What gender-related double standard annoys you the most?

ar423 · 2016-02-01T17:28:08+00:00

women can hit men but men can't even hit men back - I'm practically as skinny as most women myself and as short as most of them too, so hearing this is the most frustrating thing in the world. I even had a woman punch me in the stomach and her friend, instead of condemning her violent friend, tells me "sigh, what did you say?" - fucking christ.

Lethn · 2016-02-01T16:59:57+00:00

There are so many but here's my top two.

Women who blatantly get away with murder, assault, rape and assortment of other crimes that men would either get decades or life imprisonment for with judges themselves giving the most ridiculous excuses on top of everything
People who think that no matter how violent a woman is a man should never hit back, these are people you should watch out for by the way as well if you are in a self-defence situation, they will likely attack you

ugkcliff · 2016-02-01T16:29:19+00:00

I hate how even though a young boy can be legally molested, if the woman has a child by him, she does not get charged with a crime AND he has to pay child support as soon as he is able to.

I'm not sure if laws are like this in every state but I heard this happened in AZ and it's mind-blowing

192873982 · 2016-02-01T16:09:08+00:00

That some feminists want to have womens feels above the law, while they practically dismiss the notion that men have any feelings at all.

coip · 2016-02-01T17:10:51+00:00

What gender-related double standard annoys you the most?

Circumcision.

It's mind-boggling to me that people can realize it's unjust to mutilate a girl's genitals at birth, without her consent, but then completely fail to realize that it is equally as unjust to mutilate a boy's genitals at birth, without his consent.

Even worse is the incredibly offensive, superficial justifications they cite for doing it, such as "an uncircumcised one is so gross!" That is pure misandry, and a double standard, as no one would tolerate men saying that about uncircumcised female genitalia.

6455465454 · 2016-02-01T17:06:08+00:00

I wouldn't even know where to start.

How about how gender roles are oppressive and evil, but men need to conform to all the gender roles that benefit women. This can't be mentioned even though it is reality, instead you have to create this false narrative so you don't piss off feminists (who are seemingly everyone these days) with your stories of the world that don't fall into their narrative of post-gender role utopia. You can be completely for female rights, then get skewered because you dare to point out how the people around you act.

You don't even have to do that, if you don't virtue signal they will get on your case and go on the attack regardless of whether you are secretly the leader of an important feminist organization. You have to pretend we're past gender roles, then listen to stories of women standing near men hoping the men will approach them. You listen to them talk about "creepy" men who approached them. Initiative isn't a thing, apparently. Maybe initiative is part of patriarchy?

You have to be a feminist, but feminists attack male feminists. You are either a creepy rapist (probably! better get some rumors started!) or you're a whiny pushover who thinks "he's entitled to sex."

Women prefer women, men prefer women, but the patriarchy means that even though statistics show right now men are getting the shaft, that's not true because who cares about facts when they don't align with the feminist narrative?

Feminists don't see men as people. They see them as broken women.

You can't even talk about reality. You can't talk about what people are doing. You can't even critique art anymore without overtly pandering to women at the expense of the actual art.

babno · 2016-02-01T20:21:32+00:00

Not sure if it counts as one, but children in general as a whole process. A woman could drug and rape me, get pregnant, sue for child support, never let me have contact with the child, drag me through the mud, and even have me sent to prison if I can't make support payments. I can end up in prison if I am raped. It's beyond insanity.

HeForeverBleeds · 2016-02-01T16:27:22+00:00

If I had to rank them, personally it would be the statutory rape/CSA one. And how people are absolutely hysterical over things like men in college having girlfriends in high school, but are completely dismissive of and often condoning of adult female teachers and middle aged women grooming boys as young as 12/13/14 and believe that such behaviors are never harmful because "you can't rape the willing" and "it's every boy's dream!" supposedly. (And apparently teen girls don't fantasize about attracted older guys, ever /s)

It's more than annoying, but a very harmful stereotype. One that's led to many, many cases of judges letting dangerous female predators off with little or no jail time and too often not even having to register as offenders

Additionally these kind of responses can make it difficult for boys who had genuinely been abused by women to come forward, or for those who have come forward to get appropriate social support, because of the assumption that this kind of thing is never harmful for boys, and that if he says it was he must be "gay" or "lying for attention"

McFeely_Smackup · 2016-02-02T17:31:49+00:00

The domestic violence perception double-standard.

