"I'm Sorry"

Archwinger · 2016-02-02T16:13:16+00:00

If you have actually done something wrong, or something that hurt or significantly inconvenienced someone, even unintentionally, you should apologize. You should do it once, keep it short, and most importantly, you need to do it without the person you've wronged confronting you on it. If the other person then belabors the issue, you blow them off.

Nobody's perfect and people screw shit up all the time. In cases where you've actually fucked something up that affected your wife, you absolutely should apologize when needed, and take steps to fix your screw-up, all without her saying a word. In fact, if she has to come to you and complain and confront you about the issue to get you to apologize, that's your failing, not hers.

However, if an issue is trivial or you haven't done anything worthy of an apology, you absolutely never apologize, never admit you're wrong, never show weakness, and never try to smooth anything over. You did what you wanted to do, and it was right because you wanted it. You have nothing to apologize for. End of story. In those cases (which are usually much more common that the cases where you actually fuck up to the extent that an apology is needed), confronting you and demanding an apology is a shit test. It's your wife trying to set the precedent that you answer to her.

getbackdownhere · 2016-02-02T16:26:36+00:00

It is a power struggle, one that she desperately want to lose.

Losing easily will not satisfy her need for submission to a powerful man. Any man with a modicum of assertiveness can refuse to apologize. It takes a strong man to refuse to bend to the hurricane force of a woman in full rage, and proof of your strength is what she is after.

Your initial refusal woke her up and gave her a taste of what she has been longing for: leadership and strength from the man to whom she has attached her life. She is Alice peeking in the rabbit hole of your resolve. She is transfixed, baited, curious and driven with a need to see how far the hole goes, and so she escalates.

Heaping upon you torrents of what to the sleeping men of the world would seem abuse, she digs, ever downward, thrilling to the possibility of plumbing the depths of your resolve. She appears frenzied and angry but in truth she is frightened, scared that once again she will break you and then find herself above the surface, exposed, awake from her dream that she had a man who could keep her safe and protected from anything.

It is this fear that drives her. Daring to hope that this is the moment you become the man she needs seems futile, but she digs anyway, expecting you to relent but hoping you don't. Prove her wrong. Show her that you will not be broken and there, in the depths of your resolve she will find comfort, security. When her efforts to break you have exceeded her fear of the world's uncertainties, and you prove worthy, she will be home.

alphabeta49 · 2016-02-02T16:57:43+00:00

As long as you're not an emo, introverted recluse, A&A and AM is going to be your friend here. You must cultivate an aura of "I am the master of my world, and when things don't go my way, it amuses me." Its a little hump you're going to have to get over (as you're currently experiencing) when she orders you to apologize. I'll bet you still sometimes shake in your boots when she does that and you can feel a confrontation coming. But stay strong and adopt the above aura as soon as possible. Example that I've personally executed in the past:

Her: You didn't get organic milk. [she tries to tell me I did something wrong, classic nice guy pigeon-holing]

Me: Oops. Next time. [it wasn't wrong, just not her preference. no obligation to explain or defend]

H: stress starts oozing We always get the organic milk. You never know what's in the regular milk. [nice try]

M: mock scream in horror AAAAAAUUUGGGHHHH!!!!! What are we going to do?!?! What if our kids start growing third arms?! calming down and acting more reflective On the upside, what if I grew a second penis? Eh, eh? winky, implying DP, making smoochy noises like a dog [A&A, then AM]

H: laughing, situation diffused [bam]

I had to get to a place of mastery real quick to be able to pull off that little skit, because if I had been shaking in my boots it would come across as try-hard or half-assed. I would have been watching to see if it was working, and she would smell that insecurity.

Ultimately, you're taking this way too seriously. Lighten up, tell yourself that logically there's nothing to apologize for (if there really isn't), and show her how ridiculous the situation is.

Agree and amplify, my friend.

Redneck001 · 2016-02-02T15:33:03+00:00

Apologize if YOU want to. Not because someone tells you to.

Just say "no" and go do something else. You don't have to listen to her tantrum.

And there's no reason to explain why you're not apologizing.

jacktenofhearts · 2016-02-03T00:36:24+00:00

Quoting myself, because that's the kind of rogue I am:

Look, the only meaningful apology is something that communicates this:

"I did/didn't do X and I realize now that I hurt you [emotionally, financially, materially, etc]. I recognize my actions had a negative impact on you, I regret my decisions, and would have made different decisions if I could do them over again."

