Reoccurring problem

MsSadieDunham · 2017-02-20T01:25:34+00:00

"I'm just trying to help," in woman translates into "I'm going to nag you to death," in man.

teaandtalk · 2017-02-19T22:51:54+00:00

Wouldn't a man who chose a women who made him into a better man, cherish her? Why did these men have affairs if his woman supported him and his successes?

If she 'made him into a better man' by supporting him and being a soft place to land, i'm sure he wouldn't have. But if she 'made him into a better man' by nagging and making him feel like he owed her for financial support and shaping his career trajectory, I can understand how he'd end up resenting her and having an affair with someone less shrew-like.

Bamfmaiden · 2017-02-20T01:57:37+00:00

Yep, the method matters. I see women "molding" men to be what they want them to be. And I wonder, do they men really want the same thing? If they don't then it makes sense they would rebel -- transference-- by having an affair.

c_a_l_m · 2017-02-20T03:23:38+00:00

This is not to imply that it was "their fault somehow," because I don't know these women. How could I possibly know?

I do hope, though, that this anecdote sticks in the mind, as it illustrates the importance of vetting. Sometimes you can't see it coming, obviously, but (also obviously) sometimes you can.

mrpthrowa · 2017-02-20T11:08:48+00:00

If you act like a mother to a man he'll want a partner somewhere else.

PerniciousPernida · 2017-02-20T03:05:37+00:00

I kind of pity the woman, though... She made a lot of sacrifice for him so that he can become successful. She stayed with him when he had nothing and now he did this to her. Not many women want to stay with a man that has not fully established his career these days...

Gardrothard · 2017-02-20T05:57:01+00:00

It depends on the man. It could be woman's fault. But it could also be that the man was being nice and faithful because he was never in a position to be something else and this just let him do what he really wants.

Vector-Sigma · 2017-02-20T09:18:03+00:00

Honestly, who knows?

All I can say is that I don’t think providing career advice contributes to sexual attraction and emotional intimacy. I certainly don’t feel emotionally close or sexually attracted to any mentors at work, just grateful I know some smart cookies who were able to provide good advice. And thus I’m more likely to maintain favourable business relationships with them.

My partner and I work in different fields, but we also have previous experience in each other’s fields, just enough to understand the basic technical details. But what we discuss tends to be the social/emotional aspects of the job – dealing with lazy coworkers, strict bosses, teamwork etc. Ironically most of our discussion on work centers around “why can’t we just go to work and do a job instead of dealing with politics?”. This kind of discussion is roughly equal – it’s not one of us consistently providing advice to the other. I do think from a strong emotional connection to occur, there must be reciprocity. Not in a ‘you scratch me back, now you scratch mine’ but this feeling that we can rely on each other to provide support when we need it. A type of relationship you cannot expect at work or from a therapist.

Back when my partner was jobless, we both moved in with my mum for mates rates on rent. My mum (divorcee) nags a lot. Mum felt she successfully nagged my partner all the way to a job. I do think it might have worked, but because of the additional motivation to be able to afford our own place to move away from her. And I could see how the nagging effected their relationship – she became stressful to live with. If I felt the need to nag that much, I would have broken up first! Mum may have done me a solid by doing the nagging for me, but I don’t think it was worth it. As she lives on her own, she’d probably prefer we live with her to keep her company. I feel a romantic relationship should be one where you both have that ‘soft place to land’ as discussed on RPW. Otherwise you have parents, you have mentors, you have bosses and you have therapists to fill the other roles.

I'm sure there's more to it

It’s hard to nail it down. Perhaps her husband has a tendency to fall in love with domineering women, but when the honeymoon period wears off, he’s on to the next one. Or perhaps he stayed with her because she’s the best he could get. And then his SMV increased (social status increase) and could do better. Or he’s a selfish advantage taker who used her to advance his career. Who knows? Women cheat like that too – he provides everything, she’s a housewife, she gets lonely and cheats.

TheLaughingRhino · 2017-02-21T15:49:02+00:00

In Robert Glover's book, No More Mr Nice Guy ( though in this case, it would be No More Mrs Nice Girl I suppose) , he discusses "covert contracts" and how they are toxic to people.

A covert contract would be, I ask you out, I take you out for dinner, I pay for dinner, then I expect sex afterwards. I feel I am entitled to sex because I paid for you dinner. None of this is verbalized. ( I don't actually feel this way, this is an example)

The flip side, a girl meets a guy, she likes him, she was a COMMITMENT. She has sex with him to lure him into commitment. Nothing is overtly spoken. He pumps her, dumps her and hard nexts her. She is miserable and angry. She feels entitled to a commitment because she felt she gave something of immense value to trade for it.

