Woman getting beaten up vs. man getting beaten up

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I'm taking a guess here, but, I'm assuming they are connecting it to MRAs, and therefore to politics. As soon as you say policy should change because of the video, it becomes a political video. I don't go to that sub ever (most of the default subs are ones I immediately removed because they don't interest me), but as long as they are being fair (such as removing feminist videos or any other political video), it's technically fine. It's when they are not applying the rules fairly or equally that there start to be issues. I'm not trying to say what they did is right or wrong, but that I understand why they did it.

There are places to discuss politics. There's a place and time for everything. You wouldn't expect them to allow videos from r/watchpeopledie to show up there, because there is already a place for those videos and not everyone wants to see them.

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I got into the original thread and everything was deleted. I figured they where all just controversial comments, but reading the comments in your link it seems like they just wanted to censor this video.

I hope someone keeps reposting it.

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[+]geoddi1 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link

To be fair, it violated rule 7 of r/Videos, no posting of battery or assault.

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/u/sknabcv2 (will delete if you request, apologies if take offense)

Because when a man does it to a woman hes an evil bastard. When a woman does it to a man its because he deserved it. When my ex stabbed me in the chest. A half inch from my heart with a steak knife. When I was having emergency open heart surgery. When the doctors were telling me I had a 5% chance of making it through that. That I'm a walking miracle. When I was at home recovering, barely able to care for myself for months there were people saying that I deserved it. That obviously she wouldn't stab me without good reason. My crime? I asked her for the knife after she cut her arm open and threatened to kill herself.

Its fucked. Its more than fucked. Domestic abuse against women is a real issue. A very real issue. And its a very real issue when its against men as well. 40% of domestic abuse victims are men. Yes it happens slightly more to women but 40% is a pretty big fucking number. There are abuse shelters everywhere for women. There are ZERO for men.

Thank you for sharing the archive.

[+]sknabcv21 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

No worries. Glad something got saved.

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[+]RJPatrick -42 points-41 points-40 points 8 years ago (65 children) | Copy Link

Hello everyone, please be nice to me. I just want to share some statistics.

Even if men account for 40% of domestic abuse victims, women are much more likely to be killed by a man in a domestic abuse situation, and much more likely to be the victim of sexual assault as part of that abuse.

Although I get the point of this video (let's all stick up for people whenever we can), it downplays the relative severity of violence against women.

Most recent stats from Office for National Statistics:

37% of domestic abuse victims are men

This gap is biggest in the 16-19 age group, where women are nearly three times more likely to be victims

For domestic abuse incidents that go on to be classified as a criminal offence, only 24% of the victims are men

96% of victims of sexual abuse offences are women

In 30% of domestic homicides, the victims are male

66% of male victims of domestic homicides were killed by other males

(https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/bulletins/domesticabuseinenglandandwales/yearendingmarch2017)

Hopefully all of this highlights the massive skew in domestic abuse towards severe male violence against both women and men.

We can't dilute this point by turning it into a "violence is violence" argument.

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[+]geoddi1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

I don't think the video distorts the perception of severity, it simply does not make any such claims, so that is perhaps more due to perception bias.

On that point, though, maybe the video should give more reference to how violence affects men and women differently on physical and psychological levels. I would love to see a study on mental health affecting either gender around domestic violence.

Until then, I think it's healthy to expose young people to all viewpoints.

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The problem with this is that people might start to think that men are subject to the same magnitude of violence and sexual violence that women are, which is not true.

Men are 50% more likely to become a victim of violence and 3 times as likely to become a victim of severe violence than women, and this statistic already includes sexual violence.

Men were more likely to be a victim of violent crime measured by the face-to-face Crime Survey for England and Wales (CSEW) interview than women (2.2% of males compared with 1.4% of females1, Figure 1.8)2, with stranger violence showing the largest difference in victimisation between men and women (1.2% compared with 0.4%).