That's it. This is the only version of a sincere apology. And if you do feel this way, you probably didn't just say, "sorry." You probably apologized with a lot more words, and your recipient sighed and said, "... OK. I'll get over it. Thank you for the apology. At least you understood why I'm so upset about this."

Or they said: "That's not enough. You can't go back in time. What's done is done. It's going to be a long time before I can forgive you, if ever."

If you get any other response to your apology, it's probably because it was a bullshit apology.

An apology is a recognition of your actions hurting others, regret that you took those actions, and a request for forgiveness. I guarantee you that 99% of times you've said "sorry" in your life, one or more of those prerequisites was missing. Which meant your apology sounded like this:

"I don't even really know what you're mad about, but whatever it is, I'm sorry."
"I know you're pissed off about, although I don't think you should be, but your frustration seems disproportionate enough so I guess I'm sorry."
"Even though I've done this several times already which means I clearly don't think your issue has any validity and don't plan on modifying my behavior in the future, I'm sorry."

This is why our wives give us "shit" for saying "sorry." We're not owning the apology. We're just hand-waving at the hamster, hoping its distracted enough to keep spinning. Hamsters are usually smarter than that.

Ive_Had_Enuf · 2016-02-02T15:46:32+00:00

You don't really HAVE to say anything. Her demanding an apology is just a shit test: you can respond by STFU, or AA / AM.

Now, if it's truly your fuck-up and YOU feel the need to say something (on your own initiative), just own your mistake without saying your sorry for it.

However, you said:

I like this new version of me personally. I feel so much better about myself.

If YOU like how you are handling these situations, if it's making YOU feel better, then just continue doing YOU.

Trekneck · 2016-02-02T16:29:54+00:00

First, keep in mind that your wife is pregnant. Normal rules don't apply in exact context here because hamster is in hormonal overdrive.

I was much like you, in that I was not only apologizing for things that I had no business apologizing for (taking too long, showering with another woman, etc). Why should I apologize for things I intentionally did, I knew what I was doing when I did it, and i knew the possible repercussions.

Obviously, there's a lack of context here, so we have no way of knowing if you're just being a stubborn douche to your wife, or if she's just rage filled and coming after her apology bitch as you claim she is.

That being said, if you're actively creating situations where you've done shit she's wanting to apologies for, perhaps look into what's causing these arguments and hamster fits in the first place and how you can avoid them entirely, rather than focusing so much on the "I'm not going to apologize" aspect of it.

Beyond any of that, don't give her the room to engage you with this. If you don't intend to apologize, don't let the argument happen. Simply tell her you've got nothing to apologize for, and walk away. The more you engage, the more problems you create. STFU is your friend.

stargazer35 · 2016-02-02T15:36:34+00:00

Only say sorry if you think you did wrong. You're the judge of your own actions like the books say. Say sorry once and not all the time for the same thing.

Another one to watch, true sorry's are unconditional. A sorry, but ... is not sorry at all. Remember that, I notice women tend to fall into this trap ALOT, they say sorry but are not really sorry at all.

vox_veritas · 2016-02-02T15:56:12+00:00

Remember that an apology is for the benefit of the apologizer, not the apologizee. Keep that in mind and a let that guide your decision on whether to apologize in a given situation.

Am I considering an apology because I truly feel I fucked up and need to own it, or is it because I just want to placate her?

2016-02-02T16:06:48+00:00

My opinion is if you truly fucked up then you need to. I draw an distinction between I'm sorry and I apologize as well as making a mistake. So for me...and my wife is starting to learn.

Here are three responses I have.

"I'm sorry." I am NEVER sorry.

"I apologize for that." I will apologize if I harm someone in some way.

"Yep. I made that mistake. I won't again." If I make a mistake I own up to it

But YMMV. My wife has this whole ritual in her head about how you have to be sorry for something in order to mean it. I stopped playing that game. Because what she wants is contrition.

The other two are not me begging nor asking. I offer something and it's her decision to accept it.

I thought a lot about it over the last few months, which lead me to RP, but being sorry and trust are weapons to my wife. She will often tell me she doesn't trust me, which caused me to go BP mode and try to earn or get her trust. What eventually occurred me is that she never considered that I want it. I no longer want her trust because it comes with too many strings attached and i just get lead a long...I deserve her trust but ultimately I can't make her give it to me.