I'm a former police officer and in the dozens of domestic violence incidents I was personally present for, I never once saw a woman need medical care as a result. I saw two men laid out dead, both had been stabbed by their wives.

I realize that's a personal anecdote, and not necessarily even statistically valid, but it's enough for me to know for no uncertain fact that domestic violence is NOT a boxing match. It's not "biggest person wins", in fact it's most typically one person abuses, and the other doesn't WANT to fight back.

Basically, if you eliminated 100% of male domestic abusers, you'd still have a shitload of domestic violence out there...so let's quit pretending otherwise.

SRSLovesGawker · 2016-02-01T16:48:46+00:00

Unequal treatment under the law is the most harmful imo.

It's going to be extraordinarily difficult to fix social issues without first at least getting men and women treated the same by the police and the judiciary.

Walawalawow · 2016-02-01T18:17:00+00:00

Women are doing worse/underrepresented in an industry or group: immediate action is necessary and is taken.

Men are doing worse/underrepresented in an industry or group: silence and attempt to silence anyone who speaks up about it.

Feminism has become a movement about creating as many privileges for women as possible while reducing those men enjoy. Feminism is about lifting women ABOVE men.

cymrich · 2016-02-01T16:51:06+00:00

the fact that I'm viewed as a child molester first and human second if I go anywhere near a child in this country.

Ibster · 2016-02-01T17:14:05+00:00

When I was a kid at school I used to cry a fair amount more than would be expected of boys my age. Majority of teachers sent me outside to "get a hold of myself".

When the girls in my class started crying there was no sending out, just being hugged and being told it was ok. It would have been nice to have that when I was a kid but us boys got on with life and girls needed mollycoddling.

Not to say my entire primary school was staffed with teachers that felt this way, I had one teacher who was wonderful and provided the emotional support I needed when she had time.

I also get annoyed at the circumcision, abortion rights, and the whole raft of other stuff, but I think the crying/support thing was one of the issues that had the biggest impact on me just because I was young at that time.

closetedapostate · 2016-02-01T16:34:07+00:00

The fact that it is legal to mutilate the genitals of newborn males while girls are protected from any form of genital cutting, even a tiny pinprick, which is undeniably far less invasive than the abuse inflicted on baby boys everyday. The reason it bugs me the most was because I was sliced up down there as a newborn and wish I wasn't. I'd give almost anything to have the sensitivity and bodily integrity that is my birthright back. I really hope Foregen succeeds in making foreskin regeneration a reality.

FatMan8Pack · 2016-02-01T19:01:16+00:00

[permanently deleted]

thatlowdowndirty47 · 2016-02-01T23:06:19+00:00

Shaming.

By far the one that annoys me the most. It's incredible to me that we have movements like "stop fat shaming" or "stop slut shaming". You think society would ever allow a "stop deadbeat shaming"? Hell no. Because movements that advocate for agency is apparently only for women. This one hits home more because it so emphatically points to feminism's legacy of doing everything it can to liberate the female gender role while simultaneously doing everything it can to keep the male gender role the same and stuck in it's archaic functions.

R50cent · 2016-02-01T19:43:58+00:00

Women are just as culpable in domestic violence, and violence in the general populace predominately effects men.

"Teach boys not to be violent"

eletheros · 2016-02-01T19:14:31+00:00

The second-chance choice of abortion.

Barring a crime, everybody is choosing to have sex. Only half get the second choice, yet bears the minority of the burden.

MRA-automatron-2kb · 2016-02-02T18:29:32+00:00

The laws protects girls from genital mutilation but doesn't protect boys (= an unconstitutional law)
Men's clubs are sexist and banned while women's only clubs continue to exist.
No one believes boys and men can be sexually assaulted because women are wonderful.
women can hit men, and men can't hit back.
police automatically arrest men in domestic violence calls.
Men are removed from their homes and the woman gets to stay.
If a man complains about sexual harrassment at work, he's the one who gets fired.
The woman gets to decide if they should keep the baby.
men are made to feel like rapists and child molesters while women who are, abuse freely.
Men built houses, city infrastructure, comfort for women, but get shit on all the time.
Men are portrayed as bumbling morons on TV
Men who were sexually abused by women when they were boys are mocked and no help is available for them.
When a man's friends die off as he ages, he's on his own. Women get a "support network".
If a man talks to others he's viewed with suspicion.
if a man is in emotional or physical pain, he has to man up.
if a man is poor due to a work injury he's off the dating scene; a poor woman is still datable.
a woman can stay home, a man is mocked.
a woman can remove her consent to sex years later; a man is laughed at if he says he was sexually assaulted by a female.
when a woman cuts off a man's penis she's applauded on TV.

