Man released after 3 years for having consensual sex with no intention to marry.

undervannsjeger · 2013-05-21T07:25:23+00:00

that's not how rape works, rape is when someone force you to have sex, not when they have sex with you, but doesn't want to marry you.

GiskardReventlov · 2013-05-21T09:23:40+00:00

Differentiating consensual sex and rape, the Supreme Court said, "Rape is the most morally and physically reprehensible crime in a society, as it is an assault on the body, mind and privacy of the victim. While a murderer destroys the physical frame of the victim, a rapist degrades and defiles the soul of a helpless female.

I knew people thought like this, but to actually read government officials say aloud that rape is worse than murder is mind-boggling.

Labut · 2013-05-21T10:51:05+00:00

It's quite bad but you have to understand the cultural context behind this; the very vast majority of Indians (of all stations) have arranged marriages and it's culturally necessitated for them to be virgins up until the wedding night. Premarital sex (and even dating around) is highly taboo and forbidden (esp. for women but men as well) and is seen as ruining one's chances of ever marrying (at least traditionally) -- which is why "dating" or sleeping with a woman without any intent to marry her is a very serious thing in India. You occasionally hear of some assholes promising to marry a woman and then having sex with her and then disappearing the next morning with some pretty ugly consequences faced by the woman afterward (if the word gets out). Obviously this should not be a crime (and def. not considered rape), but these are the reasons why people think it should be.

angrybutthurt · 2013-05-21T11:44:02+00:00

FFS put the country in the headline, it's kind of important.

Godspiral · 2013-05-21T17:54:57+00:00

Rape is the most morally and physically reprehensible crime in a society, as it is an assault on the body, mind and privacy of the victim. While a murderer destroys the physical frame of the victim, a rapist degrades and defiles the soul of a helpless female.

This is an absolutely disgusting exaggeration and perversion of rape. A vagina getting used for intended purpose, cannot come close to murder or other bodily harm in terms of damages. Rape can also occur without the knowledge of the rapist, or can be technical in nature based on age, or having a few drinks. You can't call sex with a 17 year old awesome fun in one jurisdiction, and worse than murder in another.

degrades and defiles the soul of a helpless female.

That is basically calling sex rape, and implying no agency for sex by women unless they receive "consideration" (marriage) for their prostitution. Its disturbing to see tunnel vision on what rape is and what rape means, and then portraying it as some universal harm. The comment implies the absurdity that prostitutes should charge the same fee as snuff film victims.

typhonblue · 2013-05-21T17:08:03+00:00

Breech of promise laws.

A while back SRS went nuts on a poster here who said he wanted to bring back breech of promise laws (he later clarified he wanted to apply them to both sexes equally and that they would be opt-in.)

So where's the SRS brigade going nuts over the existence of breech of promise laws in India directed at men?

7wap · 2013-05-21T17:54:29+00:00

India is fucked. Situation normal.

TheFarnell · 2013-05-21T15:31:58+00:00

In many places in the world, "seduction" - or convincing a woman to sleep with you by falsely promising to marry her - is still a crime. It was still in certain parts of Canada until the 1950s, IIRC, and I wouldn't be surprised if certain similar archaic laws were still on the books in other places. This could be such a situation.

jianadaren1 · 2013-05-21T16:11:33+00:00

The supreme court, to its credit, did undo the horror of the lower court judgments.

chibambi · 2013-05-21T16:48:07+00:00

did the guy promise to marry her for sex?

2013-05-21T22:22:44+00:00

This is from New Dehli.....

IceSuicida · 2013-05-21T12:26:04+00:00

Coming at this as a gender equality supporter, this is the first time I've seen a male jailed for having sex before marriage.

rebuildingMyself · 2013-05-21T09:04:47+00:00

Good lord, I can't believe the SC had to get involved in this.

MRAreader · 2013-05-21T12:34:14+00:00

So maybe it's just me but I still don't like this:

"Coerced or misguided, obtained willingly or through deceit. Consent is an act of reason, accompanied by deliberation, the mind weighing, as in a balance, the good and evil on each side. There is a clear distinction between rape and consensual sex and in a case like this, the court must very carefully examine whether the accused had actually wanted to marry the victim, or had mala fide motives, and had made a false promise to this effect only to satisfy his lust, as the latter falls within the ambit of cheating or deception. There is a distinction between the mere breach of a promise, and not fulfilling a false promise," said the Supreme Court.

Seems to imply that the technicality here is that the guy did actually intend to marry her at the time of consensual sex and that this is why it is not rape. If in fact he had had no intention of marrying her at the time of the consensual sex, he would still be in jail.

I'm of the opinion that lying or in fact any dishonesty leading up to the sex does not make this rape. If I tell a sex partner that I don't have HIV and I do (knowingly or unknowingly) that certainly makes me reprehensible - the lowest of the low. But that does not make me guilty of rape after the fact if consent was given at the time.

rappleg1 · 2013-05-21T15:37:08+00:00

So honest question...can a man be raped by a woman? Perhaps not physically overpower him, but mock him: "you must be gay","what are you a pussy?"...threaten to cheat? Eventually a man may concede and agree to sex. Its early so sorry if I am being unclear in my wording.

2013-05-21T16:26:32+00:00

"Coerced or misguided, obtained willingly or through deceit. Consent is an act of reason, accompanied by deliberation..."

While India's supreme court has it right, all of SRS, most feminists, and an unfortunately large percentage of /r/relationships believes that coerced or misguided consent is no different than no consent at all.

Purpledrank · 2013-05-21T16:51:31+00:00

This is India, and having sex with a girl and not Marrying is practically taboo in the westernized areas, and certainly taboo in the rural. So according to their laws and traditions he did commit a crime. Whether it should be a crime or not is not the point I am making.

Title	Man released after 3 years for having consensual sex with no intention to marry.
Author	EnlightMen
Upvotes	366
Comments	102
Date	May 21, 2013 6:51 AM UTC (13 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/mensrights/comments/1er1q9/man-released-after-3-years-for-having-consensual-/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/man-released-after-3-years-for-having-consensual.1613072 https://theredarchive.com/post/1613072

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