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/compendium/focusonviolentcrimeandsexualoffences/yearendingmarch2016/overviewofviolentcrimeandsexualoffences

By your own logic you not just equated the victimization of women with that of men, but made it look like women are more likely to be victimized by only focusing on domestic homicide rates when in fact 70% of all homicide victims in the UK are male. If you seriously think that every time domestic violence between genders gets compared in any way, it needs to be mentioned that women make up 70% of domestic homicide victims you can't really argue that total homicide statistics don't need to be mentioned whenever we talk about any specific kind of homicide.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/articles/homicideinenglandandwales/yearendingmarch2017

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[–]Meyright 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

Of course there is none about men and domestic violence. Domestic violence of men is an understudied crime. Why do you think is that?

I found this about women though, what a surprise: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2644020/

Which states that 62% of women suffering from domestic violence are depressed and 9% out of those are somewhat suicidal. Now I want you to think about how about 50% of domestic violence victims are men about how women are pretty clever at inflicting psychological violence and violence by proxy (e.g. through the state) on men and that men are even much more likely to kill themselves. Now I want you to think about how nobody believes a man suffering from DV, that nobody cares about a weak man or what he has to say and that there is just no help for you as a man from the state in this situation and even your friends think you deserved it and how damaging psychological violence can be to someone.

Do you see any possible connection there? Do you think suicide could be the consequence of suffering dv and not being able to receive any help?

Now I want you to think about the many fathers that have their kids taken away from them by their kids mother. Fathers who have to pay for her and her lover, living in the house they built, paying alimony for the rest of their lifes, literally living as a slave in this world, killing themselves.

Or what about the many men who kill themselves because they're falsely accused of rape by their ex girlfriends.

And now I want to ask you if you still don't see the connection here. And these cases happen. It happens all the time. We see good bye letters in this sub from broken fathers often enough, or hear of men killing themselves because of false accusations. Women can be just as evil as men, they just use other methods to accomplish their goals. More sneaky and malicious methods. Womens violence goes unnoticed, it's more often violence by proxy and it doesn't get included in any statistic.

[–]RJPatrick -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Meyright 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

u/RJPatrick wrote:

My god. You language is soaked with hatred and bigotry. I can't have a discussion with you, you've already decided that women are evil.

The patriarchy has done all the evil things you describe, plus so much more, to women for thousands of years. I'm sorry, but you're just completely blind to the big picture.

At least now I know you're just trolling. You didn't consider any of my arguments, you're just accusing me of misogyny, attacking my character and not the argument. A classical feminist shaming move and you've got nothing else to say.

Bye

Edit: If you're not a troll, I want you to read my post again but now slowly and I want you to notice how you projected what you think about me into this text before actually reading it. If you still see hatred, bigotry and me describing women as evil, I want you to cite me. I want you to explain what your unproven conspiracy theory about the patriarchy has to do with the situation in which we are living now and how what men allegedly did to women for thousands of years justifies that we treat men not fairly today when it comes to domestic violence. The only bigot I see in this argument is you.

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[+]ThisNameIsValid273 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

Whilst what you say is factually correct, you cant "pick and choose" with equality. Equality by nature means focusing on everyones problems and fixing them. So saying "but women account for ~60% of domestic violence victims" is true, but completely missing the point. We should aim to end all domestic violence, against men and women. We shouldn't say "women are more likely to be affected by it, so only try and stop it for them" as that is the direct opposite of equality.

The fact you said "we can't dilute this point by turning to the violence is violence argument" shutsdown all opposing arguments, which is allowing you to push a women's only agenda. When, we should in fact be striving to end it for men and women alike. You are turning this into a competition, which is quite frankly, pretty disturbing for someone preaching equality.

Sorry for poor formatting / grammar; was typed on a phone.

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[–]SirYouAreIncorrect 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What about a man getting raped and murdered by a woman, you believe that can not happen

. Yet the second scenario happens so much more often to women than it does to men

Well because in many parts of the world, including still in some area's of the US, a man can not be legally raped by a women, the laws are worded as such that is makes it impossible. Slowly the laws are being changed but given the history any stats on the subject are going to be severely warped.

