Is a 9-5 worth it, or would becoming an entrepreneur really help solve my social, financial and romantic problems?

anthonyrecenello · 2023-05-20T16:59:55+00:00

If you’re asking then a 9-5. Trust me running your own business is a million times harder plus you likely won’t be spending time with anyone.

mikey_weasel · 2023-05-20T15:48:45+00:00

They often elaborate that many women these days won't settle for any man who makes less than 100k a year, or who does a 9-5 or other forms of traditional work.

Lol wut? No. Just no. Also how old are you?

Now I'll concede it's possible that if you were to ask women to describe their ideal dream man's job/financial position he might be an entrepreneur making 100k at age 24. Similarly to if you asked a group of men to describe their ideal dream woman's body type you'd get a bunch of talk about wildly uncommon body proportions.

In the real world for most partners you need to be able to keep up and not be a drain. Being able to financially support yourself, with some opportunity for career growth and eventual savings for big things (like eventually a house)) is usually enough. And if you look at the real world there are plenty of men who don't even do that.

And yes you'll absolutely be able to find women who only date men who make 100k as entrepreneurs. They are usually either equally driven entrepreneurs or hilariously entitled. Do you want to date either of those groups of women?

Do a career path that will work for you. If you don't want to be an entrepreneur then don't be an entrepreneur simply to get into a relationship.

LillyPeu2 · 2023-05-20T16:34:16+00:00

The entrepreneursphere is just as toxic, self-absorbed, and self-promoting as the manosphere, MLM-pushing schemes, or anything else like that on social media.

There are opportunities to be had being your own boss, sure. But far and away, most small businesses fail in their first year, and most of the remainders don't survive their 2nd year. Social media is flooded with people making more hype than success, or with groups/schemes that are overfunded with careless money, trying to get people to buy into their scam (again, see: MLM).

Only you know if you're cut out to start your own business, deal with uncertainty of not having a paycheck, etc.

As far as "many women these days won't settle for any man who...", just ignore that shit. You know better, or else you wouldn't be here on ExRedPill. That's just your former thought processes slipping back into old habits. Resist, ignore, and tune out those messages.

azucarleta · 2023-05-20T17:09:55+00:00

When dating, I hear "entrepreneur," or just any young person starting their own business of any kind almost, sounds like code for loser/lazy with excuses, anti-social doesn't work well with others, dreamy-eyed/idealistic/unstable and hopeless, and/or a pretentious rich kid.

It's a red flag for a creep, dude. Stick with your job.

SweelFor- · 2023-05-20T18:50:42+00:00

There is a lot going on here.

Do you question any of the things that you mention?

You read that some moron says that women aren't attracted to men who make less than 100k, or have 9-5 jobs. Ok, you read it, now have you questioned it?

When presented with this claim, have you gone through a process of critical thinking to evaluate its validity?

Have you asked yourself "how can I tell if this is true or not?"? "If this were true, how would I see its effects"?

I'd say that this is far more important than the question you ask in itself. The fact that you appear to be an adult, and when presented with a ridiculous claim, it appears that you didn't question it at all, is 10 times more of a "red flag" than the fact that you have a 9 to 5 job.

I don't know what it means that working a 9 to 5 job makes you look not intelligent, however I do believe that reading ridiculous things and not questioning them at all, does make you look not intelligent.

Have you considered the fact that likely the vast majority of the population in western countries, work these jobs? If you were to meet all of those people, do you believe that you would consider them unintelligent, based on the working hours of their job? Please actually go through this scenario in your brain, and please please please tell me that you understand how ridiculous this notion is.

DON'T JUST READ STUFF, QUESTION WHAT YOU READ BY USING YOUR BRAIN TO EVALUATE ITS VALIDITY

The fact that you have no interest in running a company, but you read some RP scammer moron who said that you should do that for stupid and factually incorrect reasons, and now you think you suddenly want to do it... That is so much more concerning than the fact that you work a 9 to 5 job. Like 100 times more problematic.

Now, onto your actual question.

I am a job counsellor, I see people who want to create their business all the time. Your question is what I do for a job. Creating a viable business takes a lot of effort, planning, questionning, decisions, risks, and personal interest and motivation.

