toxic femininity" and just call assholes assholes.

IoSonCalaf · 2022-09-29T12:49:37+00:00

Wanting equality AND special treatment. Bitchsplaining. Using their gender to their advantage to get things from men.

Raining_Hope · 2022-09-29T12:55:37+00:00

I think a toxic side exists in how they communicate, and how good they can be at subtle or not so subtle jabs. But they do it so often as a whole that they are also more aware of it when it's done so it can just feed on "I can't believe she said ____," while at the same time saying similar things about the other woman.

Jmcb23 · 2022-09-29T12:40:27+00:00

The biggest one to me is probably how woman are "allowed" to hit men but men can't hit back

MicrosoftOSX · 2022-09-29T13:01:45+00:00

there is only toxic personality trait. using feminity and masculinity to categorise toxic behaviour is problematic. Whoever started this phrase has yet to define what is masculinity and what is femininity? Without clear definition, masculinity and femininity will be a reference to the "gender" they derive from. Is there inherit biological difference between male and female? If so do those physical differences affect our behaviour? Does that mean making assumption based on sex is justifiable?

The most important thing here is actually why the phrase "toxic masculinity". In an academic env. they well tell you its a phrase for toxic behaviour that are seen as masculine. In reality when being used, it actually means masculinity is toxic. It is a very clever way to pollute our minds using grammar. These people love to emphasize on the problem behind phrases/vocabularies those implied a specific gender or sex. Why didn't they just call it toxic trait?

I do not like identity modifiers for the word toxic but at this point it is inevitable. We should start using toxic femininity to neutralise the damage done by the phrase toxic personality. It is a prisoners dilemma we cant escape unless miracle happens.

Rod-Molina · 2022-09-29T13:10:22+00:00

Yelling to get your way.

leroy2007 · 2022-09-29T15:01:24+00:00

The thing that bothers me the most about toxic women is that they’re never held accountable for their actions. It’s as if women are beyond reproach.

orione16 · 2022-09-29T14:58:34+00:00

Man-bashing "because they can" with no fear of comeback. Women believing they are entitled to the best of treatment regardless. Saying whatever they want with no regard for others. Banging on about oppression and misogyny at every opportunity.

Some of these would be toxic whoever is doing it, but it seems to only be women doing it.

heeroena · 2022-09-29T12:58:47+00:00

there is no such thing as toxic masculinity

pomegranate2012 · 2022-09-29T13:53:29+00:00

Women see themselves as being in competition with all other women. And that means that pretty women make them feel ugly in comparison. So, they'll tell slim women they are 'too skinny' or make catty comments about any woman who is younger, slimmer, more attractive. In fact, some women are so insecure they even don't like to compete with a drawing! Feminists complain about cartoons, computer game characters, dolls - they can't deal with the competition. That's just insecurity though. It's when they attack other women for their appearance that you have toxic femininity. As well as cattyness let's add passive aggression, talking about someone behind their back and gossiping. Those are very female qualities that are toxic and mostly directed at other women. If there is a social problem in an office, there's almost always a woman behind it.

Policing women's bodies and telling women what they should do with them is also something only women do. So, if someone shames a woman for breastfeeding that will be another woman. If someone sends hate mail to a female TV presenter for being too fat, or too skinny - that will be a woman.

There's a kind of bossiness that certain women have. If someone calls a child 'bossy boots', it's usually a girl. I think it's a motherly urge with no outlet so they have to find people to tell what to do. I suppose men do this as well to some extent, so I won't add it to my list.

Then of course there is Karening. Women go through their whole life without the threat of violence. If a man goes up to a group of strangers and stirs up trouble for their own personal enjoyment then he risks getting his ass kicked! Karens exist because these women love creating drama and are allowed to get away with it. I'm not going to add that to my list though, because I'm a bit bored of anyone being called a Karen.

Oh and racism. Women are more racist than men and less likely to date outside their race. If you've never exprienced this, wait until you see a white woman react to a white man dating an Asian woman! That's not UNIQUELY female, however. If someone complains about a mixed race couple, there's a 90% chance it's a woman, but not 100% so I won't add it to my list.

What I have so far is:

Tearing down other women for their appearance
Policing women's bodies
Two facedness
Cattyness
Passive aggression
Gossiping

lurker-burner · 2022-09-29T13:38:27+00:00

Narcissistic Compassion - credit Jordan Peterson

crz8956 · 2022-09-29T12:35:58+00:00

So huge internalized and nor acknowledged misoginy, that a patient needs constant reaffirmation and appreciation, that, while she happened to be women, she is still okay.

And no, this time it is not sarcasm.

If you look on feminist community form that POV, you will be surprised. Looks like people in the West "cured" (if we assume it was a thing evem) men from mysoginiy, but completely forgotten about fairer sex.

Your_Agenda_Sucks · 2022-09-29T17:58:02+00:00

It's a bad idea to try and coin this term for the same reasons it was ridiculous to start using "toxic masculinity". The terms mean nothing other than "I don't like this thing right here"

NeoNotNeo · 2022-09-30T01:02:12+00:00

Virtually every slander of feminism against men is a transference mechanism.