Further in many instances Domestic Violence is a 2 way street, however only the man is criminally charged, thus leading to an MASSIVE under representation of women and a massive OVER representation by men.

I can also point you to several documented cases where men have been charged because when the women hit them they injured themselves (i.e Broken wrist, or lacerations on arms etc) so the Man was charged with a crime even though he was the victim.

we need to understand the full spectrum of violence, and all its nuances.

Yes we do, and your "Women are wonderful" bias combined with your complete delusion to the reality of the world shows you believe that women are majority the victims which in reality it is at minimum closer to 50/50

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[–]mensmod 12 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

"I am going to ignore the point being made and continue to push stats that are refuted by the argument."

Good job, dude.

Problems with the stats you are reporting:

Men under report DV as the cause of injury.
Society classifies female-on-male DV as self defense, thus reducing statistics of female-on-male severity.
It is widely argued in feminist circles (which you seem to fit into) that severe injury is rare, but emotional consequences of DV are the longest lasting effect and are as significant or more significant than bodily injury in many cases. Thus, severity is not relevant to the discussion of DV in general.

Here is a study that talks about the issues with reporting between the genders:

http://www.fact.on.ca/Info/dom/kwong99.htm

Certainly one study is not conclusive. But considering the anti-male bias present in the groups who do DV studies (see Duluth Model), it suggests that there is an issue with how DV statistics are collected. The researchers can't be trusted to be unbiased (see Duluth Model).

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[+]Throwaway__shmoe1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Does this include unreported domestic abuse? I would be willing to bet most men don't report domestic abuse when it happens from their partner.

[–]Halafax 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Quintrell 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Hello everyone, please be nice to me. I just want to share some statistics

Well okay. I mean as long as they're accurate.

[This video] downplays the relative severity of violence against women.

Wait I thought you were "just" sharing statistics? Now you're made an argument. A foolish one. And that's why you're being downvoted.

Bringing attention to sexist double-standards against men does not "downplay" female DV anymore than campaigning to raise funds to fight thyroid cancer "downplays" alzheimers. Especially in a hypothetical society where people laugh at those suffering from thyroid cancer.

Given the extreme double-standard being portrayed here I'm kind of amazed that anyone would chime in "but da womyn!" As others have noted, this isn't a zero sum game. At least it doesn't have to be and it shouldn't be.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Even if men account for 40% of domestic abuse victims, women are much more likely to be killed by a man in a domestic abuse situation, and much more likely to be the victim of sexual assault as part of that abuse.

Yeah but the thing is, after highlighting a bad thing a lot of women do, other women will downplay it as a thing both men and women have to change for it to not be a thing anymore, make a better world and such.

On one hand we have a minority receiving mistreatment, and women and feminism wanting a voice for that minority because it's a female minority; and on the other, another minority receiving mistreatment, but because it's a male minority, we have to remember "women suffer too". We literally can not win an argument against you if you keep using this stupid bullshit. Us suffering doesn't mean you don't suffer as well, but it seems that by people laughing at abused men, it really makes the problem look not so big. You and I agree that we have to combat all forms of violence, well then don't say "yes but women suffer more!!".

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[+]geoddi1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

I just wanted to thank you for your comment, and that I don't think it deserves the downvotes. I don't think I agree with the applicability of the arguments you bring up in the given circumstances, but it certainly made me think! Thanks for that!

[–]RJPatrick 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Woman getting beaten up vs. man getting beaten up

Comments

REMOVE THE HATE SPEECH NOW!!!

FREEOLDREDDIT

WHAT IS HAPPENING TO REDDIT AND FREE SPEECH? #PITCHFORKS

Title	Woman getting beaten up vs. man getting beaten up
Author	TheLifeOfBilly
Upvotes	719
Comments	151
Date	April 6, 2018 5:43 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/8abjgf/woman_getting_beaten_up_vs_man_getting_beaten_up/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/woman-getting-beaten-up-vs-man-getting-beaten-up.903236 https://theredarchive.com/post/903236