As far as what you've described, it appears you have none of those.

I assume you are in the US, and I am not, we have a lot of legal processes here and it is difficult. You have to be very informed to start a business and be smart about it. I imagine you might have less laws and stuff surrounding this (maybe not, idk), but this is also what you need to consider.

Don't give up on your perfectly fine job that you appear to have a carreer in, because some literal pathetic RP scammer told you to. And please, think about what you read before accepting it. You have been gifted with the smartest brain in the universe as far as we know, so USE IT.

AssistTemporary8422 · 2023-05-20T17:20:21+00:00

They often elaborate that many women these days won't settle for any man who makes less than 100k a year,

About 15% of men earn six figures and I've seen no evidence most women demand that.

or who does a 9-5 or other forms of traditional work.

I've never even heard of this. They'd reject a surgeon earning $400K because he works a regular job? Some of these redpillers are so disconnected from reality.

Although I'm shortlisted for a healthcare job that'll make me nearly $50k a year, it still doesn't feel like quite enough.

Thats okay for a start but with the cost of living where it is you will need to earn more than that eventually.

but I can't think of how to do the same to my career and finances.

Maybe go to school to get a better healthcare job if your job won't pay much.

imhereforthemeta · 2023-05-20T17:20:53+00:00

I can not relate to any of the things they are saying- when in doubt look at reality. How many married people do you know who just work a regular job? Are the only people in relationships wealthy! When you step back and observe reality you will see these claims have no basis. Many poor and middle class men are dating or married. Many retail, manual labor. And office employees are in relationships. Romance isn’t just for the rich and self employed.

Naus1987 · 2023-05-20T18:52:00+00:00

The problem is men can be as stupid as women. Op is the kind of guy who only wants the kind of woman that would be attracted to that lifestyle, a trophy wife.

Calm down on your expectations and just be a normal dude dating a normal girl.

People’s expectations are so out of whack these days…

sickbabe · 2023-05-20T17:27:28+00:00

unfortunately this is what happens when you live in a society that fetishizes the small business owner. the people feeding you these ideas got all their money scamming people who've grown up like you, believing there's something somehow inherently valorous to owning a business. doing what? that's besides the point, as long as you're "engaging the market" right?

owning a business and being able to make a success of it is a privilege almost exclusively afforded to the wealthy, at least in the states. while I don't know the numbers for americans at large, in the past 20 years or so the rate of black-owned businesses have exploded while black buying power in the US has actually shrunk. it's a con that initially makes you feel like you're in control of your own life. learn a language, get a library card, pick up an interesting hobby. there are things you can do to improve your life that don't involve setting money on fire or drop-shipping cheap shit on amazon and contributing to wider immiseration.

HelenHavok · 2023-05-20T19:05:40+00:00

I can speak from experience, both my own starting a business and those of friends and family members. Being an entrepreneur is absurdly hard and regularly fails. You will work harder than you’ve ever worked. For years every second of the day and every dollar you make will need to be reinvested into your business. No vacations, little disposable income, no time for dating. And even with that work ethic and discipline, lots of driven, smart people never make the cut. As an example, there are tens of thousands of people who want to become professional sports stars, and put forth their best effort, but only a tiny, tiny minority make it. That’s entrepreneurship.

Plenty of people have hobbies and side gigs that supplement their income. Entrepreneurs who go on to make six figures are either people obsessively passionate or educated about an emerging or high pay field (think code writing or AI), those who come from significant money and can bankroll their business needs, or those who have worked for long periods in a career path and take their lived expertise to start their own business (ie: a 15-20year roofer or auto technician that opens their own shop with a crew).

Starting a business is also technically difficult. You’ll need a strong fundamental understanding of finance, accounting, payroll, labor laws, industry regulation, taxes, insurance, etc. (there’s a reason MBAs take years and $$$ to get) or spend the limited time you have outside the full-time job of making money to also learn how to run a business so you don’t end up in legal trouble or bankrupt (usually the hours you’d prefer to be sleeping).

