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UK: Police 'should tell men to stay indoors' when a killer is on the run

furchfur

September 28, 2021
453 upvotes
/r/MensRights
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10036343/Police-tell-men-stay-indoors-killer-run.html
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Title UK: Police 'should tell men to stay indoors' when a killer is on the run
Author

furchfur

Upvotes 453
Comments 161
Date September 28, 2021 12:18 PM UTC
(4 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/px55gy/uk_police_should_tell_men_to_stay_indoors_when_a/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/uk-police-should-tell-men-to-stay-indoors-when-a.1073788
https://theredarchive.com/post/1073788
Red Pill terms in post
feminism
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Comments

[–]mikesteane 162 points163 points164 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Presumably, they would make an exception for policemen. Except that the killer of Sarah Everard was just such a person.

[–]Vidar34 133 points134 points135 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

They won't accept comments on that article, the bloody cowards.

[–]40moreyears 22 points23 points24 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Always. Any article like this that would show a majority of people screaming bullshit about it they never let comments happen.

[–]aigars2 15 points16 points17 points 4 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Can't accept that for example a man was killed by his wife in sleep for assuming his unfaithful which turned out to be even false. So we should spread posters to not sleep in one bed with women and kick them out of homes?

[–]63daddy 153 points154 points155 points 4 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

  1. It says much about a society when misandrists feel free to print their hate speech in newspapers.

  2. Her analogy makes no sense. In the case of the Yorkshire Ripper, women weren’t told to stay indoors simply because a killer was on the run. They were told to take precautions because there was a mass murderer on the loose who was actively stalking and murdering women. It was very isolated and extreme situation. It says much that she has to base her reason on an incident that happened in one city over 40 years ago.

Update: If she thinks it’s wrong to have public service announcements aimed at protecting women, then that’s what she should argue. Saying men should stay inside isn’t a productive way to address such PSAs, it’s simply a poorly veiled excuse to promote misandry.

[–]andejoh 36 points37 points38 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

More men are killed than women. What does it say about how society values men that men haven't been given leaflets telling them how to stay safe?

[–]SpookeyClown 15 points16 points17 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Some 80% of all assaults are vs men.

[–]ShoutoutsToSimple 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You don't count as a victim unless the person victimizing you has different genitals. Everyone knows that.

[–]sleepyJoeBidet 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Because it is somehow significant that it is male on male violence.

[–]ShoutoutsToSimple 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

"Hey women, there's a killer specifically targeting women. You do what you want, but we advise you stay inside after dark for your own protection."

"Hey men, there's a killer out there who has the same genitals as you. So you are legally not allowed to leave your home, as we are just going to assume your penis means you are the killer."

Yep, totally the same thing! Feminist logic strikes again!

[–]TheSpaceDuck 19 points20 points21 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I remember when every time there was a Muslim terror attack there were people saying we should send Muslims away and others similar comments. What did we call those people? Ah yes, bigots.

[–]Dogrose22 62 points63 points64 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

She is our so called ‘victims commissioner’, in reality, she is a biased, misandrist who only advocates for women who claim to have been hurt by men. Her using the tragic death of this young woman in order to further her hate-filled agenda is typical of her selfish usage of a powerful position in order to harm a section of society that she has decided deserves to have no rights.

She consistently uses incorrect statistics and outright lies in order to push for men to be punished e.g. she lied about domestic violence against women rising during lockdown in the UK while deliberately dismissing and suppressing any assistance for Male domestic abuse victims and their children. You also never hear her speak out for other victims of women e.g. a woman murdered another woman recently in sheltered accommodation, hid her body and is on trial, a woman recently killed her baby and hid the body, a woman recently lied about being raped in a graveyard and caused police to carry out an investigation at the cost to the taxpayers and other victims, the countless other victims of female violence, sexual violence and false allegations that are tucked away in dark corners of media reports, you will never hear this person advocate for these victims because she has a sinister obsession with assaults reported by women against men, especially if they involve sexual assault - she cares nothing for genuine victims, regardless of their gender, only for feeding her twisted obsession.

[–]furchfur[S] 12 points13 points14 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You are right. A real man hater.

[–]aigars2 51 points52 points53 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Like there's no women who kill men. But who cares if a man dies.

[–]40moreyears 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Women are celebrated as brave if they cut off men’s penises ( Bobbit ) so that tells you all you need to know.

[–]spvcebound 8 points9 points10 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They get their own Netflix show

[–]chrisorwhatever 48 points49 points50 points 4 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

What are they going to do if we refuse to stay indoors?

[–]Magnum007 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Where have you been for the last 18 months?