McFeely_Smackup · 2016-02-01T20:41:12+00:00

[permanently deleted]

2016-02-02T06:25:53+00:00

I can't pick just one!

FijoTheEpic · 2016-02-02T09:39:59+00:00

I don't like that women think it's ok to be violent toward men, and that it makes men feel they can't defend themselves. This has to be my least favorite of the double standards. Just as women shouldn't have to defend themselves from males, Men shouldn't be put in the position of having to defend themselves or be abused by women either.

MenandBoysareGood · 2016-02-02T11:41:04+00:00

Women=good; men=evil

Allblacksworldchamps · 2016-02-02T12:06:18+00:00

The empathy gap

mentioned here in various forms, but is the heart of the reason that feminists can ask for social problems to be adressed and its valid activism, while MRA's point to actual legal discrimination and government sexism and they are told they are working against human rights?

alclarkey · 2016-02-01T20:53:51+00:00

That women are allowed to dump on short men to their hearts content, but don't you dare even think about rejecting an overweight woman.

HotSauciness · 2016-02-02T15:04:52+00:00

The double standard about caring about double standards. MRAs have several issues which would be near the top of the list for feminists if the genders were reversed, but they get ignored by the media and government, and feminists tell us we're just whining about minor problems. Such as issues in the justice system. Here are some numbers. Civil rights advocates consider the racial issues there to be one of, if not the, biggest issue facing blacks today. If women were getting the short end as much as men do, it would be all over the media and Presidential candidates would be talking about it daily. But since it's men, we ignore it and nobody talks about it

Hzle · 2016-02-02T17:53:58+00:00

A very hotly contested award :)

Should it go to the feminists & useful idiots who ignore the figures saying that more women go to university overall than men, that there are more women studying languages, biology, medical & social sciences. They ignore all that and say how unfair it is that there are more men doing STEM sciences. Where women predominate, noone sees it, when it's men, everyone believes this "discrimination"/"sexism" rubbish.

Or should it be the bias in criminal sentencing - where women get easier sentences, avoid jail more often, and get several extra cards to play (battered wife, mood & hormonal disorders). You get men who have squirted water pistols at a girlfriend, or thrown sauce over her, given worse sentences than a woman who kicked her ex-husband in the testicles and said "I hope he can't have any more children"

Or the teachers at schools who praise the most ridiculously minor achievement by a girl, but refuse (on ideological grounds) to praise a young boy whose reading is years ahead of even the girls in his class.

I think more annoying than these (though not necessarily more serious) is the fact that if a woman attacks a man in public, people just watch and laugh. If he defends himself - everyone is suddenly saying "hey come on, why are you doing that?".

I think this last one makes me want to scream the loudest.

SilencingNarrative · 2016-02-03T00:13:51+00:00

A woman that loses a pregnancy, and is devestated by the loss, is widely sympathsized with, regardless of how the father felt, if his feelings are mentioned at all.

When the father is devestated by the loss of a fetus, and the mother is not devestated, his position is never mentioned, let alone sympathsized with.

He simply ceases to exist in any emotionally relevant sense.

Mitschu · 2016-02-03T02:05:43+00:00

Special pleading on grounds of mutilation.

It irritates me that people refuse to acknowledge that their own arguments in favor of MGM are the exact same arguments that others use for FGM (and hell, some of the exact same respectable academic sources they cite on the benefits of MGM, also have written about the benefits of FGM... as a respectable academic body. The American Pediatric Association, the first invocation in any debate on the medical ethics involved, wrote papers in favor of female circumcision back before they received backlash for it.)

