What does your side get wrong?

[deleted] · 2014-01-29T14:46:21+00:00

[permanently deleted]

deepthrill · 2014-01-29T23:46:02+00:00

Okay since joining this sub I have been making an effort to be courteous and present only facts as such, and state that my opinions are my opinions.

This whole sub has been good to test my views of the world, and I've surely learned a thing or two.

That being said, I really don't like how this thread has evolved (yes, that is my opinion, not a fact).

Of all the top-level comments as of 2014-01-29 18:36 EST:

8 are from red-pillers trying to engage in some good introspection which has brought up some good debate and good points (some aren't self-identified red-pillers but from the comment I've classified it as such)
2 are simply stating that TBP doesn't really have any specific views. Perhaps the comment from /u/shw3nn (one of the blue-pillers here I have a good deal of respect for and enjoy debating with) offers some introspection in that maybe TRP isn't as insane as it's made out to be.
1 is from a blue-piller whose comment is not about any introspection or self-evaluation, but rather that blue-pillers AREN'T BLUE PILL ENOUGH and are underestimating the HATE from TRP

If TBP members are simply going to say that they have no views and are simply against TRP views, then be logical, and offer a TRP view that perhaps you agree with (god forbid!). Or take an anti-red-pill view that you don't think is so bad.

I'm noticing that TRP in this thread are trying hard at some introspection here and I'm not seeing the same level of dedication from TBP members in this thread. They seem to be waiting for TRP members to trip up and admit that we don't agree with everything on our sub (okay I know that's mind reading and that's simply my impression).

Oh, and to answer the OP's question (let's make it 9), a lot of TRP people seem to take the position that everything we do in this world is motivated, perhaps in some small part, by sex and the evolutionary drive. I happen to disagree and I think things such as freedom, money, etc., make me purely happy and joyful and aren't motivated by sex for me. Freedom and money to travel, for example, is to me not motivated by a desire to have sex with foreign girls, or to increase how interesting I am; I simply want to experience more of the world. Maybe I need some more introspection to really know if that's true, but that's just my gut response.

polyhooly · 2014-01-30T02:30:45+00:00

I think many Blue Pillers are too quick to dismiss users of TRP as the stereotypical neckbearded virgin losers, and the overall existence of RPW, while getting upset at RP types for dismissing the feelings and experiences of others, such as women and "blue pill" men. TRP is a little more nuanced than they are often given credit for on TBP.

Wolfwoodd · 2014-01-29T16:02:27+00:00

What TRP gets wrong: Screening women for dating / LTR's. They focus on things that don't really matter and ignore things that do. 90% of their process is figuring out how much sex a girl has had prior to dating. That's dumb. You are going to screen out girls with high sexual standards (i.e. the ones with the high self-esteems, that are also good in bed). These women have quality problems.. they tend to have to sleep with many men until they find the one with the required bedroom skills. Furthermore, you're going to rule out women who are honest (specifically, about their number of previous partners). That's also pretty stupid.

Better option for screening: Freaks, Hoes & Good Girls

EDIT: Since some people have a problem with the link, I'll post the relevant part:

Good Girls - Girls who are happy in relationships when their significant other is happy. These girls will tend to go out of their way to do nice things for their guys: cook, clean, give them gifts, play out their sexual fantasies, etc. They are the easiest type to maintain a long term relationship with because they make it fairly easy for the guy.

Freaks - Girls who are happy in relationships when they receive attention and strong emotional states. This is the type guys fall for the quickest, because they generally come off as very vulnerable. This type thrives on validation, both positive and negative. They cause a lot of drama, are more likely to cheat on you (sex is a form of validation), and usually have some form of daddy issues. These are also the type of women who tend to stay in abusive relationships. Guys, don’t get into serious relationships with these types of girls unless you really know what you’re doing. The way to make this work is for the guy to be able to inject a steady amount of drama into the relationship (or find some way to give her strong emotional states).

Hoes - Kind of self-explanatory. These girls are happiest when they are receiving material resources (money, gifts, etc) from guys. They are only interested in dating high-status guys or guys who show a willingness to buy them things. When you meet them, they will probably ask you about your job, what car you drive and/or where you live. They will relentlessly tool a guy over to get what they want. They’ll try to get you to pay for everything. The best way to have a long term relationship with a girl like this is to play the “pimp”. Don’t put up with any of that stuff.. Be clear that she’s going to have to pay for her crap if she wants any chance of seeing you. Be fine with her tooling over her orbiters or get her to tool over her orbiters for your benefit (I.e. send her up to the bar to get you free drinks from AFC‘s).

[deleted] · 2014-01-29T05:39:07+00:00

Too many hamster jokes.

mikado12 · 2014-01-29T21:04:21+00:00

"Sexual strategy is amoral." If we go with this, then you can do anything to get laid: Lie, cheat, drug...

It's one of those often repeated phrases on TRP but most of the users probably would backstep if the point was pressed.

_Reticent_ · 2014-01-29T14:07:30+00:00

I don't like speaking for a side as such, but recently I have downplayed society's role in the shaping of our learned behaviours, over our inherent genetic urges.