If you decide to start a business, it can be VERY rewarding!! It can be a great path. But it has to be something you’re passionate about, not some scheme to find romance, and without strong skills in your field and connections to influence or money, you won’t be making that 9-5 $50k salary for many years. You won’t have vacation days or sick days or health insurance without paying for those things yourself. You’ll work more than the standard 40 hours and all of your relationships (including platonic/familial ones) will suffer because all your resources will have to go into your vision. It’s why so many people prefer a 9-5 type position: job security, regular wages, predictable hours and leisure time, and higher likelihood of healthy work-life separation.

As a woman, what ladies as a generalization want in a working partner isn’t entrepreneur vs 9-5, it’s someone who demonstrates financial stability and responsibility, whatever that looks like. Someone who pulls their own weight and doesn’t rely on others to support him. I want someone who takes pride in what they do and has ambitions to better themselves, learn more, and expand their skill sets, in all facets of their life, not just at work. No one loves their job every day, and might need to work unfulfilling positions to be financially stable, but someone who is just going through the motions with no plan for the future or personal goals isn’t going to be as attractive to me compared to someone with dreams and ambitions (this could just be working on hobbies that bring you joy and not some aggressive plan to make $100k or $500k a year for prestige’s sake).

I will say that when young guys (let’s say under 25) tell me they’re self-employed or entrepreneurs, I’m very skeptical and usually see red flags. Did they go to college for finance, business, or tech, or come from a very wealthy family with connections? Then entrepreneurship may make sense. Otherwise, what I have too often experienced is “self-employed” young guys who have problems with authority or taking direction from managers, or who have poor work ethic and think they can get rich quick “outside the system” and usually end up grifting (ie self-help gurus or shallow influencers). Often they have a narcissistic or overinflated sense of self that makes them unbearable to be around. They haven’t been able to cut it in a traditional job due to a lack of interpersonal or job skills and are largely just playing at being small business owners for clout without putting in any real work.

TLDR: there isn’t one answer when it comes to finding romance and how you make a living. Whether you work a traditional day job or start your own business or do something more exotic (firefighting, archaeology, disaster response, etc) will not in itself determine your dating success (except perhaps in regards to the amount of hours you have available each week based on your job’s demands).

mikayrodr · 2023-05-20T21:07:15+00:00

When talking to other women we’ve all agreed that 90% of the time seeing “Entrepreneur” on a dating profile means he’s unemployed or equivalent. Obvi we’re exaggerating with the 90%, but aside from the hyperbole the point stands. So no, probably won’t help with dating.

9-5 = stable, predictable, reliable

Mean_Mechanic9889 · 2023-05-21T02:16:41+00:00

I'm a woman. I've started a couple of businesses.

The truth is. Yeah you can make more money for less work time. But if you don't enjoy or have talent in what you do. Your earnings will probably be a lot less than a well established career person doing what they trained for. You'll also live a very lonely and un-fulfilling life, unless you have something you truly are passionate about doing on your own.

The hard fact to swallow here for rp men is that Andrew tate and the likes haven't made their money through crypto or investments atall. They made their money from exploiting rp men (it's the true source of nearly all their income).

Their Business income is from their rp followers taking their business advice etc. When you truly pick this all a part. It's an incredibly dumb situation.

Find your passion. Follow it. A man who's contributing something he cares about to the world will always be more attractive than a man lieing and scheming to get "rich".

. . . And be an "alpha" for alpha's sake. Alpha in what? We're human beings. Saying you're an alpha in general is like saying you're an expert in general. Sorry 😆 tangent. You're worth more than this wierd insecure man cult. You have a lot more to offer the world.

xvszero · 2023-05-20T22:43:07+00:00

The idea that women won't date anyone who makes under 100k is just obviously false, same with the idea that they won't date men who work a 9-5. The vast majority of men make under 100k and work a 9-5 and still date. The median household income in America is around 70k and that often contains 2 incomes.

impressablenomad38 · 2023-05-21T05:18:56+00:00

If you want time, money and freedom be an entrepreneur. But you're going to need a hell of a better reason then hitting on women

KingKunta2-D · 2023-05-22T18:37:19+00:00

Don't believe the hype. Don't believe the stupid capitalist dogma of a meritocracy. Careermaxing will not make you better at relationships. Hypergamy is legal But on the other side two steps away from hiring and escort.