Just like being sorry. If she wants to forgive me she will. Nothing I say will make a difference.

What I do will.

Duchat · 2016-02-02T19:21:30+00:00

You've renounced your Canadian citizenship, for sure.

Hamilton950B · 2016-02-02T23:04:54+00:00

Do not apologize for using coins instead of paper. It's the cashier's job to take your money. Do not apologize for the cashier being slow, that's not your fault.

Do say "sorry" if you bump in to someone. Just that one word, and move on. You're not saying it so much as an apology (I doubt you bumped them on purpose) as to indicate that you are not looking for a fight. It's just a social convention, like saying "good morning" when you don't actually have any control over the other person's morning and don't actually GAF what kind of morning they have.

Sadbeary · 2016-02-02T23:21:18+00:00

It is amazing to truly not GAF; liberating. I have also cut back on the unnecessary sorrys. Wife was behind a door when I was carrying stuff and kicked the door out of the way (and into her): "sorry hun, didn't see you there". Forget something "oops" shrug shoulders move on.

I also have toned down the "thank yous" for every little thing. Notably after a BJ I have to stop myself saying "thanks" instead I go for "wow, that was great". Praise is better than grateful here I suspect.

0kool74 · 2016-02-03T08:59:30+00:00

Her - apologize for ______________

Me: no

Her: APOLOGIZE NOW!!!

Me: no

Her: WHY WON'T YOU JUST APOLOGIZE?!?!

Me: I don't feel it's warranted in this instance.

DEER. That's all your last sentence is. You're implicitly tolerating absolutely shitty behavior. Doesn't matter whether or not you're apologizing, you're letting yourself be browbeaten and you're not enforcing any type of boundaries or standards.

These guys are missing the point. What you're pointing to is a symptom, not a problem. This woman has absolutely no reason to be pleasant since you're not giving her one.

Since new posters so often want bandaid solutions, try this one "The more of a harpy you are, the less I care about what you think and feel." Then end the conversation, or continue the conversation repeating that line.

Alternatively, give her a reason to not piss you off. Assuming you can control your anger, turn it up a little. Get pissed off. Woman have been treated like princesses and men have been emasculated.

Edit: Personally, I can be the cruelest person in the world to my wife. I imagine most of you married lot can be as well. It doesn't get there often, but if I have to be, I will be a total asshole if and when my wife gives me a reason to be. This only happens to demonstrate that she can choose to get the best of me or the worst of me.

cholomite · 2016-02-02T17:43:51+00:00

Sounds like you're on track. Another good line when she's giving you shit about "not liking the new you" is that she doesn't have to. You're your own man now, and she either has to accept that or go find a new beta bux to boss around. The odds are good that she eventually accepts the new alpha you over a new beta someone else.

You're right about the power play. In relationships, the partner who is most willing to walk away is the one with the most power. Almost all power play arguments are built on that principle and if argued long enough will usually devolve to those simple terms . The key to regaining the power in your relationship, which as the man, it is the natural relationship dynamic anyway, is to be an awesome guy that she would be a fool to leave over something so stupid. You must also be willing to walk away. If she says "apologize or its over", you say ok and show her the door. You will either be an awesome guy worth sticking around for, and the power will return to you, or you are still a beta and she'll walk over you on the way out. Either way, keep up the good work and don't stop improving.

Chocomitaco · 2016-02-03T01:02:12+00:00

One thing to consider is that your pregnant wife is full of hormones right now - it doesn't make you weak to be considerate of her feelings and needs. Growing up I had a very stern, strict father who absolutely ran our household, but he would not have put our family in jeopardy to take a stand over milk. Did he apologize often? Not really, but he knew how to keep the peace.

Redpilllife79 · 2016-02-03T01:19:15+00:00

I kinda went/going through the same thing. Once I truly wronged my wife. When she brought it up I told her I wanted to talk to her about it later when the kids were in bed. When the time came I say her down and I said straight up that I was wrong and I was sorry that I did/said it and I apologize. I did this while looking in her eyes and I meant it. Later in the convo she brought it up again I just told her I felt bad about it. A few days later she brings it up again. I was doing my sit-ups and I just stopped looked her in the eyes and said I had already apologized for it and I was not gonna talk about it again. Case closed. She never brought it up again.