[–]chrisorwhatever 12 points13 points14 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Going outside every day

[+]TheGreatIllien -63 points-62 points-61 points 4 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

What are YOU going to do when they start the arrests?

EDIT: I should clarify, I made this comment because even if this guy refuses to stay indoors, the moment the first arrests are made all of these people standing for their freedoms will crumple and stay home. Hopefully that doesn’t happen, but I’m pointing out the reality, you can continue to get mad if you please.

[–]expiredyoghurtcase 25 points26 points27 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

*WE

[+]TheGreatIllien -24 points-23 points-22 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I’m not in the UK, that’s not a “we” for me. I couldn’t do anything no matter how hard I tried. Point being, everyone talks a big game but when the government steps on their necks they do fuck all.

[–]SpiceHogs 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

What are you babbling on about you fucking buffoon?

[+]TheGreatIllien -7 points-6 points-5 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I’ve made it very clear, friend.

EDIT: The same thing happens with most schmucks that stand for guns. They talk a big game and hate on the ATF (fuck the ATF) but when any laws come rolling in and when the government cracks down or bans things they comply. Same shit here.

[–]DouglasWallace 32 points33 points34 points 4 years ago (82 children) | Copy Link

It's almost as though people don't know that men are the majority victims of violence, and men are the majority of people who chase down and catch murderers.

[+]lux-33 -41 points-40 points-39 points 4 years ago (81 children) | Copy Link

And who commits the majority of violence?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 27 points28 points29 points 4 years ago (39 children) | Copy Link

Why the fuck does that matter?

But fine: Criminals. Criminals commit the majority of violence, and everybody should be equally protected from them.

[+]lux-33 -41 points-40 points-39 points 4 years ago (38 children) | Copy Link

And the vast majority of criminals are...men.

Why wouldn't it matter? If the gender of the victims matters (as OP claims it does) then why doesn't the gender of the perpetrator?

Agreed. Both genders should feel safe from violence. But if one gender is causing the vast majority of the violence then that is worth considering when working toward a solution.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 25 points26 points27 points 4 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

If the gender of the victims matters (as OP claims it does) then why doesn't the gender of the perpetrator?

OP's point had nothing to do with the gender of the victim, it was about police giving sexist recommendations, and then you cast all men as complicit in the violence criminals produce, like a sexist bigot, and implied they deserve different treatment because they share a biological trait with those criminals.

Criminals are by and large individuals with troubled lives, and that happens to affect men more than women. Correlation does not imply causation. You are making the same argument that it is acceptable to be racist to black people because in the USA they are disproportionately likely to be violent offenders. This "hot take" completely ignores that there are other things that make someone more likely to be a criminal, and those other things are applied more often to black people, and to men, which is why you're a sexist shit.

You also ignore that one gender often coerces/manipulates/threatens the other gender into doing violence on their behalf, so if you want to get into which gender is more of a piece of shit, i've got some really bad news for you: You're just blind to the faults of one of them.

Like, i would explain how most baby killers are women, but i'm guessing you're not the type to hold women accountable for their actions, and it's somehow a man's fault there, too.


Edit: Kinda funny how this is the one comment he hasn't responded to

[–]Filo_F 23 points24 points25 points 4 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Technically same about black people lmao

[+]lux-33 -14 points-13 points-12 points 4 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Exactly. Isn't it worth examining why that is so we can find the root causes of issues that lead to violence?

Why ignore statistical realities? There are many societal issues that lead to men committing more crime – if we ignore those then we aren't going to get anywhere.

[–]Filo_F 18 points19 points20 points 4 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

Hmm... I actually thought you're one of the BLM radical feminists, but you're actually staying consistant... While i kind of disagree with you i can kinda respect that

[–]lux-33 -2 points-1 points0 points 4 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Certainly not a BLM radical feminist. Just a guy who thinks both the gender of the victim and perpetrator should be considered when looking at crime and the underlying societal issues that cause it. There are plenty of legitimate "men's issues" that lead to higher crime rates in my opinion.

I suppose that makes me a radical in an echo chamber like this. Cheers.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 17 points18 points19 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yet all you seem to want to do is focus on the "man" part of criminal stats, and not the "mens issues" part.

[–]dungeonmonkey69 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah fair re mens issues causing higher crime rate. Fatherlessness, lower access to higher education, sexist laws, sentencing gap, social alienation from a misandric society, stagnant median wages in comparison to women. Not surprised more men are crims tbh.

