Q4Men: Men of PPD, how many of you had a male mentor to teach you social/sexual game when you were growing up? Can you elaborate on your mentorship experience? And how did the presence (or lack) of a mentor affect your life?

OfSpock · 2017-06-07T20:53:44+00:00

1) I had a dad and other adults who taught me beta/omega "game". These people acted as though the SMP and MMP had not changed at all. I was prepared for marketplaces that last existed around 1960.

2) It was a 20 year exercise in bombardment and deluges of Blue Pill training. "Be nice, be yourself!" "Someone will love you just for who you are!" "Don't change! If you change everyone will think you're fake!" "Girls don't like those good looking guys. Looks don't matter (all that much)". "The only girls who like good looking guys are stupid, slutty, shallow, broken or crazy. You don't want one of those girls anyway." "Nice Guys are sexually attractive. Girls love to date, marry and have sex with nice, kind, affable, friendly, morally good, churchgoing men."

3) The presence of these mentors and their malpractice ruined my sex life and relationships, put me at a 30-year delay disadvantage, and almost got me divorced and thus almost ruined the lives of my kids. I'm still dealing with the fallout. I'm still repairing the damage.

DB605 · 2017-06-07T21:22:25+00:00

I did not have a mentor. When I was young, I was good friends with several Chad's though.

The first tore families apart lol. A female acquaintance of mine I introduced him to decided she was in love with him. He kinda strung her along because she wasn't sure if he really wanted her) then a while later, he met her hotter cousin and the cousin decided after about a day that she was also in love with him, which made the first girl furious because her cousin was hotter and he started ignoring her. Oh, her black friend also decided she was in love with him too, but that he wouldn't go for her because she wasn't entertaining enough so maybe if she gave some blowjobs, he'd take an interest in her. He was more of the bad boy type.

The second one a star athlete who was derpy as hell but a really chill guy. Girls used to fight over who got to take him on a date that week. He eventually got a girlfriend, who was also a friend of mine. This hot redhead but when I met her she was kinda punky. Like Avril Lavigne was her idol, but he didn't like that so he said he'd only give her a shot of she dressed more feminine, so like literally the next day she started wearing body Con dresses and heels and that's all she wore for the next 4, yrs.

I sat down with both of them to ask what it was that makes women insane over them. The bad boy said "bro, I just talk to them till they like me". Not very useful.

The athlete basically just said "get swole", which in hindsight was solid advice though, many guys were also successful without having giant muscles like the other star athlete at our school who was just as good; a little Spanish guy named Bryant who we called "two point Bryant" because he had a three way with Elizabeth and Kate, two super hot blonde girls.

Anyways, that's basically my male mentorship as far as living people I know in real life go. Apex males have very little useful information for those of us who aren't already apex. It wasn't until I started watching David DeAngelo seminars and meeting Tyler D (RSDOwen) that I really started to understand how alien women are and how they work.

I literally know a SJW Chad right now who thinks being their friend is the most effective method, lmao.

wub1234 · 2017-06-07T21:17:49+00:00

Yeah, I had a sexual mentor. He was extremely old, four foot tall, with a ball head on top and long white hair at the back, and he carried a staff with him at all times, and spoke in riddles.

No, wait a minute, that was the dungeon master from Dungeons and Dragons. No-one has a mentor in real life.

grandaddychimp · 2017-06-07T22:01:22+00:00

I had no male mentor growing up. I was shy around women I wanted to fuck. I didn't give a shit about women I didn't want to fuck, and sometimes treated them like shit. The ones that I ignored or treated badly were the ones that were attracted to me.

So I accidentally discovered some RP truths early on. Women don't want to sleep with men who have SMV below their own perceived SMV. If your goal is to get laid, being an asshole is always preferable to being nice.

I never ever relied on game to get laid because I sucked at it. I always relied on looks and status. I became less shy around women I wanted to fuck because they always approached me so I knew they were interested. I didn't need to worry about approach anxiety even though it crippled me.

I went through an egalitarian mode after college because I didn't want to be seen as an asshole player in my circle of (male and female) friends anymore, because I slept with a few different women in that group in a short period of time. so I turned into a blue pill nice guy in my next relationship because I thought that's what women really wanted in an LTR. Failed miserably, she cheated on me. Figured out a lot more RP truths from that experience.

