Is there something specific the MGTOWs want?

squidracer · 2016-08-04T20:53:21+00:00

I consider myself a less obsessed mgtow.. I want to bring back traditional families and the two parent household.. I think divorce culture is nothing more the grass is greener syndrome and most (not all) of the time nethier party is better off leaving their spouse in the long run. Specially the children..

Not sure what mgtow wants now, they seem to have become a very angry group.

darkmoon09 · 2016-08-04T20:33:58+00:00

MGTOWS are opting out of the game altogether because they see it as an unwinnable situation, some of them may prefer traditionalism when gender dynamics were more simpler, but they are also realists in that they know that society will never revert back to traditionalism; they also know that the direction society is heading is increasingly anti-male and so decide that they're not going to play by society's rules, a society that deems men expendable and disposable - they're just going to opt out, work on themselves and their careers and simply just be the best possible man they can be without female validation, this usually means swearing off marriage and LTRs, you're right that MGTOWs do hate traditionalism in that sense. Keep in mind being MGTOW doesn't necessarily mean going full monk mode, many MGTOWS still deal with women by on their own terms by platting, paying hookers, etc.

Also some of these "MGTOW" guys are kidding themselves: they're low-SMV beta/omega neckbeard types who very much want women, but the mountain they have to climb in order to improve is just too much for them so they've given up on themselves and only call themselves "MGTOW" to save face and ego-bruising.

prometheangambit · 2016-08-04T20:29:50+00:00

Depends on how recent and how long they've MGTOW'd, how healthy they are, personality type and age.

Three values off the top of my head as I procrastinate on my work:

Serenity - Peace and quiet. They don't want to be nagged, harassed, or bothered by irrational nonsense. This includes - mind you - that annoying, intrusive and pestering sex drive. The MGTOW forum spends a lot of time focused on women perhaps as a means to keep the sex drive in check. Also, getting raped by divorce courts or fired for sexual harassment is a HUGE destroyer of serenity, so they hate that as well.

Self-actualization - they wish to achieve their highest development or potential in their own way, on their own terms, from within not from without. Let everyone dance the monkey dance in the social hierarchy, MGTOW have their own internal hierarchy. This internal hierarchy may or may not attract women, and whether it does or not is irrelevant.

Authenticity - arguably, MGTOW and BPers agree here with the "Just be yourself." What if myself values philosophical conversations, deep talks about society, Austrian economics, and quantum theory inspired metaphysics? Pussy drying topics no doubt. So should a man change his behavior to please Lady Vagina? MGTOW say "Fuck that." TRP says "Treat women like women, and men like men. Save Socrates for the bros."

After that, it's pretty random and varies per MGTOW. Some MGTOW have girlfriends. Some stay celibate and cerebral. Some older bros got divorced already and pass down warnings. Not all MGTOW are like that or like the above.

PemBayliss · 2016-08-04T20:40:56+00:00

Depends on which MGTOWs you're talking about. MGTOWs are not a monolithic group.

Original MGTOWs have always been with us. Eternal bachelors who refused the "conventional" male paths of school, get job earning 500% more than you need, get married, have kids. They didn't necessarily avoid women; they had relationships that didn't involve marriage or children. Those men just want to be left alone to live their lives as they want.

Then there were activist MGTOWs like the guys at AVfM. These are MRAs, mostly burned by sexual/relationship failure or bitter divorces. They lost everything and are trying to piece their lives back together after a woman tornadoed her way through it. These men agitate for social and legal reforms to marriage, divorce, child support and other laws. These men are basically the gender flip side of legal reform feminists. Those men want attention for social, economic, medical and other issues pertaining specifically to men, and they want societal and legal changes. They are mostly ignored because at the end of the day, no one gives a shit about the plight of ordinary men.

Then there is the incel/omega crowd. These men either can't get women no matter how they improve, or can't or won't do the work to improve. These men want women, sex and relationships, but cannot get them and are seethingly frustrated, angry and resentful. The only reason they identify as MGTOW is because they can't get laid. If they get a girlfriend, they will drop MGTOW as fast as they drop their male friends.

These are the guys Captain Capitalism calls VGTOW (virgins going their own way). Incels and gammas/omegas have almost completely taken over MGTOW and now are by far its most visible and audible faction. This last faction wants sex, and can't get it. Despite their vocal outcries, they are mostly ignored too, because at the end of the day, no one gives a shit about unattractive men being unable to get laid.

DarkLord0chinChin · 2016-08-04T22:39:00+00:00

Freedom

AdamAJ · 2016-08-04T20:30:54+00:00

They are bitter about being pressed into gender roles that they couldn't dream of fulfilling and resent women both for denying them the time of the day; and also because feminism made the female role more of an optional thing while (they think) retaining the advantages of said role.

An absolute mess with no easy way out, no clear path to any ideal situation; lacking a definition for ideal, even. The problem there begins when they fuel a bunch of reactionary movements.

They make me pity them and worry about their effect, at once.

deskgrunt88 · 2016-08-04T19:59:35+00:00

They think that they will eventually change basic human relationship dynamics by boycotting marriage.

prodigy2throw · 2016-08-05T01:16:10+00:00

Pussy

tallwheel · 2016-08-05T08:00:03+00:00

They don't care about any "ideal world", they just want to be left alone.

future_space_boobs · 2016-08-04T19:59:58+00:00

I think more than any other "manosphere" group they're a bunch of guys who have been, in some way, hurt by women. There's no endgame or ideal world, they're commiserating. And very few of them, if the subreddit is accurately representative, actually "go their own way" at all. They just spend their energy stewing in a warm bath of resentment towards women instead of trying to seduce them.

