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A simple thought for your leveling up journey: you are, first and foremost, doing this for yourself

herbivorouscarnivore

December 14, 2021
1559 upvotes
/r/FemaleDatingStrategy
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Post Information
Title A simple thought for your leveling up journey: you are, first and foremost, doing this for yourself
Author

herbivorouscarnivore

Upvotes 1559
Comments 26
Date December 14, 2021 3:46 AM UTC
(4 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/FemaleDatingStrategy
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/comments/rfycwe/a_simple_thought_for_your_leveling_up_journey_you/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/a-simple-thought-for-your-leveling-up-journey-you.1092555
https://theredarchive.com/post/1092555
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Comments

[–]PeanutButterPigeon85FDS Newbie 162 points163 points164 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

That last line is a paraphrase of this famous quote:

You don’t owe prettiness to anyone. Not to your boyfriend/spouse/partner, not to your co-workers, especially not to random men on the street. You don’t owe it to your mother, you don’t owe it to your children, you don’t owe it to civilization in general. Prettiness is not a rent you pay for occupying a space marked ‘female’.

― Erin McKean

[–]w0rmsongsFDS Apprentice 297 points298 points299 points 4 years ago* (9 children) | Copy Link

Lovely reminder. I've always received attention from men and consider myself a conventionally attractive woman. Then I unexpectedly lost my breasts and had to undergo chemo. My hair fell out and I shaved it. My eyebrows fell off, and eyelashes too. My skin broke out from stress and meds.

I was suddenly thrown into a world where people made very little eye contact. No attention, from men or women. At first it was jarring and disturbing. Then it was freeing. I had the same respect as always from the high value people that matter in my life.. and everyone else could go kick rocks. We are but meat sacks for the soul..

[–]matte_personalityFDS Newbie 70 points71 points72 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

We are special and we are strong. You are special and strong and it is the beauty behind your strength that makes you stunning. You’re beautiful ❤️

[–]w0rmsongsFDS Apprentice 16 points17 points18 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thank you 💓💓💓

[–]xfelugirlxFDS Newbie 16 points17 points18 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

You are beautiful and your mind is beautiful too. Such a strong woman❤️

[–]w0rmsongsFDS Apprentice 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thank you sis. Aren't we all 🤗

[–]katiekat0214FDS Newbie 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Love this, and I also found it freeing at over 400, and now, a more conventional size but older. It's lovely when someone sees us as we really are; that feeling of being seen, heard, understood, appreciated... nothing like it. It's a super quick, easy way to vet everyone: do they look only at the meat suit, or do they/can they look deeper to see mind and soul and heart?

[–]w0rmsongsFDS Apprentice 4 points5 points6 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

100%... it's been a blessing in disguise 😊 💞

[–]sourcircusFDS Newbie 185 points186 points187 points 4 years ago* (13 children) | Copy Link

I agree on absolutely no obligation for anything. It's not that cut and dry for women unfortunately, when society and the messaging everywhere has reduced us to our looks when we live in a patriarchy.

We will be penalised for not looking attractive and this will affect all aspects of our lives especially important ones like our career (for our independence). I remember when I was scolded for not wearing concealer because of my dark eye circles (due to allergies) while a male colleague also had the same but it was totally fine for him...

Aiming to fit into societal expectations or not - it is a losing battle where you lose out on time, mental energy, $$$ or it could also be missed opportunities. It is not fun and clearly is meant to distract us from other worthwhile pursuits. Huge systematic change is required

[–]sleutherinoFDS Newbie 136 points137 points138 points 4 years ago* (8 children) | Copy Link

Pretty privilege is real, and even more dramatic for women. As in, if you don't do it, you will feel the effects harder than a man. As society stands, we benefit from looking "pretty", and we're hurt by being "plain".

We're expected to look a certain way, and when we don't, people will say things to you, or talk about you. Huge double standard, considering men are neither expected to do this or questioned when they don't.

Especially when you consider the time and money that goes into being pretty. Shit ain't cheap. Just another expense for women that the vast majority of men don't have.