[–]Filo_F 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

It doesnt. It's just that there is a small flood of people like that and my brain put you in the same category as them. I mislabeled and mistreated you. My bad man, the human genome sucks

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 11 points12 points13 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I mislabeled and mistreated you

Dude, i don't think you did

[–]IceyMan45 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (18 children) | Copy Link

The gender of the perpetrator of a crime shouldn't matter, the same way a woman's dress shouldn't matter when she's sexually harassed.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

If it doesn't matter then why do criminal profilers always include gender in their profile? The gender of the perpetrator says a lot about the motivations of the crime – it can also give insights into any structural issues that led to it.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

it can also give insights into any structural issues that led to it

And where, in anything relating to or around the posted article, are people talking about the issues men face that lead them to this? Are they instead just accusing men of and treating men like criminals, like the whole "teach men not to rape" nonsense? Are the people who are causing problems likely to even listen to this?

No, you went to a different population of men, stated that a criminal's gender is intrinsically related to how much violence they are likely to commit, whined about how no one takes you seriously instead of talking about the reasons men are over represented in these stats in the first place

So, i might believe you if anyone except me and people arguing like me are the ones bringing up any issues men face, you and all the people in the posted article are fine treating this as a "man" problem, and not going any further than that.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

That's exactly my point lol. If you don't accept the fact that men commit the vast majority of violent crime, then how are you ever going to have a serious look into what issues lead to that?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 12 points13 points14 points 4 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Well, one of the issues is that when people do sexist things, other people show up and say "yeah, but men are committing more violence, so this is justified" just like in america they had the whole "Yeah, but blacks are committing more violence, so this is justified" leading to a whole bunch of racial profiling, stop and frisk laws, and other shit that took decades to undo and most of it is still an issue.

Reducing the complexity of the problem to their gender is the problem here, not the fact that a criminal, or the majority of them, happen to be male. You understand that many laws are written specifically to get more men in prison, right? and those laws get pushed by people using your logic, which puts more men in the prison system, making them more violent by exposing them to more violent offenders and restricting them from aid, making the sexist shits even more sure about their sexist solution that isn't helping the problem.

[–]lux-33 -3 points-2 points-1 points 4 years agolocked comment (8 children) | Copy Link

Yup and who wrote the vast majority of those laws genius? Men.

Look no further than Biden's 94 crime bill.

[–]Magnum007 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

You're going down a slippery slope and I'm here to warn you.

What if we did this with race? Suspect is black, all black people have to stay home..

What if we did it with religion? Suspect is Muslim, all muslim men must stay home...

Do you now see how stupid your argument is?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Do you now see how stupid your argument is?

He literally doesn't, I've been talking to him a while.

Sexist trolls gonna sexistly troll

[–]SokalDidNothingWrong 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Lux seems to be a bad-faith troll - https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/px55gy/uk_police_should_tell_men_to_stay_indoors_when_a/henawn5/?context=3

edit: Maaaybe not, but they are contrarian and don't explain themselves very well.

[–]lux-33 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Sigh. You're not following the point.

If a Christian shoots up a mosque (or vice versa), you examine whether their faith had anything to do with the crime. Not looking into that potential link would be foolish.

In the same way, someone's gender should be considered when untangling the motivations for a given crime. It may or may not be relevant in that particular instance but it shouldn't be ignored.

[–]Magnum007 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Those are important when looking for a particular suspect. You can't then turn around and breach the rights of others because of one individual's actions.

[–]peter_venture 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

But is that what is happening now? No, we just bemoan the fact that women are victims of violence and then ignore the fact that more men are victims. That's not looking for a solution at all when the majority of victims are ignored.

[–]IceyMan45 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Not really lmao. If you really cared about the victims you wouldn't care about the gender of the perpetrator... a man could murder someone and it would (or should, rather) be no different to if a woman murders the person. The fact that you choose to highlight the perpetrator's gender to try dismiss the crimes shows you don't care about the victims, you only look for the gender of who commits the crime to find a way to blame men.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

There's no need to "find a way to blame men". Statistics show that men are overwhelmingly responsible for violent crimes.

If we want to protect BOTH men and women, we need to do more to figure out why that is and address the root causes.

[–]IceyMan45 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Criminals are criminals, their gender doesn't matter and literally has nothing to do with the crime. Male or female, the damage has been done to the victim already and pointing out that the perpetrator is male to try dismiss it or make it seem less worse isn't helping. You're turning this into a gender war.

[–]lux-33 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Such simplistic thinking. If gender doesn't have anything to do with crime why do FBI profilers always include gender?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

They also include if they were wearing a red shirt, or high heels.

Should we profile everyone wearing red shirts, too?