Started reading TRP a couple years later and it all clicked. Alpha Bucks is what she wants. I was mixing the wrong cocktail of different alpha and beta traits.

Kralee · 2017-06-07T23:19:44+00:00

My dad was only around for the occasional weekend and a couple of weeks in the summer. He was no help. I had no real mentor. I had to figure it out on my own. In the early days of PUA I found the forums. I read The Game and Mystery Method. It's mostly bullshit that might work on club sluts. The only time it even kind of worked was at a bar one night, the bartender asked for my ID, so I asked to see her's. It's all too much work. Execute Plan XY6 to escalate and move target. It's ridiculous. Have a gimmick and wear silly shit. No thanks.

After I quickly tossed that to the side, I found myself hanging out with guys that were good with girls. Best education one can have. I started taking on their personalities after a while, and getting decent in my own right. I started figuring out what worked and what didn't. Humor goes a LONG way.

Red Pillers are mostly just bitter and angry Incels. It's been so bad for so long that they've started blaming women for not liking them. They're just angry betas and niceguys. Looking for someone to point the finger at. Blindly following gurus that feed them lines of bullshit to line their own pockets.

Years later I have read PUA stuff now. Modern PUA I can actually get behind. Mark Manson, David Wygant, even Tucker Max has turned to the light side. I do make it a point now to talk to guys standing awkwardly along the walls or at tables by themselves. I try to include them in my own conversations. Maybe they'll pick something up.

Love8Death · 2017-06-07T21:26:45+00:00

1 & 2: A mentor is a weird way of putting it but my dad was and is a great example of traditional masculinity. Outside of my dad, I was surrounded by male peers who all got interested in women and started pursuing them at roughly the same time. Some were better than others, obviously, but we could all learn from each other. To me, this seems like the most common way of learning social skills and interacting with the gender of your desire. Learning together with your peers.

3: I've got some serious problems and do not at all have a good social/sexual life. Plenty of people that grew up in similar circumstances do. So I don't think my problems have anything to with having or not having "mentors".

HitchensTwoPointOh · 2017-06-08T15:31:25+00:00

1 I had my dad from life up until college, and then a fraternity brother from college onward.

2 my dad always inquired throughout middle and high school into my personal life and constantly asked if there were any girls I liked and provided advice on how to get them. He told me to be nice, act the gentleman, and I will find someone who likes me for who I am. I understandably never even kissed a girl until college. College onward my best friend and fraternity brother (my little, ironically) mentored me in how to systematically become more attractive to women, where in those 3 college years I went from virgin to 50+ count.

3 my lack of any female connections or validation at a younger age due to the disneyesque white knight advice led to depression, my redpilling really caused me to lose faith in the idea of love, but it beats hating myself and living a lie

KrispyMcSockington · 2017-06-08T02:55:04+00:00

I had a dad and sometimes older friends, but to call them mentors is a strong word. Dad spent most of his time working and older friends were Chad-like and couldn't really explain it. I had to figure some shit out on my own but suffered from the beta programming as a result of having a lot of women around offering poor advice: be yourself, girls like nice guys etc. Mom was sex negative and mean to my dad (as in emotionally abusive, manipulative and condescending) so I got the "don't be useless, like your father" guilt dumped on me despite dad being a nice guy, hard worker and actually quite charming in social situations.

Thus, I grew up believing girls didn't want sex and if you want to be her boyfriend, you have to be friends first. Picture an wakward, chubby teen unable to look a cute girl in the eye, forever stuck in the friendzone and feeling left behind at university. I once asked one out who told me she wasn't looking for a relationship, only to walk past her in a mall arm in arm with another guy. It took years for the beta programming, feminist narrative and poor rationalizations to work its way out.

In terms of advice, I ended up getting advice from different women. In high school the female teachers would reinforce how terrible the boys are by making snide remarks about how much more wonderful or capable women are. I also once asked a family friend what to do about scoring a date and she asked me why I was so desperate. It took me years to figure out she never had to be because she never had to approach. Another female friend at university tried to help me by suggesting I should "let them come to me" as if that were possible. I began to realize then that women had no idea what it was like. I began reading up on stuff like Ladder Theory because I kept getting rejected and friendzoned. And boy, was I angry.
When my friends had girlfriends or were getting laid, I was a virgin and it took the generosity of a very averagr looking white girl for my virginity to come to an end. Thereafter things got a little easier but I was still awkward around women I liked. I got rejected a lot. Then after a lengthy dry spell I got pissed off enough to do something about it and lost a lot of weight. I put on some muscle and it was much easier to get a date or get laid. But I still experienced plenty of rejection. Made a lot more friends too but only really benefited from this in my mid to late 20s because I ignored the shitty advice women gave over the years and tried being a funnier, more social person. Being my usual, shy, can't make a move self was not working.