The appeal to popularity. Guess what, you're not the only culture , religion, and / or population in the world.

The appeal to authority. Guess what, other authorities exist who are equally valid. Some of whom are in favor of both.

The appeal to intergender enforcement, aka men harming men is no harm at all. Guess what, in countries that practice FGM, it is predominantly mothers who elect their daughters for it.

The appeal to relative harm, as though since losing a leg is worse than losing a foot, foot binding girls in China is a non-issue since we still have countries with amputee veterans.

The appeal to minimization, as though the foreskin is just a wad of useless, redundant flesh. No, the foreskin is an organ, a distinct collection of functional tissues that serve a unified purpose. Read a damn anatomy textbook before talking about anatomy. Meanwhile, if you want to insist upon uninformed talking about redundancy, how about that clitoris, which is just a biological analogue to the male penis and technically serves no explicitly functional purpose in female reproduction? (My favorite useless body part, in other words, right behind the male nipple.) I mean, that statement is about as true as the "wad of flesh" statement, but... it's about as true. Leave a stupid penny, take a stupid penny.

The appeal to partner consideration. Firstly, the overwhelming majority of women prefer uncut men. (We won't even start on the measured harm that cut men regularly cause their sexual partners, such as chaffing and vaginal tearing, that's an entirely different rant.) Secondly, while the same is true in reverse, there are also a small number of men who prefer cut women. If we're going to consider the opinions of women who find intact penises icky valid, shouldn't we also consider the men who find intact vaginas icky, too?

The appeal to self-tolerance. If I like being cut, you can't say that being cut is harmful without being bigoted against me. As above, the majority of people who enforce cutting of either gender are people who have been cut themselves. If it is fine for me to cut my sons because I was cut myself, it is equally fine for my sister to cut her daughters because she was cut herself. Both, or neither.

The appeal to legality. Slavery used to be legal.

The appeal to hygiene. Soap exists. Condoms exist. Nothing more needs to be said unless you grew up in a country where they lopped off your ears to make it easier to wash behind them, or lopped of your hands because wearing rubber protective gloves is too much to expect.

The appeal to uninformed medical ridiculousness. Phimosis affects a very small minority of men, and in the majority of those that it does affect, it typically resolves itself before full adulthood. The fractional fraction of remaining cases can be treated in adulthood, by rational and informed adults, instead. We don't lop off breasts to prevent breast cancer, we don't perform labioplasty on female children who might otherwise grow up unable to fully enjoy sex, we don't sew the vagina shut to reduce the risk of STDs.

In short:

There is not one valid reason to support MGM that isn't also an equally valid reason to support FGM, or other harmful practices that we've stood against.

ee4m · 2016-02-01T16:28:55+00:00

Usually ones that come from feminists.

Feminism can object to discriminatory laws (back in the past when there were laws that discriminated against women), mra's are wrong and "blaming feminism" in the wrong when they object to feminist laws that harm men.

I was having a conversation with a male feminist - /u/Ciceros_Assassin and he lost his shit because of this http://boysmeneducation.com/the-language-of-misandry-in-academia-faculty-students-administrators/ . To his mind it is completely wrong for men to highlight institutional misandry, even though feminism did and does exactly the same thing with examples of institutionalized misogyny from the past.

Obviously the whole thing with feminism's abuse denialism, there needs to a a conversation about abuse, but not women's and pointing out feminism has been covering up abuse, is some sort of blasphemy and its morally correct to attack, silence and abuse people that bring it up. Can you imagine if it was some sort of "meninist" group covering up mens abuse of women and children at a GOV, academic and legal level?

And so on.

These are the most toxic and overt double standards at the moment.

EDIT - Its wrong to criticize feminism for its oppressive family court system, it was right for feminists in the past to change the system when it as bad women.

Its wrong for mens movements to have gladflys like Elam, its perfectly normal for feminism to have them situated in mainstream media and their books on recommended reading lists for gender studies.

junoguten · 2016-02-01T23:46:18+00:00

That mothers murdering their infants because the inconvenience of signing up for adoption results in women being able to just drop them off at police- and fire stations, but guys who don't pay child support can go to jail in much of the US. Or I guess just father's rights in general.

FGM/MGM is high on my list too.

