"The real reason for the rise in male childlessness"

Proud-Cheesecake-813 · 2024-11-01T11:18:34+00:00

I was literally about to post this. I wrote a long post, so might as well post it here. Here are my takeaways:

Most mainstream media articles about men getting married less/having less children are not great at discovering the root problem. This article is better than most, but still not great.

The article correctly identifies that poor, uneducated men are the least likely to have children. It also points out that the wealthiest women are the least likely to be forced into childlessness. Now, I don’t think you need genius level intellect to discern that women primarily want a man with money, compared to men not caring about a woman’s financial situation (as long as they’re not in crippling debt).

The article dances around this fact - going on to state that young men are currently going through ‘male malaise’ - whereby they don’t understand their role in society. Women are becoming “more empowered” and men can’t deal with this. Well, that’s just attacking men again and not dealing with the actual problem - prioritising women in education and the workforce. It’s quite clear women want to have children with a rich, successful man. Yet feminism keeps elevating women above men. How does this help?

The article is great at highlighting women don’t ’date down’ - they have to date someone at their social level (i.e. classism). Men don’t care about this because they are nowhere near as classist.

Finally, the article asks ‘How do we fix this?’. Does it ask women to be open to men who are poorer than them? Who are less educated? Of course not. It says men need to worry about their biological clock more and should consider becoming a ‘community father figure’ (i.e. be open to the single mother).

This is classic BBC - don’t ask women to do anything and don’t be too probing. However, I’ve noticed articles like this are definitely highlighting more and more that women want a rich, successful man - whilst men are getting poorer and less educated than ever. Hopefully people reading it see the patterns and connect the dots.

LouisdeRouvroy · 2024-11-01T12:09:10+00:00

It has been called “the selection effect” by sociologists, where women tend to look for someone of the same social class or above when they choose a partner.

No, it's called hypergamy. I like how they're trying to bury it under another label because it's not good optics for women.

TisIChenoir · 2024-11-01T13:19:14+00:00

You know, it's always funny whenever I hear that men feel uncomfortable being with a woman with more power/a higher salary, like that's oppressive of men to do, but nobody points out that women just don't date down (cue "women are single because there is a lack of eligible bachelors in society since women are the majority of college degree earners nowadays" articles), therefore for a lot of men, a woman outearning them is almost a romantic death sentence... through no choice of the man...

fuckthemoddsofreddit · 2024-11-01T11:39:18+00:00

The problem is simply that most men dont meet the standards for women anymore. Many men are disqualified at a basic level of attraction. The standard for a non good looking man to get a woman today is so absurd that most men cant reach it.

So of course they arent having kids, many of these man cant even get a date.

Women just dont want most men at a raw level. Nothing can even change this core truth.

kochIndustriesRussia · 2024-11-01T11:34:15+00:00

Its a zero sum game for men and they're wising up. Most women want children...not marriage to a man (no young woman actually wants a man around 24/7...for the next 35 years lol). They endure marriage, to get children. Then, more often than not, they take their children and leave. With half of the mans material assets as well as his children.

So....why would any man sign up for that?

jessi387 · 2024-11-01T16:57:45+00:00

I’m part of this “dissaffected” generation of young men and what I find interesting is that, no one has ever asked me why I didn’t get an education. Not one time has anyone ever asked me what I would like.

Instead everybody else tells me what to do and what’s wrong with me. Ask yourself this, has anyone ever asked you what you need to change so that you can succeed? Exactly.

We are an after thought and people only wake up to our problems when it affects women.

PurpleRoman · 2024-11-01T15:26:19+00:00

Why is there no pro-men’s magazines or news organizations?

SidewaysGiraffe · 2024-11-01T15:45:08+00:00

They're writing about the kind of person who decides she'll only accept a man who's taller than her- then goes out wearing shoes that make her taller. How much logic can you really expect?

WhereProgressIsMade · 2024-11-01T16:37:13+00:00

In the bigger picture, it's not new. DNA research has found around 4x as many women have passed down genes to the present generation than men for the last ~100k years. If anything, the anomaly has been the last few thousand where it dipped below this where culture and religion tried to pair people off in monogamy. We're just going back to our biology now that those norms have been shaken off. The bottom ~75% of men where undesirable then and are undesirable now just like the okcupid data that revealed women rate 80% of men as "below average".