All the red pill guys pay for it they don't say they pay for it. That's what they're doing. They're terrible people they couldn't get a girlfriend off the strength of their personality to save their lives

LilDarkRidingHood · 2023-05-20T16:11:45+00:00

Is a 9-5 worth it, or would becoming an entrepreneur really help solve my social, financial and romantic problems?

A 9-5 is a very typical thing for most people/couples. This is not unusual, though these coaches (who are usually running their coaching network in an MLM anyways) want you to believe it. It's not strange, undesirable, or any of the other stupid adjectives these guys use as their faux pyramid Mary Kay-type bullshit they sling. If you get with some unreasonable snob, then that's on you.

a 9-5 or working under another person. According to these people, being a successful entrepreneur is the only way to be financially stable and to be seen as responsible, disciplined and intelligent.

I used to be a successful entrepreneur and I can tell you that life is not easy, not remotely. You have to build it for years before you can even start paying others to take on that work for you (unless you get a huge loan ahead of time, which I didn't because I didn't want the debt). I wished for a 9-5 some days.

While I no longer have my business, I am set to become debt-free very soon (I'm in my 30's still). Most people in my age bracket are at an average of $250k debt. That's absurd. I can talk about finances forever and how stupid people get about it all, but that's besides the point.

That wasn't given to me, I earned that by working 16+ hour days for way too many years. It's hard-fucking-work, many of the days you want to give up, you can't afford to be sick, suck it up and fuck your tears, you're expected to do things even if you don't want to, and many other things they don't tell you.

They often elaborate that many women these days won't settle for any man who makes less than 100k a year, or who does a 9-5 or other forms of traditional work.

They're idiots. There is no other way around it. They're selling you that same bullshit dream they teach you to bullshit women with. Stop eating bullshit. There are hundreds of millions of women, if not a billion of them that are completely fine with that life.

I'm shortlisted for a healthcare job that'll make me nearly $50k a year, it still doesn't feel like quite enough.

$50k can be a great start so as long as it's good for the CoL (cost of living) for that area. You can't do Toronto or NYC on that, but you could easily live on that in many of the smaller areas that aren't major country hubs. Live within your means (I personally do FIRE and envelope budgeting that works perfectly). r/personalfinance is really good at guiding you when you get all your numbers worked out. Learn r/FIRE and see if that works for you as well.

SophiaPhilae · 2023-05-20T21:26:11+00:00

It's all bullshit, but actually learning about entrepreneurship wouldn't hurt you.

Find a reputable source… maybe the MIT's courses are decent? I can't vouch for them.

The two main domains that study entrepreneurship are economics and sociology. You could have a look at academic books in those domains. Most of my references are in French, I can't recommend introductory books in English. I did find this article though, for the economic perspective, it should give you an idea about the main themes and authors: M. Endres, C. R. Woods (2005) "Modern Theories of Entrepreneurial Behavior: A Comparison and Appraisal".

There's also non-profits that offer courses and support.

Understanding more about economics and enterprises would be useful regardless of whether you become an entrepreneur or not. It will also show you if you'd actually like to go through the process, if you learn about the nitty gritty details and find statistics about success and failure in entrepreneurship in your area (spoiler, most enterprises fail, and early).

JonF1 · 2023-05-21T07:13:41+00:00

Most influences, youtubers and "content creators" are clueless when it comes to really running a business and being an entrepreneur.

YouTube, podcasting, etc are low investment industries that while hard to be seed at, have basically zero up front cost, required cooling, capital, or funding. It's why everyone does it. Getting a used DSLR and a few mikes and halo lights and firing up OBS is extremely easy... compared to me studding engineering for 5 years at a personal cost of $40k.

Lazly-prodictiv-68 · 2023-05-21T11:37:54+00:00

Look, something like 47% of Americans are currently or in a committed relationship of over 5 years. 21% are in a committed relationship of less than 5 years. That adds up to 68% of Americans being in committed relationships. Only 7% are looking and single. Only 18% of Americans make over $100k a year. Even if every single person making 100k is in that 68% (almost certainly untrue), that leaves 50% of Americans who make less than 100k and are in committed relationships.