Bottom line is, society is just as likely to affect your behaviour and your actions, and that the source of our behaviours and ideas cannot be traced back to either our genetics or the society in which we live. Unfortunately I see this in a conspiratorial light in that we know society, or powers-that-be, such as law makers or the elite, are capable of pushing through agendas or ideas that the society will adopt as a given (that happen to be in their interest) using tools such as the media; in Nazi Germany this was that Jews were bad. A terrible 'truth' that turned out to be quite untrue after the bodies were buried of course.

Society is and has been wrong depending on where or when you lived compared to the now. It's ever changing and effervescent, differing massively within a 100 year span. It is ignorant to think a thing that moves as such a speed, and changes with such voracity, should be regarded with a disproportionally high value; my eggs cannot go willingly into that basket. Societal norms are forced upon you and can conflict with what your body and mind want from your life. If you disagree, you are shunned, if you agree but don't believe it, you are unhappy. I see a lot of shunned, unhappy people based off what 'the norms' are.

Point is, is that our genetic destiny is (I believe) less likely to be affected, seeing as we evolve very slowly, than our learned and observed behaviours or 'norms' with regarding to the norms of whichever society it is. I will still endeavour to understand the world as it makes sense to me, but will not seek to believe systems open to abuse so easily.

BruceIsTheBatman · 2014-01-29T09:01:25+00:00

Don't know which side this applies to, but I think 'Nice guys vs Assholes' is such a false dichotomy. Usually someone brings up either of these terms and then someone else steps in and tries to point out the conditions and nuances of the terms and then we have a huge debate over what girls are attracted to whether it is rational or not.

I think the answer is simpler than a lot of people think. It has nothing to do with actual kindness or douchebaggery in itself. It really comes down to fear, or lack of it.

Any behavior that gives the impression "I am not afraid of you, society, or the consequences of my actions" is attractive, to women and men. Guys want to be badass, too.

It's like, okay guys--of all the books and comics and movies and tv shows you love, who are your favorite characters? Who are the ones you want to be like? Guess what, girls like that kind of man, too. Heroes who help other people by kicking ass. Please note the kick-ass part, it is very important. People want more than kindness and generosity, they want someone who doesn't let the constructs of society phase them or prevent them from getting what they want. In short, women are attracted to men who appear fearless. Unfortunately, many of the fearless are also assholes in real life. Pretty much all children grow up in fantasy land.

_Reticent_ · 2014-01-29T10:42:59+00:00

I think many bluepillers underestimate the dangers of a TRP-mindset. I don't think TRP are a bunch of virgin losers, I think it's a hate group. Sometimes I wonder if it's right to make fun of it. Not because I feel sorry for redpillers but because it's sort of like laughing at a car crash or a murder. I think a lot of people in TRP are very sick in the brain.

DevilishRogue · 2014-01-29T16:25:56+00:00

TRP's use of language is alienating to fence-sitters who take it literally rather than the reasoning behind it. The generalization itself isn't a problem but the phraseology (alpha/beta, pussy, spinning plates, etc.) creates a tendency for casual observers to be dismissive of arguments that if worded differently would be understood and accepted more readily. However, whilst TRP isn't about safe spaces and all that crap it is in some ways a good thing that such language is not just acceptable but a genuine part of parlance that both eases understanding of those who have red pill knowledge and enables individuals going through the five stages of grief to vent without fear of repercussion.

[deleted] · 2014-01-29T18:30:39+00:00

Well tbp doesn't really have any outstanding view points we express and all agree on. It's more of a space to call trp out on lack of sources facts and real world common sense. And we tend to make fun of trp in more of retaliation against false claims and sweeping generalizations of women.

shw3nn · 2014-01-29T18:57:52+00:00

We aren't really a side. We don't have a theory of the world.

But I do think TBP is a bit too trigger happy in painting some stuff from RP as insane. There are some very unfair interpretations of some of the things said on TRP.

potopotp · 2014-01-29T18:45:58+00:00

I feel like TRP doesn't understand the amount of White Supremacy and Racism that TBP is responsible for enabling.

The stances that TBP is continually enabling are for the benefit of white women, who continue to allow high numbers of ethnic prison arrests, deny ethnic minority men jobs, and destroy the ability for minorities to form families.

It's unfortunate that so many TBPers are against racism, but end up playing into Big Feminism's racism.

When TRP can understand that #solidarityisforwhitewomen, we might finally be able to deal with the liberal hipster racism that passes for progressivism from TBP.

artthoumadbrother · 2014-01-30T02:51:05+00:00

The Blue Pill isn't an actual ideology. TRP is. My side doesn't get anything wrong because it doesn't have any stated beliefs.

angatar_ · 2014-01-30T02:46:00+00:00

Now that this won't be the only comment in the thread...

[irony]Coming here. It offers a false sense of legitimacy to /r/TheRedPill that I really do not think it deserves.[/irony]

Title	What does your side get wrong?
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	6
Comments	110
Date	January 29, 2014 4:13 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1wfr1g/what_does_your_side_get_wrong/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/what-does-your-side-get-wrong.286292 https://theredarchive.com/post/286292

Comments