It is getting interesting how articles like this are starting to admit some of the issues, but can't dare say that the math just doesn't work trying to combine hypergamy with 2/3rd of college degrees being earned by women now.

Few-Procedure-268 · 2024-11-01T12:30:11+00:00

The thing I keep rolling over in my mind is that

1) in countries with high inequality, like the US, this problem is heavily concentrated in poor men with limited education, but

2) in countries with less inequality, (Nordic, Japan, etc.) everyone is choosing to have fewer kids.

The second option is clearly better, but it does point (IMO) towards a certain lack of purpose/meaning in life for a lot of folks that is easier to see when people aren't being crushed by poverty.

walterwallcarpet · 2024-11-03T10:56:40+00:00

They're STILL banging on about how cruel and unfair it is that women are 'forced' to freeze their eggs (conveniently omitting the fact that this is due to their own, totally unrealistic 'standards' for Prince Charming). Yet ANOTHER article on today's BBC website. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4g7x5kl5l8o

The real reason why this won't go away is an underlying campaign to have the taxpayer foot the £18k bill. We had the same article back in May of this year. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4nn5y4j0z4o

Current_Finding_4066 · 2024-11-01T12:15:09+00:00

Exploitive economic system that enables few to become richer than god, and large number of employed people having trouble getting their basic needs met is not conducive to having kids? Kids who will most likely also have trouble securing a decent life.

I see no problem if population crashes and the system fails.

noserotonyn · 2024-11-05T11:05:07+00:00

They always say something about the "need for change in masculinity as a result of female empowerment", they talk about the "financial difficulties of today's men", "social ostracism of low-status men" etc., they don't have the courage to say how much female hypergamy is a hindrance to relationships, they act as if hypergamy is a natural right to be exercised by women in any circumstances. Well, if a man has to give up waiting for a submissive, delicate, feminine woman, does the woman not need to give up anything? Should their irremediable hypergamy continue? Haven't times changed after all?

The truth is, if women don't give up their hypergamy, there will no longer be a liberal western society, and all the experts are afraid to say it.

Billmacia · 2024-11-01T22:27:05+00:00

Fixing hypergamy would fix so much problèmes, but at last.

Standard_Court_5639 · 2024-11-01T14:30:52+00:00

2 “men”, trump and Elon … 17 kids, 6 ex wives, couple dozen accusers, toss in a porn star for good measure. If this were two brothers in the nba the MAGA folks would be tossing around all your “see they can’t keep it in their pants, no family values”. While hypocritically banging anyone but their wife, claiming their wife is essentially property and second class citizen. But it’s the obese pumpkin and the prick who mass fired at Twitter and then tells people they will work exorbitant hours …just wait …

Oh and wants to put women in the kitchen, at the foot of a man, with men telling her who she is and what she should do, and take back the male dominated world with women as second class citizens. What about gop and bro culture bullshit fake masculinity says otherwise?

You all need to quit crying and get your head out of your asses and compete. Women aren’t just looking to marry the rich guy, but they are skipping past the uneducated who spent their childhood playing video games and still do in their 20-30’s. Zero EQ. Zero communication skills with women. Self defeatism and victim attitude. If you knew how to be an alpha male and yet a servant leader you would get what you want. It is your perpetual self absorbed woe is me crap that keeps you trapped in a cycle of porn wanking, video games and talking like a child with your video game bros, or your gym bros. Do some reading. Hire a life coach who knows his shit. Not these chins telling you the secrets to dating and getting women. That’s wholly bullshit. Geez

Title	"The real reason for the rise in male childlessness"
Author	Roddy0608
Upvotes	201
Comments	69
Date	November 1, 2024 11:16 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1gh2y0f/the_real_reason_for_the_rise_in_male_childlessness/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/the-real-reason-for-the-rise-in-male-childlessness.1534181 https://theredarchive.com/post/1534181

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