Hesitant_Observer · 2016-02-01T20:19:16+00:00

Manspreading. Clearly all the other answers in this thread are just promoting the patriarchy.

fritzcat42 · 2016-02-02T05:28:13+00:00

Consent can't be given while drunk!!!11!

Either start arresting both parties that gave consent while drunk, or admit it's a farce, and people trying to blame others for their bad decisions.

Not talking about actual rape while drunk, or drugging someone against their will. Sad that I have to explicitly state that.

phespa · 2016-02-02T11:19:24+00:00

Too many to pick from, but I will try to pick one that isnt there;

not specific, but double standards in schools. You all know them.

Rethgil · 2016-02-02T21:45:46+00:00

Portrayal in media. Adverts showing female on male violence are encouraged as it sells product to women. The same women who freak out if they even imagine they see the reverse. Ads showing men as stupid disposable playthings and slaves of women. None of this is allowed to exist in reverse without questions being raised by our own politicians for flips sake!

atheist4thecause · 2016-02-03T05:16:22+00:00

The celebration of women being better than men at things while declaring discrimination when men are better at things. Some examples were basically when I got emails from "Rock the Vote" stating that women have voted more than men in every Presidential election since 1980, something they celebrated, but still maintained that we needed to do more to get women to vote. When girls passed boys in graduation rates and everybody celebrated while nothing changes to now help boys. Things like that. This mindset is just disgusting to me, and I can't believe people don't think twice about how maybe boys and men now need help. And the fact that so much of society thinks like this, too. It really irritates me on principle.

Mitschu · 2016-02-03T07:05:31+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Friedrischa · 2016-02-03T13:30:57+00:00

Getting called a beta or a manlet because I'm too feminine. According to at least one poster in here that means I get "low quality sex" whatever the fuck that means. I am also skinny, which is another mountain of cock I have to deal with. I do not want to lift, I have no interest in lifting, and no I don't want a female body, I just want my non muscular man body I was born with and adorn it with the finer fabrics in life without being considered less of a male or having my partner choices criticised.

Also circumcision. Wtf made the USA decide that would become a regular occurence? No really, I want to know. In my country that is unheard of unless you're from a religious/cultural group who does it, and I disagree with it in any case unless a concious decision by an adult man himself.

Bk_iGingy · 2016-02-03T14:29:48+00:00

I haven't seen this one said, so I hate how women can't consent to drunk sex, but men can. Also, if a women had drunk sex, she wouldn't be responsible for her actions, but if she drove and killed someone that same night, she'd be responsible for her actions.

Edit: Just saw the story a few posts down and somebody said almost the same exact thing there.

2016-02-03T17:07:35+00:00

The idea that "objectification" only/mainly happens to women, when all it really means is "natural physical attraction" and men are judged by their looks just as much (though usually on different aspects).

theothersquiggle · 2016-02-03T20:57:33+00:00

Conscription. My dad, who grew up in communist Poland, was lucky to dodge the 2 years long military service - he got away with having his freedom taken away for just 2 months. I hate the fact people think women are entitled to men's lifes, I hate the fact that I had to show up at the military medical examination when I was 18 and I had to show my genitals to some government-appointed female doctors. And I consider myself very lucky, too - I know someone from Russia who served a full year. Men of South Korea serve two years. Two years! They spend two years doing things have no interest in doing while their female counterparts can study or work on their careers or maybe spend time with their dying relatives. We are not criminals and we don't deserve to have our freedom taken from us because we are male!

And I get it: women are not as capable as us when it comes to fighting, but look: thanks to first wave feminism, women get to elect leaders who get to decide whether to engage in a military conflict or not (read: whether MEN should go down the meat grinder or not). I don't think women should have the right to vote unless they are ready to pay the same price for that right that men pay. Just make it a requirement for voters of both genders to sign up for the draft and I'll shut up. Sorry if this post was incoherent but I haven't spoken English in a while and I'm too tired to proofread this

Title	What gender-related double standard annoys you the most?
Author	Younglibertarianuk
Upvotes	58
Comments	107
Date	February 1, 2016 3:58 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/43p226/what_genderrelated_double_standard_annoys_you_the/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/what-gender-related-double-standard-annoys-you-the.957210 https://theredarchive.com/post/957210

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