(and also the FBI is an incredibly sexist organization, who doctor the definition of rape to exclude most female perpetrators. So you're whole "who's doing most of the violence" is leaving more than a few things out.)

[–]lux-33 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

So you truly don't think it's worthwhile exploring why roughly 88% of homicides in the US are committed by men?

[–]ElPercebe69 13 points14 points15 points 4 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Most crimes and violent crimes are committed by poor people, so we should do a curfew for poor people, and have stronger penalties for poor people that commit a violent crime.

Good logic

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Nope. We should investigate why poor people commit more crime and find solutions to rectify that situation (affordable housing, jobs programs, etc.).

Not rocket science my friend. Just a simple examination of causal relationships.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 12 points13 points14 points 4 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

yes, and who is more likely to be poor and not have government support for that? (75% of homeless are men)

but, to you, that's a man problem, not a poor problem

and you still don't get why people are upset with you

[–]notascaffoldingpole 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Plenty of rich people commit crime. Poor people. Ight be more likely to steal or whatever but rich people have just as much chance of being violent as anyone else ....

[–]ElPercebe69 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They commit crime too as women commit crimes too but the majority of crimes, yes, even violent crimes are committed mostly by poor people.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Lol by your own logic, we should just ignore the fact that 75% of the homeless population is male rather than investigating why that is.

That's all I'm saying about violent crime. Admit that men commit the overwhelming majority of it and try to figure out why.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 8 points9 points10 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Admit that men commit the overwhelming majority of it

You've yet to respond to anyone's point that women have a lot of loopholes to these stats, and the hill you seem to want to die on is that "ADMIT MEN COMMIT THE VIOLENCE".

You're not in here talking about why "men commit the violence", you only seem to care that people acknowledge that they do, and you ignore all the people telling you why saying that is a shit thing to do.

[–]lux-33 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Yes, men commit violence for a variety of reasons. Some of those are certainly tied to gender norms and expectations. But asking why men commit the vast majority of violence is the first step to actually untangling why that is.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

But you're not untangling why it is, you're blaming men.

When do you move to the untangling part? I'm very curious

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

When do you? You're seemingly dead-set on deflecting blame despite the statistical evidence staring you in the face.

[–]DouglasWallace 8 points9 points10 points 4 years ago* (8 children) | Copy Link

People commit the majority of crime. People who have mostly been brought up by women.

You're interested in which sex those people are, I suppose, though I don't see why that matters (if someone bashes you on the head to steal your money, do you really care what sex or gender they are?). Well, I've looked into the data, wanting to prove or disprove the commonly-accepted notion that men commit most crime. But what I found was that:

1) most crime is not solved, the perpetrator remains unknown; and

2) because men are treated more seriously by courts, police have a tendency to spend their limited resources chasing down men rather than women, so the proportion of people in court who are men is skewed (I know of no study to quantify by how much men are over-represented in courts).

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 7 points8 points9 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

warning my dude, this guy has no deeper thoughts than "Men are the violent gender", and will die on that hill

[–]DouglasWallace 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I find that many people hold this "men commit more crime" view. It's 'common knowledge'.

It was actually a retired policeman who helps me understand things from the police view who pulled me up short when I made that common claim. He said that any honest policeman will admit that they don't really know who commits most crime. It is feasible that more men that women do, but it is also feasible that women are better at avoiding detection and he explained that police—with a duty to reduce crime on a limited budget—will target men because men tend to get dealt with by the CPS (Britain's public prosecutor) and by the courts. Even if a policeman does catch a female criminal, she is far less likely to be punished for her crime.

So, when you take into account that most crime is not solved—the perpetrator is unknown—there really is no way to know who commits most crime.

[–]lux-33 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

Aha the level of delusion in the sub is incredible. The statistics don't lie about which gender commits the vast majority of violence.

​

People who have mostly been brought up by women.

Are you targeting single mothers with this or just mothers in general?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 12 points13 points14 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I mean, they both have a lot to answer for.

And single mother households provably produce more violent adults

Edit: Actually, wait, YOU DID IT AGAIN!

You: "lets admit men are violent so we can talk about why"

Him: "talking about why"

You: "NO NO NO. ADMIT THEY ARE MORE VIOLENT THAN WOMEN"

[–]DouglasWallace 7 points8 points9 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Show me statistics that prove who commits the majority of violence. I have looked for such and, on examination, found that none actually do (though there are many that make the claim). What statistics are these that you say don't lie? Point to them, please.

​

>People who have mostly been brought up by women.
Are you targeting single mothers with this or just mothers in general?

I am not targeting anyone. Are you denying that it is mothers who primarily bring up children?