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Hairbrainer · 2017-06-07T21:50:39+00:00

I had some friends who tried to wingman me or teach me game. I had no interest because I wasn't comfortable acting the way they wanted me to act to score with women.

After a few nights at the bar doing fine on my own, they quit with the "mentor" shit.

[deleted] · 2017-06-07T21:56:53+00:00

Didn't have a mentor, as I didn't have a father. I guess everyone else just assumed I'd figure it out so no one else bothered to teach me anything. Holy shit, it was rough until I discovered PUA and used elements of it to change my perspective and improve my game.

TheGreasyPole · 2017-06-07T22:03:40+00:00

1: How many of you had a male mentor to teach you social/sexual game when you were growing up?

No mentor.

Only mates. And mates that took the chronic piss. We weren't "helpful" with each other advice and assistance wise, although we always worked as a little pack looking for little groups of chicks.

2: Can you elaborate on your mentorship experience?

Yup. When you fucked up and looked a tit they pointed and laughed at you. And when they fucked up and looked a tit you pointed and laughed at them. Then you'd spend the next 6 months taking the piss out of them for doing that.

And we all had a fun time. And basically worked it out whilst looking like tits for much of our teenage years.... but gradually getting better and better at it.

3: How did the presence (or lack) of a mentor affect your outcomes in social life and sexual life and life in general?

I learned the world isn't going to treat me like a Ming Vase, and bow to my inherent awesomeness without chipping me. That I had a lot to learn. And that if I wanted to get where I wanted to go I had to work out how to do it myself. No-one was going to hold my hand and make it alright. I had to work it out for me.

So I did.

And only much later did I discover RP and think "Well fucking hell, if I knew this 20 years ago it would've been fucking easy".

[deleted] · 2017-06-07T22:21:38+00:00

I didn't have a father figure for most of my childhood or any male role models, just watched a shit ton of old movies my mom used to put on while she studied for her degree. From those movies I learned that being cool, calm and lighthearted when socializing was something that people loved. When I started talking to girls, that's how I acted, and it worked well for me!!!

Wallstreet3 · 2017-06-07T22:23:04+00:00

Our mothers were absolute crap for any sort of advice on women. What a woman at 40 wants is far different than what a 20 year old young woman wants.

A 20 year old woman wants excitement, drama, virility, dominance. At 40 she wants a decent man who will provide for her and is dependable.

PieceBringer · 2017-06-07T22:24:10+00:00

1: My older cousins, they were all players, they still are honestly. (I lived with them)

2: They were all red pill af, most of the time were just them explaining and telling their experiences.

3: it was very positive in the first years of my teenage years.

WhiskersNT · 2017-06-07T22:57:17+00:00

No mentor while growing up. I had a decent amount of success through social circles though, basically just falling hard for girls and then doing some clumsy ass flirting. Did a few confessions of feelings. Maybe getting somewhere due to alcohol or drugs a couple times. My parents gave me a lot of "be a good man" advice like what u/Lewiscross described in this thread , that I sort of heeded and sort of didn't

Anyway this more or less worked out for me, I've had my dry spells tho. I think those are a thing of the past as I more or less know how to attract women at this point in my life

[deleted] · 2017-06-07T23:07:34+00:00

No mentor.

And no gf.

Kralee · 2017-06-08T00:15:10+00:00

No mentor

Never discussed dating or sex with my family. Did not do well with girls in high school and could not figure out why. Got even worse in 1st year uni when I realized I actually have no idea how to talk to or attract women.

Had many Chad friends who were hooking up with tonnes of girls and I was so jealous but was too proud to ask for how it's done. I'm certain they couldn't explain it all though.

Went to the internet and found "The Game" by Neil Strauss. Read the whole book in a night; could not believe what I read. Read it again the next night.

Found the Mystery Method and downloaded all the free content possible.