XXYukieXX · 2016-08-04T19:58:44+00:00

An Asian woman XD

[deleted] · 2016-08-04T20:12:43+00:00

Disregarding relationships or giving up aren't exclusive to troubled men. All kinds of people don't make dating a priority, avoiding meeting new people in a romantic way due to complex issues. Some just don't have that opportunity and don't take any sort of action to change that.

Don't confuse this with MGTOW. Giving up on relationships isn't the purpose of the sub, it's a place, a mentality and an ideology designed towards hating women, and anything that doesn't fit their world narrative. By the way they talk about feminism and drop concepts like cultural marxism, I wouldn't be surprised if most of them were right wing, neo nazi internet fighters. Harmless, but still a group united by one goal: the irrational hate of women.

AutoModerator · 2016-08-04T19:38:21+00:00

Attention!

You can post off topic/jokes/puns as a comment to this Automoderator message.
For "CMV" and "Question for X" Threads: Parent comments that aren't from the target group will be removed, along with their child replies.
If you want to agree with OP instead of challenging their view or if the question is not targeted at you, post it as an answer to this comment.
OP you can choose your own flair, just press Flair under your post!

Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion!

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

goatismycopilot · 2016-08-04T23:49:52+00:00

Well, MGTOWS do not like me on account of being a woman human I do not have a problem with them wanting to live the single man lifestyle, the minimal lifestyle, the prepper lifestyle, the debt free lifestyle all while opting not to either form close relations with women, interact with women, have minimal contact with women. If they want to opt out of the game I get it, more than once I have though: hey if the zombie apocalypse happens and is just me and my dog I am ok with it.

[deleted] · 2016-08-05T16:27:00+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Uncurseme · 2016-08-05T02:08:45+00:00

I wouldn't consider myself MGTOW although I do occasionally browse that sub, but I do consider myself effectively MGTOW. I think as it stands now, I wouldn't want to have any relationship with about 99% of women. Modern western women are simply shit, they don't value virginity or sexual purity, and want to fuck as much as possible before marriage.

If I ever get married, it HAS to be to a woman who believes in waiting until marriage, is Catholic, and wants children, and is a loyal, kind, traditional, good person. Feminists and women say those kind of women don't exist any more "HURR DURR NO WOMEN ARE VIRGINS ANY MORE". Well, if that's the case, I guess I'm never going to get married or having a relationship, because I'd much rather be single forever than have a relationship with a non-virgin.

Noxin__Nixon · 2016-08-05T18:20:52+00:00

What is 'MGTOW' and why is TRP so obsessed with these asinine acronyms?

duckyhunter · 2016-08-05T18:59:31+00:00

I want real equality. I want women to suffer just as much as men. I want the value of women to plummet until even an addled homeless man would be wary of a gorgeous woman spread eagle in the middle of a street.

I wouldn't hate women if they just weren't of value to me. I hate them because they're an anti value. They make my work less enjoyable. They make my friendships less enjoyable. They are a population of miserable, boring nothings, and I want to expose them for it.

Put a woman in the body of a man and no one would give a shit about her. I want a world of women where that isn't true.

flamethrowup · 2016-08-05T19:50:52+00:00

We mainly want to be left alone. The fuel behind MGTOW is the recognition that that society's unrealistically positive view of women's moral character and the assignment of greater value to their lives than men means that they have more power to destroy our lives with impunity than most men do—false rape accusations, false domestic violence accusations, alimony, and so on.

This is why we avoid situations that put our well-being at the risk of women who can use the legal apparatus or social connections to destroy us on a whim. For this reason nearly every MGTOW avoids marriage, and almost all avoid cohabitation, but the extent of avoidance otherwise varies from person to person. Some sleep with women but avoid relationships. Some are voluntarily celibate. Some will actively avoid or repel women so they don't have to talk to them. PaulProteus has a great bit about how he lies that he cleans office buildings for a living so he doesn't have to talk to women at parties.

I don't want to feel obligated to marry women, have relationships with them, help them, die for them, care about them, or otherwise sacrifice my well-being for their sake. I am all for complete independence from the oppressive aspects of the male gender, and the freedom to not care about, help, or protect women is a critical part of that.

aanarchist · 2016-08-07T02:35:40+00:00

it's not that a traditionalist world is ideal, it's that it is necessary.

are you sure you want an answer to your question?

rulenumber303 · 2016-08-05T05:21:30+00:00

As far as I can tell from their behavior they want women to chase after them when they run away.

ifelsedowhile · 2016-08-05T09:52:17+00:00

I guess they want to reform divorce laws to make them more balanced and favorable to men.

Title	Is there something specific the MGTOWs want?
Author	ThatGreekLady
Upvotes	2
Comments	93
Date	August 4, 2016 7:38 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/4w6cvs/is_there_something_specific_the_mgtows_want/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/is-there-something-specific-the-mgtows-want.273737 https://theredarchive.com/post/273737

Comments