[+][deleted] 4 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh like he gives a shit about that, lol

Would love a that link to bookmark tho

[–]lux-33 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Which study? Link it and I'll give it a read.

[+][deleted] 4 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Statistically, most violent crime is committed by men.

Most men are not violent criminals. There's a very clear distinction there.

​

ignoring ton of stuff that's committed equally by men and women (sexual violence, domestic violnce)

Have a source for that?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You mean, like you don't for most of the stats you post about?

[–]SokalDidNothingWrong 4 points5 points6 points 4 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link

Obviously larger, stronger people cause more serious violent crimes, for the same reason why good-natured Labradors cause more serious attacks than vicious little corgis.

We need to also investigate why men don't commit more crime. Maybe gender roles actually reduce domestic violence.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

Obviously larger, stronger people cause more serious violent crimes

A study of close to 1 million men actually found that, among men, "shorter stature was associated with increased risk of violent offending".

Source.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Well, yeah, anyone who's known a women or Chihuahua knows small size is positively correlated to aggression

But, again, you limit your sources on aggression or violence to men only

[–]lux-33 -2 points-1 points0 points 4 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Actually, I was simply pointing out that size does not necessarily correlate to aggression. Meaning that anyone, of any size, has the capacity to be aggressive/violent.

However, the reality is that men commit 88% percent of violent crime in the US. A number that is certainly even higher in more male-dominated societies.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

However, the reality is that men commit 88% percent of violent crime in the US. A number that is certainly even higher in more male-dominated societies.

aaaand way to bring it back to "Men are the problem!"

See, we know you're sexist because you added the second paragraph, instead of stopping at the first one, in case you're still confused.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

It's not "sexist" – it's the statistical reality. Why men commit more crime is another question altogether.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

It is sexist, because not a single person here ever claimed your stats weren't accurate, they (and me) are saying (repeatedly) that you throwing it in people's face as a "men are the problem" is sexist, and you won't stop, any discussion on anything related to why you continue like a broken record with your (uncited) stats and ignore anything else anyone says, unless it's a condemnation of you personally and then its: "Men are the problem, and so are you"

Seriously, do you have anything else to say beyond "look guys! this (uncited) stat i keep pushing says men are the majority of (convicted) criminals, men are the problem!"

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I do. What I am trying to get through to you is that your problems are overwhelmingly caused by other men, not women. You're scapegoating women to hide yourself from that harsh reality.

[–]SokalDidNothingWrong 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Can't get the source, but I'd guess it's hard to disentangle things like childhood nutrition (well-off people tend to be taller).

Wait, I found the article:

However, when simultaneously controlling for all measured confounders, height was weakly and positively related to violent crime.

So the study you linked really shows the opposite to what you said.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link

You're reading that part wrong. It's saying that height is a factor in violent crime, albeit not that significant of a factor. It's using 'height' in the sense of a generic factor rather than indicating "shorter" or "taller".

I quoted the primary conclusion: "shorter stature was associated with increased risk of violent offending".

[–]SokalDidNothingWrong 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

No you didn't.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24453240/

Conclusions: Although shorter stature was associated with increased risk of violent offending, our analyses strongly suggested that this relationship was explained by intelligence and other confounding factors. Hence, it is unlikely that height, a highly heritable physical characteristic, accounts for much of the unexplained heritability of violent criminality.

If you literally crop out that "although" in a sentence, you're not arguing in good faith.

[–]lux-33 -2 points-1 points0 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

So you've essentially proven my point. Which is that your original comment of "obviously larger, stronger people cause more serious violent crime" is incorrect.

Also "accounts for much of the unexplained heritability of violent criminality" means that it could still account for some of it.

[–]SokalDidNothingWrong 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What's your point?

All other things being equal, larger stronger people cause more serious violent crime.

If you asked me to qualify it, you'd be right. But you're arguing in bad faith because you're saying the evidence refutes my main point, despite your evidence merely backing it up (with a qualification).

[–]notascaffoldingpole -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Exactly what I was thinking, not sure why you're being downvoted so much

[–]j0k3ricu 33 points34 points35 points 4 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

Feminist logic:- Killer could be a man. If we ask men to stay indoor, then the law obeying killer would go to his house.

[–]LettuceBeGrateful 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

"Hey Dave, it's getting dark. Do you mind walking me back to my place?"

"Sorry Sara, all men are under curfew. That also applies to the guy who's been going around stabbing people, though, so I'm sure you'll be safe."

"..."

[–]SporkTornado 4 points5 points6 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

United Kingdom murder victims are 70% male and 30% female, and the overwhelming majority of victims of stranger violence are male. And no one seems to really give a shit about male victims anyway. So you might as well keep yourself safe by staying indoors.