Femininity is far more toxic than masculinity

Men suffer emotional labor as much if not more than women ( have you dealt with women??)

Gender wage gap proves women are not joining men in the work force as equals, not that employers are paying them less Etc etc etc

Input_output_error · 2022-09-29T12:49:00+00:00

They have it, but just don't call it 'toxic femininity' but 'internalized misogyny', it's batshit crazy of course, but that has never stopped feminism before.

secret_tiger101 · 2022-09-30T00:08:14+00:00

Hitting men. Mocking men based on physical characteristics (phallus length, height, waist size). Assumption men cannot undertake parental role.

parahacker · 2022-09-29T13:41:48+00:00

None.

I think it's a horrible idea to validate the term 'toxic masculinity' by trying to flip the script. The phrase needs to die, and we need a unified front on that to make it happen.

RocketCat287 · 2022-09-29T18:21:54+00:00

Weaponised damsel in distress complex…some women will always be in trouble, or will always be the victim- especially if they’ve done something wrong but don’t want to face responsibilities. Case in point, my cousin got arrested for drunk driving, but it wasn’t her fault of course! It was all because she was having a panic attack and had to leave the party immediately (regardless of the fact she’d been shown to drink drive almost every time she went out). I feel lots of women pray on men’s (and other women’s) desire to help and protect others, this way they get extra attention and control by always being in need of help/ support/ sympathy.

Longjumping_Joke_751 · 2022-09-29T19:43:01+00:00

How they shame women who want the traditional nuclear family.

Altruistic-Cat-4193 · 2022-09-29T20:20:17+00:00

Current 4th wave feminism

Drougen · 2022-09-29T16:46:18+00:00

Women are blatantly more toxic than men, that's why they had to make up terms like toxic masculinity to project, it helps them justify their own toxicity.

GltyUntlPrvnInncnt · 2022-09-29T17:29:00+00:00

There is no toxic masculinity or femininity. Just harmful gender expectations. Feminists like to use toxic masculinity to shame men. And they also deny the existence of harmful gender roles for women.

PugnaciousBart · 2022-09-29T17:30:46+00:00

What is toxic femininity other than woke feminism

cedal_lito · 2022-09-29T19:00:05+00:00

Aside from what others here have said, one example of toxic femininity I deal with all the time is in dating. Women can be cruel, disrespectful and/or very ambiguous when rejecting someone and they get away easily with it. Getting a normal rejection, just something like "I'm not interested", is extremely rare.

Amazing-Bit6140 · 2022-09-29T19:34:29+00:00

Women gossiping about men.

Men's vulnerabilities, secrets, hopes, dreams, equipment. All reduced to entertainment for a woman's social group.

This is sexual harassment that women have convinced themselves is just find to do because the target is male.

Normal-Yogurtcloset5 · 2022-09-29T19:16:35+00:00

Working with predominantly women is hell. They form cliques like they’re still in junior high school. They also encourage bad eating habits. They get excited like my dogs when there’s food around and they put on pounds claiming that they’re “thick”. But, if one of the women starts eating healthy and exercising they turn on her like a pack wild hyenas.

When women talk about toxic masculinity they’re projecting their own shit onto us. When men don’t get along we stay away from each other. When women don’t get along they try to destroy each other.

Sudden_Difference500 · 2022-09-29T17:18:01+00:00

Manipulating, being passive aggressive, lying, always playing the victim, not being able to recognize male feelings, talking down to men, gossiping, hating men in general, expecting the man to pay for everything, expecting the man to always make the first move, false rape accusations, paternity fraud to name just a few.

agenericusername9 · 2022-09-29T14:07:53+00:00

Materialism, elitism, superficial behaviour/mentality, entitlement to men they don’t deserve, basically the same shit just the inverse.

JayTylGra97 · 2022-09-29T21:53:07+00:00

I don’t really think being feminine can be toxic. Just like how being masculine isn’t toxic.

asb3s7 · 2022-09-30T01:57:59+00:00

Toxic femininity isn't a thing.

IronJohnMRA · 2022-09-29T18:39:01+00:00

There is no toxic femininity.

blast4310 · 2022-09-29T19:55:00+00:00

There’s no such thing as “toxic femininity” because what you’re describing is low quality behavior, which can exist independently from gender.

Women naturally gossip, shame, and complain.

LetsTalkFV · 2022-09-29T15:41:25+00:00

There's a very interesting (and troubling) thread over on r/raisedbynarcissists/ atm, talking about mothers possibly poisoning their children/spouses. Shocking to read just how many commenters have experienced similar things.