[–]sourcircusFDS Newbie 100 points101 points102 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I wouldn't want to call it a privilege at all. It's more like a tax if anything. And it only hits women and girls hard. It is so disproportionate in its consequences it's so obvious who created this system.

But other than the term (I prefer using "lookism") I do agree it is just double standards. They love pitting women against women trying to create some internal competition by creating this insecurities and instilling it in us from the day we were born.

We know this because young girls aren't exempt and sadly have to spend way too much time and focus on their looks. Boys as a whole have no worries about being sexualised as kids or looking good enough and men sure don't have to deal with it either.

Like you I'm so mad our limited resources should be spent on things that add value into our lives not into looking a certain way so we can have some modicum of "respect".

[–]PenelopePitstop21FDS Newbie 61 points62 points63 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

looking a certain way so we can have some modicum of "respect".

I'm glad you put "respect" in quotes here

At work men don't respect women who put work into their appearance if they don't respect women anyway. Men feel entitled to be surrounded by prettiness when surrounded by women. If you are the lone woman in a male environment they expect prettiness from you to make up for the fact that they can't be surrounded by prettiness when surrounded by men.

I found I often got more real respect at work going without makeup.

[–]katiekat0214FDS Newbie 18 points19 points20 points 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I don't know what's worse, people saying things to you, or talking about you... or being invisible. I was invisible (maybe hyper visible) when I was over 400 lbs. But now that I've lost 170, still over 200 but a more acceptable basic size, and older, I'm still invisible.

I've thought about this my whole life, and I just refuse to cater to the male gaze. I have a basic, clean style, and I dress for comfort first. I can use makeup, but it breaks me out, so I quit years ago. I also suffer from a skin inflammation disease, prurigo nodularis, so I deal with that anyway. Easier when it's an outbreak I can cover, horrible when it's on my face or arms. :( These take *months* to heal. And once you have it, it's for life. Ugh.

Once again it comes down to damned if you do, damned if you don't, so the only sane solution is to please myself first. Stop grasping, stop climbing, stop attempting a prize that's forever out of reach because the goalposts always move. This is me; accept me as I am or GTFO of my life. This is what I always come back to.

[–]sourcircusFDS Newbie 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Chronic illnesses are really horrible I do have a few myself so I'm sorry you have to face them too...

But it seems like you are in such a great headspace! I am really glad for you because it seems like you are content and at peace ❤️😊

[–]katiekat0214FDS Newbie 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thank you so much! I've worked hard for it.

[–]Miss_InsherFDS Newbie 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

“Pretty privilege” really hit me, cause I couldn’t put this into words - and here it is. I do feel like not everyone can just stop wearing makeup as a form of protest. I have a very fair, thin skin, blue eyes and light eyebrows/eyelashes - I look “sick” without makeup. As much as I love myself, I know that I WILL be treated differently (worse) without makeup even by women. Somehow not being conventionally attractive makes you “low value” by default even to other women, it’s insane. It makes me sad that I can’t cut out the makeup expenses of my budget but I just can’t exist in this society without having to “shield” myself.

[+][deleted] 4 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]sourcircusFDS Newbie 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

For all they have done to me, I do still really empathise with pickemeishas though I don't associate with them personally.

I am sad for them because we all grew up fed with more or less the same messaging. Women seeing each other as competition has been cooked up and bought into. Pickmeishas falter because they base so much of who they are on men and externalities in a patriarchal society.

I'm not even conventionally attractive but I have been brought down by some just just because they feel truly insecure. I have been envious of conventionally attractive women myself, it is not so bad now but it was pretty bad when I was younger. I guess the only difference is that I never attacked them because of it but I was always not confident to go out of my way to make friends with them.

A huge part of why pickmeishas are so is not surprising due to the society we are in is really what I wanted to say. Some can change with proper understanding and some empathy because FDS is in part composed of former pickmeishas. Few have been fortunate to have great guidance by older people in their lives.

They should still be called out on it and not excused of course.
It is just that I rather we be united rather than divided as women.