[–]TracyMorganFreeman 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ah so that way they can say "any man that is outside is either a killer or doesn't care enough about women's feelings to put their fears at ease."

So when the killer now has more vulnerable targets available and fewer people to surveil or defend said targets they can then shame men for being so violent and letting it happen.

The irony of this is that it's because they care about women's safety over anything else, but in doing so they're going to make women less safe and further any trust issues women have of men-which will further dissuade men from helping women, and hey look a feedback loop of misandry and misogyny, brought to you by the self asserted authorities on bigotry.

[–]g1455ofwater 16 points17 points18 points 4 years ago (39 children) | Copy Link

Of the 758 recorded homicides in Great Britain in 2019/20, 551 of the victims were male and 207 of the victims were female.

​

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1221306/homicides-in-britain-by-gender/

​

Vera Baird should be rebuked for the discriminatory narrative she is peddling.

[+]lux-33 -10 points-9 points-8 points 4 years ago (38 children) | Copy Link

And who committed most of the homicides?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 19 points20 points21 points 4 years ago* (9 children) | Copy Link

Again, troll, criminals commit the homicides, and everybody is equally entitled to police and societal protection from criminals.

Not whomever you think the criminals look like the most, you sexist shit.


Edit: Moving this higher so people know what a sexist troll looks like

"just admit you want to blame men for society's problems"

Bingo. Now you're getting it. Men are definitely to blame for the bulk of society's problems. That doesn't mean men are exclusively to blame nor does it mean that the average man is to blame.

But does the male gender fuel most of the world's problems? That's incontrovertible at this point.

[+]lux-33 -9 points-8 points-7 points 4 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Just because someone disagrees with you they are not automatically a "troll".

It's not about what criminals "look like", it's what the statistics say about them. And the statistics show that the vast majority are men. I'm not sexist because I point out the reality.

To ensure equal "police and societal protection" it's worth examining why men commit the overwhelming majority of violent crime.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 12 points13 points14 points 4 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

You're a troll because you came into a mens rights thread and said something incredibly sexist against men.

If i went into a sub for black people and said "Yeah, but which race is committing most of the homocides?" I'd rightly be shouted out, banned, and called a troll for being a racist PoS.

Just like you, now, but with sexism instead of racism. So, congrats on that?

[–]lux-33 -5 points-4 points-3 points 4 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I come to this subreddit because I'm a man who's curious about these issues and wants to live in a society with other good men. I don't know why you're hell-bent on deflecting the blame away from violent men – we should be united against that.

But sure, shout me down and call me names. Great way to have a conversation and help people understand your side – cheers mate.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 15 points16 points17 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

I'm defecting blame from men, which it shouldn't be directed at, and putting it back where it belongs: on criminals.

Yes i'm quick to the names, because people who come in with comments like yours are often here just to shit on the men here.

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

You're quick to names because you clearly don't have a great handle on your emotions. Don't shift the blame to me because you're incapable of having a level-headed conversation.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Haha, because you can tell my emotions through text, huh?

Fucker i'm quick to names because bigots deserve name calling, and we live in a very name calling heavy world. Taking the high road doesn't benefit you here, and you can question my handle on my emotions when you've come up with a valid logical counter argument to the holes people are blowing in your comments.

[–]lux-33 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I've presented a few logical counterpoints. But sure, stay angry – people like you are the reason no one takes this subreddit seriously. Which is somewhat unfortunate as there are plenty of legitimate issues facing men.

[–]TheSpaceDuck 7 points8 points9 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's not about what criminals "look like", it's what the statistics say about them.

Are you talking about men or black people?

[–]Filo_F 12 points13 points14 points 4 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link

Black people. Are you gonna be racist now because of that? 🤔

[–]lux-33 -3 points-2 points-1 points 4 years ago (26 children) | Copy Link

Black communities have higher incidences of violent crimes for a range of socioeconomic factors.

In the same way, men don't commit crimes at higher rates for no reason. Ignoring the fact that they are responsible for most crime prevents us from actually addressing underlying issues.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 11 points12 points13 points 4 years ago (23 children) | Copy Link

Ok, so you defended black people with "a range of socioeconomic factors", instead of saying at the top level "Black people commit most of the homicides"

And then when it's men instead of black people, you do the opposite of that

[–]lux-33 -3 points-2 points-1 points 4 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link

Nope. I'm saying that there are clearly underlying reasons why men commit the vast majority of violent crime. By ignoring the fact that they do, you'll never get closer to understanding those reasons.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 11 points12 points13 points 4 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link

By ignoring the fact that they do, you'll never get closer to understanding those reasons.