What_is_real_anymore · 2016-02-03T01:20:54+00:00

I will offer Deflection/Distraction, and amusement to the best of my understanding. I’m still unplugging so if anything I say here sounds non-TRP, it’s because I too am still learning. I’ll rely on the moderators to...moderate my answer.

First, I agree. Hormones don't excuse bad behavior. There are still consequences. We "know" the consequence to bad behavior is lack of attention. However, pregnancy is an extenuating circumstance because you recognize her pregnancy limits her impulse control. So you temper the normal consequence with something different. Would you charge a mentally challenged adult with first degree premeditated murder, or would you consider a lesser charge?

You certainly do not give her what she asks for, which is the apology. What she’s really looking for is validation and comfort because she feelz and her feelz are all over the place. What you can do is respond with deflection, distraction, and amusement.

Her: Apologize! You: Hug her. distraction "I love you, I won't let this happen again. I know how important it is to you. Let's go get some ice cream. deflection" Her: No, I'm still mad at you. You: I know you are babe. Let's cool off some of that heat. How have your tastes been changing? distraction Are you still into walnuts, or do you want pickles on your ice cream? Deflection and amusement (smirk)” Her: You’re trying to distract me. You: Feigned horror. I would never! Ok, you got me. Her: Giggles.

It’s easier done post-analysis, but at the end of the day, your response should come from a place of understanding and compassion. She doesn’t actually want you to apologize. She wants you to love her like a man - with compassion, comfort, and steadfastness so that she knows no matter how batshit crazy she gets during pregnancy, she can’t throw you off your game.

feminazis_stalk_me · 2016-02-03T06:42:48+00:00

Apologies are for mistakes that require an apology. A lesser mistake can be handled with an "oops" or "my bad". But "sorry" should only be said when you mean it and when it is required.

Once you stop apologizing out of habit, you realize how many other people do that too, and just how annoying it is to hear. Learn to say the appropriate response or nothing at all if it's a trivial manner that requires no words on your part. Most of the time, "excuse me", "pardon me" or even "hello!" can be substituted where you might have muttered "sorry!"

Constantly apologizing for yourself shows a lack of self-esteem and poor social skills. Simply replacing most of your "sorry"'s with "excuse me"'s will go a long way toward making you look more confident, polite and socially savvy.

StingrayVC · 2016-02-03T12:37:32+00:00

Yes it's a power struggle. She's had it and you're taking it back and it's freaking her out.

Why are you trying to logic with your pregnant wife? That's just as bad as apologizing.

EDIT: Also, listen to this guy. She's pregnant and you're completely changing of her. What you are doing is good for you and creating dread for her. This guy's advice will give her what she wants and what you want. You will be in charge of the situation and she will feel good.

killxorxbexkilled · 2016-02-03T17:12:01+00:00

I'm tired of saying sorry for every goddamn thing I do or don't do. Hell yes.

0kool74 · 2016-02-03T18:19:08+00:00

My attitude is "if she doesn't like the new me she can leave."

Now if we could only get men EVERYWHERE to adopt that same mindset. Alas......there's still too many stupid people out there.

bogeyd6 · 2016-02-02T15:38:44+00:00

Looks like I am first. How fitting, because I believe in absolutely no apologies especially when warranted to your wife. However, she is pregnant so you are treading on dangerous ground. Dreading a pregnant wife is not recommended. Ride it out and keep to your readings and applying. Just make sure you pass the umpteen comfort tests properly.

spexer · 2016-02-02T16:21:11+00:00

too much talk. You should not apologize, and not discuss / argue about apologizing.

Her: WHY WON'T YOU JUST APOLOGIZE?!?!

Me: This is childish. I am going to lift.

I will say that stopping the "sorry" was a big help to me out the gate. I still on occasion catch it getting back into my dialogue - for instance this morning I said to her "I am sorry your foot is hurting, I hope you feel better".

So there is always work to do - but ending the use of that word is a BIG step.

good job.

2016-02-02T17:54:15+00:00

I think you really need to think about the child you are about to have. I don't know if you have other children already but adopting a new posture as you face impending fatherhood might make more sense to a pregnant woman.

Fathering that child is not an abstract concept, it's a lifelong responsibility.

Title	"I'm Sorry"
Author	Stoptalkingplease64
Upvotes	19
Comments	64
Date	February 2, 2016 3:26 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MarriedRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/43unl7/im_sorry/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MarriedRedPill/im-sorry.200386 https://theredarchive.com/post/200386

Comments