[–]hensbanexFDS Newbie 36 points37 points38 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

yeah but the quote is a great reminder for women in every other aspect of their lives aside from career. we don’t spend all our time at work, so I like that it’s saying don’t feel pressured to look presentable at all times - you should be able to go out to brunch or go shopping without agonizing over your eyebrows or eyeliner.

I used to wear makeup every day for work and it was ruining my skin, aging it and creating fine lines and making my eye bags much worse. on top of that, I felt I HAD to be made up whenever i left the house, which happened over time because i forgot what my bare face looked like and thought it looked “weird” or “bad”. when I stopped wearing makeup all together, I saved money, time, my skin, and my self esteem.

[–]sourcircusFDS Newbie 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I do understand the quote and how it can be helpful to those who feel like they have to wear makeup everyday and look put together.

I wanted to provide an additional viewpoint because I empathise with why it could be hard for these same group to be able to just stop being done up for all occasions.
There should be no shame either way because it's not a great system.

[–]w0rmsongsFDS Apprentice 18 points19 points20 points 4 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Interestingly when I lost my hair and was lookin real weird (unattractive by society's standards), I interviewed and was successful for a job with a 20k salary increase. Life has been on a steady uphill trajectory since finding my confidence. Personally I think the majority of success is directly related to attitude. And some companies are less shitty than others I guess.

[–]mashibeansFDS Apprentice 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Absolutely this. We can all talk and talk about how we wish things were, about an ideal world, etc. BUT the truth is that the reality we live in, we have to at least at a minimum level, play the game.

Does it suck? Yes. Is it unfair? Yes. Would it be nice if things were fair? YES. Unfortunately, we do not live in that world.

This is why I like FDS, we just don't virtue signal and spread pretty words (to the point of toxic positivity) thinking of how we'd like things to be, we acknowledge the shit world we live in, acknowledge how every type of woman gets hit by similar and different issues, and try our best to strategize based on the reality we live in.

[–]The_Cat_EmpressFDS Newbie 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I JUST agonized about this to my sister, why she has to spend so much time on her hair when she was just doing errands. She said "I do it for me, when I look good I feel good."

The radfem in me wonders why though? Why do women have to spend an exorbitant amount of time that men don't when just going to the grocery store? "Doing it for me" is one thing but I think about the societal pressure put on women...to look pretty all the time...to "do it all."

I was never given a passing glance even when I was skinnier and wore makeup, so why bother? I'll just be invisible with my t-shirt and sweats.

[–]sourcircusFDS Newbie 8 points9 points10 points 4 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

I think it is not wrong for her to say it in that manner. The feedback loop is doing its job. When she looks more attractive, people generally treat her better so she does feel better.Perhaps she hasn't dug deeper as to why hence her conclusion.

It is the society that we are in hence we have to spend all that time to reach a certain baseline to not lose out. It is very much "I do it for me, because otherwise these are the consequences i face because i live in a patriarchy".

It's so much extra effort on top of us already being hygienic and have way higher standard upkeep. Men can't even perfect normal grooming 🤡

Glad she has you in her life to guide her though!

[–]shoesfromparis135FDS Apprentice 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

We don’t HAVE to do anything. We do it because we WANT to.

I’m on your sister’s side with this one. I love dressing up. I live in a place where being fashionable is not the norm, so I actually get punished socially for dressing the way that I do. I don’t care. I’m only leaving the house once this week to run errands, so this is it for me. I’m going all out. I don’t care if people stare at me because I’m walking through the grocery store in high heels. These boots are too fabulous to collect dust in the closet just because of some stupid pandemic.

It’s great that you feel so comfortable in public in sweats and t-shirts. Some of us don’t. I personally suffer from depression so going out in public in sweats would be showing the world how I look when I’m at my lowest. I don’t feel good about that. I want to show the world my best self when I leave the house. When I look good, I feel good. I feel confident. I feel better about myself. It brings me out of the void of utter meaninglessness that my life has become. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

We all have different standards for our appearance. Perhaps you should respect your sister’s preferences about her personal style instead of trying to convince her to go to the grocery store in her pajamas. I hear that kind of thing all the time too. I just roll my eyes and laugh it off. I can still be a radfem and dress up to run errands. They are not mutually exclusive.

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