You mean, ignoring them like you are now, to push that it's men, not violent sociopathic people, but MALE violent sociopathic people that society needs protection against, and that you damn sure need to make sure people know?

[–]lux-33 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

Here's a statistic on sociopathy:

ASPD is 2–3% of the population — This constitutes a prevalence of 3.42–5.34% in men, and 0.44–0.86%.

Again, men are far more likely to be sociopaths. So to answer your questions, yes.

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 8 points9 points10 points 4 years ago* (18 children) | Copy Link

Gender also seems to play a role in ASPD, as males are 3 to 5 times more likely to be diagnosed with ASPD than females

Seems to, in a paper written by women, in a field dominated by women, men get diagnosed with antisocial personality disorder at a much higher rate than girls.

OMG i'm shocked, my worldview is changed, so glad psychology doesn't have a fucking terrible replication crisis and massive proven gender bias (like the APA advocating therapy for men focus on "toxic masculinity")

[–]lux-33 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years agolocked comment (17 children) | Copy Link

By your stellar logic, let's just discount every other scientific field dominated by men.

The level of mental gymnastics you're doing to dodge the reality that men are the more violent gender is actually quite impressive.

[–]Acrobatic_Sport_7664 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

But you really are

[–]LettuceBeGrateful 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Actually, "maleness" is causing this pathological behavior

This right here, combined with the comment I'm responding to, is where you laid bare the double standards of your bigotry.

When someone brought up black people, you immediately jumped to external causation. When the conversation below shifted back to men, you didn't grant them the same grace of being victim to external factors, which even your link supports.

You've got a blatant double standard here, and it's no wonder people are frustrated by it.

[–]dadibom 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Noone is ignoring that fact. It is simply irrelevant to the topic, being the suggestion "tell men to stay inside" as a way to reduce crime, just like we won't say "tell black people to stay inside" for the same reason.

[–]Living-Reference5329 21 points22 points23 points 4 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Wasn’t long ago the Green Party. Tried introducing a 6pm curfew for all men 😂😂 that was because of the copper who killed that lass

[–]expiredyoghurtcase 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Fuckin greens man... vote fuckin Niko Omilana he's a more sound politician

[–]Living-Reference5329 -3 points-2 points-1 points 4 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Ndl for life( niki defence)

[+]Mousetaurus -8 points-7 points-6 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

That was after the cops told women not to go out alone lmfao. The whole thing was fucking hilarious wasn’t it 🤣🤣🤣

[–]Living-Reference5329 4 points5 points6 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

It does get ridiculous. They talk about “protected characteristics “ then just ignore that

[+]Mousetaurus -8 points-7 points-6 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Well the cops told women they were being specifically targeted. I guess they didn’t find that amusing.

[–]TheSuperPie89 7 points8 points9 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If they know the killer is male, fair enough, provided they do the same to women if they know the killer is female.

Otherwise, assuming every murderer is a man is fucking dehumanizing as shit and absolute bs

[–]VeteranOfDepression 4 points5 points6 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Or they could have potential targets stay inside or go out with people. Like for example, a murderer that primarily goes for the elderly. Or a serial killer that only kills young boys and girls. It makes more sense than keeping all men indoors when the murderer is only looking for female victims.

[–]Rol9x 11 points12 points13 points 4 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Yes, I think the police was completely wrong. They should not tell women to stay indoors. Women are free, strong and independent, they can defend themselves if a killer on the loose might attack them.

I mean, if men are not told to stay in, why should women be told that? Aren't they smart enough to imagine the danger about a killer on the run? I mean, women are always considerate and careful, arent they?

[–]Zombiepizzachef -5 points-4 points-3 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Please, go outside and get arrested. That would do us all a favor.

[–]Rol9x 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Well, I understand that would be the case in a feminazi state. But we are not there yet. So crawl back under your rock and only open your mouth when you can actually say something smart.

[+]Zombiepizzachef -6 points-5 points-4 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Oh my god. Did you even read the article? They don't want men outside so they don't get confused with the murder you UTTER Buffon.

[–]Rol9x 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I see you're having a very productive morning. Is this some part of a feministas gang induction ritual, but instead of drive-shooting you need to fire as many comments as you can to prove that your stupid enough for their standards? Well, you can go there and tell them you've done it. I can sign a recommendation letter for you.

[–]Zombiepizzachef -3 points-2 points-1 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's a no, I didn't read the article. Moron.

[–]EmptinessWithin 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Well, the majority of victims of non-domestic murders through craziness and robbery are men. Why isn't that brought up?