Clearly, many woman are "settling" for men who make less than 100k. Most people do traditional work (that's why it's called that), and yet they seem to be finding love. The social media world is not the real world. You shouldn't have any trouble finding a girl because you don't make 100k, and anyone who does write you off for that is a shallow gold digger and you probably shouldn't be with someone like that anyway. Any rich person can loose their money - do you want a partner who will leave you when the money does?

I found the relationship numbers here: https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2006/02/13/romance-in-america/#:\~:text=Overall%3A,looking%20for%20a%20romantic%20partner.

Accomplished_Bus1375 · 2023-05-21T11:58:38+00:00

Personally I find it good to protect yourself against being fired by having a specific skill. Like mechanics, plumbing, nursing.

That way you can be useful in a variety of settings or can make a few dollars if you do get laid off or at least find a different job quickly.

I don't know what's involved in making money on social media.

Gmed66 · 2023-05-22T05:10:32+00:00

I'll use myself as an example.

7 figure earner physician. I didn't have issues dating before when I was like 18 or 20 but I definitely wasn't like super successful at it either. Fast forward to high earner status, it's the exact same.

1) Being a successful entrepreneur or successful anything takes A LOT of hard work, luck and talent.

2) It takes a lot of time. Time you won't be able to spend on dating if that's your goal.

Most important:

3) No one's going to care if you're looking to date or hook up genuinely. If you want to be a sugar daddy, then sure. I guess depends which one you're into. But you're not suddenly getting genuine attraction that you didn't get before.

vcreativ · 2023-05-22T10:59:50+00:00

being a successful entrepreneur is the only way to be financially stable and to be seen as responsible, disciplined and intelligent.

So aehm. Nope.

It's all about critical thinking and vested interests. Their mission is to generate attention from suggestible people. A really good way to achieve this is to work with negative reinforcement. That's what you're feeling.

Set up a business if you want. Have a 9-5 if you want. Don't limit yourself more than you have to but most importantly find something you like doing. I'd argue money is a secondary concern to you doing something well because you actually like it.

And in that pesky 9-5 you might even get some managing experience. And be able to tell if you fancy managing any number of people at all. Or you could try a side-project while your finances are accounted for through that 9-5.

There are financial realities and they do pay thinking about. But the hamster wheel is precisely the thought of "I don't have enough", itself an extension of "I am not enough. Because once you orienteer yourself in relation to outside metrics it'll be very difficult to tell what's enough. The key is to discover what's enough for *you not others.

sturgeo123 · 2023-05-24T04:59:44+00:00

The 9-5 is extremely underrated. I don’t wanna shit on entrepreneurs but those online spaces are so scam ridden and watered down between crypto bro’s and forex scammers. The best entrepreneurs are selling something because they believe it can improve the world and help people’s lives not because they are trying to make money. I wasn’t happy working my 9-5 but that inspired me to save money to change my career as well as find work in other countries to go through life changing experiences. Granted my solution isn’t the solution for everyone but the idea that being rich is some sort of of fix all to life’s problems is asinine. I had friends in college who were failing all their classes and couldn’t rub two pennies together but seemed happy as hell and ran thru every girl in our hall lol. There is no formula to happiness but I’ll try to explain it as best I can. First u identify what u want in life that would fulfill u. Then u identify the realistic steps you would have to take to get there. Then u identify the fears that are stopping u from doing those things. Then you work thru those fears.

carritotaquito · 2023-05-25T05:07:53+00:00

Didn't seem to help this dude.

Always_Scheming · 2023-05-26T02:56:24+00:00

Being an entrepreneur is 9-9 lol

Regular_Biscotti693 · 2023-05-27T14:30:35+00:00

I made a lot more money by my self than working for someone else. I have easy online freelance coding business that enable me to work every where in the world. I only made 11$ an hour working as 9-5 slave. I now make around 20-30$ per hour. And it's not slavery just posting some ads,chill stuff is much nicer than other non professional jobs.

Title	Is a 9-5 worth it, or would becoming an entrepreneur really help solve my social, financial and romantic problems?
Author	Bumly1998
Upvotes	11
Comments	40
Date	May 20, 2023 3:34 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/13my2jp/is_a_95_worth_it_or_would_becoming_an/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/is-a-9-5-worth-it-or-would-becoming-an.1219837 https://theredarchive.com/post/1219837

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