There is NOTHING WRONG with a transaction situation if that's what is plainly stated. Plainly stated would be, "I'm investing in you as a person, I'm putting time, money and effort into helping you develop your life. In the end of this, I expect to see a return on this investment. I want fidelity and commitment and respect and if I can't have these things long term, I won't invest in you"

Or

"Listen lady, I'm just here for casual sex. I'm not looking for commitment of any kind. I won't pretend to want commitment to just have sex. If this isn't what you want, then we should not waste any more time and I wish you luck in pursuit of what you want long term for your goals"

Obviously there are gentler ways to be overt and direct about your intentions.

Best answer - Do things you want to do, but expect no return. If you have no expectations, you will never be disappointed.

Is it right to cheat? No, these guys are all worthless douchebags. If any of these women were my sisters, I'd literally gun down these dudes.

If you are in a LTR, make your expectations clear and overt.

If you are in a LTR, no matter how hard you vet, sadly to say it, but expect to be left at any time for any reason.

( Over time, seeing many friends or guys from college or guys I've worked with, seeing multiple divorces, cheating, domestic violence, infidelity, swinging, cuckolding, paternity fraud, lying, deceit, brutality, etc, nothing surprises me anymore, sadly so though. If someone I knew got cheated on by their spouse and their spouse was having sex with a farm animal, it would not surprise me at this point in my life. I don't think I'm fully jaded all the way around, I just realize most people can never truly "know" another person and even with strong vetting, it still comes down to trusting someone else with your emotional state. )

Sort of not a pleasant thing to say, people will do what is in line with their character. If you follow a person's character, their actions, most of them, become predictable. 100 percent? No, not that accurate, but I'd still say a good gauge.

A person who cheats in a LTR is a low character person. People will tend to bypass signs of low character for a couple of reasons i.e. they jumped into commitment too fast, didn't want or know how to read the red flags or their own poor character in place didn't see the problems evident ( i.e. a cheater doesn't see the moral conflicts of another cheater, I'm not saying your friends here cheated or would cheat though, it's again an example)

TL/DR

NO COVERT CONTRACTS. State your expectations clearly and upfront. If the nature of the discussion is purely transactional, then state that upfront
Do only things you want to do, without any regard for return ons said "investment" ( This is fundamentally why many people do or give to charity and never discuss it, the external validation of others approval with others hear about is a form of "payment" to some)
Be of high character and constantly filter out bad character. Spend the time to get to know someone before you commit to them.
Always be prepared to leave any relationship at any time and always be prepared that your LTR/co parent/spouse can leave at any time or any reason, even one you think is insanely stupid.

I dated a girl who put her ex BF through his Master Degree. They talked marriage and all that. The day he graduated and got his first big paying job, he dumped her. It's not just men getting hosed by women out there, lots of people are crappy about all of this, i.e the situation you describe.

This is inherently a risk any time you put yourself out there in a relationship. I'm not sure there's a full on way to mitigate it.

Dance like no one's watching Sing like no ones listening Love like you've never been hurt Live like it's heaven on Earth

That's the hard part, the new person isn't the old people, and it's hard to "Love like you've never been hurt" But it's the only chance anyone has to move on and find a good person after a bad experience. New people can't pay the tab of old people. Nor should you be expected to as well if you meet someone who was burned before.

For what it's worth, I'm sorry for the pain of your friends here. No one deserves that.

nonnimoose · 2017-02-21T18:47:24+00:00

I'm calling BS on the notion that a woman can make her "boyfriend/husband into the man that he is now." If these women wanted to become CEOs (or whatever level of achievement/status they feel they deserve) they should have put the effort into themselves instead of their men. Why didn't they? There are plenty of female CEOs out there, why aren't they one of them? They need to face the reality that while they (maybe) had the smarts, they didn't have the ambition and drive that their men did.

The fact that they now feel they deserve credit for their husband's financial success speaks volumes about their entitlement issues.

she had supported him with her high salary while he was studying his MBA (now she's a SAHM living on his salary).

She got exactly what she bargained for. She invested in his education and the return on that investment is she gets to stay home with her kids.

Wouldn't a man who chose a women who made him into a better man, cherish her?

So you think this guy is thinking, gee I'd be a loser shmuck instead of the successful attractive guy I am if I hadn't met my wife? That's laughable. Here's what he's really thinking

https://www.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/5o228b/can_you_imagine_where_youd_be_without_me/

Why did these men have affairs if his woman supported him and his successes?

Indeed, why. Maybe things were lacking in the bedroom. Maybe she got fat, boring, shrewish and generally unattractive. Maybe she was simply wonderful and he's an asshole. The only thing that's certain is the fact that her putting him through school in no way increased his sexual desire for her.

WholesomeAwesome · 2017-02-21T04:05:39+00:00

There could also be something with the man.

Title	Reoccurring problem
Author	vanBeethovenLudwig
Upvotes	12
Comments	52
Date	February 19, 2017 10:44 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/5v0yht/reoccurring_problem/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/reoccurring-problem.86988 https://theredarchive.com/post/86988

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