[–]day5tar 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Except they never do anything about violence against men

[–]BrokeMacMountain 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

And if we dont who is going to stop us?

Also, according to toxic feminists, as man I am unlikely to be raped or killed. Unlike 110% of all women. Therefore, it the women who should stay at home, where they are safe, and us men can go about our lives, safe in the knowledge we will never be murdered or abused. .........

..... well except for the fact that men are more likely to be murdered than women, and face more abuse than women, especially in a domestic setting.

But, sure. lets not think things through or be rational. Noooooo, lets all be hyper reactionary and hysterical instead. ffs

[–]leachlurker 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Why is country so sexist ):

[–]rainbow_bro_bot 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Don't the feminists who spout this crap realise they are just going to lose all PR with men (half the population)? Spewing man-bashing nonsense generally doesn't make men suddenly go "gosh she's right, I am a bad person and I better start doing what she says!".

[–]ohmygoshimdrowning 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Well, they're women, so no.

[–]theCourtofJames 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Why don't they just ask everyone to stay off the streets until the killer is found? Dunno why this keeps getting gendered.

[–]vwatchrepair 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Then when killer breaks into another woman's home and does more harm......

......."wHeRe wErE aLL tHe mEn?!?!?!??"

[–]Hollowhowler100 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They do know that women can kill people too right?

[–]ReasonableSignature7 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This is how women feel, bloody angry at the very few who ruin it for the many.

[–]Xx24reminder 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Isn't that safer for men?

[–]Brave-Evidence2793 9 points10 points11 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yuuuuuuuuuuuup.

They decided to be sexist and blame all men for the actions of criminals, and if these recommendations were followed the only thing that would happen is victim stats for men dropping and victim stats for women rising.

It is literally like they don't think, at all.

[–]Xx24reminder -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's not something to complain about then. Just another dub brought home for men

[–]VeteranOfDepression 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Forcing men to stay indoors= Less men outdoors= less male targets = more female targets = more female victims = blame men for the increase in violence against women = repeat.

How exactly is this going to help anyone? I doubt anyone would follow it but still.

[–]awsdlefthandbutton 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Anyone ever looked up the suffragettes? Strong women, intelligent, willing to go to prison for their beliefs (and this was Victorian prisons mind you). Has the qualities of feminists gone down hill since? Now it just seems to be soundbites to keep a person's name out there.

[–]LoneArcher96 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I just looked it up (and also Victorian), and first I thank you for making me learn new stuff today (not a native English speaker), and I gotta say I wholeheartedly agree with your comment.

[–]Traditional_Job2467 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

It's as if they can't understand that a killer can GASP "follow the rules" to hide within crowds

[–]Living-Reference5329 8 points9 points10 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

God forbid the killer identifies as a woman... police can’t just assume identity;)

[–]Stonkman3 -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

She looks like a dog

[–]BenTVNerd21 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't remember much complaints about telling people to be careful with valuables and to avoid certain areas when muggings and robberies happen. It's not victim blaming it's advice so I don't understand why it's considered so out of line to do the same for women especially when a murderer is on the loose.

If I had children I would tell both genders to be careful when out at night alone especially if they've been drinking. Obviously we should not have to live like that but it isn't a perfect world unfortunately. If anyone does get robbed/raped/murdered alone at night they shouldn't be blamed 100%

[–]sumfacilispuella 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

is this a serious suggestion? ive seen things like this said before as a response to the police telling women to just not go anywhere until the person is caught

[–]RottingVillain666 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Take this as a gold opportunity. Stay at home guys, stop working, make your female partners do everything for you. That’s how some of us would have took it.

[–]BrokeMacMountain 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Sorry for the double posting, but i had to mention there was a thread a few months ago along a similar theme.

We discussed what would happen if all men were made to stay indoors, and how society would collapse. Same thing eould happen ehre.

[–]Flipside07 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Nobody should have to stay indoors, be aware sure, but not locked in gheir own homes.

[–]sleepyJoeBidet 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Why all men will be shot on sight ???

It makes people feel unsafe ???

It is assumed the perpetrator will be make, will hang around after the news gets out and so it can reasonably be concluded any man still on the street is up to no good ?

The bald face idiocy of some people is would be hilarious if it didn't come from those who have bullied their way to power

[+][deleted] 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]VeteranOfDepression 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Who?

[–]8P_XD 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

What was this?

[–]VeteranOfDepression 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Something along the lines of "whys that ugly dog off her leash." I don't remember exactly

[–]Stonkman3 -3 points-2 points-1 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The hideous commissioner. Who else?

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