And to my surprise I started attracting girls, and found myself getting respect from my chad-esque friends who were now seeing me more on their level as far as dating goes. Truth be told all the PUA stuff I think did was give me confidence, the ability to recognize social cues of attraction and interest, and a general idea of what to say and when to say it.

despisedlove2 · 2017-06-08T00:17:01+00:00

As far as the game is concerned, I didn't.

For Tradcon RP, my father tried to explain some basic realities. However, I was too BP in those days to listen.

wtknight · 2017-06-08T00:40:37+00:00

No mentor.
Same as above. My father never gave me any advice and my closest friends were similarly unsuccessful.
I had absolutely no game. I wasn't successful until I started interacting with women online first, and then meeting them in person was not so awkward for me. I'm still terrible at cold approaching women, but I'm married now so that's irrelevant.

[deleted] · 2017-06-08T01:09:17+00:00

I used to hang out with a group of guys older than me, so I had a bunch of mentors. It was really good, cos I was out and about when most people my age hadnt even started. We used to do the wing-man and the common goal was for everyone to hook up before the night had finished, which we usually achieved.

The result was I had quite a lot of action with women older than me. I lost my virginity to someone nearly double my age, and had girlfriends older than me throughout high school and into college.

I guess after college I came off the rails a bit, and it has taken me a while to get back to where I was. But I managed it. Having older friends was a great thing to happen to me, not only for women but in general. I dont always listen to people's advice though.

More importantly, some things you need to learn yourself. Sometimes the hard way.

Eastuss · 2017-06-08T07:22:53+00:00

I had no mentor. I had no decent male model in my surrounding.

My first sexual experience was at 19 years old. Kinda late considering I was actively trying since 14 years old. I needed way too much time to figure some RP stuff by myself.

jackandjill22 · 2017-06-08T07:46:33+00:00

No mentor. What's worse, my high school/uni experience was kinda secluded, I guess, - the classes/groups were small and mostly male and there was very little dating happening around me, so there weren't any examples to follow. My parents didn't bother to advise me on anything either, probably hoping that I would figure stuff on my own. The joke's on them, though, because now the family bloodline will most likely end with me ¯\(ツ)/¯

As for outcomes in social life and sexual life, I can't really blame my current inability to date and lack of romance related social skills on the absence of mentors - after all, even if I had mentors, it is still me who would've had to try and put in effort into dating and I definitely could and should have done more on my own. I didn't, though, and now I don't really care enough anymore.

[deleted] · 2017-06-08T08:28:48+00:00

My dad taught me nothing about about picking up girls. All he taught me was how to be a stubborn asshole.

Turns out girls love assholes

BPremium · 2017-06-08T11:59:45+00:00

I had no male mentor. I had a dad, but he didnt like me much since I wasnt good at sports and he couldnt brag about me. So he focused all the good parenting/mentor stuff on my Chad brother, and used me as a punching bag (literally) to vent his frustrations. Childhood and teen years weren't picnics lol. So I had to learn all this stuff from my mom, whom I love dearly, but she wanted to raise a good boy, and did. She and dad raised my brother as the sexy son/all American Chad type.

trpobserver · 2017-06-08T12:04:58+00:00

No, I didn't, and I had nobody in my life at all to give me decent dating advice. I'd say most of the advice I got from the adults in my life was just not good. I don't know why adults are so willing to tell kids to rest on their laurels. I cannot think of a situation where that is a good thing to tell a child.

I think the only thing my dad ever told me in terms of dating advice was "they will come to you". Thanks dad.

I understand that its my responsibility to fix now, but I think most people with major social anxiety problems developed those because they didn't have people in their lives when they were very young who were willing to teach and put that kid in situations that would have significantly changed their outcomes.

For me, I think being made very sensitive to shame through the ways I was punished, and being yelled at whenever I spoke when I wasn't supposed to, meant that by 3rd grade I was "the quiet kid who never said anything". Every time I did something embarrassing and other kids laughed I relived those moments over and over and over in my head and crawled deeper into the hole and hated myself more and more until I began to fear social situations of any kind (and of course came up with "holier than thou" reasons for why I didn't want to go to parties, clubs, etc.). By the time I was 14 I was starting to get those physical panic symptoms when walking into a crowded place. Those only got worse for the next 8 years.

I have lost a countless number of opportunities because of this shit. I still haven't really fixed it. There is a whole physical component I haven't touched, and will spend all my effort fixing after I'm out of school.

Ok I think I kind of went on a tangent there but it was nice to write it out.

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