MiniatureMartian · 2022-09-29T17:21:32+00:00

From my experience the equivalent would be when women shame other women for not being feminine enough, suggesting that if a woman doesn't give up her life and submit to a man, she's less of a woman. Or if she isn't willing to have multiple children. It's more nuanced than that but it's pretty crappy to witness. There's this pseudo-sciency stuff going on now on social media like tik tok, "Masculine energy" and "Feminine energy". Anything that isn't seen as Feminine such as living alone as a grown adult and working is seen as a woman being masculine and in her "masculine energy". Or some shit like that.

Toxic masculinity is men shaming men for not being manly enough, by setting a standard that doesn't actually have anything to do with masculinity.

Toxic femininity is women shaming women for not being womanly enough, by setting a standard that doesn't actually have anything to do with femininity.

Black-Patrick · 2022-09-29T18:06:04+00:00

Validation. Reflexive empathy, overprotectiveness. The inability or hesitancy to offer constructive criticism on behalf of children or subordinates or peers often based on the presumption of a level of neuroticism that would prevent the recipient of said criticism from accepting it or benefiting from it. A failure to instill discipline or to reinforce the concept of delayed gratification. The archetype of the devouring mother that prevents their child or those under their influence from developing the autonomy and courage to take on the world. They perpetuate the dependency and actively undermine efforts to establish independence. There’s a lot of these pathologies that show up in various forms on this sub, as a large volume of posts are thinly veiled attempts to garner sympathetic validation and confirmation of negative experience that indicates the pervasiveness of the mentality.

MiKEY_SANZ · 2022-09-29T20:35:04+00:00

The idea that anyone and everyone should bend over backwards to accommodate your every whim because your life is harder than everyone else’s

liga__privada · 2022-09-29T21:52:05+00:00

Masculinity and Femininity can Neither be good nor bad they just are. The modern feminist notion is that masculinity within itself is toxic. In their eyes there’s no form of “good masculinity”. Anything they consider “good masculinity” is actually just when men act feminine for them while they act in their Masculine chasing clout/careers and trying to “have it all just like a man” like cosmopolitan magazine told them to.

hunglikewatchbattery · 2022-09-30T00:22:54+00:00

I'm currently enrolled in a public health program. And we are constantly being shown data about differences in outcomes for males vs females. And whenever males outperform females in any way, its considered as an inequity or an injustice. But when females outperform males, its just considered facts or that its due to the patriarchy.

And as one of the only males in the entire program, I don't feel comfortable speaking up about it for fear of reprisal and shaming by my peers. I just want to get my degree and then go make a difference later, but I can't get my degree if my teachers hate me.

So I've basically chosen to be invisible and have to listen to constant man bashing in my program. The toxic femininity that I'm experiencing is simply a blatant dismissal of undeniable, in your face, men's issues and I don't feel safe enough to speak up about it.

stranger_in_the_land · 2022-09-30T02:14:21+00:00

I would never, as a man, call femininity toxic. However, feminism nowadays is toxic and cancerous because it spreads all over the body and is hard to remove from the body once a person is bitten by a toxic feminist.

mmpie3 · 2022-09-30T03:19:14+00:00

I live for the day society can finally admit that men and women can be equally toxic.

Dr_RxRedpill · 2022-09-30T03:25:43+00:00

Yes. It’s called Divorce Rape.

Happens to so many good men.

They carry a victim complex. And our gynocentric legal system upholds their ability to be toxic feminists. They loot and pillage the resources that a man has worked hard to build up.

The men lose their house, even if the woman is at fault. And if a man refuses to pay the alimony, he will get his wages garnished and even potentially be jailed.

More about divorce rape here: https://youtu.be/c_B8th9V32U

Anih1list · 2022-09-30T03:32:45+00:00

The first time I heard the term Toxic Femininity, it was a feminist speaking:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAtoMSfecgQ

It's not something most feminists talk about, or that many will acknowledge. But from a dedicated feminist framework, toxic femininity necessarily exists as a counterpart to toxic masculinity.

Traditional_Tie_5560 · 2022-09-30T04:42:21+00:00

Screaming incoherently at the sight of a man because it’s triggered some non related event that may or may not have happened.

Oh and most posts on two X.

_this_man · 2022-09-30T08:52:18+00:00

I think neither exists. There are only toxic people and toxic behavior.

OnyxStorm · 2022-09-30T17:45:20+00:00

Have you seen https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/?

If not, there's plenty of it there.

Bound-Submissive · 2022-10-01T18:14:17+00:00

I don't think there is such thing as toxic masculinity or femininity. But I will not tolerate disrespectful toxic behavior. I fucking hate gossiping, treating your man like crap, like slave, like wallet, using him, cheating on him, custody stealth, nagging him. And between friends, gossip I already mentioned, jealousy, trying to sabotage your friend's relationship, success or other achievements. I also hate peer pressure. Most of this shit I mentioned is unisex and I won't make any exceptions. I won't tolerate any of it.

Title	Toxic femininity?
Author	No_Ambassador359
Upvotes	205
Comments	77
Date	September 29, 2022 11:41 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/xr5lam/toxic_femininity/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/toxic-femininity.1133490 https://theredarchive.com/post/1133490

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